Separate realities and poor communication

[Perfidy]

In coming to a year of separation and detachment from my ex girlfriend I have a few answers that I arrived at by my self. We each viewed the relationship separately. Our realities were different. The only failure was communication. This failure in communication led to denial. A break from reality. This break from reality caused discomfort for both of us. Beyond that I can only claim prejudice. We are only human after all. Disorder, disfunction, happiness, hopes, dreams, all human traits.

[arn131arn]

Good stuff as always, Perfecty!

Would you say that the same breakdown in communicating leading to denial and different realities are trademarks of a borderline relationship or could this happen in any relationship?

The reason I ask is, I'm delving into past relationship's right now with my P and let's just say I'm not liking the patterns nor my possible NPD mother, and why that in itself attracts me to unhealthy relationships.

Sigh... . more revelations, more truth, more uneasiness. Nobody said this would be fun, huh?

Arn

[RecycledNoMore]

I doubt that even if you/ we had effective communication that the relationship would have worked, 2 people living/ experiencing different realities does not make for a functioning relationship.

The problem for me at least was, he was mentally ill  and I ignored the obvious signs because of how I veiwed myself.

I didnt love me, he couldnt love me.

I loved him, he hated himself.

I have spent endless days and nights pouring over the posts from these boards from 5 years ago till now, searching,questioning for the elusive answer as to how and why I found myself in a relatively long term relationship with a mentally ill man.

It all comes down to me.

How I feel about myself.

I cannot expect any cohesive,rational explanation from the behaviour patterns of a mentally ill person.

In the end it all comes down to me.

[Perfidy]

Each of us experiences reality separately. The disorder prevents communication. We weren't even in the same book let alone on the same page. Communication was impossible, therefore pointless. It would have taken two healthy people. My values are work, family, home, responsibility. I'm solid. I chose an unhealthy partner, for my own reasons, and we couldn't grow together. I believe that this can happen in any unhealthy relationship.

[Turkish]

I doubt that even if you/ we had effective communication that the relationship would have worked, 2 people living/ experiencing different realities does not make for a functioning relationship.

The problem for me at least was, he was mentally ill  and I ignored the obvious signs because of how I veiwed myself.

I didnt love me, he couldnt love me.

Mine wrote exactly that in her journal, right after showering me with all sorts of compliments on the written page.

The reality is that she is a love addict, and this was confirmed by things I found on my computer that she wrote her ex BF back in 2007. Same. Exact. Things. One response was that her ex, whom she was still in love with at the time, called her a drama queen. Yes. He left her. I persisted 3x longer until she left me. "Everyone leaves" is her reality. That's not mine. Heck, even though being abandoned in various ways by the 3 most significant women in my life due to a mixture of mental illnesses and addictions, I still don't think that way. Perhaps I'm the idealist.

Given more open and honest communication, the r/s wouldn't have lasted if I had really known and embraced who she was, not who she was trying to be for me and for her family and culture. My fault is that I always knew it on some level, yet still kept going. As you said, it all comes down to me.

[HerPerpetuallyTornLover]

Wow a lot of this is ringing true for me. I love to read about the similarities in the relationships sometimes, it makes me feel less alone. We had separate realities too. She just was lying to match mine, and talking and pretending like she wanted to work or fix it. So when the split came, it was natural for her, and a blindside for me. Its amazing how long they can keep it up. To me its not logical, why wallow around and be miserable when you have people genuinely trying to work with you and help you?

[chelishere42005]

So do you really think they are lying about wanting to work to fix the relationship or themselves?  Or is it that they do truly want to work on it all but as the relationship starts to improve the BPD takes over and it stresses them to a point of remission?  I ask because my SO has seemed to truly make an effort at facing her disorder and improving things but she finds it so overwhelming and stressful that she is tempted to fall back into the old patterns of abandoning me and the relationship altogether.

Just curious.  Thanks!

[HerPerpetuallyTornLover]

So do you really think they are lying about wanting to work to fix the relationship or themselves?  Or is it that they do truly want to work on it all but as the relationship starts to improve the BPD takes over and it stresses them to a point of remission?  I ask because my SO has seemed to truly make an effort at facing her disorder and improving things but she finds it so overwhelming and stressful that she is tempted to fall back into the old patterns of abandoning me and the relationship altogether.

