You've been in a difficult and distressing home life for many years, but it no doubt feels better to have decided a different path for yourself.

Be aware that the risks of conflict and even DV are higher in the months just before and after separation.  Anything may happen, so be prepared whatever happens, whether shen tries to pull you back or she schemes to "frame you for mischief" or poses as a victim to put you at a disadvantage in a divorce.  People with BPD traits (pwBPD) may be disordered and mentally ill but they also have had decades to develop master skills of manipulation.  She may very well notice a slight change in your attitude or patterns.

Now even more than in the past you need to be especially calm and not even raise your voice to her.

Thank you very much this definitely makes sense.  My stepson's responses to his sister were very angry - and not like him (or how he used to be) at all - hence why I'm a little worried about him:

"I'm sure you sat there while they talked bs about me and my family same thing they did to our brother and and same thing they did about you." 

"If I could change my last name I would but I'm stuck with it because kids have it." 

"You can pretend like we have the world's best dad but the truth is he never wanted any of us."
 
"This family is a f'ing joke and once you see that you'll understand." 

"I'm not normal anymore, I'm f'ed up because of this. But at least I can protect my boys from them."

"When things get hard in this family, we abandon them - and my sons will never experience that."
 
And this one that I found interesting: "I know you all blame my wife but she has nothing to do with any of this."

It broke my heart to read this and to feel such disdain towards his father when before the estrangement began, they spoke to each other every day.  My stepson would facetime us almost every night with our grandson.  To this? 

Hi Ted,

You've come to the right place.  Based on what you wrote, I think you did the best you could.  I'm sorry you had to call for a wellness check, but if your niece is making earnest suicide threats, I think it's the right thing to do.  That she was taken to the hospital tells me she truly was in a bad state--she couldn't convince the police that she was fine, and then her landlord approached her about a disturbance!  It sounds to me like going to the hospital was a good thing, because it stabilized her enough to be discharged.  Maybe if it happens again, she could be held for longer.  Maybe then she'd get the help she really needs.

I think you're right to be concerned that your niece might accuse you of something terrible, for example molestation, assault or rape.  I think this is fairly common among pwBPD, including the pwBPD in my life.  My advice would be not ever to be alone with your niece; always have a witness present.  That might not stop her of accusing you, but at least you'd have a witness.  If you are gravely concerned, consider recording all your interactions with her.  Also, keep records of all the correspondence from your niece, should you need to provide evidence of her threats.  If she calls for a wellness check on you, my guess is that police would see you and surmise in about twenty seconds that you're absolutely fine.  I personally wouldn't worry about that.  She can threaten calling the police all she wants; you have no control over whether she does that or not. 

It sounds to me like your niece is under a lot of stress and is taking it out on you.  That her employer asked her to take a month off is telling; my guess is that she has been acting erratic at work.  If you are in the US, HIPPA rules prevent hospitals from sharing patient data with others without patient consent.  So I don't think the employer "found out" that your niece had an episode which landed her in the hospital, unless she outright told them.  And I just don't think that an employer would dare ask a competent employee to take a leave of absence based on spending one day in the hospital.  Rather, my guess is that your niece has been acting erratic in the workplace, and they had grounds to ask her to take a leave of absence.  Maybe that's why she was threatening suicide in the first place--because she knew she was at risk in her employment situation.  I think you can't really trust how pwBPD portray a situation, as they see everything from a victim perspective.  In my experience, there is a high tendency to distort the truth, even outright lie, to protect one's image and status, and, most of all, to avoid shame.  Core issues for pwBPD are a victim identity, blame-shifting and avoiding taking responsibility.

As for your sister's attempts to get her daughter back on meds, that's noble of her, yet my opinion is that nobody can force your niece to take meds.  Your niece is an adult, and it's her choice to take meds or not.  My guess is that your niece doesn't think she needs any meds, because she thinks her mom is the one who needs to be medicated!  So I think it's a losing battle to try to "fix" your niece's life, because it's impossible to fix her life unless she does the work herself.  If you or your sister are providing ANY support to her--financial, emotional, logistical, administrative, etc.--you might be enabling the status quo of dysfunction.  If you read these boards, the general consensus here is that a pwBPD has to "hit bottom" before they decide to accept professional help to change.  In the meantime, loved ones are caught in a situation of trying to "help," trying to "fix" things when it's impossible.  In fact, the longer you enable dysfunction, the worse things might get.

In the meantime, what can you do?  You might read through these boards for support.  Know that you didn't do anything wrong, no matter how much your niece tries to convince you otherwise.  If she's accusing you of outrageous things, that's most likely projection on her part.  If she's saying that you shoud kill yourself and that you deserve to die, that's code for how she thinks about herself.  She's ruminating about it so much that it emerges as an accusation.  That's surely projection.

Hi Everyone,

Well, I hate to start off with a very concerning post, but here is what is happening:

My niece is 36 years old and has BPD. It's not diagnosed but from what I'm seeing I have no doubt. My sister and I went to visit her. She lives on the other side of the country so we flew out. The visit did not go well. I believe she was just emotionally stressed by our visit AND has had many fights with her mother over time. So it turned into fights and arguments. At one point a screaming match occurred between her and her mother. Upon our return home she continued to call and text us angry and screaming, saying that because we had a loud argument in her apartment she was going to get evicted. There was no evidence of that but that's what she claimed.

