it's not THAT bad..

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

hey y'all

i've been in an on-and-off relationship with my BPD gf for over 4 years. for the last 8 months or so we've been "on" again, more or less, now that she and i are living in the same city again. we met when we were 18, we're both in college going on 22 now.

i'm very very conflicted about if i should try to work on things or if i should leave. i only learned about her BPD and what BPD really is about 5 or 6 months ago.

the beginning years of our relationship were terrible the problem was always her inconsistency, lying, and infidelity. we were also many hours apart for the first year. however, as we got older and the distance got shorter, she started to (or seemed to start to) mature. she would seem to put in actually effort (even though she'd ultimately give back in to her old ways). she stopped being so shady, her infidelities sort of diminished into a tug-of-war between me and two other girls vying for her.

since we've been living so close, consistency and fidelity have improved greatly. we communicate a lot better, and i feel like she really does try (especially now that i understand more about her borderline behaviors and i dont misinterpret them all as signs of her cheating/leaving/lying)

she never yells at me, either. not in a threatening way, at least. when she gets into a fit of rage, its not typically over something i did (or that she perceived i did). she doesn't always blame things on me, tell me i'm a bad person, or really ever say anything that is demeaning or degrading or unacceptable. its actually usually the opposite, she'll tell me i'm too good to her, that she doesn't deserve someone like me putting up with her bullhit. when she acts out, she usually apologizes very soon afterwards and tells me that it wasn't my fault or anything i did.

i've never felt in danger or threatened around her. she's a very aggressive person, but she has never hit me and has never tried. she always insists that she would never hit me. she's more of a punch-a-wall kinda person. in fact, i feel incredibly safe with her. she's actually really protective of me, i don't ever feel like she would let anything happen to me.

of course, it's not all that great either. her constantly changing moods play into her inconsistent behavior, which upsets my need for consistency and certainty. now that i understand more about BPD though, i can predict a lot of whats coming or at least know when it's happening that it has nothing to do with me. i still don't trust her. the infidelity will always be a huge problem for me. of course, it's something that is difficult for me to talk to with her because i have to phrase it a way that doesn't sound like im accusing her or else she gets angry and defensive. she also still won't officially commit to me, like we're not in a defined relationship. thats really the key issue, because my insecurities mostly stem from her infidelity, so if she were vocally committed to me, addressing the trust issue would be easier. we've been working on communicating our needs and feelings to each other better, but it's still not perfect.

she tells me a lot that she wants to be happy, the she's sick of the mood swings and the empty feeling and the anger. these are things she never admitted to before. i honestly believe that she is very very slowly opening up to the idea of seeking help. she doesn't get quite as defensive when i suggest it now, and she isn't as opposed to her need for it as she used to be.

while she always inevitably falls back into her borderline ways, i genuinely believe that she has been making at least some sort of effort and has some desire to change and be a better person.

i'm graduating next may, and i plan to attend grad school. i've been seriously considering going back to school to be a therapist. it's something i always wanted to do (i have my own issues with anxiety and depression), and since i recently got into therapy myself and have benefitted greatly from it, my interest in that was sparked again. de-stigmatizing mental illness is something that i feel very strongly about, as well. that being said, i feel like it's terrible for me to leave someone because they are sick. she didn't choose to be this way.

i feel that if we could work through MY insecurities, that i'm strong enough to deal with her behaviors if there is a chance that eventually she will get help. i don't mind being her emotional caregiver, it's something i'm actually really good at. but i'm not sure if its worth it or not yet.

so i'm torn here. i love her dearly and i don't want to leave her, but i shouldn't have to suffer either.

