Realising they are toxic

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

This is kind of an update, kind of a revelation. I don't know if it will give anybody else the same clarity, but maybe.

Two weeks in, NC, I removed her off Facebook, which sounds kind of petty and childish saying it like that, but it's a step. Like many of you I wanted to reach out on a couple of occasions, then something really struck me.

Every time that woman comes back into my life I end up unfocused, stressed, with less money, no forward motion and real anxiety. I even stop with the gym and healthy eating. It just happens. When she goes, and I have had a few weeks detox, things start to pick up.

I really believe that her and her sister, who is worse by the way and even got pregnant to try and trap her bf into marrying her (he dumped her, immediately, blocked her on everything and is now laughing at her) have a poisonous vibe about them.

So I'm done, I'm out, I think the spell is broken. At one stage I wanted her back so badly, but that one thought crystallised things for me. Is your life actually better with them in it? Take them out the vision for a minute, look at everything except them, is it better or worse?

As soon as I did that, I stopped wanting to contact her. I hope somebody else gets something from that!

[Frustratedbloke]

This is kind of an update, kind of a revelation. I don't know if it will give anybody else the same clarity, but maybe.

Two weeks in, NC, I removed her off Facebook, which sounds kind of petty and childish saying it like that, but it's a step. Like many of you I wanted to reach out on a couple of occasions, then something really struck me.

Every time that woman comes back into my life I end up unfocused, stressed, with less money, no forward motion and real anxiety. I even stop with the gym and healthy eating. It just happens. When she goes, and I have had a few weeks detox, things start to pick up.

I really believe that her and her sister, who is worse by the way and even got pregnant to try and trap her bf into marrying her (he dumped her, immediately, blocked her on everything and is now laughing at her) have a poisonous vibe about them.

So I'm done, I'm out, I think the spell is broken. At one stage I wanted her back so badly, but that one thought crystallised things for me. Is your life actually better with them in it? Take them out the vision for a minute, look at everything except them, is it better or worse?

As soon as I did that, I stopped wanting to contact her. I hope somebody else gets something from that!

[thisagain]

Bloke,

I'm glad things are looking up for you!

I get what you mean about sounding petty, but removing someone on Facebook can be really important. It's so disruptive to be going along having a nice day, scrolling through the recipes and animal videos (or whatever your friends post on Facebook   ) and suddenly see your ex there.

How long have you been doing NC? Even after accepting that a relationship was toxic, there can still be some ups and downs. Don't be hard on yourself if you aren't always as certain as you are now. But it's really great that you've realized all of this, and I'm going to try your exercise the next time I find myself wanting to contact my ex. Thanks for sharing your insight with us!

[JerryRG]

They will suck the life out of you until you are dead or long for death. I don't know anything more evil then people who destroy. BPDs don't need lethal weapons other then their twisted mental state of mind to inflict damage and injure.

Run, run like hell and never ever look back.

[Frustratedbloke]

It is two weeks into No Contact now, this was a recycle, so it has been on, then off, then on again for a year. This time she came back for two months and it is the last time I will take her back.

Like I say my life is going fine, better even, then she comes back with her destabilising chaos and she leaves me struggling to pay the bills or find any kind of happiness. It happens every time, that realisation is enough.

She's literally out for what she can take, she doesn't care about anyone except herself and her horrid little sister who is genuinely one of the worst people I have ever met.

I should have paid more attention to that, she's just a better actress than her sister... .

[hergestridge]

Every time that woman comes back into my life I end up unfocused, stressed, with less money, no forward motion and real anxiety. I even stop with the gym and healthy eating. It just happens. When she goes, and I have had a few weeks detox, things start to pick up.

This reminds me. During the 20 years I spent with my BPDxwife there was a period when I got my ___ together, starting eating well and exercised a lot. I really had control of the situation.

Now in hindsight I understand that this particular period was when she worked nights and I worked days, so we barely met! Once she got back into my life on a daily basis everything went sour again. She attacked anyone that was at hand, and when that was me I got all the ___. It drained me of hope and energy.

Looking back it would probably have been better if we didn't meet on a daily basis.

[Frustratedbloke]

It is amazing the same patterns repeat and every time we think if we just do a b or c differently then everything will be better. It won't, breaking things and people are part of the experience for them.

