Why I think detachment/NC is cruel and cold

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

It might be that I'm still reeling with anger towards my former friend whom I believe tried to use these very tools on me to detach from the friendship BUT honestly I think it's just flat out cruel.  Please feel free to correct me, OK?  It could very well be that I'm not seeing this clearly.  Anyway, regardless of whether you are the pw BPD or the non, why would the recommendation ever be to engage in cold, NC?  And this NC, does it always happen without informing the other party?  You just simply stop communicating?  This is just me but I would NEVER do that to someone.  If I feel it's best to part ways, I would absolutely tell the other person it's best we end the relationship and then maybe start distancing myself naturally.  To simply "ween" communication or go cold NC in my mind is very hurtful regardless of who you are and what your disorder.

I feel infuriated that my "friend" did this to me thinking that I have BPD!  Unreal.  Trust me on this.  She is the one who is emotionally unstable and has the BPD.  Regardless... .I was just reading up on the info posted on the website and I disagree.  Maybe I'm misunderstanding, I don't know.

[jammit123]

It might be that I'm still reeling with anger towards my former friend whom I believe tried to use these very tools on me to detach from the friendship BUT honestly I think it's just flat out cruel.  Please feel free to correct me, OK?  It could very well be that I'm not seeing this clearly.  Anyway, regardless of whether you are the pw BPD or the non, why would the recommendation ever be to engage in cold, NC?  And this NC, does it always happen without informing the other party?  You just simply stop communicating?  This is just me but I would NEVER do that to someone.  If I feel it's best to part ways, I would absolutely tell the other person it's best we end the relationship and then maybe start distancing myself naturally.  To simply "ween" communication or go cold NC in my mind is very hurtful regardless of who you are and what your disorder.

I feel infuriated that my "friend" did this to me thinking that I have BPD!  Unreal.  Trust me on this.  She is the one who is emotionally unstable and has the BPD.  Regardless... .I was just reading up on the info posted on the website and I disagree.  Maybe I'm misunderstanding, I don't know.

[steelwork]

Hey,

I know what you're saying. I was ghosted a few times by my ex, and it was so hurtful. I don't think "NC" has to be like that. Circumstances permitting, you can tell the other person that you don't want to have contact. You can say it without malice, and even with love. You can tell them why, if you feel up to it. What I mean is, it makes a big difference how you cease contact.

I have not been following a lot of the stories of the newer members lately, so I don't know yours. Can you say something about how NC from this person hurt you?

steelwork

[jammit123]

Hi Steelwork.  I'm so glad you get what I'm saying:  OK to end relationship or reduce contact but not OK to not inform the other person of your intentions.  Also, not OK to refuse to engage in a conversation, giving the person a chance to understand what's happening.

Long story short, a person I considered a good friend with a strong spiritual connection abruptly ended the friendship after I expressed some hurt feelings in a slightly harsh way.  NC strikes such a nerve with me because the very reason I was hurt to begin with is that I strongly suspect she had tried to wean contact with me without any explanation (I think she believes that I have BPD--I do not).  Previously we had pretty frequent contact through text, emails or in person.  By the end of the summer it was down to barely any at all--which is why I began feeling resentful and never expected an ax when I expressed it.  I just think my friend knows of her diagnosis and is very familiar with these techniques and tried to use it on me.  Sad that she never felt comfortable enough sharing with me.  Would have saved us both a lot of heartache.

I have a few posts recently if you needed more info.  Thanks

[fromheeltoheal]

Hi jammit-

We elevate certain things around here and give them acronyms, like the mighty NC, but all we're really doing is deciding someone is not a positive addition to our lives, so we are removing them, something each of us has the right to do.  It gets more important when that someone has a mental illness though, since becoming emotionally enmeshed with someone with a mental illness can seriously damage our mental, physical and spiritual health, so leaving that situation is pure self preservation.

Now I agree, just disappearing without saying anything is wrong, but that's my opinion, for each of us to decide, and best to come from a frame of how will I feel about it in a year?  Will there be guilt or are we good?  With my ex all I said was "I can't do this anymore" and left, maybe not ideal but all I could muster at the time, I felt like I was literally going insane, and after the fog cleared I didn't feel any guilt, which is really the test.

[steelwork]

Sad that she never felt comfortable enough sharing with me.  Would have saved us both a lot of heartache.

