Triangulating With My Ex

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

LSS: she's been in some kind of r/s with the OM she left me for about 2 years now. She moved out 1.5 years ago. S5, D3, joint custody. She married the OM two months ago, and he moved in.

The kids had major issues not only due to the split, but also since she introduced them to him right away after she moved out. S5 has been exibiting major anger issues lately, wishing his mom would die, and then that he would die. She told me this. He's emotionally sensitive, but I've never heard anything like this at my home. It turns out that she figured out he was angry at her for she neglecting him, so she kind of fixed it for now.

S5's first day of school went well. I took us all out for ice cream after we picked him up.

I have the kids for 5 days straight, two of them hers since she's busy. Though I hardly ever send her pics, I felt generous and did last night. She replied with anxiety: "do they have enough air?" The kids wanted to sleep in two empty clothes hampers, like a fort. I replied that it wasn't a vacuum chamber and that this was why I was hesitant to send her pics, because I never knew what would trigger her. What ensued was a text convo. She apologized and said that it was hard to rewire herself from all of her patents' fleas, basically. I responded that I would support her, trying to not do it in a jerk way, though I first validated her that we don't know what we don't know. Then she went Waif and said that sometimes it needed to be pointed out to her to see all that was wrong with her. Harsh words on herself.

I donned my Turkish hat (I think) and talked about how tough it was to differentiate ourselves from a multi-generational dynamic, and I included my mom in this, even mentioning my mom's recently admitted anoerexia. She also said that she feels badly that she didn't try harder to keep our family together. I didn't comment on that much. She said that it was painful to know that she was the problem and that she needed outside support to not go through it alone. So she was going to call her T. I wound the convo down nicely.

What strikes me is that there was no mention of the OM. She's not alone. But she is... .

There's good triangulation, and bad. I like to think I did the good kind. What struck me was not guilt, as she stated, but shame. Maybe in the beginning I gave a Parent ego response,.rather than an Adult response, but it triggered her to beat up on herself, to go straight to shame "I'm the problem." (I.e., "I'm a bad person"

This I find all very fascinating, though I don't take pleasure in it because it involves our children.

[Turkish]

LSS: she's been in some kind of r/s with the OM she left me for about 2 years now. She moved out 1.5 years ago. S5, D3, joint custody. She married the OM two months ago, and he moved in.

The kids had major issues not only due to the split, but also since she introduced them to him right away after she moved out. S5 has been exibiting major anger issues lately, wishing his mom would die, and then that he would die. She told me this. He's emotionally sensitive, but I've never heard anything like this at my home. It turns out that she figured out he was angry at her for she neglecting him, so she kind of fixed it for now.

S5's first day of school went well. I took us all out for ice cream after we picked him up.

I have the kids for 5 days straight, two of them hers since she's busy. Though I hardly ever send her pics, I felt generous and did last night. She replied with anxiety: "do they have enough air?" The kids wanted to sleep in two empty clothes hampers, like a fort. I replied that it wasn't a vacuum chamber and that this was why I was hesitant to send her pics, because I never knew what would trigger her. What ensued was a text convo. She apologized and said that it was hard to rewire herself from all of her patents' fleas, basically. I responded that I would support her, trying to not do it in a jerk way, though I first validated her that we don't know what we don't know. Then she went Waif and said that sometimes it needed to be pointed out to her to see all that was wrong with her. Harsh words on herself.

I donned my Turkish hat (I think) and talked about how tough it was to differentiate ourselves from a multi-generational dynamic, and I included my mom in this, even mentioning my mom's recently admitted anoerexia. She also said that she feels badly that she didn't try harder to keep our family together. I didn't comment on that much. She said that it was painful to know that she was the problem and that she needed outside support to not go through it alone. So she was going to call her T. I wound the convo down nicely.

What strikes me is that there was no mention of the OM. She's not alone. But she is... .

