Thank you, Notwendy, for your kindness and support. I am sorry to hear of your losses as well. It really helps to hear from someone outside my circle that I am not doing "something wrong" in my grief and confusion. I appreciate your insights as well, they really make so much sense looking back. It gives me some comfort knowing I couldn't have "saved them" from their parents, though I will always wish I could save them the pain and chaos.

I will strongly consider going back into counseling, I had some poor luck finding a good match or they kept leaving the practice and passing me along to someone new. I will also look into those groups, I have not ever considered those programs before. But it makes sense.

Thank you for your kind words and support, CC43. What you said really hits the nail on the head, I believe I always got "a distorted, self-serving version of events, where she was perpetually the aggrieved victim." but never truly saw it until now. I do often feel like I am the eldest but I am the youngest child and the only who does not suffer from severe mental illness, so I have always felt the need to caretake, even after moving away years ago I tried so hard to do so from afar. Luckily, after years it has naturally diminished the need for my presence to caretake emotions in the family and is much less so now. That was a big hurdle for me though for about a decade.

Thank you for taking the time to empathize and make me feel less alone in this. It helps so much to read what others experience and be able to relate to them.

Thank you so much for your kindness and insights, these realizations are very new to me. I never noticed the guilt and fear in the relationship apart from fear of hurting my sibling or fear of losing them. It makes a lot of sense now. It helps a lot to hear that I did not "fail to do more" or "save them".

Thankfully the children are safe and away from the household now and children services is monitoring the situation on the one underage child. All are getting therapy and really focusing on taking care of themselves apart from one of the elder children who doesn't feel ready yet. I believe they are taking the right steps to heal and grieve and set boundaries now where they can. They are all working to resolve the grief and pain as well and navigate the relationship with their parent. I am very proud of them.

That “bizarro world” feeling you’re describing makes a lot of sense. When things shift this fast and this much, it can feel really disorienting even when part of you understands what’s going on.

When a relationship feels like it might actually end, it’s pretty common to see a surge of effort to try and pull things back together. More warmth, more attention, showing up in ways that haven’t been there in a long time. On the surface it can look like things are suddenly better, but a lot of the time it’s coming from the fear of losing the connection, especially when that connection still feels central.

At the same time, there can be a different version of the story happening with other people. Especially when there’s a lot of emotion tied to how things might look from the outside. As you probably already know, for a lot of pwBPD, feelings like shame and guilt can sit pretty close to the surface, so how things are seen by others can carry a lot of weight.

Holding both of those at once, what you’re experiencing directly and what’s being said around you, can really mess with your sense of what’s real.

What stands out is that you’re still clear in your read of things, even with everything suddenly looking “better” on the surface. That’s not easy to hold onto.

With the next step coming up, things may shift again once it becomes more real.

How are you doing with it today?

After years and years of struggling in my marriage, I reached a point where I could no longer ignore what I was feeling or continue living in a way that didn’t feel emotionally safe or sustainable. A few days ago, I told my wife that I want a divorce.

Even writing that still feels surreal.

Since telling her, I’ve been seeing patterns more clearly than ever. And strange behavior from my wife. I think she's been possessed by aliens.

The talk itself was strangely calm. She didn't freak out, she had noticed a lot of my distance and said she thought I might do something like this. She has been mostly in denial and bargaining since I told her. She said she doesn't want this. She knows she will win me back and I will love her again. I waited a couple days before we sat down and told the kids (19f, 21m). That conversation went ok. I went first then my wife spoke. She wanted to make it clear to the kids that she was not going to go along with the divorce, it's not what she wants and will keep praying/working for our marriage.

There’s been a strong push for reconciliation—prayers for our marriage, kindness, warmth, talking about repairing things, acting like everything could still be okay. At the same time, there are moments where I can feel tension building underneath, like things could flip quickly. It's been like bizarro world though. Ever since I told her it's crazy how much her personality has changed. She's doing things she never does, or hasn't done in years and it feels more strange then anything. Trying to be a perfect wife and mom.

