Inability to stay in relationship

[Suzn]

My apologies, when SB asked you how you ended up dating your ex again you said match.com. I thought you REconnected with him on match. 

I so get being happy with your own home, it's an accomplishment to be a home owner. I spent many, many days using working on my home as a coping technique, not knowing that was what I was doing at the time. It's productive so I certainly recommend it to anyone. Is it possible that some of your projects are coming to a close and with your daughter grown and with your being able to distance yourself from your ex emotionally that this grieving process is getting more "demanding" of your attention? Demanding might be too strong of a word but does that make sense?

I learned what kind of energy working on my house took though. Not that it was bad, I just needed to focus, I put the tools down a year ago and just recently picked them back up. I truly believe the saying "the answers are inside you." It wasn't until I no longer had any distractions that I was able to dig deep and work on me. I get the reclusiveness too, I tend to lean more towards this myself at times. It's just easy. I do make myself get out, not saying you don't. 

This grieving process was really good for me, I can't say there won't be more times of the need in the future. I think this process continues on, meaning if I lose a good friend, I need to grieve it. Or another memory from my past resurfacing. I do know, for me, I want to be more available if and when I do meet soemone. I refuse to allow myself to settle, I have invested my time and heart for the last time in a r/s where I end up feeling just as alone, if not more alone, as when I met that person. I won' t settle for a lack of substance and depth, the lack of the ability to give back in a reciprocal way from anyone.

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[turtle]

But when he's happy, he's good company (in light doses) and he's helpful.

I had one of these in my life for awhile too.  Not a BPD person, but still... .   a dysfunctional person.  I enjoyed spending time with this person on a limited basis because he was fun to be around.  Not an honest bone in his body (which I didn't know at the time,) but we had fun.  Never a cross word, same interests, easy-going, lots of laughter, etc.   And... .   there are times that I miss that.  However... .   I don't miss his ___storm of dishonesty.  And that's what pushed me over the edge. For me, there's no amount of comfort or familiarity that is worth putting up with that darkside.

I also am helpful to him, but, I over did my helpfulness in years past. I worked for years on his house when I lived there, and spent probably 15k on moving 3x when he would go south. This feels like I'm taking better care of myself and recouping some of my losses from before. I worked tirelessly to make his life nicer for five years, I helped raise his two kids, did a lot of remodeling and repair and design work of his house/yard. This feels like I'm getting some of that back now for me.  I like seeing him put some effort back into my place. He feels guilty about some of his behavior and helping out lately makes him feel like he's not such a jerk. He makes much more $ than I do.

Isn't it interesting?  Helping out makes him feel like he's not such a jerk... .   yet he IS.  If he thinks that helping you with a remodel erases his poor behavior, he's sorely mistaken.  That's always a concept that is wasted on so many people.  The only thing that erases poor behavior, is TRUE CHANGED behavior.

Works for me! I have a habit of giving but not receiving. I've let him give this time; it feels incredibly weird as I'm not used to it, but it's been good for me.

I get this.  Like you, I gave, and gave and gave and gave and gave... .   with VERY little in return.  It feels good to get a little back, even if it's loaded with BS and conditions.  Eventually though... .   that gets very old... .   and boring.

We have no committed r/s or promises. If I meet someone else I would be honest about it. I hate dating but sooner or later I may meet someone. If he has no commitment to me, then thats the way it goes I geuss. ?

He could meet someone tomorrow! That would be more likely!

It WOULD be more likely for him to meet someone tomorrow... .   God help her.

You sound good to me Maybeso.  Like you are in the "observer" mode in your own life. "Observer" mode is one of my favorite places to be!

Going forward, it sounds like you aren't really tied to the outcome of this situation one way or the other and that's probably a good place to be with someone so "iffy."  I just hope he stays away. Why stay tied (at any level) to someone like this?

[rosannadanna]

Hi Maybeso  

I admire you and Phoebe123 as mentors b/c I am in a similar situation with my SO.  My adult life mirrors yours greatly as far as being a single mother from the time my child was 5 and really not having any significant relationships until the BPD one that started when my child was 13.  I enjoy my solitude and actually crave it to keep centered.  I don't have a problem being alone, but I do have the false belief, like you, that I am unlovable and I will die without having someone really see me and love me for me.  After our second break up and 6 months of NC, I was able to unlock my childhood false beliefs and start nurturing my "little girl".  I also looked at relationship patterns and I too, am redoing what I saw with my parents over and over in one way or another.

