BPD Behaiors...

[Take2]

Last year on these boards somewhere when I was totally green to BPD... .

Someone told me "try not to take any of it personally. It was never personal! It was just your turn to take her hand, and dance with her for a while".

It broke my heart. Because its as sad as it is completely true!

It IS heartbreaking... .   I am picking up the pieces yet again as I know my ex is suddenly in a brand new r/s - even though the week before he became "exclusive" with her, he told ME he loved me... .   he was lying about this girl entirely to me until 2 days ago when his coworker told me about it.   Still smarting from that blow... .

I might understand intellectually that it's all about him... . but my heart cannot comprehend how he could have done this to me... . AGAIN... .  

[Moonie75]

Arn, similar thing with my ex. Her dad walked out when she was just five. She vividly remembers every detail of that night 30 yrs ago!

Her dad hardly saw his daughters through their school yrs and often failed to show for birthday & christmas's etc. those two girls must've felt very 'unworthy'.

Fast forward twenty years & dad suddenly wants to have a relationship with his now grown up daughters. My ex seems to worship the ground that tosser walks on. My ex's BPD behaviour didn't really appear until her own divorce four years ago. But in these last four years her father is the only family member she's never acted out on!

I've quietly wondered if this is down to fear he would abandon her again? Who knows.

[Moonie75]

Last year on these boards somewhere when I was totally green to BPD... .

Someone told me "try not to take any of it personally. It was never personal! It was just your turn to take her hand, and dance with her for a while".

It broke my heart. Because its as sad as it is completely true!

It IS heartbreaking... .  I am picking up the pieces yet again as I know my ex is suddenly in a brand new r/s - even though the week before he became "exclusive" with her, he told ME he loved me... .  he was lying about this girl entirely to me until 2 days ago when his coworker told me about it.   Still smarting from that blow... .

I might understand intellectually that it's all about him... . but my heart cannot comprehend how he could have done this to me... . AGAIN... .  

":)one this to me... . AGAIN... . "


Undoubtedly one of the most commonly repeated things we've asked ourselves through the tears, as we've curled up alone, and cried our hearts out!  

God help anyone & all of us who've become too familiar with that question!  

[Tausk]

So it's only present in the primary relationship? Going back to the core fear of abandonment? My ex's dad left her with an abusive mother when she was 5 yrs old. But she loves her dad to death today and now lives with her mother and our son. Bc her dad told her he was sorry 20 years ago, her sisters and her act like he's god.

I'm sorry I don't know how to edit my posts. Can some tell me how to edit after I have posted to correct spelling errors... .

The dysfunction does not only come out in the primary romantic relationship, but it can be the most dramatic.  But it can also be intense with primary family as well.  Read about having a person with BPD in the family.  I was writing from my experience, where my ex's family seemed to function.  It only after a couple of years did I realize that the functional only covered up the years of insanity, and everyone of them was totally f'ed up.  But again, it's not us.  It's the disorder.  

I had to depersonalize it in order to detach.  The questions that I need to answer are internal.  Real freedom for me came from asking, "Why did/do I... . ?"  not "Why did she... . ?" There will never be a final and consistent answer to any of the questions regarding "why did she... . ?"  It's simply the nature of the disorder which does not compute in my world.

Learning about BPD helps me understand what questions to ask, but ultimately the question I need at ask is, "why am I attached to a relationship with someone who is so disordered, and what can I do about it to improve myself."

[Take2]

There's a "modify" button on the top right of your post after you hit enter - it will allow you to edit your posts.

It is really our own behavior that we need to be focusing on... . particularly if we're all asking "how could he/she have done this to me... . AGAIN" as I am sitting here doing.  But I DO ask what is going on with ME that I can't fully disengage from this person - aside from the obvious fact that I do work with him and cannot escape him.  I am pretty certain that if we did not work together, I would have been done with him long ago.  But now?  I can't understand it.  I do not miss being emotionally abused constantly (how could I?  It happens all the time whether we're together or not)... . I don't miss being accused of hitting on men left and right all over the place. 

And even at the times I see him and can see a very angry, disturbed man in front of me, some part of me feels this intense craving for him... . . 

[Tausk]

There's a "modify" button on the top right of your post after you hit enter - it will allow you to edit your posts.

