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VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?" Parental alienation is when a parent allows a child to participate or hear them degrade the other parent. This is not uncommon in divorces and the children often adjust. In severe cases, however, it can be devastating to the child. This video provides a helpful overview.
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Poll
Question: Did your ex cheat on you when you were in the relationship? [pick highest level that applies]
Multiple sexual/emotional affairs, confirmed
One sexual/emotional affair, confirmed
Multiple sexual affairs, confirmed
One sexual affair, confirmed
Multiple emotional affairs, confirmed
One emotional affair, confirmed
I have strong suspicions
No
Don't know
Other (please explain)

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Author Topic: Poll: BPD and cheating without remorse  (Read 50150 times)
HostNoMore
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« on: January 23, 2012, 12:22:18 PM »

Cheating is very common behavior among BPDs which is something I have learned from reading case after case on this board.  Mine openly told me how she overtly cuckolded an exBF and cheated on her exH before and during the marriage. Remorse was no where to be found.  Great aphrodisiac material for me too let me tell you.

I also noted in mine's case that there would be instances where her lack of remorse or empathy for a particular occasion where such emotions are indicated was jaw dropping.  Yet, intellectually she knew and openly admitted that she does bad things and was dark/evil/wicked so she is cognizant.  

You're right BPD is a fascinating disorder to study.

I just cannot take the stress of trying to maintain a relationship with a BPD as they are just too bizarre, impulsive, disloyal, remorseless, and rage prone.  I have recently met someone else who I know is attracted to me with whom I am building rapport.  I also do not have to walk on eggshells.  She and my exBPDgf are incredibly similar in appearance, but this woman is normal.  She had the benefit of having grown up in a stable family, and my exBPDgf did not have that.  

If this new one goes anywhere for me, I'm sure my exBPDgf will try to take credit for it as such are her ways... .As avoidatallcost so eloquently stated "Their brains are disordered."
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yianks69
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« Reply #1 on: January 23, 2012, 03:13:54 PM »

Regardless if they are married or in a long-term r/s they will cheat as they cannot attach (because of the disorder) to the r/s 'object' (husband, boyfriend) but still want to meet their intimacy needs.

If they get caught their ‘actress mode’ kicks in which enables them to find one million excuses and blame anybody else BUT themselves. For example, she will easily find fault on her new lover because he was so effective seducing her!

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antman6
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« Reply #2 on: January 23, 2012, 03:25:50 PM »

I also had experience with the cheating. Mine was more one the narcissistic side so she  "told me without telling me". At work I received a text that she still had feelings for some girl she fooled around with college previously. Those feelings were only sexual so it was OK.  Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)

Told my family about this situation as they rightly told me head for the hills and never look back! This is what I've done and 2 years later it still isn't really easy.
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« Reply #3 on: January 23, 2012, 03:58:09 PM »

Cheating is just part of the disorder, like explained here in some posts. And is there any remorse? NOPE! It's again part of the disorder and don't seem to care, but are we able to cheat... .HELL NO! We can't even look at another girl, even if it's family.  Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)

And although I'm not proud of it, here's a example of how they think about cheating: Before it got really serious between us, we met often and I had sex with her while she was still with her boyfriend. It didn't feel right of course and I said to her: "Why are you doing this, this isn't right. You are still in a relationship. How would you find it if he cheats?". Her response: "I'm able to cheat and he's not allowed to. Only me! But no worries, I will never cheat on you. You are everything I need and I would be stupid to loose you for that.".Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post)
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Lukkien

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« Reply #4 on: January 24, 2012, 08:17:30 AM »

OP, I'm not sure if they don't have any remorse. They tend to justify it to themselves (much like other people do) in a way that makes you go 'what'? I posted it in a different thread, but I'll copypaste it below here with some slight adjustments:

----

I read a lot about BPDers who end up cheating. Funnily enough, me and my ex talked about cheating. She absolutely despised it. But. When she was in a relationship with her first boyfriend, she ended up cheating on him with a friend of mine (Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) ). She made him swear to never tell anyone, but he told me the next day and he texted another friend right after the deed that he slept with her. I was an acquaintance of her at the time, we occasionally talked. To this day, she still doesn't know that I know that she cheated on her first boyfriend. She justified to my friend that her first boyfriend 'pushed her away' and 'was more busy with video games than me'.