[bustedstuff]

hey y'all

i've been in an on-and-off relationship with my BPD gf for over 4 years. for the last 8 months or so we've been "on" again, more or less, now that she and i are living in the same city again. we met when we were 18, we're both in college going on 22 now.

i'm very very conflicted about if i should try to work on things or if i should leave. i only learned about her BPD and what BPD really is about 5 or 6 months ago.

the beginning years of our relationship were terrible the problem was always her inconsistency, lying, and infidelity. we were also many hours apart for the first year. however, as we got older and the distance got shorter, she started to (or seemed to start to) mature. she would seem to put in actually effort (even though she'd ultimately give back in to her old ways). she stopped being so shady, her infidelities sort of diminished into a tug-of-war between me and two other girls vying for her.

since we've been living so close, consistency and fidelity have improved greatly. we communicate a lot better, and i feel like she really does try (especially now that i understand more about her borderline behaviors and i dont misinterpret them all as signs of her cheating/leaving/lying)

she never yells at me, either. not in a threatening way, at least. when she gets into a fit of rage, its not typically over something i did (or that she perceived i did). she doesn't always blame things on me, tell me i'm a bad person, or really ever say anything that is demeaning or degrading or unacceptable. its actually usually the opposite, she'll tell me i'm too good to her, that she doesn't deserve someone like me putting up with her bullhit. when she acts out, she usually apologizes very soon afterwards and tells me that it wasn't my fault or anything i did.

i've never felt in danger or threatened around her. she's a very aggressive person, but she has never hit me and has never tried. she always insists that she would never hit me. she's more of a punch-a-wall kinda person. in fact, i feel incredibly safe with her. she's actually really protective of me, i don't ever feel like she would let anything happen to me.

of course, it's not all that great either. her constantly changing moods play into her inconsistent behavior, which upsets my need for consistency and certainty. now that i understand more about BPD though, i can predict a lot of whats coming or at least know when it's happening that it has nothing to do with me. i still don't trust her. the infidelity will always be a huge problem for me. of course, it's something that is difficult for me to talk to with her because i have to phrase it a way that doesn't sound like im accusing her or else she gets angry and defensive. she also still won't officially commit to me, like we're not in a defined relationship. thats really the key issue, because my insecurities mostly stem from her infidelity, so if she were vocally committed to me, addressing the trust issue would be easier. we've been working on communicating our needs and feelings to each other better, but it's still not perfect.

she tells me a lot that she wants to be happy, the she's sick of the mood swings and the empty feeling and the anger. these are things she never admitted to before. i honestly believe that she is very very slowly opening up to the idea of seeking help. she doesn't get quite as defensive when i suggest it now, and she isn't as opposed to her need for it as she used to be.

while she always inevitably falls back into her borderline ways, i genuinely believe that she has been making at least some sort of effort and has some desire to change and be a better person.

i'm graduating next may, and i plan to attend grad school. i've been seriously considering going back to school to be a therapist. it's something i always wanted to do (i have my own issues with anxiety and depression), and since i recently got into therapy myself and have benefitted greatly from it, my interest in that was sparked again. de-stigmatizing mental illness is something that i feel very strongly about, as well. that being said, i feel like it's terrible for me to leave someone because they are sick. she didn't choose to be this way.

i feel that if we could work through MY insecurities, that i'm strong enough to deal with her behaviors if there is a chance that eventually she will get help. i don't mind being her emotional caregiver, it's something i'm actually really good at. but i'm not sure if its worth it or not yet.

so i'm torn here. i love her dearly and i don't want to leave her, but i shouldn't have to suffer either.

[Remington]

Hi and welcome!

It sounds like you have lots to consider.  Take your time in doing so.  You are young yet.

Something I hear over and over again is that if spouses and/or significant others want to address the issue of infidelity, the pwBPD feels "rejected" or "judged" and too full of shame and then rages.

The issue needs to be addressed, of course, unless one is in a truly mutually acceptable "open relationship."  I do not understand why pwBPD end up feeling like the victim if/when this issue is addressed, even gently. If they don't feel okay with addressing infidelity, then don't commit infidelity. I feel, often, like this is a manipulation to not face the facts and subsequent responsibilities.  Just my own feeling on this.

I will not tolerate infidelity in a partner with or without BPD.  Period.

That's just me though.  If others can tolerate this, so be it.

I hope you take plenty of time to sort this out for yourself.

You seem to have a lot going for you.  I wonder what keeps you attracted to, connected to, this one person?  It's a question I have to ask myself, as well.

Hope to see you around here.

