Processing some new info about Mom/Stepdad

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

(Moderators, feel free to move if another board is a better fit)

This might be more of a "processing out loud" post, as I'm not really sure if there's anything "solvable" about it... .

DH recently spent time with someone who had known the kids' mom & stepdad very well. This person "P" confided to DH that they were about to officially notify Mom & Stepdad that P was done having a relationship with them. P, a bit younger, used to idolize M+SD as "the parents P wanted to have". In return, SD especially would tell P that "he knew everything about how P thought" essentially -- total knowing. P really ate it up at the time.

P recently tried setting some limits with Mom -- please don't talk to me about topics X, Y, and Z, and we can still get together. P recently got together with Mom to hang out, and Mom talked nonstop about herself and topics X, Y, and Z.

Anyway, P had an opportunity to spend time with DH. P told DH that they were done with M+SD, and told DH some more reasons why.

Apparently M+SD encouraged some of their married friends to get divorced and marry other people (who they thought would be a better fit?) -- including both P and P's spouse, and someone else very close to me, and another couple (this other couple had encouraged Mom to marry Stepdad quickly).

Also... .according to P, M+SD also think/say that I am "emotionally a child". Oh, they "like me", but "it's no wonder DH married her if she's an emotional child".

OK, so... .

I have learned a lot of tools here that have been helping. Like switching the pronouns. So, if Mom thinks I am an emotional child, then I realize that Mom is emotionally stunted.

I have also learned not to be surprised by Mom/Stepdad's new lows. I.e., the "art show" was followed by Mom "being afraid that DH would abuse the kids" which is followed by this.

I have also learned not to let them rent space in my head for free. I recognize when I am ruminating on their actions because I notice the hypothetical arguments I think about having with them.

I have a mutual acquaintance who knows me and Mom. She commented the other day that she thought I was doing a really, really good job with the kids. I trust her judgment, so I try to remind myself that emotional children wouldn't be doing a good job stepparenting.

So I have some good tools, including tools that I regularly recommend that other members here use! And I'm still bugged by what I found out.

I think there might be a few reasons why I'm bugged.

One is that I am a normal person. Normal people believe what people tell them, and also try to change for the better. If I hear that someone thinks I'm emotionally a child, I think a lot about "What could I be doing better? What am I failing at? How can I improve?" I assume that the assessment is true, because I am normal.

Another is that it is so perverse to recommend divorce just to be with someone else. I don't even know why I'm surprised that M+SD would recommend that, and yet, here I am, surprised that both of them -- who have both been through divorces -- would think it's such small potatoes that all their friends should do what THEY think is better.

I think I'm bothered that the kids are surrounded by such toxic BS, too. I mean, it's not like I didn't know that it was bad, but for a while I really thought things were getting better. I think the kids are getting old enough that they either tune out what M+SD imply about me (SD10 would) or process it but don't confront M+SD on their BS (SD12 would).

I can kind of understand why Mom might feel safe calling me emotionally immature. It takes me out of the picture as "competition" for her Mom Spot if there are no other Adult Moms around.

Like I said, this is a lot of processing of new info. Stuff that shouldn't really surprise me, but kind of does, and I'm kind of in a processing zone right now. It's not eating up my thinking like other things have, but... .IDK, in a way it just makes me sad. I kind of wanted Mom to be getting better?

Thoughts welcome.

[kells76]

(Moderators, feel free to move if another board is a better fit)

This might be more of a "processing out loud" post, as I'm not really sure if there's anything "solvable" about it... .

DH recently spent time with someone who had known the kids' mom & stepdad very well. This person "P" confided to DH that they were about to officially notify Mom & Stepdad that P was done having a relationship with them. P, a bit younger, used to idolize M+SD as "the parents P wanted to have". In return, SD especially would tell P that "he knew everything about how P thought" essentially -- total knowing. P really ate it up at the time.

P recently tried setting some limits with Mom -- please don't talk to me about topics X, Y, and Z, and we can still get together. P recently got together with Mom to hang out, and Mom talked nonstop about herself and topics X, Y, and Z.

Anyway, P had an opportunity to spend time with DH. P told DH that they were done with M+SD, and told DH some more reasons why.

Apparently M+SD encouraged some of their married friends to get divorced and marry other people (who they thought would be a better fit?) -- including both P and P's spouse, and someone else very close to me, and another couple (this other couple had encouraged Mom to marry Stepdad quickly).

Also... .according to P, M+SD also think/say that I am "emotionally a child". Oh, they "like me", but "it's no wonder DH married her if she's an emotional child".

OK, so... .

I have learned a lot of tools here that have been helping. Like switching the pronouns. So, if Mom thinks I am an emotional child, then I realize that Mom is emotionally stunted.

I have also learned not to be surprised by Mom/Stepdad's new lows. I.e., the "art show" was followed by Mom "being afraid that DH would abuse the kids" which is followed by this.

