her anger is justified

[hellokitty4]

My BPD friend is so angry at me right now. Just a backgrounder: I thought she lied to me because she has in the past. I still don't know if I heard the truth but whatever.  I teach an aerobic class and she takes my class. My mistake was I said some things on stage that upset her... . , that a normal person would have taken as a joke... .   but she took it personally. I talked to her yesterday and took a tongue lashing for a full hour. I realize my mistake and I apologized but she won't hear any of it. I know I was wrong... .   I should have asked her about things directly rather than doubting her when a friend of mine asked me a simple innocent question. I made my conclusions without talking to my BPDfriend. That is what she is very upset about. She never gave me a chance to tell my side of the story... .   and refused to accept my apology.

Now what? I am giving her space. I hope she sees the big picture. I know I hurt her. She started posting quotes on FB about fake friends. I hate that she thinks I'm a fake friend when I was the one who was there for her through thick and thin. Could my blunder lose the friendship? Probably. I want to save the friendship but do not know how to go about it.

It sounds all too grade school and she even says it.

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[Vindi]

you may just need some "time" for this to patch things up w/friendship. She may need a few days or weeks and then I am sure things will settle down. Let her know that you are sorry and validate her feelings. Yes, she may have been really hurt for something minor, but maybe she see's this as a big hurt senario, if that makes sense. Just wait it out and see how she responds.

[hellokitty4]

you may just need some "time" for this to patch things up w/friendship. She may need a few days or weeks and then I am sure things will settle down. Let her know that you are sorry and validate her feelings. Yes, she may have been really hurt for something minor, but maybe she see's this as a big hurt senario, if that makes sense. Just wait it out and see how she responds.

Thank you for your response.

I tried to validate and apologize but she cut me short and wouldn't hear any of it. She told me not to send her an email or text. And so that is what I am doing. I'm not sure if this friendship can be repaired.

[yeeter]

My take:

You made a mistake.

You owned this.  Apologized.  Expressed that you wanted to remain friends.

That is enough.  No need to bend over backwards or jump through (what might become unreasonable) hoops to make it up to her.  This can often times be what happens.

Its now on her side to decide.  Wait it out.  :)efinitely do not let it eat away at you - we all make mistakes, and how you move on from these mistakes and not let it bury you is critical.  With these relationships avoid dwelling/rehashing it - keep it simple for your own sake.

If you do reconnect the friendship, dont allow her to bring it up over and over again.  Just say 'We have covered that and as far as Im concerned its in the past'.  If she cant move on, then its not healthy to remain in the friendship.

Sorry - of course it was bound to happen.  We are human.  We make mistakes.  True friends forgive and we move on.  That may, or may not be possible but dont get sucked in if she cant let it go.

[Chosen]

I completely agree with yeeter.  You have done all you can for now.  Whether or not she accepts this apology and let her anger slowly diminish is up to her.  What I have learnt being with a uBPD is that you cannot make this process any quicker than the other person allow.  The best you can do, when in such a sitaution, is to not make it worse by adding fuel to the fire.

Give her some space.  pwBPDs are notorious for dramatising things (maybe not on purpose, but their emotions are so strong and they are ruled by that), and for all I know she may be "punishing" you by deliberately dragging out her anger.  It happens with my uBPDh a lot.  He does it so I can feel as miserable as he is.  There is nothing you can do about this decision, but at least you can try to go on with your life in the meantime, and let time do its thing.

[hellokitty4]

I completely agree with yeeter.  You have done all you can for now.  Whether or not she accepts this apology and let her anger slowly diminish is up to her.  What I have learnt being with a uBPD is that you cannot make this process any quicker than the other person allow.  The best you can do, when in such a sitaution, is to not make it worse by adding fuel to the fire.

Give her some space.  pwBPDs are notorious for dramatising things (maybe not on purpose, but their emotions are so strong and they are ruled by that), and for all I know she may be "punishing" you by deliberately dragging out her anger.  It happens with my uBPDh a lot.  He does it so I can feel as miserable as he is.  There is nothing you can do about this decision, but at least you can try to go on with your life in the meantime, and let time do its thing.

Thank you, yeeter and Chosen. I have found that my BPD friend takes longer than usual to get over her anger and pain. Definitely because her emotions are very intense.  I know she is "punishing" me... .   been there done that. She calls me the drama queen but I think that's more of a projection as is her way in so many things.

