Sitting and watching, again

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

SS22 went into his first dual diagnosis (addiction/anxiety) program when he was 15. Since then he has been to three addiction treatment programs. This week, he entered another. By his own admission, he has never entered any of these programs because he has wanted to change. His uBPD mother picked all of them, including the last one which went for a year and had no professional counselling.

This latest program is also dual diagnosis. His mom picked it too - SS22 says he knows very little about it. A few months ago, she "saved" him when his drugs debts got too high, took him in, kicked him out and took him in again. And then the two of them lived in her apartment for a few months. Neither had a job. Most of his contact with DH was asking for money to pay off his drug debt (ie his mother who paid his drug debt), or blaming him as per his mother's instructions. When we saw him a few days ago, he had a bunch of new clothes (his mom rewards him with new clothes and electronics when he does what she asks) and looked healthy and strong. Not like someone heading into a program who feels he needs to make a change.

SS22's mom is a classic enabler to his addiction. He was her all-good child. But when he tried to move in with DH when he was 15, she raged for days (staged an intervention, disowned him, then begged him to live with her again). He has spent most of his life trying to please her, which as we know is impossible. His Ts have said he doesn't have coping mechanisms for his anxiety so turns to drugs and alcohol to self medicate. He can rarely identify or name his own feelings. When he has occasionally spoken out about his mom, she has figured it out and "fired" his T or pulled him from the program. After months of freezing him out, she takes him back in again.

Now that SS22 is an adult, there is no parental participation in this latest program. In some ways this is good because the Ts don't get to hear the "poor mom" stories and then later realize they were all lies. But it also means the Ts don't get to hear some of what has really gone on from DH. His mom has convinced SS22 he has a PD. He has been diagnosed with anxiety and depression but she has told him it is bigger than that (projection?) He told DH that he and his mom think he has Avoidant PD and then said "and don't blame mom, she is just trying to help me."

Because there is no involvement of DH in this latest program, we fear that even if he gets a good counsellor, he will not tell the truth. Or maybe more likely, he doesn't even really know the truth. I am hoping the program tests him and that he doesn't have a PD. But of course we have no idea what he is dealing with since he has spent many years under his mom's control.

DH and I are going to visit with SS22 at his treatment program on Xmas eve (his mother is going Xmas day, and we have no desire to run into her.) For years, I've wondered if someone should be telling SS22 about his mother's likely BPD. She has never been diagnosed, and is unlikely to be. Many years ago, she lost it with one of SS22's Ts, who had spent years working in a BPD clinic. The T told us that although she couldn't diagnose DH's ex she recognized a number of BPD traits. But before this T was able to work through some things with SS22, his mom had pulled him from the program.

DH has talked in generalities about BPD with SS22, as per the guidance of his Ts. The ones who have figured out SS22's mom have said that the topic of mental illness needs to be slowly introduced as SS22 struggles to even talk about her. Most people meeting SS22 can see his tremendous potential. DH and I see him as smart, athletic, funny and handsome. But he believes none of that.

So, as he heads into the program do we just sit quietly and say nothing? I know he's an adult and that he needs to take responsibility for his own treatment. But it feels so deja vu to watch him head to another program where he'll say little about the real issues. I know a good T can help him work through some of what has happened in the past, but it is unlikely he'll bring those up given that he doesn't want to disappoint/upset his mom, who just "saved him", rewarded him and drove him to the program.

I honestly don't even know what we could do -- write a letter to the program, talk more to SS22 now that he's away from his mom? Of course, there is probably nothing we can do, but it sure feels helpless to just watch all of this from the sidelines.

I'd appreciate any ideas or reminders to sit on my hands.

[NorthernGirl]

SS22 went into his first dual diagnosis (addiction/anxiety) program when he was 15. Since then he has been to three addiction treatment programs. This week, he entered another. By his own admission, he has never entered any of these programs because he has wanted to change. His uBPD mother picked all of them, including the last one which went for a year and had no professional counselling.

