Empathy for BPD

[Our abuse recovery guide]

How do we keep our empathy for the person with the BPD while still having empathy for ourselves?  Have you been able to do that?  If so, what's the best way?

[Beachbumforlife]

How do we keep our empathy for the person with the BPD while still having empathy for ourselves?  Have you been able to do that?  If so, what's the best way?

[GeekyGirl]

You can be angry at someone for his or her actions and still be empathetic. I'm angry that I grew up with a mother that raged and used me as her sole source of emotional support, but at the same time, I feel sorry for her because it seems like she's never been truly happy in her life. It doesn't excuse her behavior, but helps me have some compassion for her.

There's no quick or easy way to get to a point where you can feel empathy for yourself and your mother at the same time. It starts with Radical Acceptance and working through the abuse.

[Beachbumforlife]

Geekygirl, thank you for responding.  That is very true about the unhappiness.  They are unhappy and it's so sad.  And there is nothing we can do to make them happy even when we try.   :'(

Maybe the goal is to stop trying to make them happy and make ourselves happy.  Sigh.

[Phoenix.Rising]

When I can see more clearly the emotional hell they live in, I'm able to feel empathy.  I also feel empathy for the simple fact that they are human like me and deserving of love.

But, yes, it ok and I think good to feel the anger.  I cannot get to acceptance without allowing the anger to surface.  Peace.

[Beachbumforlife]

Thank you Phoenix!  It is true about the emotional hell they live in.   :'(

Maybe you are right.  Maybe the first step is anger towards eventual peace.

Btw, geeky girl, what is radical acceptance?  Someone mentioned wise mind and validation.  With radical acceptance are you referring to mindfulness?

[GeekyGirl]

Btw, geeky girl, what is radical acceptance?  Someone mentioned wise mind and validation.  With radical acceptance are you referring to mindfulness?

Yes--this sums it up better than I can: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=89910.0. Basically it's about accepting that we can't change others, but we can acknowledge the abuse that we suffered for what it is and move forward.

Maybe the goal is to stop trying to make them happy and make ourselves happy.  Sigh.

Yes, and to do that, we have to believe that we deserve to be happy and loved ourselves. For many of us, it can be a struggle to put our own happiness ahead of our parents'.

[Louise7777]

Hey there!

I cant really answer your question, I can only say I have empathy for them as human beings, but not because they are BPDs in particular.

I still didnt reach the point you guys seem to have reached. I feel sorry for the hell I lived in, not they lived in... .  After all, in my eyes, they created it and seem very pleased creating drama and comotion. So, sometimes you have to face the consequences of your actions, you made your bed now you lie in it... .  

I guess I have a lot of healing to do still.  

[Beachbumforlife]

Thank you for the link Geekygirl!  I will check it out.  And I agree we have to realize we deserve to be loved.

Hi Christina!  Don't be hard on yourself!  There is no right or wrong way to feel.  And we all heal in our own ways.  We didn't ask for this.  Now we are just trying to heal from it.   

[Louise7777]

Thank you so much for your kind words, Beachbumforlife! Wish u all the best. 

[DaughterofDD]

I've found that I can only have empathy for my mother by keeping my distance with no communication what-so-ever.  I do know that she lives in her own personally created h*ll, and I wish she could find peace within.  By doing this it also gives me empathy for myself because I also know if I were to have contact with her, it would be h*ll for me.

[rescuenomore]

I think this is a hard one in that I have always had a lot of empathy for my mother but as I continue to try to disentangle myself, my empathy slips at times.  I mean I still have empathy for what she has experienced but I feel that she uses it in her 'victim' status as a waif type and sometimes this infuriates me.  I think distance really helps and in fact maybe what I have now is a healthier empathy because before I was an enabler/rescuer.

[louise 716]

Empathy for the BPD ... .  for me, I think it partially depends on who the BPD is/what relationship you have with that person. The BPD/NPD in my life is my DIL. I have more empathy for my son who has combat PTSD and has adopted some of her ways, than I have for her. I honestly have little empathy for her.  I didn't say I don't have any, I have very little. She has done so much damage.  She controls him/he lets himself be controlled by her ... .  and that is very frustrating. Son recently relayed message from her saying she is "done with us all."  Since I do not have to interact with her any more and haven't even seen her for 4 months (they live less than miles away) it makes it a lot easier.  I do have empathy for the people she works with. I work with someone who I have decided has HPD and wow! What a challenge, especially since it is only she and I in the office.

[Phoenix.Rising]

It is important for me to maintain some empathy, but I also have to keep myself somewhat detached, otherwise I allow myself to get drawn into the drama triangles and I start getting enmeshed.  I have made some progress in this area.  Sometimes my detachment feels like I am being cold and/or unempathetic, but that is not really the case.  I am protecting myself.

[XL]

People deserve empathy. Bad behavior does not. I revert back to a "standard level of societally acceptable politeness" when I need to.

It's important to realize that getting sucked into the antics hurts them too. If you pity them, you can't play into the games, because they themselves find those situations distressing.

