Should I finally accept that there is no going back?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

4 months since I last saw Her. 4 months since She started Her new relationship with another guy. 3 months of NC.
I'm trying to meet with another girls. I had couple of one night stands. I love my job, I'm working out, focusing on work, family, friends etc.
But... .I'm still thinking about her every day. I know what She did was unforgivable. I know that it was really, REALLY strange, often painful, weird relationship. But I known her for 12 years. We've been together 6 years and She was love of my life... .Problem is that she still is.
My mother, my friends are all telling me that her new relationship won't last. That borderline is for life. She might feel better now, but eventually it's going to come back. And then she might want to go back to her "safe place" - me.
They also tell me, when that day comes, I should kick her out of my life becasue she doesn't deserve to go back.

But me? I'm still having the worst possible thoughts. All I can see in my mind is them... .Together... .Having kids, being married... .Living happily together. And that breaks me.

So I'm not really filled with hope or anything. But on one side I have people telling me that She'll be back. (not in a good way) That when things go south in her life she'll reach out to me.
On the other hand I have mine perspective... .In which I'll never see her again.
I still don't know which is worse.

Also dating other woman? I fought for my ex for years before we started being together. I loved her more than life itself. It was everything. I can't imagine going through something like that again. I can imagine myself being with someone else. But loving again as much as I loved my ex? No. I just can't picture it.

So please... .For all of You who read my story. What do You think? Are my family/friends onto something when they are saying that it's very likely for her to come back when her new R/S will be over? Or when Borderline will be back knocking to her door?
Or am I more likely to be right with saying that she's over me. And she'll never look back and decide to reach out to me?

This is my story. For those of You who are interested:
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=314479.msg12897836#msg12897836

[Nero.]

4 months since I last saw Her. 4 months since She started Her new relationship with another guy. 3 months of NC.
I'm trying to meet with another girls. I had couple of one night stands. I love my job, I'm working out, focusing on work, family, friends etc.
But... .I'm still thinking about her every day. I know what She did was unforgivable. I know that it was really, REALLY strange, often painful, weird relationship. But I known her for 12 years. We've been together 6 years and She was love of my life... .Problem is that she still is.
My mother, my friends are all telling me that her new relationship won't last. That borderline is for life. She might feel better now, but eventually it's going to come back. And then she might want to go back to her "safe place" - me.
They also tell me, when that day comes, I should kick her out of my life becasue she doesn't deserve to go back.

But me? I'm still having the worst possible thoughts. All I can see in my mind is them... .Together... .Having kids, being married... .Living happily together. And that breaks me.

So I'm not really filled with hope or anything. But on one side I have people telling me that She'll be back. (not in a good way) That when things go south in her life she'll reach out to me.
On the other hand I have mine perspective... .In which I'll never see her again.
I still don't know which is worse.

Also dating other woman? I fought for my ex for years before we started being together. I loved her more than life itself. It was everything. I can't imagine going through something like that again. I can imagine myself being with someone else. But loving again as much as I loved my ex? No. I just can't picture it.

So please... .For all of You who read my story. What do You think? Are my family/friends onto something when they are saying that it's very likely for her to come back when her new R/S will be over? Or when Borderline will be back knocking to her door?
Or am I more likely to be right with saying that she's over me. And she'll never look back and decide to reach out to me?

This is my story. For those of You who are interested:
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=314479.msg12897836#msg12897836

[Skip]

What do You think? Are my family/friends onto something when they are saying that it's very likely for her to come back when her new R/S will be over? Or when Borderline will be back knocking to her door? Or am I more likely to be right with saying that she's over me. And she'll never look back and decide to reach out to me?

I don't think anyone can predict this. Some think of these things as one dimensional, but the reality is that there are many factors at play - why you broke up, how you broke up, how the new relationship unfolds, etc.

I would, however, consider that your relationship has been over for close to a year and  she is involved with another man... .that is a lot of distance. She might call if there is a breakup, she might even spend some time with you, but the likelihood of building a long term relationship is fairly low. Not impossible, but unlikely.

I don't know if the question is:

Should I finally accept that there is no going back?

Rather, it might be:

Is it time to let go of hope, and grieve?

Historia się powtarza.

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Nero, On some level you probably already know that it's doubtful that her r/s w/the new guy will go happily ever after.  In fact, we can pretty much predict that the same issues will continue to arise because she still has BPD.  So I would suggest that your projections about her new r/s may be unrealistic and perhaps prolonging your pain.