It is sad. Do you think maybe she did the best she was capable of?

[valet]

That sounds frustrating jammit.

I kind of want a walkthrough though. Why are you describing expressing your hurt feelings as kind of harsh? What exactly happened?

[Warcleods]

I think the NC option was really all that I had.  It depends on the circumstance.  In my particular case, I constantly felt like a yo-yo and was being filled with hope and then having the rug swept from under my feet.  It was like clockwork and my final straw came only 1 month after she told me she had a revelation about "us," and how I have made her such a better person, yada yada.  Mind you, nothing happened in between when she told me that and then decided she might want to be "alone" for a while.  She did this way too many times and I had enough.

[Mutt]

Hi jammit123 ,

I can see how it would be painful. I'm sorry that you had to go through that.

I would absolutely tell the other person it's best we end the relationship and then maybe start distancing myself naturally.

A slow fade. What works for one person, may not work for the next person, everyone's situation is different and they're ex partners are different people, with different personalities and severity of the disorder, it's not one size fits all. I think that NC is about self protection.

[jammit123]

Steelwork, she probably did do the best she was capable of and to be honest... .the relationship between us was complex.  As I'm learning I'm coming to realize that I may have been a trigger for her.  I wonder if I somehow brought about deep wounds from her mother and issues regarding sexual orientation with her father.  Without going off on a tangent, I strongly believe we have a healing relationship by nature as it was in fact emotionally complex--on both ends.  So, yeah, as much as I want to blame her (makes it easier to let go), she may not have been capable otherwise. 

Valet, an email exchange too place between us where my tone was on the harsh side.  I was so confused and hurt by the lack of contact and a comment she made... ."I'm sorry you don't understand" set me off and I fired back.  Even with my firing back though, most people would likely have rated it a 6 on a scale of 10.  I ended email saying "all I know is that I miss you and want to see you".  Next day I received another email that she was ending the friendship without explanation.

Mutt, I agree that NC is for self-protection but I still feel it's wrong to not at least tell the other person you feel it's best to no longer be in touch for whatever reason and allow enough dialog to take place for other party to understand.  If at that point it goes in circles and pwBPD keeps hounding than you stop... .but at least they knew what your intentions were.

This board has been a saving grace and I sincerely appreciate all the input and sharing.  I have no outlet and my husband can't understand the heartbreak.  She made it crystal clear now she wants nothing to do with me and it's very painful that we still have a tie to each other.  She is my daughter's soccer coach.

Thanks guys.  I'm learning and hopefully soon healing.  Just sad that I so genuinely love and care for this woman--even with all the hurt she has caused me.  I could never paint her black and wish I could stop my heart from loving her.  I just know on an intellectual level it's a toxic relationship and I don't want her to be in more pain because of me.

[valet]

Valet, an email exchange too place between us where my tone was on the harsh side.  I was so confused and hurt by the lack of contact and a comment she made... ."I'm sorry you don't understand" set me off and I fired back.  Even with my firing back though, most people would likely have rated it a 6 on a scale of 10.  I ended email saying "all I know is that I miss you and want to see you".  Next day I received another email that she was ending the friendship without explanation.

Well, you were hurt and confused. It seems like a normal response to be agitated and then to project a little bit of that. And she baited you.

Not to cast too much blame here, but all I'm trying to say is that you shouldn't view yourself as the reason for the argument and her going NC. That's not fair to you, and it enables her to stomp all over your boundaries. She made the choice to do that, not you.

And her choices are just that: hers. Not yours. Now you have a good idea of how she behaves. What are you going to do with that knowledge?

[Pretty Woman]

Personally, I am not sure what telling the other person you are going NC accomplishes. It's like emailing someone you are going to unfriend them on FB. Why open it up for conversation? Just do it.  If you feel it's the healthier approach for YOU then take care of YOU, you don't owe them an explanation.

My ex left me many times, cutting me off abruptly for months. She would threaten a RO if I tried to get closure. It was terrible.

NC protected my a_ _. The last time she left she completely replaced me and tried to triangulate me with her new girlfriend. I had done enough reading on here I knew I had to stay away from her because she would only hurt me.

I'm glad I did. Her true colors came out when I stopped responding. She told people I raped her and her sister who works with me tried to get me fired.

