Hello, thank you for sharing your story.  What you are going through is so hard. Know that you are an amazing mother, and your daughter is only going to do what she wants to do (frequently not what we wish for them to do).  I think a great piece of advice I got was: you can not control your young adult child's choices. I wanted to get out in front of everything that I perceived was going to be an issue for my child (or actually was an issue) and help steer her the right way. I was finding that to be extremely exhausting and impossible.

As you said, you are providing something (the car/insurance) to a certain point, and that's it. That is incredibly generous of you. We have given our daughter certain allowances for living (she is in college right now, which is fortunate) but it will become her responsibility soon enough. We will be slowly transitioning over responsibilities to her and hope for the best. Hang in there as you decide what you need for your own peace...you have to protect you own well-being, too.

I am new to posting, but I have received huge, life-changing help from the posts I have read on this board. This is a wonderful group of people, and I thank you for sharing your stories.  My oldest child, my daughter (almost 20) has not been diagnosed officially, but she has exhibited classic behaviors and thinking of a person with bpd over many years.  She struggled with depression in silence for a time...held it very close to herself, and my husband and I became acutely aware that she was suffering on a random weeknight, as she texted saying she wanted to die (I was out with another child at that moment, and I still did not understand when I read that text...thought it was just hyperbole for a hard day at school).  I got home straight away and went to talk with her to find out what happened that day...next thing I knew there were police at the door as a friend of hers had called to make a request for a well-check. It was unreal. The low was related to a relationship gone bad...she started spiraling from there...very, very quickly and to great depths. This led to a journey which we now understand the depression and anxiety have been outgrowths of typical bpd thinking and behaving.  It's a long story, but basically right now I want to tell you all that if you are blaming yourselves, this awful disease has NOTHING to do with your parenting. My husband and I are happily married, we have always been committed to being the best parents possible. I stayed home with my children to raise them. We have a loving, stable home, dinners around the table, our children were involved in anything that interested them...sports, clubs, groups, church, they attended a great school, have had good friends and loving extended family...idyllic. No trauma. We are certainly not perfect parents, but we have given our children a very strong foundation in life, and continue to be committed to that. STILL, this insidious mental illness has come to my child. So DO NOT blame yourself...do not search for the moment that you created this, because you did NOT create this. Absolutely horrific. Nightmare. Its impact has been toxic to our whole household (to 2 parents, 2 younger siblings, and of course for my daughter at the epicenter).  For a good while, it ravaged our peace...I know it's taken years off my life (I joke that my telemeres are singed...like burnt, ), but we are getting back some peace now because things are different, and the things written on this board have helped us get there. It has been unfortunate but necessary that we substantially limit contact with our daughter...and she feels it's right for her, as well. I am looking forward to reading and posting more. This board gives me resolve to continue to do what is right for our family. Remember that you are not alone, and you are going to make it through, too.  May you see some light, even in the smallest way, today.

Thank you all again for sharing your thoughts and experiences. I’m really struggling to get my head round it all. I have joined an online forum that may be able to advise on the legal aspects, but I’m not able to post just yet.

I am working and my wife is not. She is due to start college next week though. I will be dropping my working hours to take care of our baby. However, my mum was going to be helping us out financially. Now my wife agrees that it’s not appropriate as I’ve said you’re treating mum badly I don’t want to accept her money. So my wife is looking at putting the baby in day care. She is devastated to be stopping breast feeding before they’re both ready. But that’s how stubborn she is. Then again, whoever knows what might happen. She is going to need me to help with her studies. That may sound codependent… but… she has no qualifications. Went to special needs school. Diagnosed with moderately severe dyslexia this year. Financially I don’t know how we can survive a split. I officially own two cars the big one she drives and tiny one I drive. Were we to share custody we would need to swap cars each time which I don’t see working out. We would have to sell the house I think and both look for something cheaper.

I can’t believe that I’m exploring all this just because she’s cruel and selfish and stubborn. I don’t like her at all at the moment. But I am honestly ok with staying with her forever if she’d just do this one little thing of letting my mum see the kids occasionally. I don’t think there’s anything else I can try to get her to change her mind. A work friend today remarked that I am “very detached” when talking about my wife and our issues. I was proud of this. I do still get upset when I’m being screamed at, but nothing near what I used to be. If we said goodbye on a bad note I’d be upset and worried all day and desperate to make things right. Now I’m just like, good I don’t have to see her all day. And usually she spontaneously moves on anyway.