A few nights later she called me and said she was going to kill herself, kept threatening to slit her wrists, saying that I was always siding with her mother and it was all my fault. I told her I needed her to tell me she was going to be OK or I had to have her checked on. Or that she should call a suicide hotline. She just kept saying she was going to kill herself. I contacted the suicide help line and they recommended that I call the police and ask for a Wellness check. I was trying my best to make it as non-invasive as possible. The police came to her apartment could not calm her down and had to sedate her and literally drag her away. They took her to the hospital and she was released the next day. I don't know the details of what happened either in her apartment or at the hospital. At any rate her employer did find out and put her on a one month break, claims they will re-hire her at that time, but we are not sure. And the landlord came to speak to her due to the commotion. There may be a danger of her being evicted because of the extreme commotion. We don't know what's going to happen in either case at this point, but now she 10 times as angry at me. She's threatening me. Threatening to call the police on me in the middle of the night so that I'll know how it feels, claiming that I ruined her life, telling me that I should kill myself and I deserve to die.

She has calmed down somewhat, even telling my sister and in text that she is sorry and that she loves us. But I know how it goes. If things stay smooth, if she gets her job restored and stays in her apartment we may be able to get past this crisis. But if she loses her job and if she gets evicted who knows what she'll do. My concern is she could call the police on me in the middle of the night for a suicide check. Or worse. She has spent time staying with me on various occasions and I wouldn't put it past her to have her claim that I raped her. I'm seeing things on Youtube about men going to jail because of convincing testimony from partners who claimed all sorts of things against the men and or women they were in relationships with. My sister just managed to get health insurance for my niece, and we're hoping that she'll get back on the medication she was on previously, Seroquel. In the past that seemed to help. We are also encouraging her to get into therapy, the dialectical therapy that we've seen listed online for BPD. Hopefully she gets better. I have to say I'm feeling quite traumatized by the way she's been threatening me both on the phone and in text.

My question is can anyone give me some advice on how to handle this? Please try not to "scare me", it's bad enough as it is. But just, how can I handle this, how should I talk to her, what to avoid, etc.

Thank you.

Hi there,

I'm sorry about the recent turn of events.  It sounds to me like your stepson might be having a trauma-like response.  My guess is that his homelife is extremely stressful---with babies and a BPD wife.  My other guess is that BPD wife might be planting a BPD-like, all-black narrative in your stepson, insisting that he had a "terrible" childhood and goading him to cut off contact with family.  This serves to isolate your stepson, ensuring that he devotes all his time, money and emotional energy to cartaking (and over-functioning for) his BPD wife.  Yet at the same time, this isolation can begin to distort his own feelings of self and self-worth.  He might start to believe his wife's delusional re-interpretation of history:  that family is toxic, that he should block them, that he should "punish" them for a terrible past.  Moreover, she's probably punishing him if he dares to check his messages, which might explain why messages from you remain unopened.  He'd do practically anything to avoid her wrath.  Besides, he might be too busy tending to babies, his wife's neediness, taking care of household matters and earning money.  He could feel so overwhelmed that even the notion of a quick family visit would seem impossible, especially knowing that his wife would "punish" him afterwards.  He might feel embarrassed for you to find out what a mess his life is in, too.

I guess I'd advise, take this as a sign that your stepson is really stressed out, not as a true indictment of his childhood.  I think it's a trauma-like response of fight or flight.  Fight might look like nastiness and mean accusations.  Flight might look like blocking, avoiding and lying as a defensive measure.  Oh, when your stepson claimed his dad had blocked him:  he might have said that to protect himself, because if it ever got back to his BPD wife that he was having "unauthorized" contact with "toxic" family, he would be punished dearly for it.  I'm not saying that's what happened, but I am saying it's a distinct possibility.  He's lying to protect himself from greater harm.  My guess is that his wife found out about the baby congratulations and twisted things.  Something along the lines of, Well your parents are horrible, they don't do anything for us, they should have sent money, words are cheap, they're narcissistic, selfish people, they don't care about you one bit, they never did, you should block them, they're toxic.

It has been quite a while since I last posted. My stepdaughter-in-law is the one with BPD, and many of my previous posts discussed the family dynamics surrounding that situation. For anyone unfamiliar with the background, there is a recent history (2 years) of estrangement, conflict, and periods of no contact. I'm posting because I am becoming increasingly concerned about my stepson's mental health based on recent communications he had with his half-sister, which she shared with my husband and me.

My husband has been estranged from his son for nearly two years. During that entire time, my husband continued to reach out periodically, if only to say "I love you" and remind his son that he would always be there if needed. He never pushed, never demanded a response, and tried very hard to follow his son's lead.

