Advice needed ASAP

[blackorchid]

I have to fly out the country on Monday morning and my nd partner has raged, Split and painted me Black

He has said that he has moved out the house. But he has taken nothing with him.


He left yesterday morning. He has just messaged me now telling me to tell him if i decide to stay and not fly ( I’m going to my sisters wedding of course I have to go) and then asking if I will stay in the city or not or in the country or not or if I will move forever to my country. (I’m an expat here)

That he wanted me to change but I have PLEASE READed up his life. I must return to my country. Because I need it because I’m not normal. He’s made his decision he will never get back with me. And then not to make him angry.

What do I do?

He was supposed to be looking after our dog and home and now I have no idea if he will

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[blackorchid]

Pardon the typo. That I have f*%#ed up his life

[Witz_End]

Ouch.  That sounds difficult.

I remember your other thread, but not in detail... that his family is coming and he expects you to accept them in despite lack of space because his family is priority to him.  I see what I'm sure you feel as a double standard here - that your family can not be a priority for you.

It's your sister's wedding.  Hopefully, that's a one time thing.  If you sacrifice going, it will likely become a resentment.  You should be allowed to make your family a priority for occasions like weddings.  I would think that that would be a reasonable boundary to set.

But, I see that there is a major problem in that he seems bent on punishing you for it, plus I recall your talking about how his family treated your dog in the past, putting it in danger to get at you.  Not knowing what may happen in retaliation is a huge stressor, I'm sure.

I don't really have a solution.  I wish I did.  But, I definitely hear and understand the worry.

[blackorchid]

Thank you Witz_End just having a reply helped. I really thought we were in a better place at the moment. Then out of nowhere he started drinking more and more and choosing to go out with his friends rather than me this past weekend.

Should I try contacting him? But he’s hellbent on. It seeing me.

It’s not an option to not go to my sisters wedding. Unfortunately working in tourism his work wouldn’t give him permission to go.

I hate when he becomes like this because he truly is a different person. On Tuesday night in the night I woke up to go to the bathroom and in the dark didn’t see my dog. At the last second I realised she was there and swung my leg and stumped my toes. I honestly thought I had broken them. He was still up drinking. Didn’t believe me. Said I was play acting to get sympathy. In the morning when he saw how black and swollen they were he said I did it on purpose to make him help me and feel sorry for me. Like how could he think that. Just three weeks ago I fainted and the hospital called him. I had cracked my head open. He left work and jumped into a taxi costing 200. The difference in concern is overwhelming.

I just want to be able to have a sane rational conversation with him before I go

I don’t understand how he’s not here. He knows I can’t walk now. I’m limping. So I can’t walk our dog. But he punishes her to punish me

[Witz_End]

Thank you Witz_End just having a reply helped.

Should I try contacting him? But he’s hellbent on. It seeing me.

You're welcome, though I do not know how much help I can be with advice.  When it comes down to things like "should I call him", really I can't say.  You know him and the situation better than I.  A problem with really volatile situations like this is that *either* answer I could give could go awry.

On one hand, giving him the space may help.  In my experience with my wife, sometimes it's when I distance a bit to take my own space that she calms from the combination of being given space herself and the realization that sets in that she may have pushed too far.  In fact, a self check I find myself needing to do is to be sure I am not stepping back as a manipulation tactic.

There is a very strong BUT here.  My wife may be different.  She does have and will admit to having fears of abandonment, BUT they do not manifest like you see with most "typical" cases of BPD.  It sounds to me like your husband is very triggered by the idea of you taking the trip away from him whereas I do not get serious blowups when I have to go out of town.  Does she like it - no.  But, she does not go volatile and things do not hit critical over it.

 :caution:Please please... hear in that that there may be a very different reaction from him if you were to distance and drop off contact *because* it seems to spark more volatility in him than in my wife, if I am reading the situation right that things hit critical in reaction to you planning to go to your sister's wedding.  I also sense more potential retaliatory danger in his volatility, including a sense DV is not an impossibility.  One size does not fit all and he may be an apple to her orange, so hear others out and weigh things based on what you know.