[ScarletOlive]

Good thoughts all around. Empathy means recognizing and understanding the feelings of others. So, we can empathize and understand the feelings of our loved ones with BPD. We don't have to condone wrong behavior, and we can and should set up firm boundaries about what is acceptable. But by showing the person that we are here to support them and showing that we understand, we can nudge them towards the truth. 

[Desire]

"But by showing the person that we are here to support them and showing that we understand, we can nudge them towards the truth. "

In my experience this has only led to false hope and disappointment. I always felt a lot of empathy towards my mom but that's what got me into unhealthy behavior patterns... . I thought that by listening or trying to be reasonable or by giving her the love/understanding she needed that she would change. But she never did. It was always only about her and her trying to manipulate me into caring for her and fulfilling HER obligations. I've since come to understand that SHE is the parent and is supposed to understand and support ME .

NOT the other way around.

I still feel bad for her. How can I not? She ruined the most beautiful thing in life. The relationship with her children. But she doesn't need to know that... .

[skelly_bean]

"I still feel bad for her. How can I not? She ruined the most beautiful thing in life. The relationship with her children. But she doesn't need to know that... . "

I think about that myself. I don't know that if my uBPD mother was ever "cured" that she would be able to live with the fact that she essentially lost her children to her disease. BPD seems like the most tragic disease, because it alienates you from family, from friends. BPDs are always in pain it seems but there is no remedy, because they often refuse to get help.

But I do not have the emotional resources to grieve for her my entire life. If I want to build a happy life for myself I have to somehow accept that my mother is suffering, enduring a truly tragic life, and also say "She made her own choices and it is not my responsibility." I went through enough abuse, enough ridicule, enough subserviance and guilt and shame already. I refuse to keep that cycle going.

I'm learning a way to feel empathy for her and at the same time recognize that this isn't my fight - it's hers, and there's nothing I can do for her other than what I already have. She's refused all the help I've offered. THere are resources, I have pointed her in their direction many many times. At this point it's her call. I do feel sad for her though.

I will feel that sorrow for her for my whole life, I'm sure. But I can compensate for that by making choices to involve a lot of wonderful things in it too.

[Drained Daughter]

I have had a similar experience to Desire and have to second SkellyBean.  I think "empathy" is a tricky sentiment when interacting with a BPD parent.  They are very good at activating your empathy manipulatively, which can result in a hyper-active state of empathy from their children.  This leads to enmeshment and co-dependency for a lot of children of BPD parents in which we have been raised to view the world through their need, anticipate their moods, and work to fill their holes. 

I've been working for several years to help deaden my empathy response to her triggering behavior.  I try to tread carefully in the empathy area and try to keep myself from wallowing in grieving for my mother's life.  It is easier said than done and takes a lot of conscious effort and willpower.  Over time and with the help of this board and others in my life it is getting easier.  I don't think I'll ever stop feeling sorry for my mom's sad life, but I hope I can stop feeling responsible for it.

[Cordelia]

I don't think I'll ever stop feeling sorry for my mom's sad life, but I hope I can stop feeling responsible for it.

Beautifully stated.  For me, complete detachment allowed me to experience true empathy for my mother for the first time.  When I was engaged with her it was a manipulative tool that I soon learned could hurt me, and I had to fight my natural empathy to maintain my integrity.  When I stopped dealing with her, I was able to see for the first time how sad it was that she had broken dysfunctional relationships with all the important people in her life, sad for her as a person, not just for me as her daughter.  She really did miss out, and continues to miss out on a lot of joy and love that could have been hers because of her disease.  I don't think her sadness means I owe her anything, and I don't think I could fix her problems even if I wanted to (G-d knows I tried).  I think rather than having to choose between empathy for the BPD and oneself, they can ONLY exist together.  "Empathy" when it means doing something destructive towards yourself is not real empathy, but fear and appeasement and an attempt to avoid the real choice that needs to be made between personal safety and maintaining a relationship with the BPD. 

[Phoenix.Rising]

They are very good at activating your empathy manipulatively, which can result in a hyper-active state of empathy from their children.  This leads to enmeshment and co-dependency for a lot of children of BPD parents in which we have been raised to view the world through their need, anticipate their moods, and work to fill their holes. 

This is very insightful.  Thank you for your thoughts.  I'm not sure I have ever connected the dots in this way.  My mother will tell me how kind I am, etc.  And I do believe I can be kind, but I don't know how 'special' it is, per say.  I'm realizing that she essentially taught me to be 'kind' toward her needs, to agree with her distress, and be 'empathetic' towards her pains.  I can see how this has translated into being overly empathetic with others in life, forgetting my own needs in order to make sure others feel ok, hence my codependency and massive struggles in intimate relationships.

I feel angry thinking about this.  However, I realize my mother most likely wasn't doing this in a conscious way to harm me.  She was acting from her illness, the only way she knew how.  This doesn't make it right, but I am the only one capable of changing me now.

[slimmiller]

When I can see more clearly the emotional hell they live in, I'm able to feel empathy.  I also feel empathy for the simple fact that they are human like me and deserving of love.

I can fully understand that they do live in an emotional Hell, but what I struggle with is do they have the right to force us into it? (by deceiving us into a relationship with them so to speak by 'acting' normal)... .  

