Did your BPD flirt with members of the opposite sex with you right there?

[Beware of Junk Psychology...]

The hardest thing to get my head around was the way my stbxBPDh acted whenever we went out in public.  He would basically act like I wasn't there while he stared, played the 'eye catch game', flirted with and even sometimes followed women - all with me right there. He would always deny it and have "no idea what I was talking about".  Is that possible or just an excuse. (I tend to think excuse).  I had to wonder, if he did it with me there, what was he doing when I wasn't?

Anyone else suffer like I did?   It makes me never want to date again because it really affected my self-esteem.  I am relatively attractive and men look at me, but the wounds he inflicted were deep.  Please tell me this gets better.

[Hyacinth]

The hardest thing to get my head around was the way my stbxBPDh acted whenever we went out in public.  He would basically act like I wasn't there while he stared, played the 'eye catch game', flirted with and even sometimes followed women - all with me right there. He would always deny it and have "no idea what I was talking about".  Is that possible or just an excuse. (I tend to think excuse).  I had to wonder, if he did it with me there, what was he doing when I wasn't?

Anyone else suffer like I did?   It makes me never want to date again because it really affected my self-esteem.  I am relatively attractive and men look at me, but the wounds he inflicted were deep.  Please tell me this gets better.

[BraveTwoZero]

Yes.

My Ex was pretty gorgeous, and she would even get dressed up sexy to go to AA meetings that I attended with her - (sadly she bailed on AA after a few short months and began self-medicating again with booze again... while on her meds.)

When I questioned her on this oddity she turned it around and attacked me for "controlling how she should dress." She thrived on validation no matter where it came from, and whether I was there or not. It was hurtful since I told her how wonderful she looked daily, sometimes even twice daily.

[Worndowndad]

Mine was always looking at the men. I would catch her staring and she would say please give me more credit than that. I ended up knowing her type of guy. At parties she would flirt hard in front of me.

[DrawingBlanks]

Anyone else suffer like I did?

Yes. Mine would play the victim in need of rescue, openly flirt, ogle men, and even asked me what I thought of them/their physical attributes. Left feeling totally invisible and damaged my self-esteem as well.

He would always deny it and have "no idea what I was talking about".  Is that possible or just an excuse. (I tend to think excuse).

Could be either. He could have been somewhat aware and in denial or thought it shouldn't be a problem. Or completely oblivious.

What was his reaction or what would it have been if you were doing the same?

the wounds he inflicted were deep.

They can heal. 

Please tell me this gets better.

It does get better. It can take time, but it does. 

[Hyacinth]

Oh, he was always projecting - making me the bad guy (girl).  He would accuse me of the very thing I confronted him about.  I am the most faithful, loyal person and would never do anything like he did to me.  Once, at an out of state wedding, he ignored me for 5 hours while he checked out a blond.  He didn't even know I was there!  I had to introduce myself to his family and sit alone and watch him watch her.  It took a long time to see the pattern, but that time was the worst!

[Why Why Why]

My ex flirted all the time with other while I was there.  It makes you feel incredibly invisible.  Not sure if it was a concious action, but it happened a lot and when I would voice my displeasure she would only twist it around.

I believe there's definitely, at the very least, a subconcious motive on their end, which I'd venture to say is to make you jealous so that you'd cling/throw yourself at them more.  Over time, it breaks down your self-esteem because you're afraid if you aren't good enough you'll lose them, so it makes you work that much harder.

I suffered like you, but it does get better.  Believe me, it does.  You are worth more than this guy made you feel, in fact, your ex knows your value is priceless hence why he had to try and break you down due to his insecurities.

[Worndowndad]

I believe there's definitely, at the very least, a subconcious motive on their end, which I'd venture to say is to make you jealous so that you'd cling/throw yourself at them more.  Over time, it breaks down your self-esteem because you're afraid if you aren't good enough you'll lose them, so it makes you work that much harder.

Exactly, its all about control. Whats the ultimate control and sure fire way you not abandon them?  By destroying your self esteem it keeps you needing them that much more. My exBPD used to tell me when she got hit on. She would say "a surgeon at work was flirting with me. I had to tell him i was married.". Why say that?  I have had woman flirt with me, but certainly wouldnt cause pain to my ex by telling her.

[AlexDP]

Oddly enough no... she didn't. But she did always accuse me of flirting. I did not by the way. I just casually spoke to other people we hung out with.

[EmmyLou]

Yes.  My BPD although when we went out he flaunted me, would still flirt with others.  One time he took me to a Halloween party and didn't tell me it was gay or that clothes were optional.  I was the only "real" woman there besides a stripper and my BPD vanished during her strip for about an hour.  Another time he took me to a golf event and didn't tell me it was the strippers event.  None of the ladies had tops on, there was no food and only booze. He tried to get me involved in a threesome and when I refused he went into a rage.