Have you ever been in a similar dilemma/situation?  What did you do then and how did things go?

I hate when he becomes like this because he truly is a different person. On Tuesday night in the night I woke up to go to the bathroom and in the dark didn’t see my dog. At the last second I realised she was there and swung my leg and stumped my toes. I honestly thought I had broken them. He was still up drinking. Didn’t believe me. Said I was play acting to get sympathy. In the morning when he saw how black and swollen they were he said I did it on purpose to make him help me and feel sorry for me. Like how could he think that. Just three weeks ago I fainted and the hospital called him. I had cracked my head open. He left work and jumped into a taxi costing 200. The difference in concern is overwhelming.

Splitting, right?  It can be like night and day.

I just want to be able to have a sane rational conversation with him before I go

I'm not sure that's something in your hands.  Yes, if someone has some good advice that works to defuse the situation and bring him back from dysregulation, perhaps.  But, ultimately, it depends on him and is nothing you can force.

I'm sorry for your situation and wish I could offer something concrete.  Hopefully, others will.

[Witz_End]

Let me amend my above about my experience.  A case came to mind where giving her space *did* worsen things.

At the time, we were regrouping financially, which had her and the kids living with her family and I stayed in the area we had been in, living with mine as I worked toward re-settling in that area.  Prolonged physical separation (despite semi-regular visits) was a factor.

She hit a point where she was dysregulation more and more.  Between fatigue leading up to that point and her dysregulation, I was about at the point where I was done.  We had a series of fights and she pulled an "I'm done.  I need space.  I need distance."

As much as it hurt, I was at a point where I just resigned and said "okay."  Honoring her need for space, I didn't contact her for a week, figuring she would reach out to me when she wanted to.  Again, I was at wits' end, myself.

After a week, she reached out and went ballistic that I had not been in touch.  Pointing out that I had thought that was what she was asking me for when she said she needed space/distance didn't really help, as you may imagine.

Realizing it's BPD is a very recent thing and that was years ago.  What was probably a trigger for her at the time was that that was probably the 20th time she was "done" in the two years leading up to that alone.  It was the first time that I just resigned and left her be to do whatever she wanted.  She was used to certain reactions and the trigger probably was that she did not get them for the first time, so panicked.

I'm not sure how much of a consideration that is.  It does show that backing off and giving space does not always work, depending on circumstance and person.  It does have the similarity that she (like he) requested space.  It's always possible that in both cases, that's not really what they're asking.

Again, no clear advice.  Just offering a piece of my experience and hopefully not muddling things for you.

[blackorchid]

No not muddling. It makes sense. And i can imagine him saying that when I come back. I just have no idea how to even begin a message to him I’m trying to follow the SET guidelines but honestly have no idea what to write. In the past if I contact him he then blocks me and goes NC.

[blackorchid]

He has just messaged me saying

Hi. I have somewhere to stay. Don’t worry about me.


Is that a form of him reaching out?

[Dave89]

Hi, blackorchid  

I can't give you an answer on whether this is him reaching out, since I very well know how complex it is to understand one with BPD. My wife could write things and act in ways I find it impossible to find any rational meaning. Especially this happens when she is in paranoid stage, have been overcome by rage at me or disassociates. All I have to do is wait until she stabilises a bit. She has BPD and Bipolar, so she has both intensive mood swings in short time, but also has overlapping longer periods of mania and depression. It's kind of as complex as it gets... I had to give up on controlling or trying to somehow improve her condition, I'm powerless of her illness, there is nothing I can do to make it better. When I did in past, I became sick as well. It's like to start drink together with alcoholic to understand the pain they go trough and somehow help from there, that issn't that useful in long term, actually, it issn't good at all for any of parties involved. We can't change nature or other people in this life, the best bet we can change ourselves and the way how we respond to these kind of problems we face. We don't want to invalidate our loved one, but at the same time we don't want to validate his or hers irrational thoughts, we can just validate the feelings, and not get into fights about insane things, if that makes sense. There are some good tools here you can check up some tools for improving communication with someone with BPD. It's not so easy, at least for me, since I have long time history of making the bad pattern of responding to things, despite at the time I thought that was the best for her and me, but I was expecting that she was healthy person, and therefore many things I did didn't do any good...