It is really our own behavior that we need to be focusing on... . particularly if we're all asking "how could he/she have done this to me... . AGAIN" as I am sitting here doing.  But I DO ask what is going on with ME that I can't fully disengage from this person - aside from the obvious fact that I do work with him and cannot escape him.  I am pretty certain that if we did not work together, I would have been done with him long ago.  But now?  I can't understand it.  I do not miss being emotionally abused constantly (how could I?  It happens all the time whether we're together or not)... . I don't miss being accused of hitting on men left and right all over the place. 

And even at the times I see him and can see a very angry, disturbed man in front of me, some part of me feels this intense craving for him... . . 

Trauma Bond, Stockholm Syndrome, PTSD, Intermittent Reinforcement, Idolization to Devaluation, ADDICTION!

Why does a Heroin addict crave and pick up the drug even when he knows it will destroy him.

For me:  It's the highs.  The adrenaline.  The mirroring.  The escape from the realities of my own fears and self doubts.

But it takes time to recover, and I try to find as much compassion for myself as I do for others on this board. 

[Take2]

Tausk... . you are right and I recognize my massive addiction to him... . I just can't find my way out right now... .   I thought I'd made so much progress yet when he reached out to me this week that sent me spinning... . then as he was flatout lying to me I found out he's not only met someone new but already exclusive with her... .   and BAM the addiction sucked me right back in... .

I am struggling SOO badly tonight in withdrawal. ... .

[Tausk]

Tausk... . you are right and I recognize my massive addiction to him... . I just can't find my way out right now... .   I thought I'd made so much progress yet when he reached out to me this week that sent me spinning... . then as he was flatout lying to me I found out he's not only met someone new but already exclusive with her... .   and BAM the addiction sucked me right back in... .

I am struggling SOO badly tonight in withdrawal. ... .

T2, I hope you can be kind to yourself tonight.  We all have struggled.  The pain and the despair I have felt is so real but only people on the board really understand.  I understand your pain.  I really do. 

I have lived my own, such as why would I stalk my ex and drive by her place when my replacement is there instead of me?  Why would I jab such knives into my own gut?  Because we are trauma bonded.  At least there is a reason.  And that can provide me hope.

You're not alone, and remember that you're working on the path to freedom.  Progress not perfection.  As I said, I try to give myself the same compassion as I would others on the board.   I hope you can as well. You are good, kind, loving person of decency and character.  You are brave.  We all are on this side.  And there is always hope because we are not alone, and we do have the tools to move forward.

In support and with my prayers,

T

[Take2]

Thank you... .    :'(

[Murbay]

I would not expect a person with Autism, Aspergers, or Down's Syndrome to change and cognitively comprehend certain concepts.

That isn't necessarily true in all cases though you are correct about expectations. As someone with Aspergers, I have been been able to address weaknesses and turn them around. We differ because we are aware of being different and either chose to accept those differences or work through them. In terms of relationships, because we are aware, if someone said something we did was an issue, would have no problem working through that with them. For example, I can suffer from anxiety in crowded areas and it can cause sensory overload. Imagine trying to process 20 or 30 different conversations all happening at the same time  

I can either chose to accept it and do nothing, stay away from crowded areas and avoid the issue altogether or adapt and overcome, either through therapy or on my own. Regardless, I still take ownership and responsibility rather than place blame on the crowd for being there.

My personal approach has been to look at the situation first. If it’s for something important, I have explained to friends that I might have to step away for a short while to somewhere quiet and explained the reasons why at the start. That way it doesn’t affect my friends, they aren’t stood wondering where I have gone, ruin their day looking for me, wondering if they have done something or if something is wrong and I certainly don’t put the blame on them for being there and hold them responsible for my decisons. If there is no reason for being there then I can decline and when looking at long term prospects, addressing the issue permanently is the best solution.

PwBPD don't have that luxury, many don’t have the functionality to look inwards and when they do get a glimpse, it becomes a hot potato and everything then gets projected outwards onto others. Instead of taking ownership, they look for something to fill that void, even if it is just briefly masking the pain they are feeling. Many of the behaviours seem to be as a result of having the inability to control those inner feelings, either because they don’t understand, refuse to take on that responsibility or because they never developed those coping mechanisms and revert to what they would do as a child.

[Tausk]

I would not expect a person with Autism, Aspergers, or Down's Syndrome to change and cognitively comprehend certain concepts.

