Issues with food and poverty

[Allnighter]

Hello, all!

I thought we could have a thread for issues surrounding food. Or at least for me to vent mine and I hope you guys feel free to share!

For me it was always that we were totally forced to eat the food we were given, even if it literally made us barf. Even (and especially) if it was a special treat.
Then it was that the food that made us disgusted wasn’t at all nutritious. It was probably filling us up with salt and sugar and starch. But I understand the panic over waste and the feeling of a need for discipline if the parents are as poor as mine were... .
A new suspicion of mine, though, and I don’t know why I feel this, is that we could actually have afforded more nutritious food than we had. I mean we sure didn’t have extravagant christmases (which my mom used as guilt leverage of course). My mother is crazy strict about spending - she just got a job (her first - I thought t would be a purely positive change, leave it to her) making $54,000 extra a year, and she says that basically every penny of it is going to her and my dad’s retirement and “school.” 2/3 of my brothers have scholarships to their school and my last brother doesn’t even want to go to college. I bet that surviving on Lipton noodle soup and frozen French fries as meals was not a necessary mode of existence. She also kept the house super cold, but that’s another story... .even though I rack up crazy heat bills to this day and despise being cold.
And the last thing is that we were allowed exactly 3 meals a day and an afternoon and bedtime snack, but no more (with rare exceptions). We could only have one pop tart from the pack, not two. We couldn’t ask for more or we were ungrateful or selfish. Because sometimes we splurged and had pizza or sth, so they were “really nice to us actually right?”

Memories include my dad forcing my brother to eat (or force feeding him?) this microwave dinner of Salisbury steak and noodles until he threw it back up; I remember him puking it up basically unchewed into a plastic cup. My mom making this pumpkin spice pudding as a nice treat, but it was so gross I couldn’t even choke it down; but I was forced to eat it because she “made it special for me.” The worst memory I have of food is that she used to have us eat frozen French fries for lunch, I guess when things were really bad (I’ll never know how bad - they kept money details secret from us and my mom decided how we spent my dad’s hard earned cash). Anyway I always hated them, and one time she got a different brand. Maybe they were a few cents cheaper, maybe she was trying to make me happy and that’s why things went how they did, but anyway they were so gross and slippery and chewy that I couldn’t stand to eat them. She made me eat them, so I kept trying to fork in all these fries. When I thought I was going to puke, I gave up and spat out this huge mouthful (literally a full mouth) of CHEWED French fries. And she exiled me to the freezing side porch and told me I had to eat the chewed-up fries. I knew if I threw them out somewhere she would find them, and I wasn’t allowed to go off property without supervision due to the perceived threat of kidnappers she always made us afraid of. Or she’d hear me leave and get mad. So I had to make myself eat them. Maybe I used ketchup to choke it down, I still remember the texture of cold chewed up fries. At the one I just thought it was mean, but it’s straight up abusive.

To this day I can’t eat microwave fries or fat fries that could possibly be anything but crunchy... .or pudding of any kind or most yogurt.

Once my dad let me and my brother go crazy eating vanilla wafers dipped in cool whip. We are so many from the opportunity to eat as much as we wanted that I got horribly sick. Can’t eat Nilla Wafers or cool whip now.

When I looked back recently on pictures of myself, I was so skinny sometimes I look like a skeleton. My mom always said I ate a ton but had a good metabolism... .now I’m not so sure I went to college with a buffet style meal plan and gained literally 20 pounds. And my mom made me see a nutritionist there out of concern that I wasn’t eating healthy. So ironic.

We are also usually half dressed in pictures. Spending most of the day in pajamas or nightgowns. Or my hair was unbrushed - God it was so awful when my mom brushed my hair. Screaming matches. She just couldn’t be sensitive.

Feels good to get all that off my chest... .especially the details. I usually don’t go into detail if I tell a friend about what I went through with this stuff. Which is very rare.

