Some thoughts on patterns and attachments

[bAlex]

After reading a comment on another thread about partners leaving and already being attached to someone new by that time, I'm realising it rings true to my own experience also.

Ok, so I know quite a bit about what my ex gets up to, she used to tell me stuff and the rest were mere observations.

She was in a 10 year relationship, found out eventually her bf (a)was cheating. She chose to stay, but cheated back with his best friend (b). She met someone new (c) during this time and decided to break things off with (b), because "there was just too much deception in the picture ". She moved in with (c), eventually broke up, recycled a few times, jumped back to (a) but only as a house mate as she didn't have anywhere else to go. She was planning another recycle with (c) but then met me. We dated for a while, she left, and went back to (c) who got abusive and she came back to me, but only as a close friend. She started dating a new guy (d), later broke up with him because of physical abuse and came back to me for support. She then met someone new (e) and recycled about 5 times. 3 times she came to me for support, he's painted black now. In between recycles with (c) she was sleeping with a guy (z)which I didn't mention, friends with benefits thing. Now she's with yet a new guy (f).

Confusing I know.

What's relevant is the pattern, see how she jumps back and forth between ex's and replacements? It's completely ridiculous. It's like she always has a safety net, someone to fall back on, just in case there's no replacement for the latest breakup. I sometimes wonder if she just latches on to whoever's around when she's vulnerable...

*And more importantly, I wonder if she deliberately doesn't give closure to her ex's, just in case she might need them again in the future?*



So, who is she going to come to when that relationship fails with (f)? She's so predictable. Every time I hear from her I know her latest relationship is failing. She'll be back... I just know it, not that I'm hoping for it, but she will. Perhaps not after this latest relationship, perhaps not the next, but at some point when she's vulnerable. Guaranteed.

It was staring me in the face this whole time but looking at it as a whole, and seeing the bigger picture, I gained new insight. I'm actually realising just how dysfunctional her life really is. It's a mess. And she still doesn't realise she's the problem. Nor does she try to better herself. Nor does she seem to care that jumping back and forth between people is hurtful and confusing to them and wrong on so many levels. It's like I, along with the others, were just puppets in her life where everything is about HER.

[vortex of confusion]

It is so difficult to be able to see the pattern from the outside but not be able to say anything about it.

I have tried to communicate this to stbx. He can't hear it. We had been married for 15 years and had 4 kids when I went to him and told him I needed help. His response was "let's see other people". At that point, I decided to give it a try. It was frustrating because I found somebody that I was involved with for about a year. At first, stbx would be all gung ho about it and then he would tell me that he didn't want to do it any more. The first time, I took him at his word and told my friend that I couldn't be involved with him any more. Anyway, it didn't take too long for me to figure out that stbx's pattern was to go post ads and chase women online. He would find one and then treat me like crap and be all gung ho about having an open relationship. I went back to my friend. Then, the person that stbx was talking to would ditch him or ghost him. Said person would disappear and then he would pledge his love to me and tell me that he wanted to work things out blah, blah, blah. The most hilarious part about all of this is that he is a self proclaimed sex addict. It was okay for him to chase all of these different people and relationships because he and I were in an open relationship. He couldn't see how it was a violation of his sobriety at all.

I am dating somebody now and have been dating this person for about 7 months. In that time, stbx has been through 3 or 4, maybe more, different "friends". There was one that he told me that he was in love with and how he felt different about her than he had any of the other women. They had a spiritual connection, blah, blah, blah. She broke it off with him and within a week or two of her breaking it off he had a date with another chick that is supposedly platonic. And this week, I made the mistake of trying to point this pattern out to him and tell him that I could usually tell when he had somebody new on the hook because he is a jerk to me. He had to correct me and say, "That's not true. I am talking to somebody now."

I am dating somebody yet he wants to act like I am his go to person. Um, NO. Not NO but heck no! It is like he can conveniently throw people away as soon as they no longer fit whatever it is he is wanting from them. I find all of this kind of painful to watch because I was perfectly willing to stand by him and stay with him if he would step up to the plate and check in to the family. Nope, that was too much to ask. Now, I get to see him flail about and go from person to person without ever stopping to see that that maybe he needs to NOT be in a relationship. Whenever I get bothered by him finding somebody new, my support network chuckles at me a bit and reminds me that this one isn't likely to work out either. He is incapable of having a relationship and it is a matter of time before his latest interest ditches him and he is back to being nice to me.

[Rayban]

Her being with other guys while we were together still keeps me up some nights. I work with her, and she would sometimes take 1.5 hour lunches. Other times she would disappear for 20 to 30 minutes at a time. I saw the way she would interact with some guys and it went beyond being a friendly coworker. I have no doubt that she slept with some of these people. I was just another tool. Someone to help keep appearances, or to use to triangulate. This was just at work, Who knows what she did outside of work.

It happened on several occasions that we would be out somewhere, and she would run into ''friends she knew'' It's like she knew they would be there and I was just along for the ride to triangulate. One time it happened after work. We went to a bar for drinks, and 20 mins later in walk two male coworkers. I didn't think twice about it at the time, but I woke up with a wait a minute moment about one of the guys there.