I have also learned not to let them rent space in my head for free. I recognize when I am ruminating on their actions because I notice the hypothetical arguments I think about having with them.

I have a mutual acquaintance who knows me and Mom. She commented the other day that she thought I was doing a really, really good job with the kids. I trust her judgment, so I try to remind myself that emotional children wouldn't be doing a good job stepparenting.

So I have some good tools, including tools that I regularly recommend that other members here use! And I'm still bugged by what I found out.

I think there might be a few reasons why I'm bugged.

One is that I am a normal person. Normal people believe what people tell them, and also try to change for the better. If I hear that someone thinks I'm emotionally a child, I think a lot about "What could I be doing better? What am I failing at? How can I improve?" I assume that the assessment is true, because I am normal.

Another is that it is so perverse to recommend divorce just to be with someone else. I don't even know why I'm surprised that M+SD would recommend that, and yet, here I am, surprised that both of them -- who have both been through divorces -- would think it's such small potatoes that all their friends should do what THEY think is better.

I think I'm bothered that the kids are surrounded by such toxic BS, too. I mean, it's not like I didn't know that it was bad, but for a while I really thought things were getting better. I think the kids are getting old enough that they either tune out what M+SD imply about me (SD10 would) or process it but don't confront M+SD on their BS (SD12 would).

I can kind of understand why Mom might feel safe calling me emotionally immature. It takes me out of the picture as "competition" for her Mom Spot if there are no other Adult Moms around.

Like I said, this is a lot of processing of new info. Stuff that shouldn't really surprise me, but kind of does, and I'm kind of in a processing zone right now. It's not eating up my thinking like other things have, but... .IDK, in a way it just makes me sad. I kind of wanted Mom to be getting better?

Thoughts welcome.

[BeagleGirl]

kells,

This has got to be really rough.  I know that "new information" can take up space in my brain for a few days after I learn it, even when I'm reciting my 2018 mantra - "That's a whole lot of not my problem". 

It sounds like you're doing the right things, but also responding like a "normal" person would.  When someone holds a mirror up to you and you see a giant smudge on your nose, it's more natural to start wiping at your nose than at the mirror.  It takes effort to remember that some mirrors are unreliable. 

I can definitely relate to the frustration over the "injustice" of what Mom/Stepdad are doing.  You would think that anyone who has been through divorce would understand it's not to be taken lightly.  And all of this is probably amplified because of the impact it could have on your step kids.  I can see your care for them in your posts and know you want to protect their world view from being skewed by Mom/Stepdad. 

FWIW, I can't imagine anyone describing you as an emotional child.  Just your presence on these boards speaks to a level of maturity.  Then to hear the way you are utilizing the tools... .not something an emotionally stunted person would be doing.

Thanks for sharing your processing with us.  Is there anything specific you want feedback on?

[kells76]

Thanks for replying, BeagleGirl... .

I think I needed that reassurance and, dare I say, validation 

Knowing I can talk through this stuff here is really helpful. There are some people in town besides our C I've thought about talking with, too -- people in our sub-community who I'd trust with knowing this. But it's tricky both to make the time and then... .IDK, it's hard to know how much to tell people, because all this new stuff about M+SD involves a LOT of people from our little community.

Maybe the other thing feedback-worthy is that this new info kinda pokes at a couple of tender spots on me.

One is that I sometimes experience struggling with having an accurate perception of reality (in terms of "who did something wrong". This usually happens during highly emotional conversations/conflicts -- it gets really hard for me to sort out who is responsible for what, or if I actually did something wrong. I usually just assume I do, because that's easier. So, when I hear, even through the grapevine, "M+SD assert that kells76 is emotionally immature", that's a charged statement, and then my knee-jerk reaction is to assume "it must be kells76's problem".

The other tender spot is that I've recently been struggling a lot with feeling exhausted and depressed, but I'm with it enough to know that I can decide what I want to do about it. I'd been working on why it is that I know a lot of tools, am capable of making some changes in my life, but I don't seem to be doing it or using the tools, and I stay feeling stuck and down. Kinda like I'm taking the easy way out by just feeling bad. Again, hearing this stuff through the grapevine felt like "I don't want them to be right, but I have been feeling like an immature loser lately... ."

There is a little part of me that considers going (figuratively) jiu-jitsu in this: Sure, OK, let's accept the proposal that I am emotionally immature. But the difference between you and I is that I'm going to do something about it!

I don't like being reactive, though. So I need to remember that if I want to keep growing up, it needs to be because that's what I decide to do, not because it'll make irrelevant people think differently about me.

Apparently I still have a lot to process... .

[Nope]

That whole thing, their entire way of existing, sounds completely middle school. Except that they are all presumably adults and the stakes are higher. With divorces and kids and such involved. My advice is just to continue to show the kids stability and how they will be expected to function in society as adults. You know, after middle school is over.

[livednlearned]

I totally understand.