My T recently said that it doesn’t sound like I value myself enough to feed myself well. That’s true. A few months ago I broke my back to put away $600 a month... .just because... .and I ate crappy food like ramen and soda and $1 pizza slices and lame sandwiches. I buy food in bulk. I always feel guilty when I eat out even though I do anyway. I mean, this stuff is literally what money is for - food, experiences, a good life. Sure saving is key but... ? Why do I always life like I’m poor AF? I’d like to treat myself better with food. Sometimes I think I have to eat poorly or I’d feel guilty my mom never had better... .

[Turkish]

Lipton soup is emergency food if the kids are sick,  but I add baby carrots to give it some nutrition.

I agree that what she forced you to do was abusive.  And I thought I had it bad with the "eat at least one tablespoon of what you don't like (canned lima or kidney beans).

Maybe your mom grew up poor? My mom was the baby of the family, born in '42, so her family went though The Depression.  Sometimes we ate well,  but since my mom was never good with money,  we also didn't.  Other kids had bologna (with tomatoes and lettuce!) For lunch,  but I felt slighted with a single slice of micrometer thin meat from those 29 cent Land O' Frost packages. Or peanut butter and mayonnaise (is that a Midwest thing?) Or jelly and cream cheese, which was kind of palatable.

Though I'm 47, I remember late night with Johnny Carson well sonce my mom would sit me at my table in front of the tv for hours when I refused to eat her spaghetti until I did a face plenty into it which she thought was funny.  At least that's better than improperly cooked frozen fries. I did remember tv dinners well... .still hesitant to try them on my kids though these days we have great choices. 

What's really stopping you from eating better what you want? Stir fry fresh veggies with olive oil and some noodles is a good healthy meal by my estimation.  When you eat out,  what do you like? 

[Allnighter]

Lipton soup is emergency food if the kids are sick,  but I add baby carrots to give it some nutrition.

I agree that what she forced you to do was abusive.  And I thought I had it bad with the "eat at least one tablespoon of what you don't like (canned lima or kidney beans).

Maybe your mom grew up poor? My mom was the baby of the family, born in '42, so her family went though The Depression.  Sometimes we ate well,  but since my mom was never good with money,  we also didn't.  Other kids had bologna (with tomatoes and lettuce!) For lunch,  but I felt slighted with a single slice of micrometer thin meat from those 29 cent Land O' Frost packages. Or peanut butter and mayonnaise (is that a Midwest thing?) Or jelly and cream cheese, which was kind of palatable.

Though I'm 47, I remember late night with Johnny Carson well sonce my mom would sit me at my table in front of the tv for hours when I refused to eat her spaghetti until I did a face plenty into it which she thought was funny.  At least that's better than improperly cooked frozen fries. I did remember tv dinners well... .still hesitant to try them on my kids though these days we have great choices. 

What's really stopping you from eating better what you want? Stir fry fresh veggies with olive oil and some noodles is a good healthy meal by my estimation.  When you eat out,  what do you like? 

Lipton as a good for healing when sick makes a ton of sense! We had it because it was cheap, on the regular. Like a few times a week if memory serves.

I’m glad someone has validated that the fry incident was abuse. Whew. Feels good to hear from an outsider.

My mom definitely grew up totally dirt poor, and severely neglected. I’m aware it’s a huge reason behind a lot of what she did. I’m sorry that both of us were affected by the inconsistency of a mom without well adjusted money smarts

HEY I also had a thing with spaghetti! Thanks for reminding me. I hated when it got a little cold and there wasn’t the right amount of sauce so it got almost cakey... .ugh. She would also inexplicably cut it up. Gross. I still struggle to eat pasta sauce, never know what texture is gonna come up exactly. Here comes the familiar guilt though - she was doing her best songs hard to let myself be mad. I hate that knee jerk reaction.

Probably what’s stopping me from eating better is also the money thing. I feel bad for eating better than she could as a child or something. Or for not saving every penny, for having more than her. Even tho that’s what she wanted for me. Another thing preventing me is time - I’m always always always working or cramming in as much fun stuff as possible. So I avoid cooking and also restocking the groceries. Maybe avoiding these two things is like a weird back alley way of getting myself to allow myself to order in nice food xD

Unlike my mom who has a very limited palette from her upbringing, I love to branch out and try all kinds of foods. some favorites are steak, Thai (fav food is Tom ka gai, very nice memory of when my dad introduced me to it), Indian, sushi, and trying new things  it’s nice to be asked that!