Cheers,

Remington

[bustedstuff]

hey remmington, thanks for the response:)

infidelity is definitely not something i can tolerate, but the way she managed to make that work for her was by never officially committing to me, our relationship is always implied and never really defined. i've been telling her lately that i dont want to not know what we are, and i'm going to keep pushing the issue. its a big problem. she always talks about "when we get married" and all those sorts of things, but still wont make the full commitment. but she says its not because she doesnt want to be tied down, so i dont even know what her reasoning is.

i know what keeps me attracted and connected to her, there are tons of reasons. that's what makes me want to stay. but almost everyone else in my life says i should go. almost all of my friends and family don't like her because of all the pain she's caused me, but i feel like they don't understand the situation i'm in.

[GreenMango]

It may help to define what you need and expect in a relationship and communicate that to her.  Then ask her if she can do it.  Healthy boundaries are essential in any relationship. ... even more so with a person with BPD.  They tend to not have many of their own and not to recognize the boundaries of others when emotionally taxed.

The staying board has a set of lessons on how to communicate this in the most non threatening and productive way using validation and Set.  You can use both boards of you need too while you are weighing this out.

Have you checked those techniques out?

[bustedstuff]

It may help to define what you need and expect in a relationship and communicate that to her.  Then ask her if she can do it.  Healthy boundaries are essential in any relationship. ... even more so with a person with BPD.  They tend to not have many of their own and not to recognize the boundaries of others when emotionally taxed.

The staying board has a set of lessons on how to communicate this in the most non threatening and productive way using validation and Set.  You can use both boards of you need too while you are weighing this out.

Have you checked those techniques out?

thank you! i haven't yet, but i'm going to look at them now. hopefully i'll be able to find a good opportunity to try to talk to her about it the right way soon!

[Remington]

hey remmington, thanks for the response:)

infidelity is definitely not something i can tolerate, but the way she managed to make that work for her was by never officially committing to me, our relationship is always implied and never really defined. i've been telling her lately that i dont want to not know what we are, and i'm going to keep pushing the issue. its a big problem. she always talks about "when we get married" and all those sorts of things, but still wont make the full commitment. but she says its not because she doesnt want to be tied down, so i dont even know what her reasoning is.

i know what keeps me attracted and connected to her, there are tons of reasons. that's what makes me want to stay. but almost everyone else in my life says i should go. almost all of my friends and family don't like her because of all the pain she's caused me, but i feel like they don't understand the situation i'm in.

Hi Again,

My apologies, you had mentioned the lack of commitment in your post. I did not read your post carefully enough.

If the commitment is unclear, there is always room for "infidelity" and/or for simply freely becoming romantically involved with others and don't feel they are committing any infidelity.  Often, one person will think they are in a committed relationship with a person whom does not see this in the same light.  This often results in feeling others are cheating on us, when there's never been clarity for the parties involved.

It's critical to confirm the status of the relationship and to also be sure each of you defines the terminology used in the discussion/agreement means the same to each of you.

As I understand this, you write about her illness and how its tough to leave her because she did not ask for her BPD illness.  I do understand its tough to leave someone whom is ill.  We can feel like they need us. Yet, it seems, from what you write, that she does not perceive herself as ill (or ill enough to seek help yet).  It appears she doesn't feel like she needs you enough to totally commit to you?

If you feel, somehow, you are doing her a favor, by not leaving her to attend grad school --  are you being fair to her?  Or fair to yourself?

If you don't go to grad school because you are convinced she needs you and she feels she isn't even in a committed relationship with you, you may be setting yourself up for some rather extreme resentment toward her at some point?

You had mentioned you had participated in therapy.  I hope you will continue in therapy.  The best therapists have submitted to deep analysis, intensive long-term therapy.  I think therapy will help you in sorting out your desires and needs, how to reach your goals while showing due  compassion and having your needs met. 

You are very thoughtful and have the ability to sort through this and also have the option of reaching your goals. Just take some time to gain clarity for what you want/need.  Then see which arrangements, which people, which relationships support this. If you  give up your career goals this early in life, for someone not committed to you and because you feel they need you, you will likely come to an intense resentment and regret in the near future.