It was almost comical. I came home later after we had the talk. She was all dolled up in a dress, makeup and jewelry. She was trying to be seductive. She said she's stopped drinking, threw out the alcohol in the house and says she's done for good. She has been more helpful around the house. All of the sudden cleaning up and asking if she can help with dinner. She wanted to come to the airport to pickup our daughter at 6am which is especially strange because I do 100% of the running around taking kids to dr appts or rides wherever needed. She nearly never does. She baked cookies last night. She's been laughing and joing more. Easy going - telling me to take my time when I leave the house. Hasn't done that in years. It's so transparent to me. I know that it won't last and it's just not real.

What’s especially disorienting is the contrast between how she’s presenting externally to others vs what I’m experiencing directly. It seems like she's been in a smear campaign even before I told her about the divorce (she was sensing something was up). I know that because my MIL and Sis in law pretty much ghosted me 2-3 weeks before I told my wife about the divorce. And they've been almost silent since then which is unusual. They haven't reached out after the divorce news, even when I sent them a heartfelt letter. It let's me know whatever my wife is telling them must make me look like a pretty horrible person. And it's surprising because they've seen some pretty horrific behavior from my wife. The last family trip we took my wife was raging for 2 days and my sis in law almost took a flight home early because of my stbxBPDw's behavior and said she didn't know if she could ever travel with her again . Also I overheard her talking with her mom saying that in 6 months or a year she would drink again, that this was just a reset.

Some of the things she's told people this week and over the past couple of weeks I've learned (all lies):

• Told my aunt and sister and probably others I had a gay affair
• That I said no man would ever love her if she left me
• I’ve controlled every aspect of her life
• she’s afraid of me and that I’m angry
• I’m trying to ruin her career
• I’m trying to “put her in prison"
• Stated her drinking was caused by my behavior and needs it to cope with me
• I'm trying to trap her using cameras (I setup internal cameras in the spare room I moved to)

It's confusing but not too confusing. Clearly she's been setting up narratives to others while still trying to play me and pull me back in?

It's not changing my mind. I've seen these bursts of good behavior and even sobriety before. She doesn't know that I hired a lawyer yet. That will come in the next 24-48 hours which will probably really trigger her. That will make it really real. I was taking this one step at a time. The next step will be giving her a letter from my lawyer and seeing if she wants to do this cooperatively or if I just have to file and move this forward.

I'd like to share a few thoughts that you may be able to take to heart in addition to our empathy and compassion for the loss of your nephew.

Be assured that no one here expects you have done more or attempted more.  You're not a trained professional, counselor or therapist.  Neither are we, we are peer support who have faced a variety of crushing similar circumstances.  We've "been there, experienced that" to a greater or lesser extent.  We've learned through harsh experience that feelings of guilt need to be recognized and addressed lest they fester overlong.  Already mentioned is the acronym called BPD relationship "FOG", short for Fear, Obligation, Guilt where guilt is hitting hard now.

Mental illness, including Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD), is usually a difficult concept for people to grasp.  After all, it doesn't make common sense.  The acting-in aspects are self-sabotaging and the acting-out aspects are so very hurtful and impactful to others in the nearby relationships.

BPD is a disorder that is most impactful to close relationships such as parents, siblings and children.  People on the periphery may notice something "off" but not be aware of the worse conditions in private scenarios at home.  That's where the people with BPD traits (pwBPD) are more likely to vent and rage.

That your sibling was never, to your knowledge, diagnosed with BPD is not surprising.  (There's also a possibility that your in-law may have been dealing with or responding to your sibling's behavior?)  Most of the members here have had to conclude it is undiagnosed BPD based on the behavior and perception patterns.  That is what family courts do... they deal with the behaviors in court orders.  They may order anger management and perhaps counseling or therapy, but they generally don't try to "fix" the parents.  Personality disorders such as Borderline, Narcissistic, etc are notoriously difficult to resolve.

BPD in particular is difficult for a relative to manage to get a pwBPD to improve.  This is because BPD is a disorder most impacting close relationships and the pwBPD is too sensitized to get past whatever past history to actually listen.  That is why a neutral therapist might make progress, though even that is quite iffy with the typical Blaming and Blame Shifting so common with BPD.

In addition, have the local children's services or other agencies been alerted to the needs of the other nephews or nieces, if any?  Those children likely have been facing the same pain and turmoil.  They would benefit greatly from focused individual counseling, though if the parents don't agree it may take an agency or relatives to petition family court order to step in.  It may come to a point that the children may be removed from that unhealthy environment, but courts and agencies are often reluctant to go to that extreme if there is no obvious abuse, neglect or endangerment.