Though, to give us more context and maybe this can help you to process somehow - have you been in touch with him lately? Has this kind of separation happened before or is it the first time? Do you can think of why he wrote you this message?

Kind Regards
Dave

[blackorchid]

The last time was last summer. He left for three months. None of my family and friends understood why I was willing to stay with him and I actually lost all my expat fiends here because of it. I think that’s what I’m freaking a bit now. I don’t want it to go down that road again but I also know that he’s not rational now

My family has already started with the we told you so’s.

It’s so frustrating isn’t it. If it was a visible illness people are understanding but like this they’re not

I’m struggling to know what to do and just feel like my back is up against the wall as I’m flying tomorrow night/Monday morning

[Radcliff]

First, enjoy your sister's wedding!  I know those times can be stressful, but I hope you have some good times, too.

Yes, he was likely reaching out.  When a pwBPD withdraws suddenly like this, they need to determine their own timeline for coming back.  When they reach out, the most effective response is one that is short and slightly warm.  Don't try to make any points.  Really simple, like "thanks for letting me know you're OK."  If you find yourself missing him while you're away, you could send him a short note saying something like "missing you."  While they are away, don't torture yourself trying to think about how you can make the perfect moves to make things all better.  Enjoy your space.  Take the time to spend it with yourself and with other friends or activities; find the silver lining.

Go slow, take time to take care of yourself, and don't burden yourself with fixing everything.  Does that make sense?

RC

[blackorchid]

Thanks Radcliff

So update. I’m now on England. I haven’t seen him since he left for work on Thursday morning.

He refused to come back to the apartment until I had left for the airport. And said that he was scared of me !

He’s Muslim and it’s Eid so I just left his gift on the side and a box of chocolates for his family. As normal

I messaged to say I was on the way to the airport and to enjoy his time with his family. I explained I forgot to write a gift Tag the chocolates  are for his family.

He replied saying I don’t need anything from you and they don’t either. To get out of his life

I’m fuming. 1) he’s said he is leaving me so why is he coming back to my house.

2) why is his family coming? Because they need my apartment to stay in

I’m sure that his family is his trigger. And they hate me so another layer of anxiety for me whilst being here is what they are going to do to my home and worse to my dog. I’m unsure whether to get a different return flight and come back earlier. After the wedding

hings do not hit critical over it.

  I also sense more potential retaliatory danger in his volatility, including a sense DV is not an impossibility. 

Sorry what does DV mean?  And Witz_End you were right about splitting.  Now comes all the comments from family saying why do you care when he’s like this and why do you worry when he doesn’t worry about you...

[Radcliff]

I'm sorry you have to worry about the security of your things while you're away.  I've faced this fear as well, and it's a tough balance to know how much to let it influence you and whether the worries should be set aside.  There's no easy answer, but I would encourage you to not let fear interfere with your family time in your home country if it is giving you joy and strength.

DV is domestic violence.  Nothing in your thread raised special concern for me.  Setting aside what I think, do you feel physically safe?  Witz_End, what in particular made you think of this? (That's not a challenge, you may see something I don't, though I want to be cautious about raising this issue.) 

It's tough to be around family and friends who have a simple view of the relationship.  Let me suggest that you try to reframe it (translate in your head as they're saying it) as their way of expressing support for you.  They are seeing an aspect of things that may have value for you to listen to, but not the whole picture.  The whole picture is yours alone to decide.

RC

[blackorchid]

So he messaged me last night via Instagram in response to my story showing my sisters wedding  with congratulations for them. I replied thanks. Everyone was asking about you family and friends and they all wished you had been here.

He responded when are you returning as I will take all my belongs from the house. I am happy now I’m with my family. I’m not happy with you. I don’t need anybody

What do I respond.  It’s like he started to calm last night and then exploded again this morning.