So much great information here.  Many amazingly helpful and insightful people offering their experiences with us here.  I hope to see you around here for quite sometime as you sort through what you want and need in your life. (I wish I had a place like this to help me when I was your age.  Truly!  Take advantage of these resources to maximize your life.  You can offer the world more when you are the best you can be, are the happiest you can be, etc.)

I hope I am understanding your post?

Please forgive me if I have misunderstood?

There is no time like the present for you to gain more clarity in all of this.

Truly, best wishes to you. You have a bright future ahead. 

Commit to it!  Step up and claim it!  

Remington

[bustedstuff]

If the commitment is unclear, there is always room for "infidelity" and/or for simply freely becoming romantically involved with others and don't feel they are committing any infidelity.  Often, one person will think they are in a committed relationship with a person whom does not see this in the same light.  This often results in feeling others are cheating on us, when there's never been clarity for the parties involved.

It's critical to confirm the status of the relationship and to also be sure each of you defines the terminology used in the discussion/agreement means the same to each of you.

As I understand this, you write about her illness and how its tough to leave her because she did not ask for her BPD illness.  I do understand its tough to leave someone whom is ill.  We can feel like they need us. Yet, it seems, from what you write, that she does not perceive herself as ill (or ill enough to seek help yet).  It appears she doesn't feel like she needs you enough to totally commit to you?

thats how the relationship used to be, but for the last year or so she had been pretty consistent in saying that she wants to be with me, and only me, and sees herself with me long term, we just haven't solidified it yet, i guess. for about a month i was practically living with her (we live across the street but i was staying at her house every night, had a toothbrush, the whole nine yards). she's out of town right now, went on a trip with her friends this weekend. she's been blowing up my phone telling me how much she misses me and loves me and cant wait to come back, etc etc.

she knows there is something wrong with her, she is very unhappy and she's opened up to me a lot more recently about how she feels. she's less opposed to therapy than she used to be, but still not convinced. she actually admits to needing me a lot. i think a lot of her infidelity issues stem from her parents. shes an only child and her mom has been having an affair on and off for years and she knows about it, she was caught in it when one parent would ask her to do something for them and the other would ask the opposite (i.e. her mom would ask her to lie to her dad, her dad would ask her to follow her mom, etc). she gets incredibly upset whenever she finds out that it's on again. i could be totally wrong of course, but i feel like that probably had an impact, especially if so called "mommy issues" are a big factor in pwBPD.

If you feel, somehow, you are doing her a favor, by not leaving her to attend grad school --  are you being fair to her?  Or fair to yourself?

If you don't go to grad school because you are convinced she needs you and she feels she isn't even in a committed relationship with you, you may be setting yourself up for some rather extreme resentment toward her at some point?

if i go to grad school for social work/psychology, i'd probably go to the same school i'm doing my undergrad at, so we'd both still be able to be here if we were still together- however i'm going to take a year or two off before grad school to save more money. i was just mentioning that because it brought up a sort of ethical/moral conflict in me. i don't know how to explain it exactly. just that i feel like its wrong to give up on someone i love because they are mentally ill, and then say i want to have a career in helping people who are mentally ill. it's not a feeling of guilt or obligation, though.

You had mentioned you had participated in therapy.  I hope you will continue in therapy.  The best therapists have submitted to deep analysis, intensive long-term therapy.  I think therapy will help you in sorting out your desires and needs, how to reach your goals while showing due  compassion and having your needs met.

i'm still in therapy, i actually love it. i have generalized anxiety disorder w/ panic attacks and dysthemia, but i think i'm actually a highly sensitive person/HSP. i think me being in therapy and being open about it and how its helped me has helped my gf look at it with a little less stigma, but we'll see.

[Remington]

I have been reading lots of articles, watching videos.  All great info.

Sounds like things are okay within your relationship.

Sounds like things have improved?

Great you are enjoying therapy. 

As you mention, it's not helpful, to anyone, for any stigma to be attached to these labels.  Nobody is their diagnosis(es). I know you agree. 

Hope to see you around here!

Have a good evening,

Remington