I am basically carrying on like you are with your SO.  But I wonder, when he is not dysregulated, is he able to reciprocate emotional giving, not just do repairs around your house?  When you are interacting with him, do you feel seen and appreciated as a special, precious person?  That is what makes it worthwile for me.

Ultimately everyone has different goals.  Stay mindful, appreciate happiness in the moment and don't try to set personal goals based on other people's advice.  (Including mine  )

Got to get to work.

Take care and my thoughts are with you through this experience

[MaybeSo]

Hi Rossanadann,

Thank you for your post, will likely respond more fully later when I'm have time. But yes. When he is not dysregulated he is very fun and treats me very well. He really can be a very lovely person when not dysregulated.

[seeking balance]

Works for me! I have a habit of giving but not receiving. I've let him give this time; it feels incredibly weird as I'm not used to it, but it's been good for me.

Does this really work for you in the overall big picture?

Back to the 2 core  themes that we clarified earlier:

1 - BPD partner and how to manage your feelings of worthiness while he is dysregulated. YES

So, you have managed your feelings of worthiness, because you talked about the root causes and have processed what you needed to do to protect yourself a bit while he is dysregulated.   So, is it fair to say - applying radical acceptance - he will trigger your core worthiness fears by his NPD behavior - you will go through a version of this processing each time he does.

It isn't like we never get triggered, it is in knowing our triggers and having a plan that is the key. 

We have no committed r/s or promises. If I meet someone else I would be honest about it. I hate dating but sooner or later I may meet someone. If he has no commitment to me, then thats the way it goes I geuss. ?

He could meet someone tomorrow! That would be more likely!

2 - are you capable of attracting a more stable partner  YES

Here is where I see a disconnect in what is likely to happen versus reality.  Again, you said I could ask the hard questions, so here goes... .   in your bio, things ended in June 2011 - exactly how long were you away before getting back together?  HOW did you get back together?  I only ask this because you are a staple on the leaving board and I had no idea the limited contact you referred to was really, for all putting it out there ... .   a relationship - even if sorta a friends with benefits.

I don't think you will attract a more stable partner until you learn how let yourself have healthy intimate relationships - we really will attract what we are around.  If you settle for unhealthy - how are you going to recognize healthy?  I mean, so many of the articles on this board talk about the cycle of dysfunctional relationships and this falls into that criteria.

I get that you have been in T and I also know you have done a ton of work. There is no real right/wrong way on this and rarely do people go to the depth you have for recovery.  If you choose to keep your BF in your life in this way, there is absolutely nothing wrong with this.  Be aware of your triggers towards unworthiness and process as you have - fantastic... .   honestly.

However, to think that staying in this pattern will result in some other healthy relationship, I think you know that is unlikely - you have had enough therapy and read enough books to know this.  If this pattern works for you, which it sounds like it actually does - how can you reshape your own thinking that will allow you to accept this for what it is?

I see this thread has been moved from PI to staying - it seems this part of your question was more about PI, so I hope you take in in that spirit, not in staying spirit.

[LetItBe]

Yea.  I know.  Yuck. He doesn't seem to get that a lot of his behavior when he's dysregulated comes off as hurtful or odd; to him,  it all seems normal. Like there isn't anyone on the earth who wouldn't feel like he feels and tell me the things he tells me. And I'm thinking, who does this stuff?  He implied his T even told him, he needs to let me know what his needs are. Yea,  maybe, but in a way that is palatable and makes sense in context.  That is still missing, completly

When I read what he said to you, it got my hackles straight up. . .how dare he, who does he think he is - it triggered me to the heartless, callous things my ex said to me when (although I didn't realise it at the time) he was in dysregulating mode.

 Whatever 'type' of r/s you have with someone - committed and monogamous, open and casual, platonic - you're entitled to respect.  To me, he's gone over the line with this.

What he said to you also got my hackles up.  He can't find his own "effervescence," so he projects onto you.  No bueno.  I realize it's part of the disorder, though, and with a pwBPD, it's par for the course.  Still... .   got my hackles up reading what he said to you.

I know what you mean about, "Who does this stuff?"  After reading one of my ex's recent, cold, self-centered emails, I asked my T friend, "Who IS this guy?"  She said, "He's a wounded soul who doesn't know how to love."