That isn't necessarily true in all cases though you are correct about expectations. As someone with Aspergers, I have been been able to address weaknesses and turn them around. We differ because we are aware of being different and either chose to accept those differences or work through them. In terms of relationships, because we are aware, if someone said something we did was an issue, would have no problem working through that with them. For example, I can suffer from anxiety in crowded areas and it can cause sensory overload. Imagine trying to process 20 or 30 different conversations all happening at the same time  

It was my quote and I apologize.  I did not mean to offend anyone and my reference was incorrect.  I value respecting all people and this statement was short sighted and not well thought out.

I hope that you can accept my apology.  The intent was good, but my ignorance and haste led to a poor analogy.

[Murbay]

Tausk,

Thank you though there is no need at all for an apology, I totally understand where you are coming from and agree with your perception. I apologise if it caused any concern and also to Take2 for crediting the comment to him.

There are key similarities between someone on the AS and BPD in terms of certain reactions so your quote is certainly not wrong as it does stem from cognitive comprehension to certain concepts. My exBPDw attempted to label me with BPD as we did share some similarites to the point she almost had me convinced. It was my T that helped put that into perspective.

PwBPD is more emotional and illogical, AS is more logical and less about emotion.

PwBPD tend to project their percieved emotions outwards and meltdown where AS tend to draw emotions inwards and meltdown because of their surroundings.

PwBPD tends not to take responsibility, AS tend to take responsibility for everything

PwBPD tend to lack empathy for others, AS, although it was once said lack empathy, we are in fact hypersensitive to other peoples pain

So whilst some external traits might look similar, more often than not it's for very opposite reasons. So to that, your statement was indeed correct. People on the AS are more likely to challenge those concepts in themselves and seek help where needed. Obviously as it is a spectrum, the same cannot be said for everybody as some have the capability to be more self aware than others.

Again, no need to apologise as your comments were very valid 

[Pearl55]

Arn

Bpd is NOT an issue or a problem of INDIVISUALS. Bpd= 100% nuts.

All borderline's BRAINS only and only work the same way but their ACTIONS are different due to different level of IQs ( disorder has no effect on IQ ), different cultures,... .

Non borderlines are different individuals but because they have been affected by this illness, all become only a statistic as non borderline. That's why we all understand each other really well. 

[damage control]

So it's only present in the primary relationship? Going back to the core fear of abandonment? My ex's dad left her with an abusive mother when she was 5 yrs old. But she loves her dad to death today and now lives with her mother and our son. Bc her dad told her he was sorry 20 years ago, her sisters and her act like he's god.

Arn ... my personal issues are more evident in my familial r/s's (or lack thereof) as well as with friends - I break these bonds quite easily, go years without speaking to my family (not through fighting but because I am detached from them - sibs only - my parents both died before I was 24) ... it is the same with friends, I move on, get bored, or simply 'don't' keep up contact.

With romantic attachments, I attach much more deeply - and the abandonment stuff is triggered bigtime creating push/pull dynamics that I don't feel with friends and family - but I also tend to fight for these much more.

not sure if that addresses your question or makes any sense. 

[Rebuilding me]

I'm new here but my understanding with pwBPD or people in general is that we all have some kind of core issue to work out. It is hard to see any rhyme or reason in most cases. The variables are just too great! We meet these people to learn how to deal with ourselves, they have the same opportunity, but their wiring does not allow them to process the same! I have been hurt greatly by pwBPD, they have undoubtably been surrounding me my whole life. In order to learn what I must! Understanding the concept of a rescuer makes it easy to realize how we must change our ways, but because we are rescuers in the first place, for whatever reason, maybe our purpose is to have even greater sympathy for these sick individuals. Not to throw ourselves down on the alters, but to understand what true selfless love for others means! We all have been pushed to limits where we have lost our cool and added to the triggering! Maybe all of this is to not lose our cool, but to know when our role with pwBPDs is over! Thus limiting triggering events and both parties involved learning! Maybe we are not martyrs because of our own disorders, but what is expected of us as our roles! That is what true unconditional love is, and that is exactly what the pwBPD are looking for!

Turn the other check, while finding a way not to get ran over! Thus the purpose of life!

[Pearl55]

my w has the BPD bad enough to wreck a marriage and someone's emotional stability (viz., mine), but she didn't do the push/pull, the gaslighting, the false acusations, the alieanation, the witholding sex, or the threatening to leave. the rest of it, yes. some clevertrousers once figured out the number of permutations: 9 criteria, 5 of them for a diagnosis. i read the resulting number on this site once.

ironmanfalls put it nicely, one of the characteristics of the disorder is the denial of the disorder. it's a mechanism to protect themselves form examining themselves. very few have the awareness and, equally important, the courage to face it. that's why very few of them can work on it. a few used to post here (oceanheart and a. j. mahari - read their posts, it's very enlightening).



so they don't all exhibit quite the same traits. they've got personalities too. mine has a large circle of friends, some she's known for decades. but, you know, it still sux. more for us than them tho'. i really have a hard time sympathising.