Just curious.  Thanks!

Honestly, its a really sad situation. For me, it seemed like she really did want to... . in theory. But working on things is hard, improvement is hard, and when you're operating in a relationship with someone who is scared away or unmotivated by anything that can be considered "hard", progress doesnt really happen. This was just my experience, but she would SAY and SWEAR that's what she wanted, and maybe she would get through a day or few days or a week, but the motivation would be gone as soon as she realized it would take TIME. She had expectations that couldnt be met with just a few days of being better. So she would quit. So they might really want to, but later on down the line maybe decide its not worth it or is too hard. Everything else became a priority, I watched her waste so much time just watching tv on the internet instead of taking even a peek at the DBT websites or this website.

So for your situation, if I relate it to mine, I could see why she could be feeling overwhelmed. Do you feel she might have shorter timelines than you are expecting? Or maybe when you fight about something she did wrong and you bring it up only a few days later, do you get something like "when will you ever let that go/drop it/i changed now/that was before", even though it was only a short while ago?

[arn131arn]

Without question I was alone in a relationship with my self. She just happened to be there.

I don't mean to take light in your situation, Perf. But this statement is soo true. It made me laugh out loud

[coolioqq]

To me its not logical, why wallow around and be miserable when you have people genuinely trying to work with you and help you?

THAT is the thinking of a rational person. High-functioning pwBPD will even say the same thing, but as others said the above cannot be expected from them. Their realities are simply different from nons'. It is possible that their neural pathways leading them to this behavior are quite different. I speculate that brain chemistry reacts to reinforce behaviors that we (even unintentionally) reward. PwBPD have a strong addiction to pain and the brain is like: "Well, if you want that... . I'll keep it coming." The article on depression linked in this forum calls this behavior of the brain "garbage". Nons are far from immune to that; we too can and do have thought addictions, which is the source of our co-dependent and rescuing behaviors.

I am still working on myself, but for me the "way out" of this mess seems to be catching the brain as it generates garbage (i.e. feelings of guilt for failure, dwelling on the feelings of love towards an imaginary person constructed by our SO's through mirroring, etc.), and clearly and soundly discarding such thoughts as irrational and false. PwBPD may have a difficult time with this, which is maybe why they develop pain addiction. We too have a difficult time with that, which is maybe why we got here in the first place. In short, the "way out" of pain and into a happier life is a series of choices and a healthy dose of defiance against the negative behaviors of our brain. Love should NOT involve any emotional pain; we've been fed garbage for years and years... .

[Dog biscuit]

We each viewed the relationship separately. Our realities were different. The only failure was communication. 

I believe in a relationship, be it friends or lovers, there must be a commitment to communicate our realities. A relationship should most ideally be of two autonuomous people trying to share their reality and to be able to differ from each other. Having separate realities can be nice and challenge your mind and beliefs in a good way. But having a totally different reality or emotional perception of the bond you are trying to create or feel, and witholding that information feels like deceit to me.

Differences are okay and nice, but witholding vital information about those differences is not okay in my opinion.

[coolioqq]

Differences are okay and nice, but witholding vital information about those differences is not okay in my opinion.

This is what lead me to end my r/s. I would not end it if honesty was there from the beginning like it was on my part. My ex said to have done it out of for fear of abandonment, and then because of a memory "blackout." I find it hard to believe in the latter. I guess survival instincts often makes pwBPD to put their fear in front of everything else. Fear seems to be the only emotion they can understand and identify with. And, what is far worse, act on it mercilessly. I wouldn't wish such a dark state of mind on my worst enemy... .

There is little hope in a r/s in which trust is severely compromised, BPD involved or not. That very thought should be on everyone's mind when it comes to considering recycling.

[Skip]

In coming to a year of separation and detachment from my ex girlfriend I have a few answers that I arrived at by my self. We each viewed the relationship separately.

This is alway true in a relationship, right?