I know mine just wanted to be taken care of, but it was all encompassing, 24-7 care that only a mentally handicapped child should require. My car blew up after, of course after, taking her on a trip to the airport. I swear I could see a smile on her face when we talked about it later.

They seem to enjoy people suffering for them, it validates them. It's awful... .

[paperlung]

Every time that woman comes back into my life I end up unfocused, stressed, with less money, no forward motion and real anxiety. I even stop with the gym and healthy eating. It just happens. When she goes, and I have had a few weeks detox, things start to pick up.

I can relate to this 100%.

It's my fault, though. I always let her back into my life in some shape or form.

[Frustratedbloke]

Trust me I know how you feel, I must be on recycle number four or five and this time she literally slept with me once and then proceeded to friendzone me, all the time promising more when she just had time. I am ashamed to admit I let that go on for six weeks more, all the time she tried to get ridiculous favours and me to spend money on her.

Like absurd things, driving her 10 hours to the airport she'd chosen to fly from because it was cheaper. Crazy stuff.

I didn't give her much and eventually said no, come round mine for dinner, that's the only date available to you now. She was gone, like a poof of smoke, not even a goodbye.

Funny thing was I was calling her on her manipulation, calling her on her tricks, all the way through. I know the games. That seemed to make her angry.

[Fr4nz]

Trust me I know how you feel, I must be on recycle number four or five and this time she literally slept with me once and then proceeded to friendzone me, all the time promising more when she just had time. I am ashamed to admit I let that go on for six weeks more, all the time she tried to get ridiculous favours and me to spend money on her.

Like absurd things, driving her 10 hours to the airport she'd chosen to fly from because it was cheaper. Crazy stuff.

I didn't give her much and eventually said no, come round mine for dinner, that's the only date available to you now. She was gone, like a poof of smoke, not even a goodbye.

Funny thing was I was calling her on her manipulation, calling her on her tricks, all the way through. I know the games. That seemed to make her angry.

A usual quote you can find in this forum says... ."they usually come back to you IF and WHEN they NEED to".

That can be for being validated, neediness, feelings of void/emptiness that must be tackled, personal favours, financial help, etc.

Asking help for some of them can be okay... .others are just plain selfish and - depending on the situation - cruel; it really depends on the specific individual, but the core reason is the same: neediness.

Anyway, yours is just another empirical proof among moltitudes of empirical proofs.

Sorry man... .a big hug

[Frustratedbloke]

Thanks! Yeah I know she came back, in hindsight, because she needed help with her uni work. She would have failed that course without me I think, not that I'm arrogant but I'm a journalist and I can find information quickly, so I did her coursework when she just couldn't do it.

After that she just took more until I said no, then she was gone. It really was that simple, take as much as I can before the doors slam shut. Like a kid stuffing sweets into their pocket and running away before the parents come back downstairs.

Now I've learned to look at her like that,  I've kind of lost respect for her and I'm amused by the whole situation. She thinks she wins every encounter, but she'll drive anybody decent out of her life and she'll be left with the dregs in the end.

That's the way I am choosing to rationalise things. I was good to her, she wasn't good to me. I will find someone that deserves me. She will end up with the person she deserves... .

When her looks go South, and she is gorgeous, she will be in trouble

[Fr4nz]

Thanks! Yeah I know she came back, in hindsight, because she needed help with her uni work. She would have failed that course without me I think, not that I'm arrogant but I'm a journalist and I can find information quickly, so I did her coursework when she just couldn't do it.

After that she just took more until I said no, then she was gone. It really was that simple, take as much as I can before the doors slam shut. Like a kid stuffing sweets into their pocket and running away before the parents come back downstairs.

Now I've learned to look at her like that,  I've kind of lost respect for her and I'm amused by the whole situation. She thinks she wins every encounter, but she'll drive anybody decent out of her life and she'll be left with the dregs in the end.

That's the way I am choosing to rationalise things. I was good to her, she wasn't good to me. I will find someone that deserves me. She will end up with the person she deserves... .

When her looks go South, and she is gorgeous, she will be in trouble

Like you, I arrived at similar conclusions with my uBPD/HPD ex gf; in the end she's a beautiful and exciting person and, indeed, I can fully understand her huge inner pain as well as forgive some of the very, very bad behaviours she had with me because of these issues.