I still don’t know what to do. I’m not asking whether my marriage is worth saving. I’m saying, this is a boundary I would like to uphold. But how? What does it look like? What do I actually say and do for the best outcome? Gagrl, I get your point. But it is not just that my wife is forbidding me from letting my mum see the kids. According to her she would be fine if we were divorced and I let my mum see the kids. It’s just that she’s so unhappy with mum and her actions that she refuses to allow anything of the kind such as me taking kids without her, meeting in a public place, mum staying in a hotel etc. apparently mum does not deserve to see the kids because she’s not interested in my wife.

They say to stand up to a bully… how? (Not forgetting mum lives six hours away…)

  Hello to this new platform for me. I happened across it while doing some research on BPD discard.
to think that until 2 years ago, I was ignorant to what BPD was, along with so much of the terminology that goes along with this terrible disorder.

I met such a terrific person 3 years ago. And man I tell you - he seemed to check ALL the boxes for a good friendship!
He was quite younger than myself, so I really did not expect nor did I feel that anything would come out of it. He told me that his dad was mistreating/abusing him at home and he merely needed someone to listen to him when he felt down.
Being that I know how this felt, I could not turn him away. What could it hurt to listen and help this seeming poor guy, since I was the older more mature guy.

When I say he was a charmer....I mean he could charm the bark off of a tree!! He was so intelligent and talented too.
After about  a year in this friendship, he began to refer to me as his "best friend and uncle". Which actually was flattering to me. He had even told me numerous times that I treated him better than his biological father, whom he bashed often when speaking with me. I felt so sorry for this person. He really needed help, so I thought.

Within this 1 year timeframe is when he told me he had BPD. He mentioned vaguely that this was "one" of his disorders. I still did not delve deep into this disclaimer of his. Nor did he ever reveal to me any of his other mental challenged. Mainly because it sounded so innocent, harmless. I did not question him either to avoid making him uncomfortable.
But I did encourage him to get therapy. I offered to accompany him if he needed support. This never transpired.

I felt comfortable around him. Since I live alone, I told him that if he ever needed to either take a break from his home life with his one parent, his father, or if he ever felt so threatened that he would feel he needed to come live with me, all he would need to do is ask. The summer of 2024 he moved in with me. And for a spell, everything appeared normal. Until it wasn't.

I noticed that he repeated fabricated stories that were unnecessary and totally untrue. Many times I just overlooked these tales, justifying that it was perhaps part of his BPD. The times I would call him out on these lies, he'd apologize, many times with tears in his eyes. He would ask me to continue to be patient, which I was. I would continuously forgive him, overlooking the harm it was causing me. This went on for 8 months living under the same roof. In time I found out that he was being deceptive from the outset, for 2 plus years up to this point. So almost for 3 years!! Finally I was outraged and shouted at him so harshly  "STOP LYING TO ME!" It was explosive. To this day I regret my reaction. I have apologized to him repeatedly. Hoping that we could gain something from it all and become better friends. He even said that it was alright and that if I needed to do so, I could do it again. Which I found that to be an odd invite!??!
Immediately after this upheaval, he gathered some of his personal items and moved out. I mean like a steaming bull. He was HOT with me. I even felt threatened because he was so bitter and unreasoning. Especially after telling me that he forgave me.
I could not figure out what I did so wrong when he was the person undermining this friendship.

He left many of his cherished possessions in his room. These items remain in tact to this very day. He has returned occasionally to gather some things. But all in all, most of his personal belongings are still in his room. I do not want to go through the labor and emotions to pack it up or do anything with this stuff. It is his and he needs to be a man and get them if they hold any value in his heart. Personally I feel I did enough for him and I do not want to extend him any other favors. I am done expending myself in his behalf.

I am sorry that this message is so lengthy. I just wanted to vent.

While he and I were friends, he slandered many of his other friends. Disowning many of them. Even his family members. I should have figured that someday it would be me in their position. But I loved this person as a whole. Now he has monkey branched back to these people that he claimed to have disliked, including his so called abusive father. And I am sure he is now bad mouthing me.

I felt responsible for his leaving our friendship so abruptly. I still feel hurt that he would throw me away like garbage, when he caused all of this chaos and betrayal...I didn't! All I ever tried to do was show him his worth. Yet for 5 months now he has ghosted me, not returned my calls or texts just to say hello. Nor has he attempted asking for his personal items from his room.