I'm usually one of the most attractive women at our events and he knows it but it hurts me that he has this problem.

[iceman10]

Yes many times. My exBPD fiancée seemed to forget me at parties. She danced with a lot of men and even went outside to "talk to a man". I think dancing with other men is Ok at a private party but going outside in private with a stranger to me is not. When confronting her after we came home she only said "Oh an old friend - he meant nothing". After confronting her again my exBPD fiancée didn't apologize but only said OK. Actually this was one of the few red flags   I recognized. I missed so many.

[htl67]

while he stared, played the 'eye catch game', flirted with and even sometimes followed women - all with me right there.

Ooohhh  - the eye contact game. I almost forgot about that. Oh how I hated watching him do that. And it would always go on for so long that I always wondered what the hell was going on in the women's minds too. I mean, when I'm out and I notice a guy staring at me, if he's with someone or maybe even not, I just ignore it.  I got to the point where I could spot the woman in the room that he would be drawn to, and then he would begin this ridiculous game with her. Usually it never even led to them speaking but obviously he got something out of this behavior. And yup - one time at the airport I sat and watched him stare at some blond while we waited for what seemed like an eternity for our bags. Me, invisible. Him, making a total ass out of himself because he was so obvious that I saw other people looking and then looking at me. I felt pathetic.

[Hyacinth]

WOW, htl - I actually had to look at who wrote your post because I thought I did it and forgot! I, too got to the point where I knew who it would be and I was almost always right - usually a blond.

And I agree, if a guy is with a girl and checking me out, I just ignore it because I know how she feels and would never hurt another girl.  It certainly didn't make me feel attractive, only pissed off!

Ane the airport - what a hot bed of activity for a BPD.  Mine stared at a girl so long that she just glared at him and was mad, but he continued to do it.  He even did it on our honeymoon, positioned himself at the luggage carosel so he could stare at her.  When I asked why he moved away from where the luggage came out, he made some excuse, but I knew.  As we were walking away, he stopped and turned around for one last look.  We had been married all of 8 days.

If I really thought back, I could name hundreds of times he did it.  Why did I stay?  I really don't know because this was the thing that bothered me the most - until the abuse started.

Did he make you feel like you were his "mother" and he hadn't yet found his perfect sex partner? 

[htl67]

No, he made me feel like I was his perfect sex partner cuz he told me so - . These eye contact episodes could occur right after a fabulous romp or before - no rhyme or reason. In private, there were times when he made me feel like I was the hottest thing out there, and sex was so awesome that I knew he was attracted to me. After I wrote the previous post, I was thinking about how although it bothered me greatly, I never actually called him out on it, and it was mostly because we already had so many other issues with other women and him maintaining that I was just insecure, that I didn't even want to go there about this. But I remember walking into somewhere... .restaurant, airplane, whatever... .and if I saw a woman I knew he would like, my heart would just sink... .like oh sht, here we go... .

How did he make you feel like his mother?

[Hyacinth]

I have to agree with you about the sex - it was terrific and, according to him, I was the reason - no one was as wonderful, sexy, blah blah blah as me.  However, if they really love us like we do them, then there is no reason to check out every piece of a... .everytime we are out.  I really started to call him on it everytime and realized I was distancing myself as a result.  DO THEY NOT realize how their behavior does the very thing they don't want - push us away.  I was realy good to him and took care of him in a way, I now realize, was what he always wanted from his own mother, but she wasn't able to provide because she was busy keeping the abusive, alcoholic father away from he and his siblings.  I am a very nuturing person, just want he was looking for.  He gave back at the beginning of the relationship, but once we were married, totally changed and it was awful. 

[once removed]

hyacinth,

no, not really. i wouldn't have tolerated it anyway. i DO now suspect that she was probably doing it behind my back, but not at all like you describe. the other borderlines i dated probably did more of this and i'd have put up with more of it back then.

i can definitely and obviously see where and why this would effect your self esteem and confidence. don't get me wrong, mine are shot too, regardless of that not happening. yes they will come back. yes it does get better. 1000 fold, seriously. you'll be the most confident person you've ever seen, IF you do the healing. i tend to think anything you can do to work on or improve self esteem and/or self confidence in the aftermath of these relationships is pretty much the number one thing to do. it has been suggested to me that working on new skills, even old skills, can be helpful in this area, among other things. find yourself again, and love yourself. no more need to compare yourself or have yourself compared, or feel like you're in a competition you didn't sign up for. i don't know if the behavior was on purpose or conscious or not. it may not have been at all. remember, for borderlines its learned behavior. making you the slightest bit insecure was a must for him and if he had any INTENTION, that was probably the extent of it. try to remember it wasn't just callous, cold treatment. he had a reason for doing it, even if that reason was stupid. it's about the disorder.

