Hi Alone,

I hope you see that if you come here, you're not entirely alone.  My guess is that you're numb, mainly because your daughter has been making poor decisions for years now, and yet she still expects you to rescue her.  While you feel empathy for your daughter's pain and interpersonal difficulties related to BPD, that is no excuse for her to act badly in my opinion.  You've already spent years dreading those late-night calls for urgent help from your daughter, correct?  You've rescued her countless times, and yet she still doesn't seem to learn from her mistakes?  She expects you to fix things, and pay her expenses, all the while she treats you like dirt?  She can't seem to finish school, or keep a job, or manage a stable living situation, or get along with other people, no matter how much you help her--with tuition, coaching, encouragement, emotional support, transportation, spending money, administrative support, co-signing--correct?  Meanwhile, she self-sabotages at every turn, abusing substances, acting out, ruining anything good in her life.  Basically she quits everything and has given up on herself, while she expects YOU to work on her life, double-time.  She RESENTS you for needing you so much, and she's simultaneously extremely entitled, demanding, ungrateful and unaccountable.  All her interpersonal relationships are a mess.  Does that sound about right?  If it does, it's because I've lived it.

And now, she's in jail.  Surely she'll blame her ex for calling the cops, and probably you too.  She'll probably try to flip the script and say her ex was violent, using her typical blame-shifting tactics.  Her thinking can be so delusional that she might actually believe her own lies, as she rewrites history and embellishes the story over time.

I think you absolutely did the right thing, refusing to bail out your daughter and aiding the cops in reprimanding her.  If your daughter hasn't learned how to be a civil member of society from her family, in part because of a lifetime of emotional baggage, then she needs remedial help, through some combination of professional intervention from police, doctors,  therapists and/or social workers.  She probably won't learn anything else from you, because she doesn't want to!  Besides, you're probably at the end of your rope.  You've tried everything, and yet nothing seems to work.  Many parents on this site can relate.  Nothing is going to work until your daughter decides to make some changes for the better.  You are not the solution to her problems.  She is.

Maybe now's a good time to try something different.  How about this?  You take care of yourself first.  You've spent a lifetime taking care of your daughter, and now she's an adult (I presume).  You deserve to refocus on yourself, and that starts now.  You focus on your wellness and managing your stress.  You take care of your home, your partner, your job if you have one.  You cultivate your friendships and have time for sound sleep, exercise, hobbies and vacations.  You need to take care of your finances and the other relationships in your life.  In short, you need to model for your daughter what a healthy adult's life looks like.  That does NOT mean your whole life revolves around managing your daughter's toxic BPD behaviors.  It sounds to me like you need a break from that.  My advice?  Take a break!  Take a walk, or an art class, or a swim in the ocean, anything that gets you in a good headspace again.  If you feel good for a few minutes, then you know what works for you, and you repeat it!  How does that sound?  (For me, I found that swimming in my gym's pool was therapeutic.  There was something about the cool water, the sensation of floating, rhythmic strokes and controlled breathing that would help me re-center and reset.  If swimming sounds too challenging, water aerobics is a popular option for all fitness levels, especially if you don't want to get your head wet.)

If you flinch at the sound of a text alert or phone call from your daughter, you take a break and let the calls go to voicemail.  You don't have to be "on call" all the time to bail her out.  Try turning off your phone alerts at night, to protect your rest.

Oftentimes on this site, I recommend trying to slow walk.  That means being less reactive to your daughter, if not emotionally, then by slowing down all your responses to her.  One example might be, if she asks for a money or a favor, your default response is, Let me think about it, I'll let you know next week.  And you buy yourself some time to really think about it, when it's convenient for you--definitely not during your workday or during meals.  In addition, you give her some time and space to try to sort out her own problem first.  Most of all, you don't have to say Yes.  You can say No.  If you don't want to give her money or do the favor, then absolutely say No.  In short, you stop adjusting your schedule on demand to rescue your daughter.

I can tell you that I've skipped vacations, returned early from important events, provided money, free housing and all sorts of physical/logistical/administrative/emotional support to my adult BPD stepdaughter to rescue her, over and over again.  What do I get in return?  More dysfunction, zero gratitude, zero reciprocation, lots of blaming and misplaced anger.  I vowed to myself that I wouldn't let her completely disrupt my life anymore.  I vowed to myself that I wouldn't continue to enable a bizarro world of mixed-up incentives, where her decisions have consequences for my life, while she is shielded from the natural consequences of her own behavior.  There were many times I felt I was trying harder to make a life for her than she was.  Not anymore.