I still remember her MSN status that she 'hated men'. As I said, I was an acquaintance at the time, and she struck up a conversation with me. Mind you this is like 4 years ago. She then told me she slept with someone but he had no feelings for her and just went about his way.

She never 'got' to my friend the way she did with other people (including me). He never fell for her tricks, and he warned me on many occasions not to fall for her. I didn't listen. I think because my friend was never caught in her web, she has an unhealthy obsession with him; she still carries a picture of the two of them in a photo booth from 4 years ago in her wallet. They never dated either, just slept together once I believe. And while he is my friend, he isn't good looking at all and he's had a rough life behind him with diseases and frequent hospital visits and everything. I think that's another reason why she liked him as much as she did. She can see how 'broken' he is.

They eventually had a falling out because he said something mean on one of her Facebook statuses where she complained about her ex who didn't know how he felt about her, so she removed him from her Facebook. She apparently still has him on Skype and he occasionally says something mean to her from what he told me, but that's about the extent of their current 'relationship'.

Oh, and from what I gathered from articles and so on, she is a BPD Waif through and through.

I guess what I was trying to say was: They cheat. Even if they say they hate it. I should also say that when she broke up with her ex over Christmas 2010 (before we dated), she slept with another acquaintance of mine when she was back home at her parents. When she moved back to her flat, she found out that her ex, whom SHE dumped, had lunch with one of her girlfriends. She FREAKED out at this. He had lunch with someone vs. her sleeping with someone, only a few days after they had 'broken up'.

Another thing is, when my ex and her ex were trying to reconcile their relationship early 2011, she was seeing someone else at the side too. He treated her like absolute dirt (calling her fat/ugly, urging her to go to the gym), but she kept coming back to him all the while she was trying to reconcile with her ex at the same time. Funny story. I'll leave it up to one of the more informed posters on this board to make sense of that... .
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bpdlover
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« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2012, 08:28:21 AM »

Mine would put a different spin on it every time the topic came up. I know she entertained at least three guys at her house during the early stages of our relationship. There was either an excuse, or she broke up with me, or she told me I broke up with her, or she needed her space or a totally hindsight based gaslight of the whole occurrence. The guy that slept in her bed obviously drove a huge wedge between us and the topic was raised from time to time during break ups. Once, she went quiet and agreed that it was wrong, almost admitting she cheated. Then, she tried to deflect. Other times she would ask why this needed to be brought up as it was in the past. I got no truthful answer but did get an incomplete confession. At the end of the relationship, I had no idea. She broke up and said it was for real over this time. That lasted five weeks and then she was back, this time controlling to the point of telling me what to do. She was very confident and alluring with me also. It was almost as if there was another party because she lost her inhibition. She then turned, became suicidal and melted down. I didn't see her again. Two years later, here I am.
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« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2012, 08:57:30 AM »

Funny thing. My ex would cheat and excuse by saying she thought we had broken up. Seems they use any excuse no matter how weakness, to justify it. Then show no remorse

for doing so. Apparently pwBPD seek closeness without much scrutiny as in who the bed with.funny thing is that her current host, she would day how weird he is and unattractuve, but would always say how he inherited a lot of money.  I find that if a person always says they have lots of moneys, but don't appear to have a pot to piss in, is

Selling around their shortcomings in order to troll and land women until discovered. She is a go

ld digger by nature. Always hinting at paying her bills for her.
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Sir5r
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« Reply #7 on: January 24, 2012, 12:17:29 PM »

So much of these posts sound like my life it's a real eye opener.

I accepted a lot of her behaviors when we met because we were in college and college behaviors (socially and sexually) masked a lot of whet the future had in store for me.

Sir5r
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« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2012, 02:34:39 PM »

Mine would put a different spin on it every time the topic came up. I know she entertained at least three guys at her house during the early stages of our relationship. There was either an excuse, or she broke up with me, or she told me I broke up with her, or she needed her space or a totally hindsight based gaslight of the whole occurrence. The guy that slept in her bed obviously drove a huge wedge between us and the topic was raised from time to time during break ups. Once, she went quiet and agreed that it was wrong, almost admitting she cheated. Then, she tried to deflect. Other times she would ask why this needed to be brought up as it was in the past. I got no truthful answer but did get an incomplete confession. At the end of the relationship, I had no idea. She broke up and said it was for real over this time. That lasted five weeks and then she was back, this time controlling to the point of telling me what to do. She was very confident and alluring with me also. It was almost as if there was another party because she lost her inhibition. She then turned, became suicidal and melted down. I didn't see her again. Two years later, here I am.