[Allnighter]

*as a food!

[Turkish]

Great foods! I live in the silicon valley,  so I have a lot of choices. Both of my kids are picky, especially D6, but we love Pho. Simple and healthy. Spaghetti is a default food at home,  but they get it hot, not encrusted... .D6 disagrees with my vegetable additives, but I tell her to pick around them.  The other night I got Wal-Mart pizzas with pepperoni and sausage. They didn't Luke the sausages.  I convinced S to pick them out. D didn't like it but I wasn't going to force her so she had cheerios for dinner.  I tell them what grandma would have done but I won't enforce it. 

[Allnighter]

That all sounds reasonable to me! I want my future kids to try to eat healthy but I won’t traumatize them with force. Also to be clear the spaghetti started hot but I didn’t eat it for forever so it became cold

[itsmeSnap]

My mom made us chug that nasty thick fish oil concoction they marketed for kids nutrition. I know she had the best intentions, but we were kids, and her methods were sometimes less than "delicate".

My older brother got it worse because he did refuse entirely, I did take it reluctantly.

My dad also grew poor because grandma was bad with money (and according to stories from my mom, most likely BPD). He still to this day eats whatever is on his plate (and he gets supersized portions, but he's not fat surprisingly) or eats a tiny piece at a time "to make it last".

Its tough, they survived it, we survived it, were relatively well off now. Despite all that, the experience remains. Knowing why you do the things you do is half the battle, taking it into account for new behaviors is where we grow. Eat well allnighter, you deserve it 

Maybe avoiding these two things is like a weird back alley way of getting myself to allow myself to order in nice food

Embrace it! we buy bulk at home (too lazy to go food shopping often, if I go out when I'm hungry I'm probably getting a pizza or chinese or something instead of groceries) and make takeout/restaurant style meals some days (homemade pizza, teriyaki bowls, my brother makes some serious wings, steaks and a perfect cheesecake ) despite having food on the fridge.

It breaks the routine, and event though we make some delicious ready to reheat food, we do still like the "much tastier than takeout/restaurant" value for money along with our meals

[Allnighter]

Thank you for sharing thoughts and strategies! <3

[Turkish]

That all sounds reasonable to me! I want my future kids to try to eat healthy but I won’t traumatize them with force. Also to be clear the spaghetti started hot but I didn’t eat it for forever so it became cold

My mom took me into the bathroom at 4 at the pizzeria and spanked me bare bottom because I refused to eat pizza. 

In later years she told me she regretted herself as I was eating her out of house and home as a teenager.  Cold canned food and government cheese and potatoes, yeah, right... .

Vienna sausages, cold chefboyardee, congealed greasy canned tamales... .spam.

I tried Vienna sausages a few years ago and I couldn't stand them though I remember them being good.  Trauma!

[Allnighter]

My mom took me into the bathroom at 4 at the pizzeria and spanked me bare bottom because I refused to eat pizza. 

In later years she told me she regretted herself as I was eating her out of house and home as a teenager.  Cold canned food and government cheese and potatoes, yeah, right... .

Vienna sausages, cold chefboyardee, congealed greasy canned tamales... .spam.

I tried Vienna sausages a few years ago and I couldn't stand them though I remember them being good.  Trauma!

Ugh I am so sorry! that sounds awful. That counts as neglect for sure. I’m so sorry you had to endure that

What did she mean when you say she said “she regretted herself?”

She also used to say I ate her out of house and home too... .not only when I was a child, but when I returned for college too. She would always be like “now we have to order two pizzas so we can feed us all” or something. Family of six. I remember almost always hoping there was more food at the end. She also acted like she was the most amazing frigging mother in the world for cooking us meals. Like she deserved a medal for providing nutrition for the 4 kids SHE decided rn conceive. When she didn’t even work a job a day in her life to get the money my dad slaved away for... .she also made me prepare food pretty often after a certain age too. But still always complained about how much she had to do and how we never did enough around here and all kinds of stuff. We were lazy and spoiled rotten (as if it was our fault we were spoiled). I can still hear her saying these things.