I agree w/Skip; the question is: are you ready to grieve?

LuckyJim

[40days_in_desert]

Nero, I decided to post on your thread because you mentioned some of the same feelings and thoughts that I use to struggle with. It's been almost 2.5 years since my ex and I split. She actually started a relationship with my replacement before we separated even though she denies that part. We were together for almost 17 years. The guy was her first boyfriend and first sexual partner. He can't keep a steady job, has no car and lives with his stepdad. I not only felt rejected but if she left me for him, I thought that I was worthless in her eyes. My friends and family told me the same thing: they won't last. I told myself the same thing because I wanted it to be true. A year and a half later, they were still together and since I never pried into her personal life, I figured that they were doing good.
Then one day she told me all of the things that my replacement had done to her and why he is a bad person. How he manipulates her and plays the victim so she'll feel sorry for him, etc. Sad thing is that as much as I wanted to believe these things about him, I knew that if she could spill complete fabrications about me, she could do the same to him. Even if she believed them to be true. She said she was going to leave him and wanted us to get back together. She never did. Fortunately through good friends and therapy, I communicated my boundaries with her. Number one being that she would have to leave my replacement before we could talk about reconciliation. She said that I was judging and pressuring her and the recycle attempt ended.
Fast forward a few months and I filed for divorce this time. She filed in 2015 in another state where we lived and we ended up dismissing that case because we both moved to a different state. Long story... .
After I filed, she made two additional recycle attempts and I told her, "I don't see a romantic relationship working between us." She spiraled downward after that and painted me black after I said no twice. Just like that, I was the most evil man in the world in her eyes. In doing that, she showed me what the future would look like if we "reconciled". If I didn't agree with her or act or say things the way she feels that I should, it would be a huge problem. I can't accept a life like that.
So, as many people here would say, there's no telling if your ex's current relationship will last another week, month, year or a decade. There's no way of telling if she will ever want or try to come back to you. What if she did? What would that look like? If you would want that, I would suggest writing out your boundaries and sharing those if/when she tries to come back and see how she reacts. Have unbiased friends (like people on this site and a therapist) give feedback on those boundaries to make sure that they are healthy for both you and her. If she rejects them, it would be a good indication that the relationship would be a failure. Just my opinion based on my personal journey.
I wish you the best as you move forward with your life. I hate to hear the pain that you are going through. I, like many others here, know how you feel.   

[Nero.]

Hey Nero, On some level you probably already know that it's doubtful that her r/s w/the new guy will go happily ever after.  In fact, we can pretty much predict that the same issues will continue to arise because she still has BPD.  So I would suggest that your projections about her new r/s may be unrealistic and perhaps prolonging your pain.

I agree w/Skip; the question is: are you ready to grieve?

LuckyJim

What if she did? What would that look like? If you would want that, I would suggest writing out your boundaries and sharing those if/when she tries to come back and see how she reacts. Have unbiased friends (like people on this site and a therapist) give feedback on those boundaries to make sure that they are healthy for both you and her. If she rejects them, it would be a good indication that the relationship would be a failure. Just my opinion based on my personal journey.
I wish you the best as you move forward with your life. I hate to hear the pain that you are going through. I, like many others here, know how you feel.   

Thank You for the answers. It really helps, hearing different stories and points of view.

About Her coming back and us starting r/s again... .Right now I cant say I'm 100% sure of what I would do. However I'm closely to thinking that I want her to reach out  not because I wan't to go back to how the things were between us, but more to have a proof that her decision of leaving me in such butal way was not my fault... .That I really did everything I could to save our r/s. Because what haunts me is thought that right now, it looks like she's all good. She's happy (I think) with her new BF, she doesn't care about me at all, she moved on etc. And me? Well here I am. Depressed, trying to keep myself together on the outside but in reality I'm in pieces.

It might be an terrible thing to wish. But yeah... .I wish that her r/s won't last. That one day she'll want me back. If not for being with her, then for me to know that she needs me more than I ever needed her.

[40days_in_desert]

I can identify with those feelings as well. I still have some desire for her to want me again even though I couldn't and have no desire to be with her. At least not without significant progress of changes on her part. I wanted everyone to see her contribution to the end of our marriage. Eventually her own actions and patterns of behavior did that for me. Now, I take no pleasure in her image in the eyes of others being as tarnished as it has. That's what I wanted it in the beginning. My self worth was an all time low and thought that would help me. Come to find out, others knowing the truth about her has little to do with my self worth.