[Radcliff]

Sorry, I've been away camping.

I am so sorry that you got that response from him.  That must have been hard to hear, especially being far away and without being able to do something about it.  pwBPD often have intense feelings of abandonment.  They may push us away to avoid these feelings of abandonment, especially if we are scheduled to be separated from them for a while, like on a trip. 

Communicating by messaging is tough.  There are so many ways for things to go sideways.  Avoid long conversations or trying to solve any problems.  You can try validating his feelings, maybe something like, "I'm so sorry you're not happy, and I wish I could be there for you right now.  I'll be back on..."

It's been a few days.  Can you give us an update?

RC

[blackorchid]

He’s still saying he’s moving out and has now just messaged me asking what furniture and appliances I don’t need/use that he can take with him. He’s never asked that before and I have no idea what to respond.

[Radcliff]

He’s still saying he’s moving out and has now just messaged me asking what furniture and appliances I don’t need/use that he can take with him. He’s never asked that before and I have no idea what to respond.

He is "raising the stakes" to get a reaction from you.  He may be feeling abandoned, and certainly feels in distress, and this is his way to express his distress.  He may not be able to envision less extreme ways to handle his distress.

One strategy other members have used is to express empathy for the bad feelings their partner is having, say they are loved and you're confident things can be worked out, and suggest that you discuss everything face to face when you return.  You are calm and confident, and not getting sucked into his drama, but are reassuring and there for him.  You want to save wear and tear on yourself as well as not giving him the reward of showing him that dramatic behavior can pull you in.  Does that sound like it might work for your situation?

RC

[blackorchid]

That makes sense about raising the stakes. I was actually shocked. His mum called me and as she is now in our house she said that she’s really worried about him and has said she wants to take him to a psychiatrist. (In Turkey that’s about all the options that I know of anyway) but she doesn’t know how to proceed. She also said that he hasn’t told his family that he’s moving out. So raising the stakes actually makes sense. Thank you for your reply and suggestion


In the past when I have tried messages like that - he ends up blocking me. So I think this time I have been stronger in the sense that I have just not engaged or chased him. So I’m sure he probably is feeling more abandoned.

Should I just keep the message as short as possible?


One of my friends. Who doesn’t understand BPD says I should delay coming back until after his family leaves on Monday and give him time alone to calm down. What can people suggest for that as well?

[blackorchid]

It didn’t work. He sent more messages today. Asking if I was returning home or staying in England forever. That he needs to know what my future plans are.

I said I’m really sad that you still feel this way and that you want to move out.  I love you and I love our life together. I don’t want to fight or argue with you, that’s why I didn’t answer. We can talk when I’m back.


He became more enraged. First responded with an angry face. Then said look we talked about it. Don’t talk like this is an us anymore. Only talk about things. Do I need to tell the landlord were moving out.

I responded again with I told you it’s my home. I’m coming home. You don’t need to move out. It’s our home. I love you and I hope we can talk when I’m back

Told me we need to finish “nicely” enough. I don’t want to block you. If I see you when you’re back I will call the police. And tell them that you control me.

I haven’t responded. As I don’t know what to respond or what the point of it would be.

[blackorchid]

Oh and also I actually thought he had started to thaw this morning as he sent a nice video of our dogs morning walk. With a message saying I think you miss her. I replied. Thank you. I do miss her. I hope it’s not too hard walking her every morning ( i walk her mornings and he does evenings usually due to our work schedule.) to which he replied I need to know what your future plans are will you leave the country

[blackorchid]

This morning he has blocked me. He woke me up with a message asking for a receipt for the bbq we bought as he wanted to take it back. I told him where the receipt was. He said he needs to sell it as he hasn’t paid off the credit card on it. I just stated that I gave him the cash for it. Or I thought I did. Anyway. I said we had the cash but forgot to go to the ATM before the shop. I thought we put the cash on the card afterwards but maybe I remember wrong as I was tired from travelling. I had flown home that night. Had no sleep and we went shopping. He became angry and told me to PLEASE READ off. Saying he hates my lies, he hates my character and that he will cancel everything  and then blocked me