I agree, sm, about respect being mandatory in any kind of r/s.  

[connect]

Hi Maybeso,

I can see that you are a very intelligent, articulate person. You have been taking a deep look at yourself and your FOO issues. I also have FOO issues around my father and I am just starting a similar journey. Your insightful posts have clarified a few things for me in that area. I have been hovering over them for a while but it was good to see them clearly written down.

This situation with your ex does seem to have triggered a lot of FOO stuff for you (as it would) and I think it's really healthy that this situation has resulted in you thinking about YOU and not HIM. That's a healthy place to be and worthy of a big pat on the back. I am not there yet but would like to be able to do that at some point soon. Where I am right now a situation like yours makes me wrap myself up in knots thinking about HIM! So well done to you - it sounds like you are doing a good job there. Whatever path you take you will be ok with the frame of mind and situational reflex you have achieved for yourself. On a less serious note - get a dog! Honestly the happiest time in my life and when I picked the best emotionally available men was when I had a dog, all my maternal and attention and caring feelings went to her! When she sadly went to the kennel in the sky my ability to choose wisely seemed to go with her. Strange but true, the void left seemed to be the right size for a BPDbf to fit into!

[turtle]

I see this thread has been moved from PI to staying - it seems this part of your question was more about PI, so I hope you take in in that spirit, not in staying spirit.

I noticed this too -- and there's nothing that I've read in maybeso's posts that indicates she's staying.  Anyway... .   since this is now on the Staying Board, that means I'm out.

turtle

[patientandclear]

MaybeSo, I didn't see this till it got moved to Staying. Wow. What is it with these guys and their 5 year"travel the world" projects?  As you know, mine has embarked on just that.

And that departure and his subsequent announcement that he would randomly move to another city, did force a crisis of sorts for me, because try as I might, ultimately, I found "oh, great, I support whatever you thunk you need to do" to be at odds with my own sense of loyalty to the r/s and to what it means to genuinely care about and be connected to another person.  And I ended up protesting it, ever so gently & nicely, because to let it pass seemed like a form of self-abandonment.

That decision probably ended up costing me the r/s. After 8 months of nearly constant post-NC communication, he's disappeared completely. It's been a month since I wrote, & he's just gone.

So I've spent lots of time since, some assisted by y'all on Staying, debating whether it was worth it. In that thinking, I've mulled a lot about the limits of what one can accept, even from someone wBPD, in the name of radical acceptance, without doing some damage to our core sense of value and worth.

I feel like you ex's announcement of his planned departure, his statement of his boredom, his disrespect for all the dedication & beauty & insight & commitment & loyalty you've contributed to his life over the years that is embodied in "I'm bored" & "I'd be more committed to you if you'd handled your timing belt better" & "I wish you were more effervescent" (!) ... .   those things just ARE toxic to your self-worth. They are to anyone's, no matter how much you understand about BPD & how much you try to depersonalize and detach emotionally.

Fundamentally if you need to detach so much emotionally that this stuff doesn't hurt you (for me, enough that his sudden choice to completely change our communication dynamic, our ability to see each other, his permanent home, had no ability to hurt me or make me sad), what is left?  You know?  I think this is the inherent problem in trying to maintain these post-r/s intimate connections with pwBPD.  To survive, we have to strip it of almost all meaning.  If we start to sneak in some meaning, thinking there might have been some change & learning, as you say was sort of happening to you... .   we are setting ourselves up for hurt & a fall.  Yet if we don't ... .   what's the point?

[123Phoebe]

Hi Maybeso

I can really relate to your thread... .  

I have flipped-flopped around in my mind so much until it's fallen out at times!  Trying to figure out what the hell is going on here?  What IS this relationship?  It's craziness, hmmf.

Until I committed to the fact that this IS the relationship, and I must be pretty darn content to have spent almost a decade in it

We all have our own tolerance levels to ~weird~ circumstance... .    And a lot of the ~weirdness~ comes from my end.  I'll catch myself going into fight-or-flight mode now and get into Wise Mind; AMAZING!  Wow, to be able to catch my own neorosis totally freaks me out in a good way, a way that I can actually change my own behavior and thought processes... .    Good stuff

To see this relationship for what it is; a deep caring for someone who holds the mirror image of myself.  Kooky.  