[jalk]

Yupper. And I was also projected upon. When I would ask a store clerk for help and talk with the clerk about an item, my exBPDer would get really mad and say that I was flirting. She then told me how she was going to leave the store and go sit in the car.  Unreal! She would flirt whether I was there or not.

[Inspirationneeded]

Yep she sure did, until I stopped giving her a reaction from it.  When I stopped caring she gave more effort to keep my attention.  However, she has managed to find one guy (that I despise anyway even if she wasn't flirting with him) that gets a rise out of me.  Coincidence that his name always comes up when we are having arguments?  Probably not.

[ve01603]

The hardest thing to get my head around was the way my stbxBPDh acted whenever we went out in public.  He would basically act like I wasn't there while he stared, played the 'eye catch game', flirted with and even sometimes followed women - all with me right there. He would always deny it and have "no idea what I was talking about".  Is that possible or just an excuse. (I tend to think excuse).  I had to wonder, if he did it with me there, what was he doing when I wasn't?

Anyone else suffer like I did?   It makes me never want to date again because it really affected my self-esteem.  I am relatively attractive and men look at me, but the wounds he inflicted were deep.  Please tell me this gets better.

Exactly the same thing.  I could have written this myself.  I am an attractive woman and he purposely did a number on my head.  I am very apprehensive about getting back out there.  He tried to make me jealous all the time, and then at the end told me that I am jealous of all other women.  I said yes I am and you did everything you could to make me that way.  And there was no intimacy between us at all because he was a Narcissist. 

[ve01603]

WOW, htl - I actually had to look at who wrote your post because I thought I did it and forgot! I, too got to the point where I knew who it would be and I was almost always right - usually a blond.

And I agree, if a guy is with a girl and checking me out, I just ignore it because I know how she feels and would never hurt another girl.  It certainly didn't make me feel attractive, only pissed off!

Ane the airport - what a hot bed of activity for a BPD.  Mine stared at a girl so long that she just glared at him and was mad, but he continued to do it.  He even did it on our honeymoon, positioned himself at the luggage carosel so he could stare at her.  When I asked why he moved away from where the luggage came out, he made some excuse, but I knew.  As we were walking away, he stopped and turned around for one last look.  We had been married all of 8 days.

If I really thought back, I could name hundreds of times he did it.  Why did I stay?  I really don't know because this was the thing that bothered me the most - until the abuse started.

Did he make you feel like you were his "mother" and he hadn't yet found his perfect sex partner? 

Same stuff.

[ve01603]

I have to agree with you about the sex - it was terrific and, according to him, I was the reason - no one was as wonderful, sexy, blah blah blah as me.  However, if they really love us like we do them, then there is no reason to check out every piece of a... .everytime we are out.  I really started to call him on it everytime and realized I was distancing myself as a result.  DO THEY NOT realize how their behavior does the very thing they don't want - push us away.  I was realy good to him and took care of him in a way, I now realize, was what he always wanted from his own mother, but she wasn't able to provide because she was busy keeping the abusive, alcoholic father away from he and his siblings.  I am a very nuturing person, just want he was looking for.  He gave back at the beginning of the relationship, but once we were married, totally changed and it was awful. 

You know, that makes things clearer.  Everyone, his mother, my ex-husband all told me that I was a mother to him and that he was looking for a mother.  His parents had moved out of state and his dad was also and alcoholic and he hated his father.

[ve01603]

I am blonde and he would always want me to dress sexy if he was going around friends that he knew a long time ago.  That is because there was a rumor going around that he was gay and I think that he used it to try to dispell that rumor. 

That's O.K.  On many occasions when I was out with him, I had guys give me their card and ask me to call when they saw that he was falling down drunk and ignoring me.  And of course, I was always loyal and never called any of them.

[Undertowed]

You know, that makes things clearer.  Everyone, his mother, my ex-husband all told me that I was a mother to him and that he was looking for a mother.  His parents had moved out of state and his dad was also and alcoholic and he hated his father.

I am blonde and he would always want me to dress sexy if he was going around friends that he knew a long time ago.  That is because there was a rumor going around that he was gay and I think that he used it to try to dispell that rumor.  

My BPDexbf acted similarly.  He seemed to want me to get pregnant as if it would force out my maternal instinct.  I made the mistake of curling up with him and having a pep talk about him finding his passion in life and changing jobs and how his late father wouldn't want him to end up in a van down by the river.  I think he liked that supportive attention so much he went a little nuts with it and wanted to keep me around permanently as a mom.    Of course I don't really want a 40-something grown ass man to be my "child"!  

I also suspected that he felt guilty that he wanted gay male attention, not necessarily because he was gay but because he wanted some male as well as female nurturing.  Interesting stuff.