As parents, I think we help more by getting out of her way.  She needs to learn she's responsible for her own life, not her parents.  Maybe we'll  be amenable to support her from time to time, but when she's being respectful, and when helping her fits in our schedule and budget.  We're not dropping/sacrificing everything in our life to bail her out anymore, only to see her give up on herself again AND blame it on us afterwards.  I think resentment and despair are sure signs that we're enabling dysfunctional behavior more than supporting.  Does that make sense?

It took me over ten years before I finally cut contact with my NPD sister in law.  I discussed it with my kids first, because I was concerned about how it would affect them.  And they were good with it.  I remained no contact for 5 years, and am currently limited contact.  Though she has been trying to charm over the past year.  It was a very good 5 years of no contact.  My stress levels dropped immediately.  I felt like it brought me closer to God, and gave me a lot of clarity. I don't know what it's like for everyone dealing with a relative that is cluster B, but cutting contact really felt like the only way that I could keep my peace and protect my boundaries. Even now, we are limited contact, and I am going to be polite if I see her, but I can see that any contact with her is interpreted as proof of friendship and reconciliation.  Right now it's hard to avoid contact because my parents are elderly and both have dementia, and I have started doing two days of care taking for them.  And I believe that SIL is taking advantage of my being there to visit my parents more often. 

I wanted to add that SIL was always very controlling and mean spirited.  But when I cut contact, she suddenly changed her tune.  And she acts like she's always loved me and wants so much to be friends.  When my parents pass away, I don't expect that we'll have much to do with her or my brother at all.   

First, about the phone, I know my niece told me that her phone knows her schedule and has begun texting comments about what she'll be doing that day. Told her she must be heading out to the gym, and she was.

Secondly, about Google AI, I was shocked by a sudden downturn in my elderly dbpdh's mental state one day and I typed in what had happened to Google AI.

I told AI my husband would once in a while get facts confused, but I couldn't believe what had just happened because he accused me of stealing two of his stepfather's rings out of the chest of drawers, and taking $500 out of his formerly secret wallet he used for his secret girlfriend until I found both.

I thought he was joking at first. After he said write him a check, I spilled my sugar-free 7-up when the horror of him being serious dawned on me.

AI said some helpful things about staying calm and distract by remembering something that needed to be done, time to cook something or even say I was going to the restroom.

In fact, I had left a room he followed me to when he was mad about something else, and when I closed the bathroom door, he left me alone when earlier he was yelling at me an inch from my face for the 2nd time recently.  I've just discovered my laptop can record conversations and I've tested it to check background noise, and it is drowned out, and he was talking normally. AI said no beeping sounds come from the process and that appears to be true, but as Pook said, don't count on the information being what I need to know.

AI said  my h's brain is broken and I'm not to use grey-rock or to be negative. Several websites like Mayo Clinic caregivers' support were listed for help with this. I was also told to discuss this with our doctor, write a letter or take one with me and give secretly at check-in.

So my experience was good with AI, but I'd be cautious about any suggestions. So far, it is what I'd do anyway, but I got there faster with the "conversation."

I think that is quite a widely known thing Pook, your devices are always listening and I believe they do tailor adverts to what they hear. I think we had a smart speaker that you could actually ask to play things that it had listened in on but I might just be imagining that.

I did wonder that myself, but it wasn’t a verbal conversation to her face it was via a WhatsApp message which I believe are encrypted so I don’t know if that would be able to be picked up by AI and used virtually verbatim.

While the tools here on this board recommend validating, that is in the context of a conflict, and a tool to decrease the drama in the moment, and lessening the circular arguments. It doesn't mean that you are responsible for constantly soothing and validating your BPD partner. You have seen that doing so is taking a toll on your emotional and physical well being.

Also, the validating is not a "cure" for BPD. It's a tool to lessen drama in the moment. However, to continue to do this kind of emotional caretaking also reinforces them looking to you for their own soothing. Since their emotional needs for this continue, so will this behavior. It may even increase if reinforced.

Your feeling depleted is your own sign that you've done too much and need some self care to feel replenished. Your partner may not like this and may react.

Ch0p- we aren't being critical of your family dynamics when we point out any boundary issues. It's because we recognize what also has been a common dynamic for many families where there is a person with a disorder, and the rest of the family focuses on helping that person. It was this way in my family of origin too. When children grow up in this dynamic- it's the "normal" we know, as we don't know any other way for a family to function.

Having a family member who has life threatening behavior is terrifying for parents and siblings. The family goes into survival mode when it comes to placating and rescuing that person. Yet, the flip side of it is that it gives that person a bit of power in the family- as the family complies with them to avoid the reaction.

There was a Dr. Phil episode where one child had anorexia and it had serious effects for her. The whole family was hyperfocused on that child. Did she eat? Did she eat enough? If that child refused to eat, the family panicked - for a real reason. If she didn't eat it could be very dangerous for her. This also gave her some power to get her way- as she could not eat if she didn't.