She would talk about him quite often, and I remember a conversation we had, where she mentioned he wasn't happy in his 8 year relationship with his girlfriend. She also started liking things he liked . Anyway, I still remember the look on his face as he left the bar that night, and it was jealousy.

Maybe I'm over reacting. I mean she would have to realize that if she's sleeping with all these people at work eventually others will find out, and I don't think she wants to be known as the office tramp. Hopefully this will be incentive for her to leave. She never stays more then a year at the same place. 

[bAlex]

Vortex,

It sounds like you are going through a very difficult time. I imagine it's very draining having to put up with that and not being able to just walk away.

Thing is I don't find it difficult to just keep quiet any more.  In the past I tried to communicate to her what she's doing wrong and that it's not normal behaviour and all it got me was her seeing me as the enemy. Trying to explain a pattern to her would likely make me look like an stalker in her eyes . I'm at the point where I just don't care to see her fail anymore. After all the crap she put me through and making me end up here... .Screw it, she deserves it. The people who actually loved her and tried to help her, and got burned for it are the undeserving ones. I'm well beyond the point of pitying her.

[bAlex]

Rayban I know what you mean. My ex also took "lunches" with her manager, but meantime they went over to his place for sex. He was also my friend and when we broke up I was so scared that that would happen. I was in a constant state of anxiety over it, and that's exactly what she went and did. The one thing that would hurt me the most she went and did. She doesn't think she did anything wrong to this day, but she went to great lengths to hide it from me.

And I'm well aware that I don't even know all there is to know, if I did I'd probably have a melt down .

You are not overreacting, we pick up on things and realise something is off. That's probably why I never trusted her while we dated. Knowing her past, and the things she said, way she thinks made it impossible for me to trust her to make good judgements. I was in constant fear while dating her, was even afraid to leave her alone with my friends... Stayed up at night if she went somewhere without me... But I realise that I had good reason to be scared and always expect the worst.

[Rayban]

Rayban I know what you mean. My ex also took "lunches" with her manager, but meantime they went over to his place for sex. He was also my friend and when we broke up I was so scared that that would happen. I was in a constant state of anxiety over it, and that's exactly what she went and did. The one thing that would hurt me the most she went and did. She doesn't think she did anything wrong to this day, but she went to great lengths to hide it from me.

And I'm well aware that I don't even know all there is to know, if I did I'd probably have a melt down .

You are not overreacting, we pick up on things and realise something is off. That's probably why I never trusted her while we dated. Knowing her past, and the things she said, way she thinks made it impossible for me to trust her to make good judgements. I was in constant fear while dating her, was even afraid to leave her alone with my friends... Stayed up at night if she went somewhere without me... But I realise that I had good reason to be scared and always expect the worst.

Alex, I would tell her sometimes that I didn't like it when she flirted with other guys in front of me, with one creep in particular and the next day she would do it even more blatantly, cause she knew It would hurt me. She would also accuse me of stalking her behavior, and that no one tells her what she can and can't do.

How do they justify their promiscuity in their minds? Is it notches on their belts?  I know most times cheating for them is justified by getting back at their partners for something they supposedly did . She would always complain that I never introduced her to my friends. With good reason, I know she would throw herself at them. The first thing she did when I told her she would be meeting one of my brothers, was to go change into something skimpy. This was also one of those flashbacks I had. When ever we would go out someplace she would spend time changing outfits, and ultimately wearing something revealing bordering on inappropriate. Even going to the mall was an experience. Random gawking from old men to young teenage boys. She would do stuff like drop stuff, or make sure that everyone got a good look. When I brought that up, I was just a jealous freak, and that she did nothing wrong, it wasn't her fault that other men found her pretty. 

[bAlex]

Rayban I know what you mean. My ex also took "lunches" with her manager, but meantime they went over to his place for sex. He was also my friend and when we broke up I was so scared that that would happen. I was in a constant state of anxiety over it, and that's exactly what she went and did. The one thing that would hurt me the most she went and did. She doesn't think she did anything wrong to this day, but she went to great lengths to hide it from me.

And I'm well aware that I don't even know all there is to know, if I did I'd probably have a melt down .

You are not overreacting, we pick up on things and realise something is off. That's probably why I never trusted her while we dated. Knowing her past, and the things she said, way she thinks made it impossible for me to trust her to make good judgements. I was in constant fear while dating her, was even afraid to leave her alone with my friends... Stayed up at night if she went somewhere without me... But I realise that I had good reason to be scared and always expect the worst.

Alex, I would tell her sometimes that I didn't like it when she flirted with other guys in front of me, with one creep in particular and the next day she would do it even more blatantly, cause she knew It would hurt me. She would also accuse me of stalking her behavior, and that no one tells her what she can and can't do.