[ve01603]

You know, that makes things clearer.  Everyone, his mother, my ex-husband all told me that I was a mother to him and that he was looking for a mother.  His parents had moved out of state and his dad was also and alcoholic and he hated his father.

I am blonde and he would always want me to dress sexy if he was going around friends that he knew a long time ago.  That is because there was a rumor going around that he was gay and I think that he used it to try to dispell that rumor.  

My BPDexbf acted similarly.  He seemed to want me to get pregnant as if it would force out my maternal instinct.  I made the mistake of curling up with him and having a pep talk about him finding his passion in life and changing jobs and how his late father wouldn't want him to end up in a van down by the river.  I think he liked that supportive attention so much he went a little nuts with it and wanted to keep me around permanently as a mom.    Of course I don't really want a 40-something grown ass man to be my "child"!  

I also suspected that he felt guilty that he wanted gay male attention, not necessarily because he was gay but because he wanted some male as well as female nurturing.  Interesting stuff.

Interesting point.  Mine also wanted male attention and I thought that he was either gay or a Narcissist, but it might just be because he claims he got none from his dad growing up.

[nonbpdnyc]

Hyacinth, she did it at least three times.

The first time she turned around and gaslighted me to the point I ended apologizing! Ha!

Then it got more obvious. To the point that the third time I actually said to the guy, "Really dude? you're following up when you see a ring and the husband right there? Really?". He apologized. Alas, she, never!

It's one of the very few things I don't like about NYC. I've seen both men and women behave in such shtty ways.

I'm an attractive Latino. All the time there will be some woman on a date eyeing me when the guy is distracted. I consider that a pretty obvious sign of how loyal or ethical that person is.

[Lostwithbpdwife]

Yupper. And I was also projected upon. When I would ask a store clerk for help and talk with the clerk about an item, my exBPDer would get really mad and say that I was flirting. She then told me how she was going to leave the store and go sit in the car.  Unreal! She would flirt whether I was there or not.

This was my experience too.  Not always but often enough she flirts with guys in front of me, not overly flirtatious, subtle, but noticeable enough to me and the other guy to make it unconformtable (for me at least).  Then she has the nerve to tell me I'm overly flirtatious with women.  When I ask her for examples, she talks about my interactions with hostesses and waitresses!  One minute interactions where we exchange niceties and nothing more!

[Worndowndad]

I'm an attractive Latino. All the time there will be some woman on a date eyeing me when the guy is distracted. I consider that a pretty obvious sign of how loyal or ethical that person is.

Probably just identified a borderline.

[Sir5r]

How is this.  When I used to walk around campus with my GF (now wife) she had lots of male friends, so she would talk to them a lot.  Well, out at the bars and in the college pub she would french kiss some of them right in front of me.  Oddly it was never with guys I knew well or knew she had dated.  She said one of then used to come in the yearbook darkroom at night (completely dark in there)  and "maul her.". I could never get her to define "mauling" at the time and never since but now that I know she is a BPD I can only imagine.

I really would like to know what the hell I was thinking back then.

Red flags much?

[Hyacinth]

We get such mixed signals, don't we?  The loving, sweet, totally-entralled man one minute, then like a dog in heat (sorry guys) the next.  I think that is what made it so hard - that he could act like he loved me so much (and told me constantly), then act like I wasn't there to check out every girl with miles.  I don't remember him looking for male attention, but I can see why someone from a dysfunctional family with an abusive father, might look for the father figure.  Lord knows he found his mother in me!  

Thanks to all of you who have responded - you have helped me understand that it can be part of BPD - I really didn't know that before.  That helps the healing process.

[ve01603]

We get such mixed signals, don't we?  The loving, sweet, totally-entralled man one minute, then like a dog in heat (sorry guys) the next.  I think that is what made it so hard - that he could act like he loved me so much (and told me constantly), then act like I wasn't there to check out every girl with miles.  I don't remember him looking for male attention, but I can see why someone from a dysfunctional family with an abusive father, might look for the father figure.  Lord knows he found his mother in me!  

Thanks to all of you who have responded - you have helped me understand that it can be part of BPD - I really didn't know that before.  That helps the healing process.

Someone that knows more about this than me is welcome to comment, but actually, it seems to be more NPD I think.  They have to have the Narcissistic Supply sometimes from both sexes.

[ve01603]

I love to go out and do things and I am usually the one that is getting compliments on my clothes and looks, etc. 

However, during all of this, I actually got to where I avoided social situations because I didn't want him flirting and devaluing me.

[Im done]

In answer to the original question - yes, he did.  And I was right there.

Of course, his explanation was that it wasn't flirting.  He was wearing his wedding ring so the women he was talking with were aware that he was married and therefore he was just "talking" to them.  (Yeah, like married men don't flirt and have affairs... .)