Dr. Phil said to them "you are all lost in the woods and looking to a disordered person to lead you out". This quote resonated with me. The whole family needed therapy to change their dynamic.

One part of your post stood out to me. Despite your family concerns about the relationship "they had to let the partner live there as your sister had already decided".

Whose house is it? If it's not your sister's house then she doesn't get to decide who lives there. Your parents may have been afraid to say no as they were afraid of her reaction, but it if it their house- they could have said no to a situation they didn't think was a good idea.

How much of your sister's needs are driving your decisions? That's for you to think about. It's not about if what you are doing is wrong or right- but what it is actually doing- to you, your future, and is it giving your sister the power to drive it?

You are the more emotionally stable and reliable one, and I think in the best position to chart your own path "out of the woods".

I wish I was told as well but she kept her medical information private from us. Also, the family unspoken rule was to not disclose that she had any issues and  that she was "normal". It felt like the Emperor Had No Clothes story and we'd be in trouble if we said anything.

One reason I wish I had know is- if she didn't have a disorder- then she behaved like this for some other reason. She would blame others, including us kids, and so somehow I wondered if it was my fault, and also that maybe she didn't like me.

But even as a young teen I could have understood mental illness. By high school I was looking in psychology books to see what might be going on with her as I suspected something was. BPD wasn't a main point in the books yet and no internet.

She told us her medicine was for "asthma". In college, I looked in her medicine cabinet and looked them up and realized they weren't for asthma. I naively tried to speak to one of her therapists but he wasn't willing or able to do that.

With the internet, I found BPD while looking up NPD as someone in our community was classic NPD and he was difficult to deal with. I looked this up for more information. On the page was a link to BPD and it sounded a lot like my mother.

It wasn't until BPD mother's elder years that she signed a consent for her nurse manager to speak to me. I still didn't see her actual records but the nurse carefully mentioned "PD" to me to see if I knew. I told her I thought she had BPD and the nurse agreed. By that time though, she wasn't in therapy and the medicine that helped her was for anxiety and that was the diagnosis they used.

I think a lot of confusion may have been avoided if someone had discussed BPD with me earlier- but it wasn't well known until later.

As for my own personal therapy- I haven't done it continuously. It's been more on an as needed basis. Some therapists have been more helpful than others, but a main benefit for all of them has been someone to talk to, in confidence, as these can be personal situations.

I work in tech and I've been watching the big data companies harvest our information more and more over the past decade.  It worries me and people will think I'm nuts for saying this, but I wouldn't be shocked if your phone didn't hear you say that a year ago and the information was stored to your digital profile.

Why do I think that?  Well, it's a guess.  But I've noticed dozens of times I'd have a conversation with my wife or my kid in the car, we'd talk about something and then the next day, I'd see ads for those things appear out of nowhere in my mail account, on Google, etc. 

For instance, we mentioned going to Orlando one time and I saw Disney ads and hotel specials for the next week.  I was going for a sick relative, not Mickey Mouse, but it still stood out to me.  Other times we mentioned joining a gym, getting a home security system, etc and sure enough, Google and Facebook somehow knew to show me those exact ads.  I never searched for any of that online...it was all spoken verbally in regular conversation.

Funnily enough Pete I did notice a couple of things that sounded like it was telling me things I wanted to hear, so i would call it out on it and it would re evaluate its response.

I’m aware it’s not got its own brain and isn’t thinking independently of itself. That is actually a good thing in my book. I actually said to it as a cynic are you telling me things just to be agreeable, to which it replied that it isn’t human, it has no emotions and it doesn’t need or isn’t trying to be my friend, just going on the logic of what I had written and that it has access to a data base of hundreds of thousands of accounts of similar situations.

Therefore it is not so far removed from a therapist that uses their knowledge from their client base, but taking the knowledge from a far far larger data base. Another good thing is therapists kind of have an unwritten rule that they won’t actually give you their own personal opinion. For example, they don’t, according to this rule, tell you if you are in a dangerous relationship get out for your own personal safety. They have to kind of steer you in that direction so you make that decision on your own, even if your life is at risk. Some go against that but it isn’t the norm.

That's pretty wild! 

This made me wonder how original a lot of BPD behavior is. 

I don't know if "impressed" is the right word, but sometimes BPDxw's seemingly instinctive behavior for dodging responsibility, deflecting blame, changing the subject, etc. would surprise me, and I would feel a little bit ashamed of myself for not having the same knack for navigating human interaction. 

If it's that easy to predict, then maybe it's more common and formulaic than we think. Like it's just typical learned behavior in a very negative, coercive society (which is very much like the situation she grew up in).