[isshebpd]

If you're in a chosen relationship with a BPD, you can make your choice to leave any time. I suppose its more complicated if you have children, but still it is your own life. My first gf had narcissistic traits, and I learned a lot about high conflict partners... .  and stayed away from them after that :P

A BPD can only keep a mask on for so long. Wait for a stressful situation for it to come off.

[rescuenomore]

Great thread! And Drained Daughter I also found your post very insightful. Thank you

[Cordelia]

I can fully understand that they do live in an emotional Hell, but what I struggle with is do they have the right to force us into it? (by deceiving us into a relationship with them so to speak by 'acting' normal)... .  

The key to freedom is realizing that they CAN'T force you to be in a relationship with them, or to feel any particular way.  They can rage, lie, manipulate, etc., but you only have to put up with that to the extent that you decide to, and you only are affected by their accusations and blame to the extent that you decide to take those things seriously... .    It was a huge relief to me to realize that my mother herself doesn't mean the things she says... .  they seem like statements of fact but are derived from her chaotic and disordered feelings, not from rational thought or realistic observation.  So why should I take them seriously as I would criticism from a respected, trusted source?  Just as it helps you in life to be able to take criticism to heart when it's appropriate and look at your behavior, it's also a crucial skill to be able to dismiss criticisms that aren't logical or fair.  You can't take everything anyone says seriously, or you'll drive yourself nuts trying to please everyone, even those who cannot be pleased.  Learning how to be choosy about whose opinions I cared about was a huge step in my recovery. 

[slimmiller]

If you're in a chosen relationship with a BPD, you can make your choice to leave any time. I suppose its more complicated if you have children, but still it is your own life. My first gf had narcissistic traits, and I learned a lot about high conflict partners... .  and stayed away from them after that :P

A BPD can only keep a mask on for so long. Wait for a stressful situation for it to come off.

I agree.

I envy those than CAN just leave albeit if it causes pain. I have three of the most wonderful children in the world born by her. I can just leave but will never just walk out of my kids live because then they have NO protection from the emotional monster she has become. I instead elect to practice some radical acceptance and so she DOES have some power over me in that respect.

But the trick for me is to then like the original poster asked, practice empathy. When I realize the Hell she lives in it makes it easier

[cleotokos]

Just as it helps you in life to be able to take criticism to heart when it's appropriate and look at your behavior, it's also a crucial skill to be able to dismiss criticisms that aren't logical or fair. 

Cordelia, how do you resist the urge to fight against the illogical and unfair criticisms? I've had it up to here with these from my uBPD mom and find I'm no longer able to just let it go.

[Cordelia]

Cordelia, how do you resist the urge to fight against the illogical and unfair criticisms? I've had it up to here with these from my uBPD mom and find I'm no longer able to just let it go.

It's so hard when this stuff is coming from a parent, who, as children, we had every reason to trust and listen to and to crave the approval of.  What I've done that's helped is first and foremost, stopped interacting with my mom so I won't be exposed to new crazy accusations, and second (much harder) worked with a therapist to identify how I've absorbed those illogical and harmful ideas into my worldview, and challenged those ideas with new ones, loosely using the model of cognitive behavioral therapy.  So I come to therapy and say, I can't stand the fact that being eight months pregnant with twins is slowing me down at work so I can't accomplish all I used to.  I feel horrible, lazy, worthless, I try to just work through the pain and exhaustion but I can't and that makes me hate myself.  The therapist will say something like, is it reasonable to expect that you will be able to do everything you could before, when your energy is naturally shifting to this really important change in your life which is taking place right now?  And I will respond, but if I don't work hard and show people at work that I am able to contribute and help, they will reject me and abandon me, leaving me devastated.  She will say, does that sound like something that someone else in your life has done?  And I will recognize that this irrational fear, which is making me put unreasonable pressure on myself, comes from my early experiences with my mom.  And that her inability to deal with my needs as a child had to do with her disease, and does not reflect a reasonable expectation for my behavior, then or now. 

So that's what I would suggest.  First, stop exposing yourself to further ridiculous demands and blame, and second, identify and root out those areas where you HAVE inadvertently absorbed a BPD's hateful ideas into your worldview and counter them with compassion, reason, and understanding.   

[cleotokos]

Thanks Cordelia - I have stopped interacting with my mom. It makes me sad and I'm not optimistic anything can change from her end. Same as always, it seems I have to put up with her the way she is or not have a relationship with her. I was so lucky to have a dad who made sure I knew that I wasn't the crazy one, I know that not everyone had a "hero" when they were small. I feel like he was my lifeline. So I don't feel I've internalized a lot of her accusations (though I certainly have with some). But, I just can't stand to even hear them anymore. I guess it's a choice I have to make, whether to continue a relationship with her at this point. I guess I was hoping there was another way.

[justine1984]

My empathy comes from the fact that I understand that, had I not had the incredible chance of studying psychology, I would have wined up just like her. I am very glad it didn't happen. She was less lucky, being born in an era when psychology was basically nonexistent and when parents would educate by beating all the time, it was the norm.