[C12P21]

The hardest thing to get my head around was the way my stbxBPDh acted whenever we went out in public.  He would basically act like I wasn't there while he stared, played the 'eye catch game', flirted with and even sometimes followed women - all with me right there. He would always deny it and have "no idea what I was talking about".  Is that possible or just an excuse. (I tend to think excuse).  I had to wonder, if he did it with me there, what was he doing when I wasn't?

All the time, never stopped.

I found out later he had numerous porn and single sights he belonged too.

C

[Hyacinth]

I know what you mean, VE - I always said if we never had to leave the house, things would have been great.  But who can live in a bubble?  I traveled this weekend to a graduation and was at the airport.  It was so nice to just be me alone and not have to constantly watch him watch for someone to stare at and flirt with.  Before, I just read a good book, while his head bounced around like a bobble head!   It isn't so bad being alone... .

[C12P21]

My ex flirted all the time with other while I was there.  It makes you feel incredibly invisible.  Not sure if it was a concious action, but it happened a lot and when I would voice my displeasure she would only twist it around.

I believe there's definitely, at the very least, a subconcious motive on their end, which I'd venture to say is to make you jealous so that you'd cling/throw yourself at them more.  Over time, it breaks down your self-esteem because you're afraid if you aren't good enough you'll lose them, so it makes you work that much harder.

I suffered like you, but it does get better.  Believe me, it does.  You are worth more than this guy made you feel, in fact, your ex knows your value is priceless hence why he had to try and break you down due to his insecurities

Thanks for posting this-it helps me to put it in perspective.

[MindfulJavaJoe]

Yes, she didn't do normal conversation with strangers.

All she could do was flirt.

[ve01603]

I know what you mean, VE - I always said if we never had to leave the house, things would have been great.  But who can live in a bubble?  I traveled this weekend to a graduation and was at the airport.  It was so nice to just be me alone and not have to constantly watch him watch for someone to stare at and flirt with.  Before, I just read a good book, while his head bounced around like a bobble head!   It isn't so bad being alone... .

I hate being alone but it is better than being like we were.  I was watching mine do the same thing.  Then they try to make you think that you are jealous and imagining it.

[BoreasXIV]

Thank you guys all for sharing. I thought it was just me, but now I see it's not. I completely relate to the feeling.

I don't understand how they can't see how invisible and cheap we feel when they do that to us. Then when we approached them about how it makes us feel, that it hurts us, they get defensive and act like they are the victim of our abuse.

[lifeafter18years]

Yes he was so blunt in staring women up and down that I told him not to walk with me because I was so ashamed of him looking like a pervert.  He would not get it and say I was being ridiculous and that ALL men stare.  I told him he was just not staring, but undressing them and looked like he was imagining them with him... . Thanks to his porn addicition.  BUT NOO, I was the PRUDE that changed over time and would not go with ideas.  I told him I RESPECTED myself even if he did not after so many years and I was not going to let HIM much less anyone else tell me what I SHOULD be doing to not be a PRUDE.  After was has transpired with him, I am glad I never put myself down to please him.  I have that atleast to take with me after these 18 years.  He would have my special needs daughter in shopping cart and be doing this or flirting in front of me saying he was just being friendly.  Imagine what he did behind me back, well he cheated and has her now.  So I will never ignore my feelings... . they were true.

[corraline]

My ex flirted with women in front of me.  He even flirted with my son's teacher at a parent teacher interview.  He  flirted with his good buddies new partner went we went out for the first time as couples. He humiliated me in front of them saying i was involved in a cult because i put my children through an alternate private school . I wanted to get up and leave. I was so hurt.  He loved attention regardless.  He usually had to be the smart guy , the funny guy, the guru guy.  It could be embarrassing at times.  Other times he seemed to be his peaceful self.  It was strange.  All the while giving me the impression that he was working on that... . trying to be an ordinary guy he said... . he claims that was hard for him.

[blissful_camper]

No, but he did behind my back, and eagerly let me know that other women wanted him. 

Blissful "healthy people don't play those games" Camper

[froggy]

mine did it from the beginning and it only got worse after we were married.

He would come home when we first got married and would tell me all about the sripper he saw after work and then let me know what he liked better on her than me.

He knew I had self esteem issues and played on them. I wasn't a jealous person when we met but he sure made me one for awhile.

ive had him practically trip over me to go talk to ex girlfriends or other women... . had him stand in front of me to speak to the redhead who got away ... it was bad enough foe his brother who was with us turned to me and said WOW... thats not rude at all! (34 years  later he still talks about her) and I'm sure he would still do it if he were to run into her again.

After awhile I just hoped he would run off

one thing different. .he has never been jealous. ... pretty sure its because he doesn't think that any one else would want me.