I have a terrible admission of guilt. The first, maybe second summer uBPD SD21 was here, she was doing a puzzle with me at the table, and was showing me videos on her laptop from her Facebook feed. She left the laptop there. Then she left the house. And her mom messaged her with the question, "Is LnL still being a b1tch?"

I wish I could say I didn't read that whole thread.

But I did.

 

And man. Did that put my heart through the grinder.

I can't even put into words how awful it was to read what the two of them wrote. Two BPD women in a FB thread, writing nonstop about me. She also said terrible things about my kid. Who is a sweet, fragile kid, and probably ASD, which her son is, too (diagnosed). Our two boys are actually very similar (except mine is sweet! and very intelligent! just sayin'!)

I could write volumes about that episode.

Altho at the moment, it makes me laugh, some of the things she said about me -- including that I'm immature (you have a missing sister in between a ton of animated Disney princess stickers that they sent to each other nonstop. I mean. Gah.

So I totally understand how you can rationally understand that this other person is projecting like a champion, but still feel like you have to put yourself on trial and figure out what's wrong with you.

Remember that you're dealing with BPD -- not just difficult people, but the most difficult people. (That's from Bill Eddy, and he's compassionate about working with personality disordered people.).

For me, I think the wave of emotion was fueled by sheer anger that I worked so hard on my relationship with her kids. Especially one that she practically broke, who is very likely BPD, and even if she isn't, she is a level of troubled that I consider off the charts. Anger isn't an easy feeling for me, so I suspect I turned it back on myself because the alternative was to blow a gasket on SD21 or on SO, and that can't happen. I am the person in this kooky family who does the emotional heavy lifting and the last person who is going to recognize who I am and what I do is BPD mom.

I also think the work of becoming emotionally mature is a continuum that we can always get better at, and dealing with someone who has BPD can make what is supposed to be a natural arc in life feel like a matter of pathology.

You have a really, really, really hard job that is extra challenging with a big helping of difficult.

And all you get in response is a heckler who didn't even see the show.

[livednlearned]

Also 

One is that I sometimes experience struggling with having an accurate perception of reality (in terms of "who did something wrong". This usually happens during highly emotional conversations/conflicts -- it gets really hard for me to sort out who is responsible for what, or if I actually did something wrong. I usually just assume I do, because that's easier. So, when I hear, even through the grapevine, "M+SD assert that kells76 is emotionally immature", that's a charged statement, and then my knee-jerk reaction is to assume "it must be kells76's problem".

I think I do this, too.

I work with people who are really definite about things. Whereas I always feel like things are gray, and there is ambiguity, and there are two sides to things, and it's not fair to say xyz without knowing the whole story, and on and on. And when there is an argument, that stuff really hits a little kid place in me, because when other people argue, it takes me a beat to figure out how I feel. Other people's feelings always matter more than mine is how I was raised. If my brother was beating me up, I was supposed to think about what I did to make him beat me up and stop doing it.

So maybe the wincing about what BPD mom said is that you can feel your little kid stuff like most people and it's a bit unresolved, and you'll probably get insight in your life until you understand it better, and meanwhile you'll grow like people do, figuring things out and becoming more and more awesome emotionally 

[GaGrl]

I have had to put a great deal of distance between DH's ex and me/my household.

I used to be a sounding board for my step-daughters, but I no longer feel comfortable doing that anymore. Anything that comes across to the Ex as "Gagrl says... .or... .Gagrl
has great advice about... ." just riles the Ex. ( Never mind that I have decades of career counseling and have given both stepdaughter some valuable career assistance).

But the clincher was that, after trying to have a cordial relationship and welcoming her into our home when the daughter/stepdaughter lived with us, she insulted me/my house and home, etc. in front of me by speaking in Thai to our daughter and assuming she would get away with her BS. What chutzpah! Of course, D was honest later about what was said, and Ex has never been in my house again.

I really have little patience with it, but I don't share underage children... .just the grandchildren.

[kells76]

Gagrl, thanks for continuing to remind me that saying No is an option as a stepparent... .You'll be proud to know that we had an "opportunity" to help Mom & Stepdad set up for an event SD12 was doing... .Nope, I didn't do it! Just went to the event, didn't talk to M/SD, cheered for SD12, hugged the kids, went home. So nice 

[Notwendy]

I can relate to seeing an e mail where I was discussed by dysfunctional people. My BPD mother has painted me black to her family members but I was not aware of the extent of it. Apparently I contacted one of them and it got passed to someone else and evidently someone pressed “reply all” and their discussion got to me in my mailbox.

At first I thought they were discussing my BPD mother and after reading through it I realized they were discussing “me” or rather her projections on me as they don’t know the real me. They mostly know what she has told them about me.

I also was hurt to see people talking about me like that. I think that’s a normal reaction. But I also realized it was their fiction version- as told by my mother. I then wrote something short but neutral back- not sure what but it wasn’t reactive. Hit reply all so they know I saw it. It’s been a while but the one who wrote most of it still doesn’t talk to me.

It can shake us up but thank goodness we have support people to reassure us it isn’t true.