Hi telephone,

I see you have a huge heart, and it's no wonder you're reeling from your loss.  At the same time, you're beset by conflicting feelings--grief, anger, guilt--which are unfortunately very common in this community.  As for the guilt, I hope you can let that one go soon.  You didn't know how bad things were--you weren't living with the family full-time, and what your sibling told you was in all liklihood a distorted, self-serving version of events, where she was perpetually the aggrieved victim.  Even if you weren't misled, you had limited options for action--it's not as if you could have taken your nephew away from his parents.  And you can't force your sibling to get therapy, no matter how much she needs it.  All you could do was your best, by providing an empathetic ear, wise counsel, financial support and probably a ton of administrative and logistical support as well.  That is all anyone can do, should they choose to offer support in the first place.  Just know that you can't fix your sibling, as she has to be the one to decide to commit to therapy to feel better.  Like many things in life, for adults, therapy and self-care can't be delegated, and they can't be someone else's responsibility, either.  My guess is that your sister hasn't embraced the notion that SHE is responsible for herself and her behavior--not you, not her parents, not her husband.  In case nobody has told you, you are not responsible for her, either, even if you feel that has always been your role, even if your sister constantly blames you for things, even if you think you bear some responsibility because of her mental illness.  I'm venturing a guess that you're the eldest daughter in your family, because it sounds like you have taken on an excess of caretaking burdens.  Evolving your role and right-sizing your responsibities might take some getting used to, not just for you but the entire family.

As for the grief and anger, you're justified in feeling that way.  I can empathize with the stress and chaos of untreated BPD, of dealing with loved ones who always seem on the brink of eviction/homelessness, "starting over" in countless jobs/living situations, needing numerous bail-outs, the health emergencies, the meltdowns, the chaos in communications, the emotional rollercoaster, the feeling that you're watching an impending train wreck while being powerless to stop it.  If you're triggered every time the phone rings, that's a sure sign that you need to take a break, and allow yourself the time and space to process your emotions in your own way.  I think it's best that you put yourself first right now.  It doesn't have to be forever (though it could be).  You can allow your sibling to deal with her life right now, while you deal with yours.  With time, you can check in with yourself, see if you feel calmer and more at peace, and then decide how to deal with your sibling.

Condolences on this loss. You are grieving. It's OK to feel what you feel. It makes sense that you don't have the additional emotional space to be more empathetic or supportive to your sibling. You aren't doing anything wrong- it's normal for the circumstances.

Your sibling may be the one with BPD but BPD dynamics involve the entire family. When one family member has a disorder, other family members take on roles to keep the family in balance. Often these roles are dysfunctional too, outside the family system.

In your family of origin- (and mine too)- the focus is on the feelings and needs of the pwBPD. I hope that you will be able to forgive yourself for your focus on your sibling - because, it's probably something you were raised as expected to do. You were doing what you knew to do.

That you weren't aware of what this situation was like for your nephew and other children also isn't your fault. I am the adult child of a mother with BPD. Both my parents are deceased now. Few people, even relatives, outside our nuclear family knew what the experience was like for us growing up. A part of this dynamic is secrecy about the pwBPD and also pwBPD tend to hold it together more with people outside the family. Other family members have expressed their feeling they wish they could have done more. I have assured them that they could not have done any more. They didn't know, and even if they did, legally, they could not have intervened over parental rights.

I am telling you this too. You did all you knew to do, to the best of your ability.

My father passed away before my mother did. PwBPD perceive themselves as victims. My BPD mother also got angry at me during this time. I was grieving the loss of my father. This was a very difficult time, emotionally.

As a result, I had counseling and also attended 12 step groups- CODA, ACA. Not because alcohol was an issue for me but because- the dynamics in families with a person with addiction are very similar to that with a pwBPD. I also had tendencies to overfunction, to feel overly responsible, for my mother with BPD and also other people.

FOG- Fear, Obligation, Guilt- are aspects of this kind of dynamics. You've seen your sister in a different light now. It's a lot to process. However, you have done nothing wrong. You can choose how to proceed with your relationship with her. In actuality, you are not responsible for her.