Why in the world would anyone want to keep contact with someone that destructive? Someone who called you the love of their life one minute and a stalker the next. No thanks. It's not being cruel, it's called self-preservation. What's cruel is to continue to contribute to the "mad dance" which isn't healthy for either party. There comes a time where a little self respect and self love is needed to move on to healthier situations.  I'm not condemning who don't go NC, some people have no choice, they have kids or financial attachments but imo, if you don't have any of those why punish yourself staying in communication with someone who could care less about your feelings and is only using you when they need something?

[steelwork]

Personally, I am not sure what telling the other person you are going NC accomplishes.

It would have meant the world to me, Pretty Woman. I would not have tried to reach him, and then I would not have sat waiting, hoping, the truth slowly dawning on me that I would never hear from him again. It was without question the most painful, cruel way to part with me.

[Mutt]

I see what you're saying. Dehumanization - it can feel like you're less than human if you're on the receiving end of NC.

[steelwork]

I see what you're saying. Dehumanization - it can feel like you're less than human if you're on the receiving end of NC.

I would have understood if he'd said he didn't want contact. He never said that. He just froze me out without warning. That's the issue.

[Pretty Woman]

Steelwork, darling... .

I'm talking about the non initiating NC to save themselves not the BPD.

I'm sorry you are hurting.


It kills when they go silent and ghost you. I know, love. I've been there. I wanted to die. Early in our relationship she'd change her number or block it after a fight. She'd go back on dating sites and come back months later... .when she couldn't find someone else.

I know how you feel. With them there is rarely any closure, at least no genuine closure.

Every relationship is different. My ex dumped me 13x in three years, left me for exes and conditioned me she'd always return.

When she didn't I made the decision for ME to be NC. I have t reached out, I broke our toxic dance. I did this to save ME.

If it were easy I wouldn't be on here checking in with you all. Everyday is a struggle but I keep plugging on. I wish she had said something too, but knowing she's is telling people I'm a rapist provided me closure. This is someone that is dangerous to my life and well being.

 
PW

[steelwork]

I was responding to your statement that you didn't understand what was the point of warning someone that you were going NC.

EDIT --

Maybe, if my meaning wasn't clear, it's because I should have stipulated that I hold to the golden rule as much as possible: do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

[Pretty Woman]

I understand what you are saying I think... .

Do you mean you wish your friend/ex hadn't gone NC on you?

Mine was mutual NC. I stopped responding once she cruelly replaced me like I never existed. She only wanted me around to make both myself and her gf jealous.  I dont think that was a case of do unto others. I think it's a case of it's time to surround myself with healthier ppl who have my best interests in mind,  not soul suckers that want to use me.

[jammit123]

I guess it's hard for me to relate, Pretty Woman.  I was a loving, supportive friend and gave this woman every reason to believe I was an honest, trustworthy person who had her best interest at heart.  Part of why I connected so deeply with her was the shared experience of past pain.  I knew of her struggles (minus probable diagnosis of BPD) and she knew of mine.  I gave a lot.  I helped her in any way that I could.  So, Pretty Woman, do you think it's unreasonable for her to respect me enough to tell me the friendship wasn't working for her anymore?  Instead she did LC (which I should have called her out on but didn't want to crack any shells) and made me suffer with my own insecurities by not knowing if I was just being paranoid.  When I expressed frustration she was a cold-b___ to me.  

Depends on the situation, I suppose.  I feel in mine... .it was a total slap in the face.  

I want to add that it is my friend who has BPD, not me--although I think she thinks it's me.

[steelwork]

I understand what you are saying I think... .

Do you mean you wish your friend/ex hadn't gone NC on you?

Not sure if this question is for me, but I'll go ahead and answer   

As I said, I would have understood if he told me straight-up that he couldn't be in contact. Eventually I probably would have been grateful, even. I was talking about HOW he did it. You said you didn't understand the point of saying something before going no contact, and I was explaining that it was incredibly painful to be frozen out without a word. I would not do that to someone else if I could possibly avoid it.

Now, sometimes I'm sure there's no other way. But usually, I believe, there is.

[Pretty Woman]

Jammit as I explained to Steel... .

I'm referring to the NON going NC on the BPD after being used for a long period of time.  

Of course I think your ex/friend owes you an explanation. The thing is this... .it's not possible for someone with BPD and this is how they operate.

I've been on these boards for close to four years. If you read my old posts you would see the crap I took and went through. It was terrible.  