This latest program is also dual diagnosis. His mom picked it too - SS22 says he knows very little about it. A few months ago, she "saved" him when his drugs debts got too high, took him in, kicked him out and took him in again. And then the two of them lived in her apartment for a few months. Neither had a job. Most of his contact with DH was asking for money to pay off his drug debt (ie his mother who paid his drug debt), or blaming him as per his mother's instructions. When we saw him a few days ago, he had a bunch of new clothes (his mom rewards him with new clothes and electronics when he does what she asks) and looked healthy and strong. Not like someone heading into a program who feels he needs to make a change.

SS22's mom is a classic enabler to his addiction. He was her all-good child. But when he tried to move in with DH when he was 15, she raged for days (staged an intervention, disowned him, then begged him to live with her again). He has spent most of his life trying to please her, which as we know is impossible. His Ts have said he doesn't have coping mechanisms for his anxiety so turns to drugs and alcohol to self medicate. He can rarely identify or name his own feelings. When he has occasionally spoken out about his mom, she has figured it out and "fired" his T or pulled him from the program. After months of freezing him out, she takes him back in again.

Now that SS22 is an adult, there is no parental participation in this latest program. In some ways this is good because the Ts don't get to hear the "poor mom" stories and then later realize they were all lies. But it also means the Ts don't get to hear some of what has really gone on from DH. His mom has convinced SS22 he has a PD. He has been diagnosed with anxiety and depression but she has told him it is bigger than that (projection?) He told DH that he and his mom think he has Avoidant PD and then said "and don't blame mom, she is just trying to help me."

Because there is no involvement of DH in this latest program, we fear that even if he gets a good counsellor, he will not tell the truth. Or maybe more likely, he doesn't even really know the truth. I am hoping the program tests him and that he doesn't have a PD. But of course we have no idea what he is dealing with since he has spent many years under his mom's control.

DH and I are going to visit with SS22 at his treatment program on Xmas eve (his mother is going Xmas day, and we have no desire to run into her.) For years, I've wondered if someone should be telling SS22 about his mother's likely BPD. She has never been diagnosed, and is unlikely to be. Many years ago, she lost it with one of SS22's Ts, who had spent years working in a BPD clinic. The T told us that although she couldn't diagnose DH's ex she recognized a number of BPD traits. But before this T was able to work through some things with SS22, his mom had pulled him from the program.

DH has talked in generalities about BPD with SS22, as per the guidance of his Ts. The ones who have figured out SS22's mom have said that the topic of mental illness needs to be slowly introduced as SS22 struggles to even talk about her. Most people meeting SS22 can see his tremendous potential. DH and I see him as smart, athletic, funny and handsome. But he believes none of that.

So, as he heads into the program do we just sit quietly and say nothing? I know he's an adult and that he needs to take responsibility for his own treatment. But it feels so deja vu to watch him head to another program where he'll say little about the real issues. I know a good T can help him work through some of what has happened in the past, but it is unlikely he'll bring those up given that he doesn't want to disappoint/upset his mom, who just "saved him", rewarded him and drove him to the program.

I honestly don't even know what we could do -- write a letter to the program, talk more to SS22 now that he's away from his mom? Of course, there is probably nothing we can do, but it sure feels helpless to just watch all of this from the sidelines.

I'd appreciate any ideas or reminders to sit on my hands.

[livednlearned]

It's a hard choice. On one hand, codependence is codependence, and like you say SS22 is an adult. And getting into the middle might just make it worse, since it sounds like anything you do gets back to BPD mom.

On the other hand, writing a letter might give the clinic some important back story. Similar to what you shared with us. One thing I've found very useful in the past four years dealing with a revolving door of third-party mental health professionals, school personnel, and lawyers is to tell them just the facts. I usually start by saying that I have my own ideas about what is going on, but since I am not a clinician and cannot make any official diagnoses, it's best if I just stick to the facts. I used to want to dump the whole story on people without taking a breath, but now I feel more measured in my approach. What do they think? What kind of information is useful?

A carefully thought out and well-written confidential and loving letter could go a long way. Something along the lines of, "We recognize that SS22 is an adult, and that parental participation is not required. But he is our son and we love him, and want to share some of the things we have observed over the years in the hopes that they may give treatment staff some perspective."