----------------------------

I get the same thing. "it's in the past, so why do I need to bring it up?"

The answer is easy.     Because it was never settled.  Ever.

When someone lies to you and you know it there is a compelling force that causes you to need the truth.  Otherwise, your trust in them never returns.

Here I am as well, 25 years into this relationship. She is working to try to get better in therapy but still no sensible explanation from her for her behavior.

So, I have no trust and with no trust there's no real intimacy, therefore she gets what she wants, a distant relationship.

Sir5r
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GonnaMakeIt
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« Reply #9 on: January 25, 2012, 01:42:39 AM »

Wow! I've heard the "it's in the past" line so many times   . It was almost humorous towards the end because everything was literally in the past do it was off limits to talk about. He told me once that he worried about my soul because of the unforgiveness in my heart. It's like you said, the issues were never dealt with so there was no closure and no moving forward without accountability and consequences.

What ended it for me was when I knew he was lying and I couldn't get the truth out if him and he was insanely jealous and paranoid of me cheating. I knew he must have a guilty conscience. But still I couldn't get any proof. So I stayed until one day he went off on me (for the last time). It was traumatizing. I asked myself how it was that he could be so paranoid with zero proof but I was trusting of him with loads of proof of his lies. When I honestly answered that I realized I dont trust him and there is no relationship.

After 14 years of marriage he moved into his own apartment today.
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JonnyJon42
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« Reply #10 on: January 25, 2012, 03:55:51 AM »

Muggzy

Mine was the same way always had way to much make up on a few times she flirted with guys in front of me if i said something was oh i was not flirting and stuff like that when she was. I was the same way i just took it she cheated on me a few times i sure there is more i dont know and she has left me to go jump in with another guy or seek meaningless sex like she is doing right now. The truth is i still take it cause she if tried to talk to me i would hear her out but since she has been ignoring me for the last 2 months i dont think that will happen anytime soon. Ive taken this crap for 7 years mostly just because i love her which i know cant be enough when they are cheating and lieing ALL the time.

She also had Emotional Affairs all the time a few i think she leads on making them think they will be more then friends in time. If you think about it they are victims as well not the cheaters i think if you get in bed with a women you know is taken your just as scummy as the women but the ones in the emotional affairs.

seems to be there MO though.
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Lukkien

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« Reply #11 on: January 25, 2012, 04:18:58 AM »

Emotional cheating: I totally forgot about that one. Thanks Jonny.

During the summer of 2010~ish (way before I dated her), she was seeing her ex. But at the same time she was talking/IMing/Skyping a lot with a friend of hers (the one whom she slept with during Christmas 2010 when she broke up with her ex).

She told him all of her relationship problems with her ex; how he had a tough time staying hard with her, how he'd rather watch porn, all his flaws and so on, the fact that she was his first. This guy (I briefly talked to him about my ex, long story) told me that at one point, when she was sitting behind the computer and they were playing a video game and her ex was in the room, she said "I like you so much better than [ex], [R]!"

So yeah. Cheating isn't just limited to physical cheating with BPD (waifs). In fact, I believe I read an article here or on  that said that if BPD cannot get the stimuli they need from their SO's, they'll get it from somewhere else.

Just another reason to never get involved with a BPD ever again.
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« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2012, 06:45:44 PM »

My ex waif was similar. I don't think cheating has any limitations for them. It could be anyone. I was kept in the dark about her facebook page and she always turned her phone off when I was around. There was never an atmosphere of trust and it was turned back on me if I questioned it. During her pregnancy, her main gripe was losing her body. She would always tell me I had her now because she couldn't go and pick up. She also told me having a child with me meant I got her. Funny? Since she got an RO and I have't seen her or my child for almost two years. She'd say that she was joking about a lot of statements but when you observed her actions for a while, you soon started to realise, anything was possible. There were tons of horrible things that my ex said to me during close moments. She would joke about the other guy who was interested in her that she kept in touch with. Then other times, contradict and suggest he wasn't interested in her. Half the stuff could have been from conversations with other guys on the net or over the phone. How horrible to even have to piece her craziness together like that. She told me her ex husband was useless in bed and also kept saying that "you know you have got me this way." As if I had some sort of sexual control over her. She re-seduced one of her fling objects after he dumped her initially, saying they weren't suited to each other. She re-seduced him to quote, "have the last laugh." She also loved that I told her in the beginning that I just wanted to be friends.
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antman6
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« Reply #13 on: January 26, 2012, 12:21:47 PM »