Maxen

I know a borderline woman who is a smoker and has a large circle of friends. She doesn't smoke infront her freinds who doesn't know she's a smoker! BUT she took a revenge from her husband and slept around with strangers, a middle aged woman!

Borderlines have chameleons personalities, they are copy cats because they've got NO sense of SELF. When somebody has got no sense of self, they are not able to have a true perdonities. If they had they wouldn't be borderlines. Not all borderlines act the same way, waif type ACT IN their negative feelings and emotions.

If your wife was a borderline and didn't ACT OUT, that doesn't mean she didn't have all the negative feelings towards you, she didn't just express them to you. That's why so many men get shocked when their shy and... . Wives cheated on them and suddenly left them!

[Take2]

Arn ... my personal issues are more evident in my familial r/s's (or lack thereof) as well as with friends - I break these bonds quite easily, go years without speaking to my family (not through fighting but because I am detached from them - sibs only - my parents both died before I was 24) ... it is the same with friends, I move on, get bored, or simply 'don't' keep up contact.

With romantic attachments, I attach much more deeply - and the abandonment stuff is triggered bigtime creating push/pull dynamics that I don't feel with friends and family - but I also tend to fight for these much more.

not sure if that addresses your question or makes any sense. 

damage control are you BPD?  very interesting perspective... .   I am interested to hear more, will read some of your background to help me understand more... .    

[Take2]

PwBPD is more emotional and illogical, AS is more logical and less about emotion.

PwBPD tend to project their percieved emotions outwards and meltdown where AS tend to draw emotions inwards and meltdown because of their surroundings.

PwBPD tends not to take responsibility, AS tend to take responsibility for everything

PwBPD tend to lack empathy for others, AS, although it was once said lack empathy, we are in fact hypersensitive to other peoples pain

So whilst some external traits might look similar, more often than not it's for very opposite reasons. So to that, your statement was indeed correct. People on the AS are more likely to challenge those concepts in themselves and seek help where needed.

Murbay... .   very intersting, I didn't know that there was any comparison between the two.  I didn't think the original comments about this were doing that - I must have the boat on it but admit that both last night and this morning my head is in a pretty bad place... . but it's very interesting to read your perspective, thank you for sharing... .

[Pearl55]

So it's only present in the primary relationship? Going back to the core fear of abandonment? My ex's dad left her with an abusive mother when she was 5 yrs old. But she loves her dad to death today and now lives with her mother and our son. Bc her dad told her he was sorry 20 years ago, her sisters and her act like he's god.

Lack of symbiotic bond between a newborn and her/ his biological mum is one of the reason that lead to BPD. A borderline disordered mum is not able to have this bond with her baby that's why when you look at their families most probably their mums are borderline too! That maybe one of the reason their dads left.

A borderline disordered female normally is not close to her borderline mum and always attaches to their dads. A borderline disordered mum is envious of her daughter's success and even sometimes feel worthy if they are able to steal their daughter's boyfriends or husbands if they are able to!

[damage control]

Arn ... my personal issues are more evident in my familial r/s's (or lack thereof) as well as with friends - I break these bonds quite easily, go years without speaking to my family (not through fighting but because I am detached from them - sibs only - my parents both died before I was 24) ... it is the same with friends, I move on, get bored, or simply 'don't' keep up contact.

With romantic attachments, I attach much more deeply - and the abandonment stuff is triggered bigtime creating push/pull dynamics that I don't feel with friends and family - but I also tend to fight for these much more.

not sure if that addresses your question or makes any sense.  

damage control are you BPD?  very interesting perspective... .  I am interested to hear more, will read some of your background to help me understand more... .  

Take2

I honestly don't know - I meet 7/8 of the 9 of the criteria - I definitely do not outwardly rage.

TBH - until I saw the criteria listed in b+w I had never thought about there being anything 'specifically' wrong with me but the list was a bit of a shock to me as I most certainly to detach easily from friends/family- I just always thought I was a loner.

With my romantic r/'s, I have only ever had one that went past 1 year - and that one, I did detach from completely and easily (together 15 years).