How do I get her to get a BPD diagnosis?

[Golan Trevize]

For 25 years I have been the emotional caretaker of my wife: 15 with internalizing traits, the last 10 with strong externalizing traits. But I did so without knowing what I was doing, what was going on. So I made lots of mistakes. I hid all that was happening from everyone. Only in the last 3 years have I understood what BPD is at a theoretical level. I struggle with the cycles a lot. For some reason, up until the present episode, I thought that the devaluation cycle will go away. (I know, that's why it is called a cycle, because there is always another one coming). It takes a really big toll on me all this. I think I am out of my league. So I need practical advice. Specifics. I also need to keep myself grounded. Literally. Threatening divorce all the time is the easiest thing now. I hear it every other week. Moving downstairs and threatening, distancing fully in the blink of an eye seems unreal, but it happens. And I go up and down with all this. 4-5 times / year x 10 years = 40 times. But she has no diagnosis. So maybe I am wrong believing she has BPD sometimes I think. I did lots of research, my therapist says she does, but I still have doubts, because with the exception of 1 friend and my family, no one else believes me. And then there is all the suffering she goes through and that I go through. I find it too much to carry on my shoulders.

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[Mutt]

Hi Golan Trevize,



We believe you, although we can't diagnose because we're not professionals we can look at BPD traits it sounds like your cousellor hears BPD traits in your sessions, I'd suggest to not worry about the diagnosis, family and friends may think "Well she's not diagnosed" My ex wife is not diagnosed but I know about those push / pull cycles every year I would get kicked out of the house around the same time just after the Christmas holidays. It helps to talk to people that can relate with you and offer you guidance and support.

It sounds like she's currently emotionally dysregulated it takes a pwBPD much longer than you or I to return to baseline. I'd start with the lessons on the right, the perspective articles are excellent pieces then check your basic tools especially Ending ConflictDo you mean that you moved downstairs and that she'll follow you down there and fight with you? What do you when she's like that?

[isilme]

I think as long as it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, it's okay to expect it to swim and try to fly south or north based on the seasons, even if it turns out to be a goose.

A diagnosis is often NOT going to do much to change your PWBPD.  It CAN make you feel a little better, but it's honestly often missed by a therapist, and only those who specialize in it seem to be willing to make that determination.  Even if a health care professional tells her point blank "you have BPD" she will possibly (likely) deny it, and it can make her not want to talk to them again.

The term BPD describes a spectrum of behaviors that can be constant but are often cyclical.  The tools seem sound for use in any dramatic relationship, so take a look at them and see if there are any you have not tried. 

As for family and friends - they often mean well but unless they are VERY open minded and willing to believe you, they can't usually understand it.  Depression, anxiety, these are hard for people to follow and they have far less stigma than borderline issues or things like bi polar disorder.  Think about some of the stories you may have relayed to them... .if you heard that from a friend before you'd live with BPD in your life, how likely is it you'd have thought they must be exaggerating - no one can be like that?"  Add to this the concept of mental illness makes pretty much everyone uncomfortable because there is NO simple solution for any of them, and BPD can't even be treated directly with drugs... .it's all behavioral adjustments and learning to process and express emotions in more healthy ways. 

Don't be disheartened about a formal diagnosis.  I've been on this site for about 10 years.  It's helped a lot, and I believe it's helped my life get past some really bad drama.  H will never be diagnosed.  I can barely get him to the MD about physical issues - took me 2-3 years to finally learn he has diabetes.  But that does not mean the tools did not help me, the lack of a formal diagnosis.  Keep posting - this community won't tell you-you're crazy, making it up, or trying to make her look bad.  We've been through the crazy boat a few times, the cycles of praise then demonization, the black and the white.  We've had to step up in many cases and handle the "adulting" to keep things afloat.

You're not alone 

[Golan Trevize]

Thank you, Mutt,



I mean she is moving dowstairs, blocks me on emails, phones, etc. incommunicado, threatens with the police if I try to talk to find out what happen. After a yelling session where I become from best friend - the enemy. One moment I was barbecuing, the next I failed to get the car out of the garage, even though I am the one leaving in a bit, not her.  Takes 5 days to come up with a reason why, obviously something from the past, transformed now, inaccurate, inflated. So I have no choice but not to communicate, to give space. Currently going  on 5 weeks like this. I am a prisoner in the master bedroom, can not be on the same floor at the same time.  It happened before. usually sometime after all the excitement of the new year's activities fades away and the Canadian winter reality sets in, mid jan- feb. this is the biggest of the crisis. there are 3 more at least during the year. She also starts a campaign of lies about me with the people that never met me mostly. Then she leaves me written messages, mostly ridiculous accusations about infidelity, or makes comments of the same nature, but shuts me down if I try to say anything since they have no base and uses the opportunity to threaten again with the police or divorce.  

but the pattern has evolved a lot. 2008-2011 there was a lot, a lot of yelling. especially in the morning. I left a few times, got out of the car and left, and she came after me. Other times, I got so depressed from all the yelling that i would cry in the closet for hours and she had no reaction.  I did not know about BPD at that time. Other times she would be depressed and run away from home or from work for  day or 2 or 3. Or sometimes just a few hours. Mostly I was expected to deliver on the obsession she ahd at the time: moving to california = I have to get a job so WE can move. or to the Hague. Or to victoria bc. Or to florida. Or I had to come up with the money for her new school. I did, it took 5 days and she changed her mind.