So I'm giving her space with very minimal communication. A goodnight text is all. If she sends me a text during the day, I send a very short response.  I am now assessing our friendship. Someone asked me on this board what I get out of this friendship. I am not sure I get anything other than the weekly tantrums and me doing everything wrong. I have been accused of so many things that I didn't even do and has been treated unfairly. Ironically, she called me a fake friend the last time she raged this past Monday. And I find that statement mean, unfair and uncalled for.  What to others would consider a silly argument has turned into something bigger than what it truly is. And it is getting quite exhausting. My other friends tell me to just cut the ties. So maybe someday soon I will be done with "Staying and Improving" and move on to "Undecided." I just keep giving her chances that she thinks she's entitled to. If I ever see her face to face again, I plan to finally put my foot down and tell her this is unacceptable.

[Chosen]

hellokitty4,

It isn't easy dealing with these ups and downs on a regular basis.  However, as it's always said on this board, changes start with ourselves.  Considering what you said, you have done well this time!  Also, you seem to be clear what is going on, with the projections, accusations... .   What happens next, nobody knows. 

I suppose it is of little use to tell her it's unacceptable to you if she keeps raging, etc.  They are pwBPDs and they WILL do everything they can to push your boundaries and you can't trust them to abide to any rules.  A lot of us on here probably get asked why we stay in our relationships/ marriages, we all have our own reason, it's very personal and it's ok to make that decision any time... .   for some it's a much longer process.

[yeeter]

And it is getting quite exhausting.

Re read this statement 50 times.  These relationships take much much larger amounts of energy than normal ones do.  So you have to decide to what degree you want to put your energy (your life really) into the relationship, and figure out how to minimize the drain.

Its what boundaries are for.  And indirectly means you cant likely have the close, intimate relationship that you might be imagining as a model.  If you think about it its unfortunate for the person - by definition there is either unhealthy enmeshment or distance/detachment - no genuine deep relationship potential.

[hellokitty4]

Update:

I have been sticking to minimal contact. Not initiating texting except to say good night. Not posting, not "liking" anything on FB. No phone calls. This afternoon I got a  text "All this feels so weird." Hmmm "Yes it is." Last night she said she didn't want to talk about the incident again. Today, quite a different story. I don't think she was baiting me... .   more like wanting to get a sense of how I am doing. In other words, pulling me in again. I kept the exchange pleasant with validation. She said she will not bring it up again because it makes me sad. I just said that until I know that's she's feeling okay then and only then would I feel better. I know did something wrong and I wanted to let her know that I do feel bad about it. I did not say "I'm sorry" again. 

[Chosen]

Good job, hellokitty4!

[hellokitty4]

Good job, hellokitty4!

Thanks, Chosen. Today she sent me a couple of texts. I gave her short responses. A picture of her eldest daughter's newly pierced ears and another about flooding in their basement... .   normal stuff that she shares with me.  Then she started liking 2 quotes. One about getting a hug from the right person and another about forgiveness... .   she told me a couple of months ago that quotes she likes or shares are directed at me. Must be her passive aggressive way letting me know?  It's weird. Why can't she just tell me?

[rogerroger]

Correction: "Her anger was justified".

Of course you are imperfect and make mistakes. You recognized where your actions hurt her feelings and did all that a reasonable person can and should do. Just because she won't let it go doesn't mean you can't. Don't get dragged into protracted self-punishment. Accept that it will take her longer to get over it than it will you. Continue to validate her feelings, but don't keep apologizing or trying to make up for the mistake. She may have a right to her feelings, but you also have a right to yours. The trick is to find the balance point where both of your feelings are being appropriately respected.

[Mono No Aware]

Good job, hellokitty4!

Thanks, Chosen. Today she sent me a couple of texts. I gave her short responses. A picture of her eldest daughter's newly pierced ears and another about flooding in their basement... .   normal stuff that she shares with me.  Then she started liking 2 quotes. One about getting a hug from the right person and another about forgiveness... .   she told me a couple of months ago that quotes she likes or shares are directed at me. Must be her passive aggressive way letting me know?  It's weird. Why can't she just tell me?

hellokitty4,

I'm glad to hear that Friend is coming around to the positive again.

However, I encourage you to read The Lessons and study up on Splitting.

Be prepared for the following: this may not the last you'll hear of the "Hurtful Things You Said On Stage in Class" incident.

My undiagnosed BPD wife, like her father before her, is unable to heal from hurts (real or imagined!). So when the mood splits her image of me, or her friends, or sisters, whomever triggered the eposide, turns to being BAD. Then every Hurtful Thing (again, real or imagined) from me or friends or sisters is hauled up from the depths of memory, expanded and enlarged, and used as ammunition in the war to destroy the bad.

So I hope that she is healing, but chances are she has split you to the Good side because she really does like you.