First, take care of yourself. Let yourself grieve and feel whatever feelings you have. There's no one way to do this. I recommend counseling, for support. It does help.

Hi telephoneauthor,



Welcome to BPDFamily. I’m really glad you found your way here, and I’m sorry for the circumstances that brought you.

Reading what you shared, this is a lot to be carrying all at once. You’re grieving your nephew, and at the same time you’re sitting with anger, confusion, and guilt about your sibling and everything that led up to this. Those things can exist side by side, even if it feels uncomfortable or wrong.

It also makes sense that your view of your sibling is shifting right now. For a long time you were showing up with empathy and support, and now you’re seeing pieces of the situation more clearly. That kind of shift can be really disorienting, especially when it happens during a loss like this.

The reaction you described when your phone goes off stood out to me too. That kind of feeling usually means you’re reaching your limit, and it’s okay to listen to that. Pulling back a bit doesn’t make you a bad sibling, it means you’re trying to take care of yourself in a very intense situation.

You don’t have to sort everything out right now. Taking this one day at a time, like you said, is a good place to start. If it feels okay, what has been helping you get through the day, even in small ways?

Sorry this is a little long, I have a lot on my mind.

I am feeling conflicted and guilty. Somewhat recently my family lost my teenage nephew to suicide.
We are devastated; and in the weeks that followed I learned details that made me so angry with my sibling that I cannot yet figure out how I feel about it all. My nephew lived in household with pwBPD (not diagnosed), it was a very bad situation between my sibling with BPD and their spouse for year. This constantly affected the children, but they refused to separate. The spouse is also mentally ill and they struggled to get along for a decade but it devolved into a highly abusive and toxic and emotionally dangerous situation for the last few years. We all tried to be supportive, offered living arrangements, endless amounts of money to help "start over", leave or just keep the lights on/food there/shelter. I tried to be a listening ear, always validating and trying hard to understand and empathize and be a place to vent emotions whenever they needed. I felt very close to my sibling for the longest time, like I really understood their pain and thoughts and life.

It all seemed very much to be coming to a boiling point, we thought my sibling would leave the spouse and start to get better. That did not happen. I cannot imagine what it was like for the children and I am deeply ashamed to say I was not aware of how bad it was or what was really going on and I lost sight of everyone else's pain while constantly worrying about my sibling's troubles and emotions. My sibling always made it seem like they were the victim, they were doing SO MUCH to get better and fix things and others kept ruining it.  I feel manipulated and lied to now. I always thought they were the victim too. The whole family handled her with child-gloves her whole life, never wanting to make things "worse". What a mistake that feels like now.

They were just about to lose their home and the extreme stress and emotional strain I believe caused the snapping point for my nephew. The selfishness and obliviousness to the children's suffering has angered me beyond what I could ever imagine. He did not want to leave this world.

Now my sibling with BPD is grieving and angry and just about homeless any day. They refuse to live with either parent, flip flops between hating them and calling them evil, etc. and needing them. They have been so vicious and explosive, nearly everyone has stepped back but still given what they can. We are grieving too. I keep low contact but when I do hear from them, I try to keep it short and calm, validate that I hear them and say I love you. But they have been attacking me saying I do not care, that I am selfish, that we (the family) are horrible and we will suffer one day like they are.

 I know its mental illness and extreme grief talking. It still hurts me and causes me guilt, I feel awful that this was the thing that broke the relationship for me. Its a horrible time when a parent is grieving to pull back and distance myself. I thought I could be so supportive in our shared grief -though it is different. But I am so angry that I lost my sympathy for their constant victimhood and lack of taking responsibility for anything, ever. The stress of it gave my mother a heart attack, my sibling has not even checked on her.

Overall, I just am begin eaten up by grief and guilt of feeling like a horrid sibling who cannot support their loved one in the worst loss imaginable. But I feel completely unable to. I feel so done with it all. Every time my phone notification goes off I get nauseous that it may be them. I am struggling to forgive and figure out where I want to go with this relationship. I want them to be happy and safe. But I want that for me as well.

I just wanted to get it off my chest. I am taking it a day at a time. Thank you for listening.