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[walkinthepark247]

Golan, Welcome to this site. It has been a lifesaver for me.

Like you, I used to worry about getting that diagnosis for my wife. In the past, I was certain that once she just got that diagnosis, she would see the light and realize how awful she had been treating me. I have learned to just let it go.

The fact is that pwBPD need to truly want the change for themselves. Merely getting someone the label of BPD (a behavioral disorder) is not going to do much to help. Most of the top programs for treating BPD required that the person come of their own volition. That’s very different from other forms of mental illness which you can just medicate away.

Many months ago, my wife found my secret stash of BPD books. She began reading them and became convinced that I was the one who truly had BPD. Also, what if your wife goes to a therapist who is ignorant on BPD or doesn’t dig deeper, it’s wholly possible that they won’t see the BPD traits you do. We’re the “lucky” ones who get to see all of the concerning traits firsthand. The save the worst for those in their household. Sure, there are instances of very low functioning pwBPD. But, those who are high-functioning can mask it quite well. Keep in mind that therapists aren’t often truly qualified to make a diagnosis. I say this because my wife told her therapist that I was reading BPD books. That therapist (who is truly making a medical diagnosis without a license) told her she didn’t have BPD. My wife has rubbed that in my face many times even when I’m not bringing up BPD.

I should add that I never expressly said “BPD” to my wife. Rather, I often said that I was concerned about her mental state. Either way, it wasn’t received well – ever.

As others have pointed out, you know the truth of what happens behind those closed doors. If learning about BPD helps you, keep on truckin’! You need to just let that diagnosis go because it might never come. She might never seek a diagnosis or accept a diagnosis. That’s your reality. Once you accept that, it will help you to move forward. At least, it did for me. Please keep up with this site.

[sladezy]

Hi Golan Trevize,



We believe you, although we can't diagnose because we're not professionals we can look at BPD traits it sounds like your cousellor hears BPD traits in your sessions, I'd suggest to not worry about the diagnosis, family and friends may think "Well she's not diagnosed" My ex wife is not diagnosed but I know about those push / pull cycles every year I would get kicked out of the house around the same time just after the Christmas holidays. It helps to talk to people that can relate with you and offer you guidance and support.

It sounds like she's currently emotionally dysregulated it takes a pwBPD much longer than you or I to return to baseline. I'd start with the lessons on the right, the perspective articles are excellent pieces then check your basic tools especially Ending ConflictDo you mean that you moved downstairs and that she'll follow you down there and fight with you? What do you when she's like that?

Mutt,

This sounds very much like the cycle I am in (trip number 3 this time). What was your longest time apart?  The current one is my longest and most damaging. I don't know if it's really over now or not. Did you cut ties in the end or did your ex wife just stop coming back? I know every situation is different but I'd love to hear more from a similar cycling style.

[Golan Trevize]

Hi,

My wife agrees that she has abandonment issues. She does not agree of the PBD, but she agrees she has a problem with abandonment issues. She is not really seing something well qualified, rather a new age student in counselling. Recently she got the idea that i have narcissism... .I wish... .but it is not the case, I just have a caretaker personality, so really far from an NPD. Any way, specifically, how do I get her to calm down now that she is in this state and rejects me? Last time it stopped when we started having lawyers and mediators and I traveled a few days, but it was after months of separation... .Is that the only way? She is suffering, I am also, etc. Is there a shortcut? How do I break the cycle so all this suffering is avoided?


Thank you,

Golan

[Radcliff]

Golan,

I am sorry to hear of your great difficulties.  Being in a long marriage with a pwBPD can be tremendously exhausting, to say the least.  It sounds like you've done some research on BPD.  If you've read books on the topic, which ones?

Have you come upon any of the coping tools for "nons" such as ourselves in your reading?  With so many years of marriage behind you, you likely figured out a lot of coping mechanisms on your own.  This Web site can help you raise your game to a new level, bringing some relief.

What are some of the successful coping techniques you've developed over the years that you didn't know about back in the beginning?

WW

[Golan Trevize]

Mutt,

This sounds very much like the cycle I am in (trip number 3 this time). What was your longest time apart?  The current one is my longest and most damaging. I don't know if it's really over now or not. Did you cut ties in the end or did your ex wife just stop coming back? I know every situation is different but I'd love to hear more from a similar cycling style.