Yet, she's very clever, and she's capable of realizing how much badly she ends up treating people who actually care (cared) about her. The fact that she doesn't try to tackle these issues is something that cannot be forgiven.

[adaw]

i never realized mixing with the dregs is a trade with PDs. they used to hang out at our place and found me to cultural and educated , in the long run they all avoided my company because i am very straight forward and show no tollerance for bad behavior

[Frustratedbloke]

The dregs aspect is fairly straightforward logic. In the end you drive all the good people in your life away and the only ones that will stay are the ones that are as toxic and messed up as you are. Dregs end up together, water finds its own  level, say it however you want to.

I hope one day she will have an epiphany, way too late, she'll look round and think why am I surrounded by this kind of person. Then she'll realise she is one of them.

That's the poetic way of thinking. She might go through life thinking she's won, everything is rosey, her ratchet friends and family are the best people on Earth and we were just losers she was too smart for.

And Franz I am with  you. She knows what she is doing, it's not heat of the moment stuff, it's often carried out over several days and weeks. I told her, she knows she can be a total nightmare, I won't say what I actually said on here, she knows it, yet she keeps doing it. She tried to be friends, even came back and tried again to put me in friendzone, there's no way she deserves my friendship.

I'm not even sure I want to sleep with her anymore, I definitely don't want to be friends.

[Fr4nz]

i never realized mixing with the dregs is a trade with PDs. they used to hang out at our place and found me to cultural and educated , in the long run they all avoided my company because i am very straight forward and show no tollerance for bad behavior

Actually the "mixing with dregs" thing is pretty common; the problem with BPDs is that, even if they are good persons with fantastic qualities, they need so much to "complete" their own selves, and avoid feelings of emptiness/void/abandonment, that they often fall in love with "dregs" to temporarily tackle these feelings.

Needless to say, this is plain dysfunctional, since it's just a behaviour that allows them to avoid facing the real issues in their psyche.

[JerryRG]

All I can say is let them burn!

Let their anger and hatred consume them instead of us who love them, who can love,

Let them destroy themselves,

Let them learn the hard way,

Let them GO!

Let us have the peace we so deserve,

Let us recover our lives and sanity,

Let us help each other stay human,

Let us build each other up out of the madness,

Let us give each other hope,

Let us heal,

Let us learn,

Let us live our lives and grow, move forward,

Shake the dust off our shoes,

Walk away from sick people,

Leave them where we found them... .

Just my two cents for today, by tonight I will probably be crying in despair but there is always hope for us, not them. I always told my ex I am not God, I cannot save you from your pain, you have to do this yourself, I offered her the way out, DBT, Hospitalization, Recovery in AA, NA, Alanon and NOPE, she wants to stay sick, fine I'm not staying sick with you, tired of TOXIC! life is difficult enough without having to raise an adult child.

Hang in there people, there is light at the end of the tunnel

[Frustratedbloke]

Jerry

Sounds like you have been through the ringer, whereas I kept enough emotional detachment this time around not to get too destroyed by her. I'm annoyed, I'm spending too much time thinking about her, but I'm almost on the outside looking in this time. I didn't let it shred my heart.

I put another thread up, just a thought, but you might really like to try it. Hypnosis, it's weird but it works. If nothing else it slows your heart rate, zones your mind out and gets you a bit relaxed. Really try it, it won't fix everything overnight but it will help if you keep doing it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SzOj3jq14d0

And he has another one, detachment from over thinking. Paul McKenna is also very good.

It might sound crazy, but you have a choice to either spend an hour pacing the floor being angry (been there, last time) or lying back, putting some headphones in and trying something different.

In three hours you'll be angry again, it's life, but try it, daily, and you might see a difference.

[Scopikaz]

Yes my exgf has a sister a couple years older than herself. And she also is nuts. Never had stable relationship. Has some sort of personality disorder I think as well.  It's funny my ex has had bad relationship with the sister at times too.  But now it seems she's her most Trusted advisor and she's following in her footsteps.

Oh and her mother was married three times. She's been married a long time now though. 20 years.  But her husband is 20 years younger than her. 