My heart ached for this woman and I still love her today. NC keeps me from re engaging with someone destructive to my life.

Read these boards and you will see exes returning years later only to pull the same stuff all over again. It hurts not getting an apology or being able to have rational closure but sometimes it isn't possible, you need to find closure within yourself.

[jammit123]

ditto steelwork

got it pretty woman.  i'm sorry for all that you have gone through and look forward to learning from all of you.

[Pretty Woman]

Thank you.  I wish you all the best. I think my wording was confusing. I was left with NC. Hard to have contact when someone isn't talking to you

But I've kept it. I don't reach out or try to because I know it will only hurt me.

[apollotech]

If I feel it's best to part ways, I would absolutely tell the other person it's best we end the relationship and then maybe start distancing myself naturally.  To simply "ween" communication or go cold NC in my mind is very hurtful regardless of who you are and what your disorder.

jammit123,

I don't believe that many on these boards chose NC as a first choice; at some point, for many, it became the only choice. A person with BPD will usually try to maintain an attachment, regardless of the damage done to the attached. It is an attachment disorder. Sometimes to get free of that and recover yourself, you just have to walk away.

[FallBack!Monster]

the golden rule as much as possible:" do unto others as you would have them do unto you."

[elfyguy]

Anyway, regardless of whether you are the pw BPD or the non, why would the recommendation ever be to engage in cold, NC?  And this NC, does it always happen without informing the other party?  You just simply stop communicating?  This is just me but I would NEVER do that to someone.  

My BPDex wanted to keep in contact. However, she was being a really bad friend after the breakup. She sent weird,greedy and psychological messed up messages. When she said she had a new partner, I sent all of her friends and family(that I care for too) messages that I can't keep them as friends on Facebook. Then, deleted them all and blocked my ex. If my ex was as kind as I was during the breakup and during our relationship, then it would have been ok. Ask yourself, what's the point of having a friend that takes some pleasure in seeing you suffer? No contact was the best thing for me. I haven't spoken to her in months and, about 5 months ago, I was in a 6 year relationship with her. 3 weeks ago was her birthday and I don't care.

[Kalinin]

I would love not to go NC and be detached enough so that we could still at least talk, but unfortunately after she left for someone else and is getting married a mere 4 months after, I feel like I have no other choice. She just hurts me repeatedly and doesn't seem to understand it.

However, I announced NC in the most respectful way I could, said I still love her and is very sad that it came to this, but it's best for both of us. She contacted me after 3 months, said she missed me and wanted to remain "friends", but I honestly don't know how this would work.

So yeah, sometimes it feels cold, but what else can you do really?

[thefinalrose]

Hi jammit, I agree with you. A person who was in my life did something similar to what your friend did, although when I asked why he was behaving that way, he put words in my mouth and accused me of saying and doing things I've never said or done, while refusing to acknowledge his own behavior. He, too, accused me of being mentally unstable (although I have PTSD and have been working on it for a few years now, way before he began calling me mentally unstable). I tried working with him and tried to figure out where the misunderstandings happened, but it seemed like he just wanted to be angry with me and hate me.

What I'm not sure is, (and this is not addressed to anyone in particular, just something I think about quite a lot) why do people think it's acceptable to be intimately involved with an individual they know has a mental illness and then just go NC because they "can't deal with it"? Like if you know the person has a mental illness, you're making an informed decision to have a relationship with them, and if you do that and then dispose of them, that's just extremely cruel and sort of washing yourself of the situation and refusing to accept responsibility for your own decision. A mental illness never justifies maltreatment or abusive behavior, but I personally would expect anyone having a relationship with someone they know to have a mental illness to be willing to communicate clearly with them without it turning into a personal attack if the person with the mental illness is doing or saying things that are upsetting. 

Even though there is a person in my life who has been physically and emotionally abusive toward me and has traits of BPD and NPD, I would still be willing to work with him to fix the situation if he wanted to. I really want to understand. Then again, I'm of the mind that people aren't just "evil" or "crazy" or "personality disordered"; there must be a complex reason for the behavior, a complex inner conflict, some painful past experience, rather than a place of genuine hostility. Maybe I just think that way because I could never imagine treating someone like that on purpose. And I don't think I could ever just dispose of someone I claim to deeply care about, either, no matter how stressful their behavior.