Last October there seemed to be a glimmer of hope. After a year of silence, my stepson reached out asking to meet. The meeting went reasonably well, and afterward they began messaging occasionally. His son would send pictures of our grandson, share updates about his tattoo work, check in from time to time, and eventually let my husband know that he and his wife were expecting another baby.

However, the relationship remained entirely through messenger. There were no phone calls, no visits, and no attempts to spend time together. Still, my husband remained patient and hopeful.

A few months ago, their second son was born. My stepson sent photos of the baby, and my husband congratulated both parents and wished them well. A few days later, my husband's youngest daughter asked him why he had blocked his son. My husband was shocked because he had never blocked him and never would. The daughter explained that she had run into her brother, who told her that "Dad blocked me."

My husband checked his messages and discovered that the photos his son had sent had been removed and that the messages he had sent after the birth had not been opened. We were completely confused. My husband continued reaching out with no response.

Then, two days before Father's Day, his son messaged asking if he wanted to go fishing. Unfortunately, my husband already had plans but told him he would love to go another day. That message still has not been opened.

For additional context, when my stepson cut off my husband and me, he also cut off both of his half-sisters. He occasionally bumps into the younger sister because they live in the same small town, but he completely cut off his older sister, despite her attempts to reach out over the past two years.

Yesterday, the older sister contacted him because she is pregnant and wanted to share her news with him. She also told him that she missed him and did not understand why he had cut her out of his life.

His response shocked all of us.

He expressed tremendous anger, saying that she had only reached out a few times as though that wasn't enough. He talked about how dysfunctional the family is, said that their father never wanted any of his children, and stated that he needs to protect his own children from his father and me. He said that my husband's youngest son, who died from an overdose a few years ago, died alone because the family abandoned him. This is simply not true. Everyone tried repeatedly to help him.

He also blamed his father for not being there enough during childhood. My husband freely admits that he was not father of the year when his children were young. He was young himself and often worked two jobs to provide for the family. He acknowledges his mistakes and has taken responsibility for them.

I can only speak to what I have personally witnessed during the past 12 years that I have been part of this family. During that time, I have seen a father who loves his children deeply, who has always been there for them no matter what, and who would do absolutely anything for them. I have watched him support them emotionally, financially, and practically whenever they needed him, often putting their needs ahead of his own. While I understand that his children may have memories from earlier years, the man I have known for the past 12 years has been a devoted father who loves his children unconditionally.

My stepdaughter responded with kindness and empathy while also gently challenging some of his statements. She told him that his feelings were valid but that he could not continue blaming their father for everything. She told him that she missed the brother she used to know, that the person responding to her did not feel like the brother she remembered, and that she hoped he would seek help to work through his anger. She ended by telling him she loved him.

His responses only became angrier. She told me that while she wishes him well, she feels she now has closure.

My husband read the messages and is devastated. He feels that after two years of being cut off, then having hope that things were improving, only to be cut off again without explanation, this latest situation may simply be too much for him emotionally.

He lost one son to addiction and death. Now he feels as though he has lost another son by choice.

I don't know whether this level of anger is related to unresolved childhood issues, guilt over his brother's death, influence from his wife with BPD, possible depression, or something else entirely. The anger seems far bigger than the original conflict that led to the estrangement.

At this point, my husband feels he may need to step back for his own emotional well-being, but doing so feels like giving up on his son.

Has anyone experienced this kind of prolonged estrangement combined with extreme anger and rewriting of family history? Did your loved one eventually come back? And how do you come back from this?  

For those following, I have found a way out.

But first, yes, I have decided that I need to get out. The problems are not going to change or get fixed.

I have a friend who is well-off, and has agreed to give me a loan when I am ready, to get an apartment to move to.

I have some projects to finish on the house. Eventually it will need to be sold, and if I can finish these major projects the house should sell for (significantly) more money, which will be better for me financially. We can pay off the debts and still have money left.

That means dealing with the problems for a few more months. I have been waiting for over 20 years for things to get better, I can get through a few more months.

It feels good to have a plan. More details another time when I have more time to wrote. Thank you for your support.

My problem is that after spending time at this site and seeing so many relationships rebound...only to blow up spectacularly...made me realize that I couldn't even trust my own feelings.  That cycle never seems to fully end and we'd always be adjusting while our partner plays the perpetual victim.  I'm sorry, but that's not for me anymore.  I don't want to rescue, or take abuse, or anything in between.

I think every one of us has thought that at some point. Our eternal optimism keeping us engaged, despite the red flags flying all around us. I believed her 'previous partners didn't treat me right' routine as at the time I didn't know this actually meant that she was the one not treating partners right

I was constantly waiting for her to finally see that I was 100% genuine in everything I said and did and that she'd finally drop the drama and chaos, believe in me totally, and we'd be a rock-solid couple, living like we were in those wonderful first few months. In hindsight, having learned about BPD, you now see the utter impossibility of that ever happening.

You know what life has been throughout your marriage.  If you allow her back into your life, you know the recent relief you've experienced (distance apart from the flying monkeys due to the separation) would end.  Standing as we are on the outside of your situation - we can't make your decisions for you - would continuing the mostly separate living arrangement be better than allowing her back?