Maybe I was wrong and this fight has been triggered by money as my other friend came. I get paid cash and so I was counting out my money. And he walked in. Home early from work and be got angry. But afterwards he was ok. This was the Saturday night and the big fight was the Wednesday

So now the worst has happened. I’m blocked

[Radcliff]

I'm sorry to hear that he has blocked you.  When are you returning?  Have you bought tickets and have definite plans, or not yet?  If there's uncertainty in your return date, that could be very stressful for him.

RC

[blackorchid]

I’ve been so unsure as to what to do with buying my tickets. It was supposed to be tonight but he’s family is still there until tomorrow night so I don’t think that that’s a good idea. My friends have suggested waiting until the end of the week to give him time to calm down and regulate himself. There’s flights Tuesday Thursday and Friday.

He has told me to tell him when I’m coming as he will love out on that day. I don’t know whether I’m best not telling him so we can at least see one another. I feel the longer we don’t see one another or communicate the worse things are... but really really at a loss as to what to do

[Radcliff]

The uncertainty about the return date is hard on you both.  Waiting to return might give him a chance to re-regulate, but the situation may be causing him continual pain, which could keep spinning him up.  Don't burden yourself with making the perfect decision here.  With his side of things as out of control as it is, things are going to be messy, and it's not your fault.  Pick the flight that's best for you, that balances your desire to be with your family and your desire to get home.  We're wishing for the best outcome.  Please keep us posted!

RC

p.s.  One thought would be to pick a return date a couple of days away, and let him know about it.  Perhaps the certainty would ease his distress, and he'd re-regulate.  Yes, he might use that time to move out, but you can't be held hostage to threats that might not come true.  Make your best decision, go with it, and don't feel it's your responsibility to make things go smoothly.

[blackorchid]

Every time he gets this deregulated he tends to move out. After last year I told him he can’t do that to me again and I won’t live through it again.

I Think I’m overthinking what day to fly back so much trying to weigh his feelings against everything else when I know I can’t do anything to control his feelings...

[blackorchid]

Should I just reply saying that I haven’t bought my flight yet as I don’t know when to come and be honest that I’m trying to wait for the dust to settle?

[Radcliff]

I can relate to the overthinking.  For me, I felt like if I thought hard enough, I could figure out the perfect plan.  It helped me greatly to just accept that things would be messy, and I'd exercise a reasonable amount of care to make the best choice I could, then not blame myself when the turbulence hit.

Telling him you're waiting for the dust to settle sounds a lot like, "I'm not coming home until you calm down," which is likely to make him do the opposite.  You are dealing with a frightened person.  Be very predictable.  Pick your return day and stick with it.  Be as steady and calm as you can.

RC

[blackorchid]

That makes sense. I just meant so that he knew that I wasn’t playing games and  not telling him just to be petty... I know that his family usually causes him to disregulate. I just don’t want to go home to an empty apartment...

[Radcliff]

I understand.  I think by just telling him you'll resolve the ambiguity and that will help.  Sometimes explaining things too much goes the wrong way when what we say is misinterpreted.

You wanting to not go home to an empty apartment is certainly understandable.  Try to accept that the apartment may be empty, it may not.  Hope for the best.  Don't try to convince him not to leave, that just places the burden on you and he may feel like you're controlling him.  But perhaps say a couple of nice things to him to build him up.

RC

[blackorchid]

You’re so on point Radcliff. He’s been accusing me of controlling him since he disregulated and has even said if he sees me when I return then he will call the police and say I control him. Which is ridiculous. But you saying that helps me understand him somehow.

He unblocked me earlier and wanted to know what was happening and what will happen with our dog. I calmly replied and said I thought you were looking after her until I returned. I said I have been upset with the situation and haven’t bought my flight. Can you look after her TIL the end of the week as the flights are cheaper then. He said yes and he will move out on the day I fly back as he doesn’t want to see me...