The good outweighs the bad as far as I'm concerned  I am crazy about my guy.  Whether our more-than-what-"healthy"people-define-as-friendship will withstand the test of time-- I don't know.  He might meet someone else.  I might meet someone else.  Who knows?  But BPD doesn't even play a factor in it (in my mind anymore); people find other people to hang with all the time, even in the most 'seemingly normal "committed" relationships'.

Maybeso, if it works for you, it works for you

If he's being a douche, chalk it up to BPD and whether or not he crossed an important value of yours.  When he crosses into 'don't even go there' land, let it be known in a way that you know he understands.

And in the meantime, consider it history in the making

I just don't even take it that seriously anymore, because when I do I know it's my own issue and I can handle it.  He cannot handle it at times, but I can.  He'll do things to push me away and it's like, 'alright, I know what the score is'... . do my own thing and here he comes... .  I think that's 'effervescence' in his mind.  A little drama goes a long a way... .

These guys will do what they do and so do we... .    It's fine!  It's what actually defines the craziness!

I hope you're feeling good and that you don't get too down deep into the recesses of your mind.  Although, that can be good, too!  Sparks ~creativity~

This is your life!  Make it special

[patientandclear]

I completely agree w/you Phoebe that if it's good for us, it's good.  I think you've done an amazing job of illustrating that & demonstrating how not to let the BPDness be toxic.

But I feel like that is pretty unusual, maybe partly b/c of your skills & attitude, but maybe also because your guy hasn't decided to take off on a 5 year motorcycle tour of the world.  If he did, you were saying on my thread a couple weeks ago, you'd tell him it was NOT ok with you, & would pretty much end the r/s & disengage.  Like you're recommending to MaybeSo here, if her guy crosses an important line.  You were conveying "there are things that just cannot be swallowed or coped with or accepted even in these special BPD relationships. Some things are antithetical to a r/s."

I just want to say, MaybeSo, that your explicit & between the lines message in what you've written on this thread sounds like you're saying  your guy is in that territor, where harm is being done despite all your analytical understanding & skill BPD wrangling & detachment.  I hear "wow, that hurts."  I also recall a certain wise poster (named MaybeSo) writing a while back that it's a mass delusion that one can have sex w/o emotional involvement (at least a sustained sexual r/s w/the same person).  So what we've got here is emotional involvement and some creeping hope of change, and then a rather overwhelming dose of "I don't recognize your value and may not be here tomorrow."  I just feel like there are few human beings on the planet for whom that is not a poisonous cocktail.

And I am just coming to feel that "so, care less then" (not referring what I hear you saying, Phoebe, but rather to a lot of advice about depersonalizing, no expectations & detachment as strategies to not be destroyed by these relationships) doesn't really engage what is going on w/us in these situations, b/c if we don't much care, whether they stay or go, what is the f'ing point of all this? I guess many of us could argue that the point is that when it's good, it's good. I just feel like some of the abandonment & denial of our worth does harm no matter how well we understand it.

[123Phoebe]

P&C, MaybeSo's guy hasn't actually left yet.  It could be the BPD doin' the talkin'.

I believe, it's our attitude and the beliefs we hold about ourselves that makes a huge difference in any relationship, or just life in general.  That's not to say we don't care deeply for others, it's accepting that we have no control over what another person chooses to do, especially another person with a disorder.

And I have 'detached' for far less than threats of moving away.  When it hurts me, I detach.  And as I've said numerous times, we all have our own limits.

[MaybeSo]

Wow, lots of really good input, thanks to everyone, truly.

I'm not on a regular keyboard so can't reply as thoroughly and with quotes as I'd like but will start.

To be clear, I do not enjoy his company when he gets dysregulated. When it moved to comments I found hurtful, I did feel triggered. I wanted to put distance between us for the time being, and I did. It got just slightly heated, but it never got into an ugly argument. And I took care of myself by ending the visit. Not with a huge amount of drama-trauma, or any huge declarations about what it all means for the future. It was just more like, you are unhappy, I cant fix if for you but support you doing what you need to do, now bye bye. I already have a boundary with him about comparing me to other women; so, while he

started in that direction it was ended quickly.

In the past, this would have floored me. I would be devastated. Just emotionally gutted.