There's good triangulation, and bad. I like to think I did the good kind. What struck me was not guilt, as she stated, but shame. Maybe in the beginning I gave a Parent ego response,.rather than an Adult response, but it triggered her to beat up on herself, to go straight to shame "I'm the problem." (I.e., "I'm a bad person"

This I find all very fascinating, though I don't take pleasure in it because it involves our children.

[Aussie JJ]

Hey Turkish,

You are really showing the ability (my reading here) to distance yourself (detatch) from what is perceived to be her stuff and what is the kids stuff. 

I dont know if im reading it correctly but I can understand the rescuer role being played in the triangulation game (we are drawn to it, its a semi natural role that many fall back into) and seeing it is for what it is. 

Fears being raised regarding the kids and the ability you have to say, i understand (validate feeling) ABC however XYZ is the case its a valid fear/feeling to have given past experiences. 

It is triangulation however as you said its healthy from where im sitting as that detachment exiats where it the kids that are the victims in this insance.  Both worrying for them and sharing information to support them. 

The second instance i beleive you have stepped out of the role a bit by defering/empowering her to seek those answers with her own T.  This is more her issue, although being previously involved your not absolutly objective you are able to sort of leave it be and not rub it in. 

IMO, not a bad effort considering.  Their was a post about an alternative to the karp-triangle with different roles being implemented by the parties.  You found yourself in a position of being placed into the rescuer and you were able to (my understanding here) step back and coach/guide her (empower her to find the answers herself) with the T she mentioned. 

My reading here is this is unavoiding the 'unhealthy' triangulation where it would be saving her and also I dont know the wording but it would have been nuteral or non-judgemental to stop the dynamic that was occuring. 

The OM, I remember you saying he was younger and from what you jad seen a bit of a Narc.  To me, this is still effecting the kids and I dont know the answer here.  Stepping back and guiding jer as non judgementally as you can is all you can do. 

(If im reading it wrong correct me)


AJJ. 

[Mutt]

Hi Turk,

She also said that she feels badly that she didn't try harder to keep our family together. I didn't comment on that much. She said that it was painful to know that she was the problem and that she needed outside support to not go through it alone. So she was going to call her T. I wound the convo down nicely.

She sounds like she's being awfully hard on herself? She's a newlywed?

I felt excitement and good after I got married for a few months although we had our issues prior to getting married, I was also split white.

Maybe she's struggling because it's a blended family?

Do you sense regret?

[Turkish]

I thought she was rather hard on herself, though she should be hard on herself for being foolish, impulsive, and neglecting the kids. However, going to shame struck me. As my T said,.she's not a bad mother, just neglectful. Kids are smarter than we think, and pick up on it. S5 told me tonight that he wants time with me apart from his sister, even though 3 weeks ago we had that when we went to a rock concert.

That she telegraphs regret almost two years later is concerning... .for the OM. It has nothing to do with me (I don't think), but her r/s with the kids.

I think I felt a little guilty by triggering her shame, but if it gets her back into T (rather than in denia, with her New Happy Life), then all the better. The kids are the one thing from her Old Life who will never go away.

AJJ: yes, I judge him to have strong narcissistic traits (probably not NPD), but the kids like him, even if they view him to be some dorky guy. It could be much worse. No matter how he came into the r/s, I get the sense he wants to do the right thing by them. I won't invalidate that. Still, I think at least S5 sees it as "Mommy and her husband" rather than the kids. Our spouses are our primary relationships, and children need to realize that. However, kids so you need the extra validation and attention as we as parents slowly wean them towards independence.

[Mutt]

I think I felt a little guilty by triggering her shame, but if it gets her back into T (rather than in denia, with her New Happy Life), then all the better. The kids are the one thing from her Old Life who will never go away.

You're right, the bigger picture is that she may get back in and see her T, that way it benefits your kids. She was foolish, impulsive and neglected your kids and her problems didn't go away and I know you know that. I'm sorry your kids had to go through that. Thankfully they you have you in their corner.

“No matter where you go – there you are.” -Confucius