Muggzy

Mine was the same way always had way to much make up on a few times she flirted with guys in front of me if i said something was oh i was not flirting and stuff like that when she was. I was the same way i just took it she cheated on me a few times i sure there is more i dont know and she has left me to go jump in with another guy or seek meaningless sex like she is doing right now. The truth is i still take it cause she if tried to talk to me i would hear her out but since she has been ignoring me for the last 2 months i dont think that will happen anytime soon. Ive taken this crap for 7 years mostly just because i love her which i know cant be enough when they are cheating and lieing ALL the time.

She also had Emotional Affairs all the time a few i think she leads on making them think they will be more then friends in time. If you think about it they are victims as well not the cheaters i think if you get in bed with a women you know is taken your just as scummy as the women but the ones in the emotional affairs.

seems to be there MO though.

I absolutely agree with all of this. Something just hit me.

It seems like my BPDexgf always had tons of guys around. Do they plan this? She worked at a pizzeria and obviously she was surrounded. I really do think she chose her job because of the access to men!
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Finished
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« Reply #14 on: January 26, 2012, 12:38:52 PM »

I get the same thing. "it's in the past, so why do I need to bring it up?"

The answer is easy.     Because it was never settled.  Ever.

When someone lies to you and you know it there is a compelling force that causes you to need the truth.  Otherwise, your trust in them never returns.

Thank you for this singular part of your post. I heard it too. In fact, when be broke up it was thrown in my face as a reason why it was my fault. Because I couldn't let go of the past. Because I kept him trapped in the "crazy box". Because I couldn't forgive him.

The truth is I did forgive him. I forgave over and over but he wasn't completely wrong either. I couldn't leave things in the past because NOTHING WAS EVER RESOLVED. Not one single issue in 4 years was ever resolved. Even the break up provided zero closure.

I didn't even realize it but it was an attempt for him to blame me for his behaviors and his running away. He was making it my fault that I couldn't just get over things. It's been rattling around in the back of my head for months now and I didn't realize it, until I read those words that it had really been bothering me.

Now I know why. Thank you
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timebomb
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« Reply #15 on: January 26, 2012, 12:59:38 PM »

My BPD had no problem using sex to get what she wanted... even though she wasnt a prostitute working the streets she was in a sense because she gave it up so easily for the stupidest things... WHORE! This woman was very attractive,smart, and college educated... how the hell did she go so wrong?
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slvr6543
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« Reply #16 on: January 26, 2012, 01:13:55 PM »

My ex cheated on me 2 times and both times she blamed it on me. As if  I could make her lay down and spread her legs out for some stranger to park his car in her garage. Made me want to kick her in the head. Sorry got a little carried away there Laugh out loud (click to insert in post). God forbid I would have cheated on her because it would most def been my fault and she probably would have cut it off as I slept.
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Sir5r
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« Reply #17 on: January 26, 2012, 01:14:57 PM »

My BPD had no problem using sex to get what she wanted... even though she wasnt a prostitute working the streets she was in a sense because she gave it up so easily for the stupidest things... WHORE! This woman was very attractive,smart, and college educated... how the hell did she go so wrong?

It's part of them. They have a mental illness.  One of their issues is that they assume relationships are much closer than they are.  They make conclusions about others that aren't true, especially in the beginnings of relationships.  Smarter men use them for what they're worth realize the depths of their problems and get out before the hooks are set.  All of the men here, including myself are the kind that are easy prey for them.  

I said in another thread a while ago that they are very vulnerable during the idealization phase.  They usually are obsessed with their immediate target and blind to any red flags that they're in a bad situation.  Again, my BPD wife used many of her exes for some sort of gain but their are others that used her as well.  One to such an extent that she said "He treated me like a piece of meat" and that relationship lasted only two weeks.  She was vulnerable at the time, just like a molting scorpion but some men know they have problems. They see the red flags, immediate sex, following them around like a puppy dog, etc. take full advantage and leave.