I cannot stress enough how good it feels to be this distanced emotionally from his stuff. Yes

I don't like hearing what he said, but I am not devastated. I do feel I've come far enough to

stay pretty grounded and I do see it as dysregulation and not personal.  That doesn't mean

I have to like it or tolerate it, and I don't, or stay and argue about it with him, and I did

not.

I took space. Yes it touches some old sore spots hearing a man you feel warmly toward, tell you "you are not enough". When he gets to that place, it has  to stop.  I can see even more

clearly ... . ,he was itching for a huge blow out reaction from me to off load the crappy way he has been feeling; this was brewing for about 2 weeks. I did not move into my usual dance pattern with him... .  I

started a few old dance steps ... .   and then caught myself.

This is a guy in a depression that has a habit of off loading it on loved ones. He knows

exactly the soft places to poke; it gets a reaction, and BAM, I'm acting out his suffering and

discharging it for him and with him. All the fireworks and dramatics  are just the same old

dance steps. He did not get that from me.

This IS different.

What does the future hold?

I don't know. And I'm okay with not knowing.

This is very different; in the past, I'd be a total anxiety ball in having to label or define what we are and nail it down or tie it up; committed, not committed, broken up or not, timelines that had to be met, having to know exactly where this is going or be miserable not knowing, needing answers that aren't there. I'd be on the phone trying to nail it down, are we still together, a couple, taking a break? How long? What are the rules?

Today, I dont know and I'm fine not knowing. I don't know what the future holds with him. Who knows? I love not caring. That's not the same as dislike or total indifference, there are things about him I like and I care for him. But it's not crucial. It's not mission critical to MY well being. I feel fine. This is very different.

I don't thing I'm totally free of whatever imago match this personality style holds for me, but I am much more free of the hooks that use to really do a number on me big time. Part if me wants to face down the beast and deal with it once and for all. To me, it's like taking a bit of poison to build up your overall immunity. Or, exposure therapy to get over PTSD or a phobia.

This 49 year old wounded man thinks he would be happier if I were more bubbly or everevescent. Ya, it's a totally crappy thing to say,  but it's also kind of stupid. Its not real. It's horrifying at first, getting a glimpse of the monster under the bed, but if you turn on the lights you can see, its just a pair of old shoes you left there.

It was a crappy, insensitive thing to say. Fighting with him, holding onto it, being devestated, mixing it up with my own long buried issues of self worth (not even realizing it at first)  that was when I totally bought into it deeply, emotionally... .   and his words would haunt me for months, like a nightmare.  Not anymore.  I didn't like it, it was yucky, triggering... .   And the evening ended without fireworks. It was time for him to go. He took his dysregulation and crappy feelings with him.

And I feel at peace.

This is very different. He doesn't have the power over me that he use to. This feels good

and very different.

[123Phoebe]

Ya, it's a totally crappy thing to say,  but it's also kind of stupid. Its not real. It's horrifying at first, getting a glimpse of the monster under the bed, but if you turn on the lights you can see, its just a pair of old shoes you left there.

  You're awesome!

[MaybeSo]

Hi P&C

I do think my choice is unusual. We could probably put a disclaimer on this thread "don't try this at home." Lol

Seriously, I'm processing my stuff here, and it's just my stuff, it shouldn't be seen as a recommendation or template for anyone else unless it resonates or offers something of value. It's just a process I'm churning through right now. I know there's no one size fits all.

I do feel it's near impossible to be intimate with someone and feel nothing.

I think im more emotionally detached then i was before... . But I don't "feel nothing" about this man or my time with him, and his comment hurt, because I do have warm feelings and a

history and a connection there. I'm just not hooked into it at the same, deep, visceral level

the way I used to be before, if that makes sense.

[MaybeSo]

Connect, I actually think your idea to get a dog is really interesting! I can see all that good unconditional positive  regard spilling over into attracting healthy relationships!

[wdone]

maybeso, thank you so much, from the bottom of my heart, for your honesty and for being so transparent. i struggle with all of the issues that you do, and am going through the same process and growth and questions that you are. this post has really helped me. much love to you, in the continued struggle for clarity and peace! 

[maria1]

I don't thing I'm totally free of whatever imago match this personality style holds for me, but I am much more free of the hooks that use to really do a number on me big time. Part if me wants to face down the beast and deal with it once and for all. To me, it's like taking a bit of poison to build up your overall immunity. Or, exposure therapy to get over PTSD or a phobia.