How do they justify their promiscuity in their minds? Is it notches on their belts?  I know most times cheating for them is justified by getting back at their partners for something they supposedly did . She would always complain that I never introduced her to my friends. With good reason, I know she would throw herself at them. The first thing she did when I told her she would be meeting one of my brothers, was to go change into something skimpy. This was also one of those flashbacks I had. When ever we would go out someplace she would spend time changing outfits, and ultimately wearing something revealing bordering on inappropriate. Even going to the mall was an experience. Random gawking from old men to young teenage boys. She would do stuff like drop stuff, or make sure that everyone got a good look. When I brought that up, I was just a jealous freak, and that she did nothing wrong, it wasn't her fault that other men found her pretty. 

Wow, mine did that kind of stuff in a way more subtle way at least. She told me once not to ever tell her not to do something, because she would then deliberately do it out of spite. It's like she couldn't control herself even. It's times like that when I just felt like calling her a total retard, who the hell does that?

[vortex of confusion]

It sounds like you are going through a very difficult time. I imagine it's very draining having to put up with that and not being able to just walk away.

Thing is I don't find it difficult to just keep quiet any more.  In the past I tried to communicate to her what she's doing wrong and that it's not normal behaviour and all it got me was her seeing me as the enemy. Trying to explain a pattern to her would likely make me look like an stalker in her eyes . I'm at the point where I just don't care to see her fail anymore. After all the crap she put me through and making me end up here... .Screw it, she deserves it. The people who actually loved her and tried to help her, and got burned for it are the undeserving ones. I'm well beyond the point of pitying her.

My ability to keep quiet seems to be cyclical. I will have these periods where I don't say anything at all and just vent to friends about how ridiculous it all is. Other times, especially when I see that his crapulence is having an impact on the kids, I can't keep quiet. The kids have no idea what is going on. They comment about when dad is being cool and genuinely nice and when he is being fake and a bit of a jerk. I have been watching the patterns to try to figure them out so I can figure out how to help the kids have a relationship with him.

Right now, I feel kind of meh about it all and am actually finding it a bit comical. When it feels like he is rubbing my nose in his latest escapades, it is a lot more difficult to keep quiet. He just does not seem to get that it is inappropriate to tell me about this stuff. I don't tell him anything at all about my romantic relationship. I even pointed that out to him one time. I don't go around telling him how great my boyfriend is. I don't go around telling him how I feel about my boyfriend yet he thinks it is okay to sit here and tell me how this time is different. He is in love, blah, friggin' blah. With me, he had it all, kids, house, a wife that loved him and would do anything for him. He threw all of that away to go chase some kind of invisible ideal. Really, I don't think it is him chasing as much as it is him running away from anything that even remotely resembles true intimacy.

[bAlex]

It sounds like you are going through a very difficult time. I imagine it's very draining having to put up with that and not being able to just walk away.

Thing is I don't find it difficult to just keep quiet any more.  In the past I tried to communicate to her what she's doing wrong and that it's not normal behaviour and all it got me was her seeing me as the enemy. Trying to explain a pattern to her would likely make me look like an stalker in her eyes . I'm at the point where I just don't care to see her fail anymore. After all the crap she put me through and making me end up here... .Screw it, she deserves it. The people who actually loved her and tried to help her, and got burned for it are the undeserving ones. I'm well beyond the point of pitying her.

My ability to keep quiet seems to be cyclical. I will have these periods where I don't say anything at all and just vent to friends about how ridiculous it all is. Other times, especially when I see that his crapulence is having an impact on the kids, I can't keep quiet. The kids have no idea what is going on. They comment about when dad is being cool and genuinely nice and when he is being fake and a bit of a jerk. I have been watching the patterns to try to figure them out so I can figure out how to help the kids have a relationship with him.

Right now, I feel kind of meh about it all and am actually finding it a bit comical. When it feels like he is rubbing my nose in his latest escapades, it is a lot more difficult to keep quiet. He just does not seem to get that it is inappropriate to tell me about this stuff. I don't tell him anything at all about my romantic relationship. I even pointed that out to him one time. I don't go around telling him how great my boyfriend is. I don't go around telling him how I feel about my boyfriend yet he thinks it is okay to sit here and tell me how this time is different. He is in love, blah, friggin' blah. With me, he had it all, kids, house, a wife that loved him and would do anything for him. He threw all of that away to go chase some kind of invisible ideal. Really, I don't think it is him chasing as much as it is him running away from anything that even remotely resembles true intimacy.

It's good to keep a sense of humour about it I guess. My ex used to jokingly say that she "refuses to be happy". It was a joke, but I should have believed her. She's also incapable of giving or receiving intamacy in any form.

[vortex of confusion]

It's good to keep a sense of humour about it I guess. My ex used to jokingly say that she "refuses to be happy". It was a joke, but I should have believed her. She's also incapable of giving or receiving intamacy in any form.

There are times when it seems like something from the Twilight Zone or Jerry Springer and I have to laugh.

During times of awareness, stbx has admitted that his self hatred has kept him from being happy. I don't know. I know that I spoke with one of the ladies he was chasing. She saw the red flags and said that his pledges of love made her really uncomfortable. She felt like he was living in some kind of fantasy land. I think that is all it is. It is chasing a fantasy world that doesn't exist.