Finally, I would caution you to not emulate her behavior and put some much emotional investment in social media.

Don't forget that those modes of communication totally lack the facial expressions, body language, and tones of voice that are 90% of human communication (really, 90%, take a speech class, and I wish you could see the hurt in my eyes when I type things about my wife).

Friend is bound to mis-interpret posts and likes in a black-and-white good/bad way, but you don't to!

Seek balance, don't assume the worst... .  

[snowmanstephan]

Her anger is NOT justified

In my opinion you handled this well.

As a BPD, she has the emotional maturity of a pre-adolescent in an adult body. Hard to remain friends. These scenarios will most likely continue. Hold her at an arms length.

[hellokitty4]

Her anger is NOT justified

In my opinion you handled this well.

As a BPD, she has the emotional maturity of a pre-adolescent in an adult body. Hard to remain friends. These scenarios will most likely continue. Hold her at an arms length.

Thank you.  It has been one week... .   and I have been painted black. I received some strange texts last night after we had seen each other briefly. It started out with good texts and spiralled into I do not know what.  I don't know what could have triggered her other than seeing me. She said things like "the whole crap about letting me grow... .   I'm mad at you for listening to that crap," "You have other people to comfort you now. You don't need me. We don't need us," You need to move forward and be with people you can be honest with. i love you," "You'lll fine, I know you will."

The last text "let's leave this alone." She didn't say what she meant.

So I asked her "where do we go from here" and she said "I don't know." I told her to meet me at the parking lot of our favorite restaurant. 4 hours later I get a response... .   "I don't think it's a good idea. Let's do it another day." I told her "I am still planning to be there and will wait until 2:30is." My feeling is if the friendship means enough to her to save she will show up. If she doesn't, I got my answer and I move on.  It is almost like I have to get slapped hard by the situation to make me get out of it.

Sad but it is what it is. She's nuts!

[bluebasket321]

Hi again hellokitty4!

Have you gone to meet her yet? Since we’ve established our BPs are the same person, I thought I’d share my very similar experience with you for whatever it’s worth... .  

One time when I think she sensed that I had cooled toward her a bit, I received a bit of silent treatment followed by a message saying:

Her: “I’m leaving for Germany (her country) in a couple of days.  Maybe we could meet up again one last time before I leave”

Me: “Sure, when are you free?”

Her: “Just one last time”

Then she said she wouldn’t be able to meet, and started to wish me a nice life, said I was a wonderful person, and that hopefully our paths would cross again someday. (Kind of a push and a hook at the same time).  She said she was going away for “9 months or forever”.

This was early in my experience with her so I was completely devastated.  Anyway, a day or 2 before she was supposed to leave I suggested meeting for a quick coffee near her house.  She said she’d see and let me know.  I told her I was just going to wait there for her, and that I hoped she would join me.  I think I waited from 7-10:30 pm.  She never came.

At that point, I started coming to terms with the fact that the friendship was one-sided, etc and started to accept that it was all over.

She sent me text messages when she was away, giving me her new phone number, etc, and asking me how things were going from time to time.

Three weeks later, she came back (it had obviously just been a vacation).  She said she had changed her mind and that it was too hard for her to be that far from me. 

I think it was around this time that I started scouring the internet for explanations for this dysfunctional behavior which led to my discovery of BPD.

SO... .   don’t be surprised if she doesn’t show up at the restaurant, but do expect her to be back again trying to reel you in with a big hook!

[hellokitty4]

bluebasket321, it didn't take long.

At 11:20 I got a text "I don't think it's a good idea. Let's try for another day." I said I'm still planning on going and will be waiting until 2:30ish.  Driving to the place, another text "I can't go." I stuck to the same "I'm here waiting." Third text, "I'm sorry but I had other plans." I didn't respond. 30 minutes later another text "I'm at the supermarket." And I said "I'm still sitting at the Big Bowl parking lot. She didn't show up as I expected she wouldn't. She wasn't ready to face me but didn't know how to say it. She said she had to do grocery shopping without her kids. So why couldn't she just tell me that instead of the 3 excuses she gave me. Another 30 minutes and she asked "Are you going home? Where are you?" I told her I was still waiting and that I should probably head home. She asked "why" am I still there. I said "Because I said I would wait until 2:30." She said "I am not surprised, why would you listen to me?" I said "it was about me asserting myself. I hoped she would change her mind and come." The last text was "I'm leaving the supermarket... .   stop by your house?"

We had a long talk about what happened [first time we actually talked about it], about how we got to this point and what we are going to do about it. We ended agreeing on many things. Will we stick to it? Time will tell. But my eyes are wide open. I know what to do next time. I think.