So much of anxiety and depression is based on family systems and if they don't have accurate information about the system, it seems unlikely that he will get the treatment he needs.

Having said that, a really good T can often hear the discrepancies in stories that people tell, although I do think that takes a lot of time and an exceptionally good T.

My T made me recognize the dysfunctional enmeshment I had with my dad (narcissistic traits) and it turned my world upside down. I was the "golden child" of the "golden child" but only when I was performing in the family as the scape goat to deflect the trauma my uBPD brother created. The only way that came to light was me writing down my conversations with my family and then sharing them as close to word for word with my T as possible. That helped her see how well I was set up to believe the kinds of things a narcissistic entitled man would say, telling me how much he loved me while having his boot on my head.

If it were me, I would write the letter. But it might be a good idea to take it to a therapist and have a conversation about what the goal is, and to make sure it stays focused on helping SS22.

[NorthernGirl]

An update. DH and I went to visit with SS22 at his treatment program on Christmas eve. He emailed after being there a few days saying that he was allowed to have visitors, he had occasional access to email, phones, etc. He didn't know any of this before going because it was his mom who booked the program.

So, some good news. His therapist is doing DBT treatment with him. He says he has already been reminded that other people haven't caused his addiction. He went in to the program with his mom telling him that his addiction was caused by DH who had allowed his brother to bully him. SS22 says he gets that the change needs to come from him. So I'm sure he shared that with his therapist.

However, he is still very much believing his mom has "saved" him. He said it a number of times. And he defended his mom, even when we said nothing about her "whatever you say, if it wasn't for mom I would still be on the street." He made lots of comments on how it is his mom against DH and me. I asked him why he thought we were so against her, rather than just having a different belief than her. He wasn't sure, just that he had always felt in the middle. He says he wants to write his story in a memoir to help capture it and referenced all the "stuff" that happened to him growing up. Which is the stuff his mom has made up about him being bullied by his brother, and DH just ignoring it all. But we're hoping a therapist can help him work through all of that.

His mom visited SS22 on Christmas day. SS20 (who has special needs) went with her. She screamed at him when he told her he wanted to spend Christmas eve/day with us). When she dropped him off on Christmas day he said his mom gave SS22 "lots and lots of gifts." SS20 doesn't seem to mind or notice that he got one gift from her (a newer version of a game he doesn't use.)

DH will now try to visit with SS22 occasionally and stay in touch on email. DH says he is going to try to bring up the topic of the behavior of SS22's mom. DH figures that since SS22 is in treatment -- he's sober and has some support -- he will talk about some of this. Not necessarily talking about BPD, but talking about some of the things she has done and how it has influenced SS22.

We will see how this goes, with fingers crossed. He will likely be there at least 6 weeks and then he has no idea what he'll do.

[livednlearned]

I was reading about the effects of having a BPD parent in a featured post on the site, and this really struck me:

They are disordered.  They cannot see us.  They are the PLAYWRIGHTS, DIRECTORS and MAIN CHARACTERS of their life drama and everyone else in the cast must read from their scripts and be waiting in the wings for their cue to come on stage and circle them and it is their show.  Even if you have a bit part, you must be available at all times and watching their show and participating in their show and GOD help you if you want to star in your own life.

My own dad has narcissistic traits, but I'm fairly certain his mother was BPD of the hermit/wait type. The metaphor of a BPD parent being the playwright, director, and main character in their life drama rings so true, and it sounds like that's how it is for your SS22. If he is kept down, then BM gets to rescue him.

Another thing from that post struck me too:

Scott Peck said it is evil to "tit suck from and control the same person" and that is what they did for years and years.  He also said recognizing "evil" in a parent is the hardest thing a child can do in a life time.  Most can't and stay enthralled.

 

If SS22 recognizes the true role his mother played in his life, it will likely end their relationship, if not severely strain it. SS22 probably knows that, and she most certainly does, at least on some level. And that may make it exceptionally difficult for him to do until he has the strength, since he believes that he would be in worse shape without her.

It's sad, and complex. I hope he has a good T in his program, and that he can start putting the pieces together.