[SuperJew82]

Since you are asking for advice - and I can relate to what you are going through.

NO CONTACT is what will be your savior. I know my ex must be in another relationship ( because she isn't harassing or stalking me anymore ). I hope she does find someone who can be with her, but that person isn't going to be me. Non-disordered relationships off so many challenges as it is - I don't want to throw a major psychiatric disorder into the mix for added fun.

I'm not saying they don't deserve a chance to be happy. Everyone does. I'm just saying that I can't handle it. Maybe someone else can. I already know what it would likely come out to, and that is not for me. I know I sound like a broken record but I can underline that enough.

I'm to the point where if she does figure out a way to manage her symptoms and have a chance at a healthy and happy relationship, I would be happy for her. I don't think that is going to happen and even if she goes to therapy religiously - a relationship with a pwBPD is not easy at all - so it isn't the life I want. That's me being selfish and realistic, which I have not been before.

It takes years and years before therapy has an impact on their behaviour. I personally know three pwBPD. I find that in their cases, they still do the same things before they had therapy, but instead afterward ( when their emotions are down to normal levels) they realize what they did and are mindful about talking about it. They still harbour the same maladaptive emotions and act on them.

She has done horrible things to me again and again. She doesn't get another chance and if another woman crosses my boundaries again - that woman will not have a 2nd or 3rd, or much less a 24th chance like my ex did.

You cheat on me... .you are done. I can't rebuild that trust. You steal my prescriptions medications and lie about it... .That's a deal breaker. You put yourself into risky situations - you can't be part of my family. Simple as that.

Yes, I loved her more than any other woman that came before her. I think about her every day, but I also love myself - and my little girls do not need a frazzled father or a screwed up blueprint on how a relationship is supposed to be like.

[SuperJew82]

No Contact if you want to live your own life. That is my advice.

[Skip]

NO CONTACT is what will be your savior.

I'm not sure what no contact means in this context, SuperJew82. She is not trying to contact him at any level and "NC" is creating a lot of anxiety with Nero.

No contact is not working. Nero is still holding out some slight glimmer of hope and feels that contacting his past gf will clarify things for him.

"NC" is a temporary crutch. What comes next?

I'm closely to thinking that I want her to reach out  not because I wan't to go back to how the things were between us, but more to have a proof that her decision of leaving me in such butal way was not my fault... .That I really did everything I could to save our r/s.

Contacting your ex for this reason is probably not a good idea. When one turns and leaves (her) and one wants to stay (you), its all about being in a very different emotional place.  As time passes, the emotional place drifts further apart.

• She has grieved your relationship - most likely during the last year that your were apart. As you said, she was different. She then moved on to new beginnings with another man.

• You are early in your grieving process and in many ways still in the relationship... .thinking what you could do or could have done to keep it alive.

These two vastly different states of mind won't easily connect on a call or email. To her, you will feel needy and intrusive. To you, she will feel insensitive and uncaring. A wrong word from either of you could trigger the other and the contact will end badly and you both will go you owns ways with more distance, not less.

In short, taking your heart to her is not the answer. Just as her bringing a happy story about her new relationship is not the answer.

As hard as it is to say this, hope is what is torturing you. Hope that the relationship will likely fail (and most of all relationships fail in six months), hope that she is still thinking about you, hope that... .

When you are ready, and you let go of hope, you will start to feel the pain starting to slip away.

We're here to talk you through it.

[Turkish]

.
It might be an terrible thing to wish. But yeah... .I wish that her r/s won't last. That one day she'll want me back. If not for being with her, then for me to know that she needs me more than I ever needed her.

It got to that point for us, though my ex wanted to come back more to be with our kids than me,  though I certainly provided security and stability.  It felt kind of like when my mother admitted to me that she had BPD after I had figured it out.  It wasn't like a Phyrric Victory (kind of),  but maybe just anticlimactic.  

If I had taken her into my home again,  our r/s would have been even more imbalanced,  and a lot more baggage on both of our sides than what we brought with us the first time.  Baggage inspection is better done separately before getting on the plane where you are both trapped at 35,000 ft in an overcrowded, pressurized cabin with only stale pretzels to eat?