Rarely will you ever here a BPD woman admit she is being used. Most of the time my wife projects and say she used them, she has said about the aforementioned relationship more than once.

It's a way for them to cope.  Their lives are train wrecks and we rode the train.


Sir5r  
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« Reply #18 on: January 26, 2012, 01:17:04 PM »

@timebomb

My ex was exactly the same. She is just stunning. Normally very sexual and she would use that to put her hooks in her victims. We broke up at one point and she took off with another guy. They got in a fight and she came to see me for like 5 days banging our brains out like old times. She made up with the new guy and that quick she was back banging him again. CRAZY.

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« Reply #19 on: January 26, 2012, 01:17:44 PM »

My BPD had no problem using sex to get what she wanted... even though she wasnt a prostitute working the streets she was in a sense because she gave it up so easily for the stupidest things... WHORE! This woman was very attractive,smart, and college educated... how the hell did she go so wrong?

That's the crazy part... to us, none of it makes any sense.  But to BP's it makes absolutely perfect sense!  I mean, how dare we ask them to be in a normal loving relationship!  I would bring up the fact that she had sex with other guys, and my BP would complain that I couldn't forget about the past, that we weren't in a relationship at the time, that I kept trying to destroy our relationship instead of building it, and when every other excuse ran out she would just plain state that I was not "entitled" to her time.   

By the way, she would use this "entitlement" problem of mine as further proof that I had BPD.

When my BP ex got tired of hearing me complain about her sexcapades with two other guys (at least) during our 1 year relationship, she would simply state that I could leave whenever I wanted.  She would say this especially near the end when she decided to triangulate me with another earlier lover of hers.  My favorite line of hers would be "who says I'm gonna stop seeing him?"

The levels of toxic insanity we were exposed to in our BPD relationships is just unbelievable.  I hate to paint myself as a victim after all I always had the freedom to leave - as my wonderful BP most nicely pointed out - but I can't help but think about how naive I was going into a relationship with this sick woman and just what a terrible effect it would have on my mental health.
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Sir5r
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« Reply #20 on: January 26, 2012, 01:26:51 PM »

@timebomb

My ex was exactly the same. She is just stunning. Normally very sexual and she would use that to put her hooks in her victims. We broke up at one point and she took off with another guy. They got in a fight and she came to see me for like 5 days banging our brains out like old times. She made up with the new guy and that quick she was back banging him again. CRAZY.

This is very similar to how I ended up where I am today.  My wife was sleeping with her BF at the time and me. I was ending the relationship I was in at the time with another BPD (a waif in 20/20 hindsight) and seeing my wife.  She would go home with her BF from a bar right in front of me and show up on my doorstep the next morning and jump into bed.  This went on for weeks until I called her on it.  Then she broke up with him, was with me and then left me to go back to him and then he had it with her and broke up with her.

How the hell did I think this was normal? She used to make out with guy friends of hers in the bars with me there. I never did anything like that, even when she wasn't around.  She told me of course "I never slept with any of them, it's all in fun."

Was I out of my mind?  Now I sit, 25 years later, 3 kids and a mentally ill wife.   What the hell made me blind to HER faults?  My avatar here says it all.


Sir5r

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slvr6543
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« Reply #21 on: January 26, 2012, 01:44:08 PM »

@sir sir

Well thats a little extreme. I couldn't sit back and watch that happen. Me and my ex broke up 4 times and 2 of those times (the last 2) she moved in with another guy so I can't actually say it was cheating but close enough for me. The only reason why I let her come see me the last time was because I was horny as hell and I knew what was going to happen. Inspite of me still loving her, I had no intentions of getting back with her or expecting more out of the situation than what is was. I have know and accepted the fact that we will never be together.

What was funny though, she said some things to me that she never said before. She was abusing drugs towards the end of the relationship and she told me she was SORRY FOR EVERYTHING SHE DID. She told me she relizes that she blamed me for everything. She accused me of saying and doing things I never did . She also said that KARMA is catching up to her for all the wrong things she did to me. (meaning her new bf beats the crap out of her.) She then went on to say That I was the most important person in her life but she has put herself in a situation she cannot get out of.