Yes yes and yes. I can relate. I can practice my stuff in a way with my pwBPD that I can with nobody else because you know what? It isn't all him! It never was.

I say do whatever you need to do Maybeso. You are your own leader and you didn't, as I understand it, start this thread asking for advice on whether you should cut him out of your life. The ability to grow as they push and pull, the ability to stand firm and continue on your own journey of self discovery is worth it to me. If it isn't worth it to others then that's OK too.

I don't think emotional intimacy can be part of the deal with a person with BPD traits/ attachment issues unless you are striving to have a relationship with them. It's my choice not to want that and how I try and handle my contact, albeit with advice from those who have experience of living with the disorder.

Every individual is unique. Every relationship/ friendship is unique. We all have our dealbreakers.

[maria1]

Also by moving this from PI to staying your original question is lost/ changed and I think that isn't positive. My view is there is more complexity to this than cut BPDex out and you'll be able to find a way to stay in a healthy relationship. Or stay and make the r/s more healthy. It is not so black and white.

I'm wondering if you may be choosing to hide yourself in an emotionally unavailable quasi relationship because the time isn't quite right for you yet. This relationship is further practice for you of facing your fears and playing out the new you with men you are outgrowing.

Just an extra thought or two.

[sm15000]

I already have a boundary with him about comparing me to other women; so, while he started in that direction it was ended quickly.

As you said, even with 8 years of therapy, when he is dysregulating he continues to say hurtful/spiteful things with no awareness.

Can you expand on the boundary thing above. . .so, you have had to put a boundary in place about him for example, making comparisons with other women.  Does this involve you telling him to go, you leaving or whatever if he does it?

Do you mention the fact he has done it when he is calm?

What will you do if he continues to do it. . .or do you accept it and your boundary is just to not inflame the situation?

All you have said I totally get, especially the 'flooding' like situation to 'face-the-fears' of BPD.  I think this is why sometimes we feel we want to re-engage.

[Cardinals in Flight]

Being free of the "need to know" what the future holds is pretty freeing for ones soul!  Allows us to kinda, carpe diem!, if you will 

And I'll just say this about a dog... .   awesome people hang out at the dog park   

You rock MaybeSo, we think and process in a similar fashion, I can relate!

CiF

[MaybeSo]

Sm15000,

Right, I know!  After 8 years, you would think!

I've done about 8 years of therapy, though, too.   And I still struggle to separate and tease out what's an old childhood wound from someone's elses crap, too,  but I'm doing better at it.

His comment while crappy, was also a kid with low self esteem who externalizes all scary bad feelings. He is very wounded, probably with less awareness. There's a part of him that thinks I have the power to be more of something that will make him feel loved and that i can provide something (everevescence) that will take his pain away. When I don't do that, his deep fear is that I withhold it because he is unworthy, too.  that's too frightening; it comes out as a demand to

a mean mommy... .   "you need to be more... . , ". He has to make himself feel better, I can't do

it for him. And the same goes for me. He can't make me feel worthy or not, it's in my

hands, my responsibility, ultimately.  Neither of our parents were in the room when we had

that talk, but it in a way, they were. That's what I want to get clear on. I don't know if he

will ever get clear of old ghosts in the room, BUT I want to! Every time I yelled at him for being a jerk it just reinforced for him that I was just another abusive parent.

My experience has been he starts talking about other women when he is getting dysregulated and feels crappy.  Something bad is happening inside of him when OW get brought up, almost without fail. He may look calm, but his face looks fearful and sad. All the OW stuff has something to do with his own lack of self worth, or maybe even deeper into some emptiness that I don't really understand fully. He thinks I'm withholding something from him, that would fill the emptiness. That feeling of emptiness is the one of the criteria for BPD that I actually don't personally understand fully cause I do not feel empty inside. This is where it goes to something deeper with him, than it does for me. The next new pretty mirroring object WILL make all that pain go away. For a while. Then it's back to the same pain again and again.

Basically, in the past, I was so hurt by his comments that the whole thing would just

explode into an ugly mess and we both feel even more traumatized and more wounded.

Today I'm just saying, dude, I can't fix this for you. You'll have to do this for yourself.

And the boundary is, I will take space when I need it, cause it was a sucky conversation.

[briefcase]

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