I am getting better now, in part because of therapy and some other platforms. Deep within my soul I know that I was could have been a good person for him, had he placed any value on a true, loving, giving, loyal friendship. I am trying to wrap my head around this entire experience. Because, had I a friend who treated me as well as I did him, I would be extremely grateful for that person in my life. Especially if I had to really endure the tumultuous life he claimed to be having with his dad. If indeed any of his life stories were factual/real.

I have/am learning a lot from this. I truly feel for the many people who suffer at the cost of pwBPD. I feel bad for those afflicted with BPD, because they miss out on lovely, vibrant, and nurturing relationships due to their not getting the help that is available.

Thank you for allowing me to exhale here on this platform. I need to be strong, because he may one day look around the corner wanting to rekindle a friendship. I do not want to fall for this type of treatment from him or anyone ever again. Without the ingredient of trust - any fruitful, trustful relationship cannot grow.

The blaming typically doesn't fade, nor even reduce.  The typical pattern is that it expands into the person's other relationships.  Right now it's directed primarily onto your mother.  The question becomes, Who's next?  You?  If you're the breadwinner in the family then that may be why you haven't yet faced the full brunt of her ire and negative perceptions.

That's what happened to me.  First it was occasional spats.  Then rejected friends.  Then my family ostracized.  Then me.  Even divorce didn't "fix" it, though it did help to have the Court's Authority to back me up as parent.  But what can you say to a preschooler who laments, "Mommy told me she would adopt a child who would obey her"?  Or a few times as he grew, "My mommy disowned me"?  Yes, it does happen, it happened to me, more than once.

You're an adult and even so it's hard for you when you experience this discord.  It's even more devastating on children.  I don't see how your children won't be impacted to some extent in future years, the only unknown is how much.  And which ways would be best for you to mitigate some of the impact.


This is about assessing - and over time reassessing* - your priorities.  Some day it may come down to a choice between prioritizing your spouse or prioritizing your children if/when "both" becomes impossible.

* You always have the right to reassess prior decisions based on added insight or concerning changes.

I hope I'm responding to your kind reply properly...it was interesting - when I went to the board to read it, I couldn't find it, but the link an the automatic email brought me to your response.   Thank you for your take on this, it is helpful to frame this as her "not coming" as possibly being a way to protect herself...and also for me to be to reminded that folks are often eager to share their own plans, and are often just making conversation about the holidays. True in many cases. There are the folks who would truly want to know - and they're a bit harder for me to get past without sharing her real intentions/plans. In time, I'm going to have to somehow learn to be comfortable with the reality, as best I can.

Hi there thanks for taking the time to reply! So my long term goal is to have a long term relationship with my daughter and therefore with my 4 grandchildren. During her teens and throughout her adult life were never close, but at times we were able to connect very well, and I always wondered why it wasn’t a constant healthy relationship.

So to give you some perspective, my daughter always made me look like the villain, when she would speak to my closest sibling (her uncle). I did have issues with my romantic relationships stemming from codependency and people pleasing.But regardless, I was always the best parent I could be to her. My then husband, her father, had substance abuse problems and we split when she was 4, and it was rough on her. He was an inconsistent presence in her life after the divorce, and the few times he did spend time with her, he would bad mouth me, play the victim so therefore in her early teens she would throw it in my face and blame me for the divorce.

 I had a very tumultuous childhood, my mom has undiagnosed mental illnesses which run on both her parents’ sides. I’m currently seeing a therapist, and working on myself. The therapist is also helping me deal with my daughter’s estrangement.

My daughter is 38 y/o, has 4 children and is married to her high school sweetheart whom I consider to be an emotionally abusive man. He has terrorized my oldest grandson who’s now 16, and my daughter would just sit there quietly watching it all unfold, so if I ever tried to bring it up to her, she would be dismissive and would become very defensive and angry. My son in law doesn’t get along with me, and he doesn’t hide it. I’ve tried anything and everything to be on his good side, but to no avail.

My daughter lives about 50 mins away from me. After my fiancé and I retired, we moved to the state where my daughter lives in hopes of mending/work on our relationship issues(we moved here before she stopped speaking to me) and the this year on Mother’s Day, one of my brothers called to check up on me and with well wishes, and that’s when we started a convo regarding my niece who has been diagnosed with BPD and BD and was admitted to an inpatient psychiatric unit when she was 17.

Hopefully this gives you a better perspective of my situation, I know it’s a lot to read and I appreciate you taking the time to do so!

I've found the only reason conflict b/t my ex and I has decreased over time is that she now has so much conflict with others in her life that she doesn't have time to fight with me.  Or I guess to look at it another way - given that she seemed happier when we were fighting and in a state of heightened emotions - she's getting "her fix" from these other people and doesn't need to fight with me. 