[jody452]

Nero,

I feel every word you have said.

Quick recap on me. Together 4.5 years almost got married, she cheated. I would of gave it another go but she left. Started dating someone else she claims a month after we split.
I hung onto hope too. For so long cause you read all these stories and they are so alike, yet you still want to believe that it was different for you. That you meant something more. That you relationship was real.
But they leave you and move on so quickly that hanging onto hope is all you can do to stop you from breaking.

In 8 months we managed to go 2 months no contact. She sent me this heart felt message that starting the contact up again. I confronted her to find out she's moving in with her new partner. I'm heaet broken again.

I can honestly say that no contact is the best thing you can do for yourself and I'm right there With you again at the painful start. I néed to get myself to hit block, but like you I keep hoping.

Grieving hurts so much

On a different note, I'm sitting here now trying to work out what is wrong with me? Why didn't I walk away why can't I still? I know the relationship was far from healthy yet I'll do almost anything to get it back

[Nero.]

• She has grieved your relationship - most likely during the last year that your were apart. As you said, she was different. She then moved on to new beginnings with another man.

• You are early in your grieving process and in many ways still in the relationship... .thinking what you could do or could have done to keep it alive.

These two vastly different states of mind won't easily connect on a call or email. To her, you will feel needy and intrusive. To you, she will feel insensitive and uncaring. A wrong word from either of you could trigger the other and the contact will end badly and you both will go you owns ways with more distance, not less.

In short, taking your heart to her is not the answer. Just as her bringing a happy story about her new relationship is not the answer.

As hard as it is to say this, hope is what is torturing you. Hope that the relationship will likely fail (and most of all relationships fail in six months), hope that she is still thinking about you, hope that... .

When you are ready, and you let go of hope, you will start to feel the pain starting to slip away.

We're here to talk you through it.

You hit close to home. So yes... .You are right. She's clearly in different place than I am. It still doesn't explain Her weird behavior and how she delt with things afterwards. (Saying one thing to me, another to my friend. Burning all bridges, blocking contact etc.)
But... .It doesn't matter, right? I can ask those questions as much as I want, but at the end of the day I'm still left with no answers.
Will she ever reach out to me? Maybe? Maybe not? If she does THEN I'll have something to think about. Right now... .Apart from "life experience" and beliving that all those years actually ment something to her, there is nothing I could take as a sign of her wanting to contact me ever again. She blocked me on social media. Before that she said that she doesn't want to be with me. She's with another man. Objectively - She's done with me. Yes, she did told my friend that "Maybe someday in the future we could be together again" but it was week before she officialy started her new relationship.

So that's me. I woudn't call my feelings "hope". Hope would mean that I can consider anything good happening between us. It's more a hunch, feeling that chapter's closed but book is still open. But I'm saying that based on, again, hunch. All evidence to the contrary.

I'll try to kill this 'hunch'. As you said... .Hope or not, it's better to kill everything that connects me to the past. It's done. Finished. There is nothing more to it. She's over me.

[Skip]

One question to explore is "what part of this is pathology and what part is just a relationship dying?"

What do you think?

The reason I ask, is that you'll see more of both in the future and the way to handle each is vastly different.

[Nero.]

One question to explore is "what part of this is pathology and what part is just a relationship dying?"

What do you think?

The reason I ask, is that you'll see more of both in the future and the way to handle each is vastly different.

Should I ask this questions in regards of her behavior or mine?

If mine then I can try to be objective as much as I can but there is no escape from thinking that I could done things differently. But is there a point of doing so? Major problem I'm facing is overthinking, overanalyzing. For every "I really shouldn't have done this!" there is "It would have happend anyway!" or "It's still beter than... .".
So again - How much of this is illusion/pathology - unhealthy thinking. and how much is me thinking straight? I don't know. I have no filter due to all the emotions bouncing back in my head.

If hers - Well... .As You pointed out. It might be just the fact that she no longer wants me. However can I forget the fact that she is diagnosed as person with BPD? And not by google or "suspicions" but by psychiatrists from the biggest mental hospital in Poland. That she self mutilated herself. That she had eating disorder. That she had all those problems that I was carrying with her? And looking into future - Can I expect that she'll behave rationally - as 100% sane person and I'll never see her again. Or maybe I should take under consideration that Borderline could come back knocking to her door and then... .then she might come knocking to mine.

... .Or maybe, don't expect anything?