[bewildered2]

yes, happened to me too. many times. why did i put up with it?

they do it to hurt you (nice) and to boost their own low self esteem.

classic borderline behaviour.

b2

[whirlpoollife]

Always, even when we were first married. Then , also with me by his side, he would boast to any man near , about the hot babe he just saw.

[pari]

Yes, always!

He would want me to dress up for a party and then forget that I was there. While we were dating, he wanted to go on date with other girls (and I allowed that, love is blind ). I would also mention that he wanted me to flirt with other men in parties. It was a turn on for him.

I later realized it was a game for him, to make me jealous and to get jealous. He wanted that extra third factor to spice up the life. We had a very passionate r/s and we both were so into each other during the r/s but I never understood the reason for 'flirting with other girls in party'. Much later, I realized it's all for attention. He loved being center of 'Attention'. During most of day, he was center of my attention but in parties, he would need that extra punch from others.

[Ihope2]

No, I can't say that he did this with me present. But then again, we hardly socialised or went out together.  And when we did go out it was mainly to the movies or to do shopping. We hardly lingered around over dinner at restaurants, etc, as he had social phobia and anxiety, panic and hypervigilance and supposedly hated being amongst lots of other people.

However... . over weekends, when I was at home and not working, he would take my car and disappear off to the shopping mall for hours at a time.  Without me.

[LoveLove]

Interesting posts to this question.

With mine, he was very friendly with everyone. And I just viewed it as him being social. Yet, one day he asked: "what if an attractive person comes and talks/flirts with me?"

I replied by telling him that I can't control what others (women) do. But because I trust him and I know he has respect for me, then I don't have to worry that he'll act upon the woman flirting with him.

I'm not sure what he was thinking (I had no idea that he could have BPD at that time). But it does seem like it's a way to control. They want us to hold on to them in any manner... . yet, I've said this in other posts - it's interesting because it is THEY who abandon us first out of their fear of being abandoned. Yet, because I don't feel insecure, it wouldn't bother me... . and I'm not sure he liked my reply.

But if he cheated... . different story.

[LoveLove]

And I have to add - my bf even told me that he needed the extra attention from whomever. I asked why my attention wasn't enough... . but he couldn't reply to that. He talked to everyone, would talk loud, anything to get attention. Very odd - but I didn't think too much of it because I just found it to be a part of his social personality... . when in fact there was something deeper ... . anyone else experience this with their SO?

[Sgt Biggs]

My ex did this, one of my first big red flags about a 6 weeks into the 3 month rs.

It was the first time we went out with a group of my friends to a concert.

Initially she was dancing with my friends no big deal but she was laying her hands on them which I was uncomfortable with.

Then I witnessed the most lustful exchange I think I've ever seen between her and a guy at the bar, right beside me, I couldn't believe what I had just saw and walked off. About 10 mins later some other dude comes up and asks me if she was with me... . um yes. I've never had that happen before, I guess he must have got some signal of availability.

Anyway, a few days later we're talking about the future etc. and I mentioned that I had concerns about trusting her because of what I'd seen that night. She runs off and locks herself in the bathroom crying, naturally I follow and urge he to come out, feeling like an ass for upsetting her and wondering if I was in fact being over jealous. She appears a few minutes later totally composed, no sign whatsoever that she had actually been crying, I'm thinking, wow, was that all an act?

Minutes later she's gazing lovingly into my eyes telling that she doesn't know what I thought I saw but that she was so proud to be by my side that night. Of course she would never cheat, never has, she loves me soo much and could see us growing old together blah blah blah... .

So very confusing, she never had me totally convinced it was all in my my mind but I sure did doubt myself and my own intuition. She was an absolute master at creating these doubts and spinning it around.   

[chai8]