For the first couple years post divorce, the story was almost the same: baseless allegations (sent via email) that I was "behaving aggressively" toward her, or engaging in "parental alienation" (which of course she was telling me at the same time she was telling our daughter I made her bad food, never loved her, never wanted to be her dad, was going to leave her and never see her again, etc.), and just general insults and difficult behavior whenever I needed to switch days, or she wanted extra time with our daughter.  I rarely engaged because I really did not like her, resented her deeply for what she put me through, and did not want to see her or even think about her if possible.  And as my D's therapist quipped "I see a lot of exes repeat the same patterns once divorced that they had when they were married.  I tell them they didn't get their money's worth in the divorce!"  I wanted to get my money's worth.   

Now, BPDxw has two more kids with her longtime BF.  They've both gone through lots of money problems and bouts of unemployment.  she brought her parents and some of her extended family over to live here (mom and dad and cousin and his wife), and one-by-one gotten in fights and thrown them all out...who knows where they live now.  And my daughter tells me that  BPDxw and her BF still fight "constantly"... throwing things, screaming, etc.  Her own mom called CPS on her BF, and he called CPS on her mom.  Nothing ever happened, but you can see the patterns continue even without me there.  Glad to be out of it, and hope over time my daughter decides to spend less time there for her own sanity. 

 I am 3 years in from my daughters diagnosis and 30 years in trying to figure out what is wrong with my  once amazing daughter! She seems to be getting worse as she gets older and is now 43 and worse than when she was 18. She managed to function through with her personality, charm, and looks but that does not cut it any more. Her tongue is as sharp as a razor blade during her manic moments and cuts very deep....she ended up living in her car for 2 years and the last 8 months in various hotels which has sucked my bank account dry and not tenable. She had the opportunity handed to her to move to Florida and start over at her Aunts house and helping in their urban farm business.....got her on train last weekend after 3 tries and she made it as far as Penn station and turned around and came back....she is her own worst enemy. I told her the bank is now closed, the new chance off the table and I will always love her and of course she can contact me but she chose to come back to nothing and I just can't anymore. For 3 years she has survived and done NOTHING to help herself...she was handed every phone number and contact and agency to call and help by DTA etc.....too proud....so is once again living in her vehicle.....which I own and pay for. But I wont have her live on the street so that particular aspect I will ensure for her. I am so alone with this....people think she is just stubborn which she is but this behavior is so self destructive!! EVERY decision she makes is the wrong one....every time. I do not want to lose her but I can not continue this emotionally, physically or finacially....

You're a good person, thankful, and your wife is not.  She puts her emotional needs, and paranoia - not physical needs, not "real" needs - above all else in your home. 

I remember, years ago, I first reached out online for help b/c my marriage was chaotic and affecting me at work and affecting my sanity.  I eventually also saw a therapist for a few months to gather which was was up.  Anyways, I noted online that my mom had told me if she was causing problems in my marriage, she would back off, go no contact, and leave us alone.  Someone commented that my mom cared more about our marriage than my own wife did.  My mom was willing to put her feelings aside for that, but my wife (now ex-wife) was not.  That hammered home to me the one-sidedness of the relationship, and the inherent selfishness of my wife's behavior.  I was also saying things like "She's mostly a good mom, it's just this one issue."  But it was not just "one issue" it was a pattern of unhinged behavior, paranoid thoughts, threats, etc.  A full-blown propaganda campaign that was directed at me, to keep me from being myself and having a life or personality outside of whatever my wife decided I should have in the moment. 

Whatever you decide to do, keep in mind that this behavior from your wife isn't going to change, because again the problem isn't anything your mom did or said, it's your wife, and her behavioral disorder.  She'll continue to bring up things your mom did - even if your mom is not around - and she'll invent new problems to fight about.  As your kids grow, chances are good that one of them will get branded the "black sheep" of the family for not toeing "mom's line" and you'll get dragged into fighting with your own kids. 

Kids learn from observing their parents, and they trust and respect their parents (at least until their parents give them a reason not to), so remember that they're observing and learning from all this. 

If you decide to stay in the marriage now because you are happy with your life as it is now, that's fine, and it's your decision you have to live you with, so I'm not saying one way or the other what you should do, but don't let a desire to stay in the marriage blind you to the reality of the situation, because your situation will change, and most inevitably, your kids are going to grow up and their needs have to come first, not another adults.