Hi Sladezy,

This is trip # 4 for me, or maybe more, depending how I count them, but if I define it as major break-up, lawyers / outside people getting involved at some point, complete non-communication and long term continuous (months) emotional separation, then it is #4. Every time I start by thinking it will be the last, this is it, this is the end. I am not anymore the tough guy that can take anything after the first week. It has a major emotional impact on me this reversal of position, of who I am really. I have a hard time moving mentally from fulfilling the expectations of constant communication and affection giving and support and being there and planing - to being alone, zero communications, not doing all I was doing just 1 day ago. Redefining my future again and again is really painful. And at #2 I made some mistakes too, that now are turned against me... .the perfect storm.

How about you, how do you cope with all this? Sounds that you are going through the same general torments... .

[Golan Trevize]

Golan,

I am sorry to hear of your great difficulties.  Being in a long marriage with a pwBPD can be tremendously exhausting, to say the least.  It sounds like you've done some research on BPD.  If you've read books on the topic, which ones?

Have you come upon any of the coping tools for "nons" such as ourselves in your reading?  With so many years of marriage behind you, you likely figured out a lot of coping mechanisms on your own.  This Web site can help you raise your game to a new level, bringing some relief.

What are some of the successful coping techniques you've developed over the years that you didn't know about back in the beginning?

Hi Wentworth,

I probably did come up with coping tools, but they seem not to work for too long with me. All this emotional roller coaster is wearing me down really bad. I show a lot of affection when talking, most of the times. I spend time with my son, I numb myself with netflix, I don't drink much in general so that is not one of my coping strategies, occasionally maybe. I honestly kept everything bottled up and did not tell a soul for the most part. Only recently I have opened up. I find that it is useful to read or talk about it, it brings reality back kind of a thing, if not, my wife's reality - I mean by that her view of reality - will take over.

[isilme]

Golan Trevize,

#1 - meant to tell you last time I posted, I'm a big Asimov fan, cool username :D. 

Now, about your coping techniques:

I honestly kept everything bottled up and did not tell a soul for the most part.

Write here.  Write as often as you can.  Bottling it up just hurts you.  No one here is going to blow you off, tell you "just leave her, man."  We all have had experiences that are pretty similar, just different flavors.  We are all loving someone who is bad about causing drama, trying to drive us away while getting mad we might pull back.  This is a good place to get some of those feeling out - you don't have to have a question, just write about your day, the god and the bad. 

Writing here is good for you because it gets it out.  It can help when you question how an event went down, what happened from your point of view versus hers. 

And having some coping skills does not mean you are suddenly super happy, everything is fine.  It's okay to feel sad about BPD.  It's okay to mourn a little how you thought the r/s might be and the reality of living with someone with the condition.  Being a caretaker of someone with BPD can often lead us to suppress our own feelings and emotions.  We worry our feelings are not important, we're not allowed to have them, they are not "correct".  This is not true.

You are allowed to feel how you feel, regardless of how your W is doing.  If you feel sad, that is okay.  If you feel content or even happy, that is also okay.  Even while she is freaking out, you are allowed to not freak out.  You likely have very little to do with her freak out, no matter what she claims.  Her emotions are out of control, unregulated, and the only coping method SHE knows is to yell at you.  Part of this is to let her express and expel the emotions.  Another part is to simply try to drag you into her emotional hell - misery really does love company.  You don't have to go down there with her. 

Are you still living parallel but separate in the same house?  Has she gotten any better after the last episode or is it still ongoing?

[Radcliff]

Golan,

Let me echo isilme and ask you to tell us a little more about the exact situation now.  Are you distant from her now, or getting along?

Do you have verbal conflict with her?  When that happens, how does it go?

WW

[sladezy]

Hi Sladezy,

This is trip # 4 for me, or maybe more, depending how I count them, but if I define it as major break-up, lawyers / outside people getting involved at some point, complete non-communication and long term continuous (months) emotional separation, then it is #4. Every time I start by thinking it will be the last, this is it, this is the end. I am not anymore the tough guy that can take anything after the first week. It has a major emotional impact on me this reversal of position, of who I am really. I have a hard time moving mentally from fulfilling the expectations of constant communication and affection giving and support and being there and planing - to being alone, zero communications, not doing all I was doing just 1 day ago. Redefining my future again and again is really painful. And at #2 I made some mistakes too, that now are turned against me... .the perfect storm.

How about you, how do you cope with all this? Sounds that you are going through the same general torments... .

Hey,

I don't know how I'm going to continue to cope, but reading and learning things was helping, so was focusing on myself and taking time out for myself, walking the dog or just being ok in my own skin. Our situation doesn't seem to be settling after many months. What was it like emotionally disconnecting and then reuniting? How does that process work?  I've been apart n together 3 times, this being the 3rd time currently. My ex wanted mediation surrounding the kidsin the beginning and I refused to play the game (we already had a plan for the kids in place and she refused to address the relationship issues)