It is so eye-opening reading everyone's comments. I didn't realize how common some of these experiences were.
In my case we had amazing passion and love together.
However from the first week I noticed this seeking to make eye-contact w other women in public. It was never looking them up and down, not ever. Just eye contact as though to say "do you see me, do you like me, am I worth looking at?" i.e. for validation. And smiling and nodding at them. Not to children, men, or seniors, just to young women, usually pretty women, usually blonde but not always..always younger than me.
He also had adhd so i thought it was coupled with distraction--like when someone doesn't know they are looking at their phone reflexively. If we were at a restaurant he would sometimes look over at another women 10 or 20 times..it was almost like a tick. I tried to draw his attention to this by saying "do you know her?".but he wouldn't get it. If I did this to him (twice I was distracted by something) he got so offended and felt rejected..yet he did it far worse.
If other pretty girls were at a table nearby he would become very animated making jokes and gestures like a young child looking for attention in class...not really any longer in the conversation with me..seeking attention from them.
With waitresses he went hard, getting their names, learning all about them, being playful, caring, seeking care with woe is me stories, basically seeking empathy and validation, hugs, high fives, special treatment.
I would come to the restaurant and the girls would act like I was invisible, they were gushing over him and all the attention he was giving him--they wrote him cards etc. He would not take my calls if in their presence..it got pretty out of control.
Same thing with a female co-worker when he was out of town--nothing sexual but really focused on impressing her, accepting rides from her, drinks from her, confiding in her, telling me how great she was..yikes!
He would even do the eye contact thing with women who were with men--it was so awkward I worried sometimes the other men would get angry. It was literally like a tick--like he totally was not aware of it..
One time traveling he was a bit drunk and completely turned his chair away from me, to face the table of girls trying to impress them with jokes. Like a young child being carried away in the moment of excitement and buzz.
another time we were tossing a football between each other. There was a young flirty blonde near by, and as though getting bored from football, he dropped the ball and went to stand near her to chat. Like completely unaware--I just stood there. Like a puppy dog following a treat.
I always felt it was very much an adhd trait mixed with validation seeking--when out of their presence they didn't seem to be on his mind, it was an in the moment thing.
Places that were boring like airport line ups or buses were very bad. Sometimes I felt the girl was also so rude to do that in front of me.
ONe time at my family event doing this with a girl who was sort of bad news flirty into him--it was embarassing for me. He hugged her in front of all my family at the end of the night--I barely know her I have never hugged her, my family was like what? he got mentionistis later "she seems really nice blah blah"..oh yeah he would get mention itis about these other girls in general. ouch
And not correcting girls who would think I was his friend--just generally trying hard to impress girls and be liked, not for sex, but like a child needing attention from a parent.
I was on crutches once and he was helping me and some young girls said "oh so nice you are helping your friend" that kind of thing--just soaking it up rather than saying "that's my partner"
And like some others, yes too, seemed to not mind gay attention in the same way--not sexual but wanted the attention anyway...accepting closeness with gay men in situations that other straight men probably would not.
I did feel so invisible. It was so humiliating. I am quite an attractive beautiful woman. I perceive he has no idea that he is doing this, that it is hurtful, that he has value and that other people start crushing on him, and that it is so evident.
He would rage at me in paranoid jealousy for things that did not occur on my end--I was beyond loyal and devoted with my energy--but he was actually the one spreading his care and emotional attention, looking for a buzz of excitement and validation in others.
It just hurt so much when these waitresses would come up (or random girls from town ) all lovey like they were best friends and knew everything about each other. They acted like I was wallpaper or his aunt or something.
These girls really felt special to him I suspect. ouch
It was a serious pattern. Seeking care from women, even crying over exagerrated woes, just desperate for female care..almost like a teen in highschool...wanting to be popular and liked.
I am grateful that I have dated men who were not like this at all...so that is what I need to remember. My ex had good boundaries around sex---but there were times that I felt like I was there just for sex and he was having an emotional relx with someone else, cuz I was feeling neglected, while the other girl was getting his time and attention, bonding w him...like girlfriend behaviour minus sex. Just terrible boundaries around intimate conversations and attention giving and receiving. It stems from low self esteem. And no, telling someone you have a girlfriend does not make it ok. Talking about personal things, and following up, and seeking excitement and intimacy and care is emotional relx.
i was sort of like that when I was young cuz i didn't know my worth, I didn't realize people craved attention and that they would fall for me, and thinking was fabulous didn't help them any. I stopped trying to make people think i was fabulous and stopped trying to be cool. A prior bf actually called me out on it..and I immediately stopped and focused on him. I was totally unaware; now I am way more guarded w my energy--I pour the affection and attention into my mate but am more sort of professional with others, less "too friendly". It was low self-esteem. With bpd I think it runs deeper plus there is the impulsivity piece, and some object constancy issues, like forgetting everyone else in the moment..in his case it could have been ADHD too.
Like others said, it did suck feeling you had to scan the environment for these kinds of threats--like I disliked going to some events, and did notice I was way happier with him at home, then out in public. At home it was a joy..in public it hurt. It hurt knowing that if he was looking away I knew it was never going to be a dog or a child or a pretty flower or a senior or a piece of art or a man, it was only ever going to be a young girl. I hated turning to see what he was looking at but it was always that.
And yes, as an attractive women I have noticed there are men who will look at me when they are with their mate, and men who don't. When near couples I always make eye contact with the woman only and smile at her, and any men looking at me I look away or get away somehow and feel badly for her. I never entertain it. I never ever make eye contact with other men who are with women.
yikes really hurts. makes us feel unattractive when that is so far from the truth. not nice.