She has been drug free for 4 months and claims she realizes everything she did and feels horrible and still crys to this day. Not sure what that was all about its just odd to see one odd to see one of these people be so vigilant and re-morseful. I dunno, it actually took me off guard and confused the hell out of me.
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« Reply #22 on: January 26, 2012, 01:52:51 PM »

Not sure what that was all about its just odd to see one odd to see one of these people be so vigilant and re-morseful. I dunno, it actually took me off guard and confused the hell out of me.

It's her way of trying to pull you back, the nuclear option.

"I know I have problems and I'm working on them, see I can be normal."

It was smart of you not to take the bait.

Sir5r
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timebomb
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« Reply #23 on: January 26, 2012, 01:55:55 PM »

Until i met my BPD i never really seen anybody as corrupt and downlow as this woman... i laugh at peoples definition of crazy.People have not seen true crazy until they have been with a person with BPD. I tried to put myself in her posistion, i tried to think like she did in certain situations and NONE of it made any sense. Im surprised they know how to put matching clothes on in the morning because they are complete lunatics!
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« Reply #24 on: January 26, 2012, 01:59:14 PM »

Great insight,

Thats about what I marked it up as. I was under the impression that since they don't think anything is wrong with what they do, they would not know what they do to harm you, therefore how could they be sorry for something they don't think is wrong. (if that makes any sense) Which then further makes me think. If you know what your doing is wrong and you continue to knowingly do it, why do you blame the other person. confusing

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« Reply #25 on: January 26, 2012, 02:00:23 PM »

Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)@timbomb

Mine was an excellent cook. but sometimes i wore the food instead of eating it.
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« Reply #26 on: January 26, 2012, 02:02:52 PM »

Until i met my BPD i never really seen anybody as corrupt and downlow as this woman... i laugh at peoples definition of crazy.People have not seen true crazy until they have been with a person with BPD. I tried to put myself in her posistion, i tried to think like she did in certain situations and NONE of it made any sense. Im surprised they know how to put matching clothes on in the morning because they are complete lunatics!

The most shocking thing about BPD is that even if they are in therapy and on the best anti-psychotic medication they still act like they're totally mental.  I truly believe their worst behaviors are deeply ingrained and pretty much unchangeable.  Never get involved with a BP unless they have been totally recovered.  I am reluctant to believe this can happen, but am still open to the concept.
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Finished
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« Reply #27 on: January 26, 2012, 02:27:36 PM »

Until i met my BPD i never really seen anybody as corrupt and downlow as this woman... i laugh at peoples definition of crazy.People have not seen true crazy until they have been with a person with BPD. I tried to put myself in her posistion, i tried to think like she did in certain situations and NONE of it made any sense. Im surprised they know how to put matching clothes on in the morning because they are complete lunatics!

The most shocking thing about BPD is that even if they are in therapy and on the best anti-psychotic medication they still act like they're totally mental.  I truly believe their worst behaviors are deeply ingrained and pretty much unchangeable.  Never get involved with a BP unless they have been totally recovered.  I am reluctant to believe this can happen, but am still open to the concept.

I saw my ex regress and progress and regress too many times ... .Even if "in full recovery mode" the answer for me is no ... .Never again ... .Can a pwBPD improve? I'm sure they can ... .Will it ever be emough for me to feel safe and comfortable? NO ... .Never want this experience again ... .

I tried to put myself in my ex's shoe's over and over ... .Guess what? It just confused me more and messed with my head ...
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« Reply #28 on: January 26, 2012, 02:29:14 PM »

I saw my ex regress and progress and regress too many times ... .Even if "in full recovery mode" the answer for me is no ... .Never again ... .Can a pwBPD improve? I'm sure they can ... .Will it ever be emough for me to feel safe and comfortable? NO ... .Never want this experience again ... .

So when your BP ex was on drugs and/or in therapy, did their behavior actually improve?  If so, what improvements did you actually see?
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« Reply #29 on: January 26, 2012, 04:34:45 PM »

I think thats part of the anger as well just wishing they would one day magically be "normal". When you realize this person that you at one time loved so dearly will never change... you have no other choice but to walk away and harsh reality wins over your hopes and hearts desire.
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