Our realities were different. The only failure was communication. This failure in communication led to denial. A break from reality. This break from reality caused discomfort for both of us. Beyond that I can only claim prejudice. We are only human after all. Disorder, disfunction, happiness, hopes, dreams, all human traits.

Is this what you mean?

Different realities: You moved away and felt in was a LDR.  She got involved with someone else and was working two relationships before selecting the other  

Failure in communication: She didn't tell you until after she moved in with him

So are you saying that she certainly had the right to move on if your relationship wasn't working for her, what really caused the problems was her inability to communicate her waning interest with your relationship and her desire to get involved with someone else?

[Perfidy]

Yes to the first skip. I feel this to be true in all relationships, human beings being separate, sorry for the typo. Not desperate.  entities having individual perception of reality.

Yes and no to the second, communication didn't seem to exist at all with the pwBPD. It was as though the words never made it to the cerebral cortex and got processed. I feel there was some obligation for her to tell me she had moved on instead of acting out deceit to me for months. It was an Oscar performance.

[Skip]

I feel there was some obligation for her to tell me she had moved on instead of acting out deceit to me for months. It was an Oscar performance.

After 8 years together, absolutely.  This was very weak on her part.

Yes and no to the second, communication didn't seem to exist at all with the pwBPD. It was as though the words never made it to the cerebral cortex and got processed.

Did you every share this with her (below)?  :)o you think she knew this?  

    Sex was my motivation not intimacy. I didn't want it to last.

It was a one night stand that lasted eight years.

Was she happy and fulfilled in the relationship before was started seeing the other guy?  Or was your just partying, sex, a convenience, and a habit?

What was her reality?  What was yours?

[Perfidy]

The sex was the original motivation. It progressed as time went on. I communicated this to her. I told her that I had grown to love her, didn't fail to show her.

[Changingman]

Yes Perfidy

An Oscar performance. I've come to realise she was always having attachment issues and would use her sexuality to gain some control. I was one and my replacement was the next. Couldnt let go of one or the other until I was about to find out and she ran and hid. I can now see how NPD grows out of the same core issues. Found out about the smear campaign, pure projection.

All this is now just a faint drama from the past, seems so childish and cruel now. I treated her like I would myself and instead got a NPD sadist when I made her take some responsibility. I was worn out and starting to wake up to the poisonous fumes. I can see how her disorder needed chaos mending daily, I started to demand some changes.

Anyway I find responding to these behaviours really dull now, getting better at expressing what I feel to myself and other people. Drinking and drugs has really lost all flavour to me, I realise lI was falling in with toxic stuff that was pretty boring to me but soothed her. She loved how people really rated me as a friend.

People pleasing is coping with others from the bottom of yourself.

It's nice to not be in charge of how others feel anymore, ugh! Being liked sounds like bondage now, it's nice to spend time with myself even when I'm with others. My best friend since 8 lost his dad the other day (93) and it was amazing to watch his mum gently bhit him off, I looked great in my suit and he looked terrible etc, we both have BPD mums. His sister has put on loads of weight, suffers from depression like her mum, seems to project a lot of hostility and negative feedback. We both were amazed at how obvious it seems now. Later argued who had the craziest mum, I won I think, though his mum did go on and on about suicide our whole lives.

I can see now Perfidy how she 'visited' our relationship like a tourist, not a friend in the world, it's so sad really. Another set of people, lovers, dogs, just vanishing away from her. Hungry ghosts.

I think I needed such an extremely mentally Ill BPD in order to see how messed up I had become, truly a huge year of learning.

[Zon]

The reason I ask is, I'm delving into past relationship's right now with my P and let's just say I'm not liking the patterns nor my possible NPD mother, and why that in itself attracts me to unhealthy relationships.

I am doing something similar with my past relationships to remember what a relationship should be or could be.  The best one I had involved someone with her own issues (minor to me then and extremely minor to me now), yet it was a wonderful experience.  I need to remember the "normal" that I like.  I have also come to realize that I met my wife when I was torn up inside and at one of my lowest points in life.  Perfect fodder. 

[itsnotme567]

Without question I was alone in a relationship with my self. She just happened to be there.

that sounds  like something my wife would say our r/s