[OKrunch]

Last summer, at MY friends camp weekend, she couldn't stay away from my best friend. Just kept finding reasons to stand near him, touch his arm, etc. She brough him coffee's the first week she kicked me out (i was staying at his place)
he even commented on it recently saying how it changed his advice from "How can I help my friend fix his relationship" to "My friend needs to GTFO away from this woman"

Triangulation is a thing, and they seem to get desperate for the attention it provides.
I also believe this was part of what helped build her narrative to breakup.
"you dont trust me" etc.
They fabricate drama, to then gaslight said drama, all in support of the relationship nuke only they know is already careening towards the ground with explosive intent.

[tina7868]

Thank you for opening up and sharing your experience, chai8. There are many relatable aspects in what you wrote.

And yes, as an attractive women I have noticed there are men who will look at me when they are with their mate, and men who don't. When near couples I always make eye contact with the woman only and smile at her, and any men looking at me I look away or get away somehow and feel badly for her. I never entertain it. I never ever make eye contact with other men who are with women.

This is so very thoughtful and considerate of you, to put yourself in someone else's place like that.

yikes really hurts. makes us feel unattractive when that is so far from the truth. not nice.

My heart goes out to you. Here to remind you that you are beautiful inside and out, and someone else's behaviour is no indication of your own value and worth. Keep your head high.

[brighter future]

During the course of our nearly two year relationship, my ex BPD g/f would tell me about guys flirting with her out in public or at work. When she would tell me these things, I got the sense that she enjoyed it. There are two instances that stand out most in my mind. The first one was the time that she took her grandmother out for lunch. She said, "The waiter was flirting with me pretty hard while grandma and I were eating. I halfway expected him to slip me his number." The second occasion happened after she and I walked out of a restaurant. She stated, "I don't know what it is these days, but I'm getting a lot of attention lately from men. A lot of guys seem to be checking me out." These comments were hurtful to me, and I don't recall ever really acknowledging what she told me.

She talked about old boyfriends and flings on and off while we were together, which made me feel uncomfortable.  I assume that this was also a problem in her marriage because she told me that her ex-husband got very angry and prohibited her from talking about old boyfriends with him.

From time to time, she would flirt openly on social media with the guy that she replaced me with. Looking back, I wish I would have stood up and said something about this, as it was something that always bothered me. She had started a relationship with this man immediately after leaving her ex-husband, then stopped seeing him to start dating me (apparently I was the better option at that moment in time). I didn't find out about him until after we'd been seeing each other for about 2 months. At that time, she also told me about the 3 other men that she was talking to at that time. She admitted to sleeping with my replacement after she left her ex-husband, sexting with one other former classmate, and "just talking" to the other two guys. Looking back, I should have run the other way when she told me these things. Major red flags!

She married my replacement late last year. I often wonder what he'd think if he knew how many guys she was involved with when she was involved with him prior to being with me. Maybe she told him the story just like she told to me? If she did, maybe he didn't care, or maybe she didn't tell him at all. She contacted me on and off for about two years after our split either in person, via text message, or through other friends' social media. It didn't stop until a while after I'd starting dating my present day girlfriend. I'm glad the contact has finally stopped, and I'm thankful every day that my relationship with her didn't work out. Now she can be the other guy's problem from now on. I got word from a friend a week or two ago that she quit the full-time management job at the store she works for and traded it for a minimum wage part-time job. Once again, I'm so thankful that it's not me.

[ConflictedWalrus]

My uBPDstbxw used to do this... She's a social butterfly. If we were in any social environment, she would immediately get sucked into conversation with anyone who showed even the slightest interest.

She tends towards talking with younger males (usually in their mid-20s, she's in her mid 30s). I would always get really uncomfortable with this... For years I felt powerless to say anything, and would be "there but not there". Somehow, I just felt like shrinking away and disappearing from the overwhelming awkwardness.

What I didn't think of was her behavior when I wasn't around. In hindsight, I'm sure the version of her when I wasn't around was probably the same but even less inhibited.

Five years ago she had physical affair. As part of reconciliation, she began therapy for Sex and Love Addiction (she wasn't diagnosed being treated for BPD at the time). With that, she did become more conscious of her interactions and things became a lot less flirty. It also helped that concurrent to her therapy we moved and developed "safer" social circles in our new location. The new social circle was largely composed of fellow Christians, which is to say people whose social values make them less prone to flirting or appearances of impropriety.

I think this helped keep her in check. She mirrored them and their values, and they didn't feed her tendencies. I was a LOT more comfortable being present for those interactions.

Unfortunately with this latest cycle of dysregulation she started up an affair again. At one point I thought the affair ended, but it was actually still ongoing. During this time we only went to a couple social occasions together, but I can say she was definitely back into flirting with any younger guys.

It's interesting to look back... When she was in "flirt mode", I'm not sure which was more bothering: The flirting itself, or the way she would stop being the "her" that I was used to (mirroring of me and the values I have) and transition to the "her" that the other person wanted (mirroring the person she was talking to). It's almost like those videos showing an octopus suddenly changing its colors in a new environment.