She also made me feel bad for taking hot showers, or complaining that it was too cold in the house. My pinky toes would turn blue. She attributed that to poor circulation. I remember always being too cold and we could never ask for it to be warmer. Sometimes they tried things like hot water bottles, or having us sit on the radiators. But it wasn’t enough. I’m sure they could have managed to turn the heat up a little.

[Allnighter]

*returned home from college, not returned home for college.

[Notwendy]

We thankfully had enough money for food growing up, but my mother was always on some kind of weight loss diet. She was very fashionable, attractive, and trim, but somehow was always dieting- at least in front of people but would then eat food at home.

When I was about 10, she began to enforce this on me too. She would tell me I needed to lose weight. I didn't need to lose any weight. She even got my father into it. This took a toll on my self esteem and I was self conscious about my body and any figure flaws. As a parent myself now, I find it shocking that a father would tell his normal size teen age daughter to lose weight. Teen girls are faced with unreal expectations from media and fashion magazines and need reassurance about themselves. My mother's thinking is distorted, but his wasn't.

Today, I focus on healthy eating. It took me a long time to allow myself to not be so self critical. I'm pretty sure my mother has some kind of eating disorder and that, she somehow projected that on me but I can also choose to not think like she does about food.

[HappyChappy]

For me it was always that we were totally forced to eat the food we were given, even if it literally made us barf... .A new suspicion of mine, though, and I don’t know why I feel this, is that we could actually have afforded more nutritious food than we had. .

Yes and ... .Yes. My BPD had us forage for food and on the rare occasions she bought a take away, she'd say we would not appreciate it - so we got grule. Also if she was trying to impress someone, she'd get decent food in and spend time cooking then leave me a tin of baked beans to cook for me and my sis. Total accepted it, what a con !

She also made me feel bad for taking hot showers, or complaining that it was too cold in the house. My pinky toes would turn blue.

You're not my sister are you ? Same here. Basically they resent spending money on their kids and pass it off as if we were porpers. Main thing is, are you continuing the trend or do you spoil yourself with indoor toilets and new fangled heating ? I sometimes throw caution to the wind with expenses, I once bought a return train ticket and never came back. 

[Turkish]

Positively Dickensian, HC!

[Allnighter]

Yes and ... .Yes. My BPD had us forage for food and on the rare occasions she bought a take away, she'd say we would not appreciate it - so we got grule. Also if she was trying to impress someone, she'd get decent food in and spend time cooking then leave me a tin of baked beans to cook for me and my sis. Total accepted it, what a con !You're not my sister are you ? Same here. Basically they resent spending money on their kids and pass it off as if we were porpers. Main thing is, are you continuing the trend or do you spoil yourself with indoor toilets and new fangled heating ? I sometimes throw caution to the wind with expenses, I once bought a return train ticket and never came back. 

Yes! Exactly - resenting spending money on us. She would also do these extravagant christmases (still does) in an attempt to like prove her love or ease her guilt or earn our praise... .but she’s never given me a SINGLE gift that she didn’t throw back in my face later to complain I hadn’t appreciated, or claim “proved that she does nothing but give everything she has to me... .”

[Allnighter]

ACTUALLY. My dad got like a high cholesterol score once recently, and he’s a grown damn man, and she made him eat a different diet than the rest of us. She would cook us all this nice food and he would get a supposedly-healthy and very small TV dinner. And he was ok with this. And we all had to eat our normal unhealthy treat-y food and he would sit there and pretend he was not suffering. So messed up how controlling she is! Meanwhile she has eaten like CRAP her whole life. She resents him for his health issues because she thinks it means he won’t be around as long; meanwhile she’s driving him to his grave. She acts like she couldn’t survive without him when she’s really the boss.

She even told us the reason she got a job is because she thinks my dad will die early and she has to take care of herself. She couldn’t just admit that she wanted to work - stuck trying to convince herself she’s not selfish. Well, she isn’t selfish for the reasons/behaviors she thinks... .! But she sure is.