So maybe my ex is also following in her footsteps as well

[JerryRG]

Thanks Frustratedbloke

I will look into that site, do I sound bitter? . I'm healing but... .we have a child together and yes I am grateful to have a son I still have to deal with her on some level, she has abused him in the past and I witnessed it, she was out of his life for 4 months and I had hopes she would give him to me in full custody but last week she wanted him back in her life, GURRRRRRR , things didn't work out for him or I but I don't have the money to get a lawyer yet!

I have to accept life on life's terms but I'm kicking and screaming all the way,

There's a site called Shrink For Men, their favorite quote is ":)on't stick your d*** in crazy!" AND NEVER HAVE CHILDREN WITH THEM, IT'S A GURENTEED LIFE SENTANCE WITH CRAZY!

LOL! Where's the Tylenol? I have a headache!

Lol no it isn't that bad and I try my best to laugh, because going crazy isn't an option, been there done that with her for a long long time.

Thanks guys and keep healing

[Frustratedbloke]

I love Shrink4men I got an email from Dr T last week that put a big smile on my face and made some of this more bearable.

In fact she told me less than most people here would tell me, that she sounded horrible, like a truly nasty piece of work, and I am better off without her.

In fact I went to a shrink because I felt crazy, while we were still in contact. Before the end of one hour he said you have a personality disordered partner and it is up to you what you do, but what would you say to no contact with this woman?

You don't sound bitter, just tired and angry, the hypnosis can help calm you, if only for a while. Do it regularly enough and just like the crazy, it slowly works its way into your life.

[Frustratedbloke]

Scopikaz from what I can see it runs in families, my ex's sister got deliberately pregnant to trap her boyfriend, the classic oopsi. The guy blocked her on everything and kicked her out the house. Honestly, I don't blame him, the girl is clearly, I mean clearly, disordered. She even has crazy eyes... .

My ex was bad at times, but there was humanity there. Her sister? Pure evil, but I think the same as you, she's a toxic influence. I made it clear I didn't like her, I don't think it helped at all but she was the rudest, most selfish little, well, ya know, I have ever encountered. She actually told me she expected me to buy her things because I was dating her sister and got angry when I didn't. Just. Messed. Up.

[once removed]

heads up guys

yes theres some bitterness here. its understandable, and i assure you i went through it myself. this is a great place to vent what i think wed all agree is righteous anger, and some productive ways of processing the bitterness have been mentioned here.

you might want to have a look at our critical review on dr t of shrink4men here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=238014.0

In fact she told me less than most people here would tell me, that she sounded horrible, like a truly nasty piece of work, and I am better off without her.

lets not forget she doesnt know nor has ever met your ex (and neither do we); thats not an especially professional opinion. a balanced, clinical perspective will go a long way toward your detachment, and soothing the bitterness; a bitterness we can all relate to.

[Frustratedbloke]

I guess she isn't as popular round these parts then I have to say she answered a specific question and I did give her a bit of background into the case, she was bang on right and she made me feel better about the course of action I took.

Maybe she was validating me, but she just basically said I was best off out of it.

She might over simplify it, but she's one of the main reasons I really narrowed down what was going on and she was a great help to me. There are shades of grey, but maybe we all need to hear this stuff in black and white before we can really start to dissect it.

Dr T was one of the people that got me thinking it wasn't me that was nuts, so I have a lot of time for the lady!

[once removed]

There are shades of grey, but maybe we all need to hear this stuff in black and white before we can really start to dissect it

i can understand that. i read whatever i could get my hands on and im sure that probably included that site. im glad youre feeling confident about your decision, i know it was not easy to reach or necessarily to stick to. anger is a crucial stage of grief. i had a lot of anger; some of those sites fueled it, and maybe at the time that wasnt the worst thing in the world. the more i learned, the more i began to understand who and what i was angry at; the internet had its own ideas and it was hard to get my head around too.

hows the hypnosis going? is it working well for you?

[Frustratedbloke]

Yeah it helps. It's not the absolute answer, there is no magic pill, but I think it really helps to introduce a bit of tranquillity to your brain, even if it's just for 30 minutes or an hour at a time.

If your whole day is spent turning over horrors and events then it's not good for you. Peace and goodness can be as infectious as toxic crazy, if you let it!