She emailed out of the blue, just to give me abuse

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

So... .  yeah, title says it all really.

The email was basically her telling me how she REALLY felt (7 months after the breakup, and we haven't spoken in about 6 weeks, other than an email back and forth about cancelling a contract we have together).

Some of the highlights were:

I broke her

She never thought I'd break her heart the way I did but she's over it now

The words I said to her and the way I said them, still ring in her ears

She hated me so much but never told me

She hopes I find somebody who gives me the bits she was obviously missing, as she believes she was never enough for me

She will never ever forgive me for what I did (?)

That we shouldnt be friends as I'd suggested (I suggested this back at the start but haven't bothered in about 2 months now)

And finished with "goodbye and good luck x"

Can I just point out, she dumped ME?  All I did was say I wanted to wait a year for the wedding. She was dramatic, childish, shouted and called me names, stayed away from home (around about the time she met her new girl), was suicidal... .  attention seeking... .  

I may not be perfect but I have NEVER so much as raised my voice to her. I never said anything cruel or mean, I told her I loved her every single day.  The worst I did was detach a little bit when she started geting a bit mental, for my own sanity.  And she picked up on this (typical fear of abandonment) and accused me of not loving her.

Obviously I'm not replying to this email.

But it has hit me hard.

The fact she GENUINELY sees me as a monster... .  that hurts.  This girl was the love of my life, I wanted to be with her until the day I died.  But she's sullied that, painted it black, painted ME black and made me feel like I have ruined her life.

I actually don't think I want to date anyone again, ever now.  I feel I may ruin them the way I clearly ruined her.  I don't know what I did wrong.  I don't even think I did anything she could PERCEIVE as being bad!  I treated her like a princess.  I was 100% loyal.  All I did was to not buy into her attention seeking drama towards the end.

It actually hurts me inside.  To think she thinks these things of me.

I don't understand where this has come from.

She is engaged to her new fiancee (we've been split 7 months now, and she's been going out with her the whole time, they got engaged about the 3 month mark).  She even had her fiancee's name tattooed on her arm last week. (I know this because one of my friends saw it on fb and thought I should know, I actually laughed and just said "Thanks, I actually don't want to know these things though" and my friend has promised she won't tell me anything else".

She's soo happy now, so she says.

Well, that's about it.

Just feeling kind of rubbish.  And I just don't understand what triggered this outburst AT ALL!

Thanks for listening guys xxx

[mango_flower]

So... .  yeah, title says it all really.

The email was basically her telling me how she REALLY felt (7 months after the breakup, and we haven't spoken in about 6 weeks, other than an email back and forth about cancelling a contract we have together).

Some of the highlights were:

I broke her

She never thought I'd break her heart the way I did but she's over it now

The words I said to her and the way I said them, still ring in her ears

She hated me so much but never told me

She hopes I find somebody who gives me the bits she was obviously missing, as she believes she was never enough for me

She will never ever forgive me for what I did (?)

That we shouldnt be friends as I'd suggested (I suggested this back at the start but haven't bothered in about 2 months now)

And finished with "goodbye and good luck x"

Can I just point out, she dumped ME?  All I did was say I wanted to wait a year for the wedding. She was dramatic, childish, shouted and called me names, stayed away from home (around about the time she met her new girl), was suicidal... .  attention seeking... .  

I may not be perfect but I have NEVER so much as raised my voice to her. I never said anything cruel or mean, I told her I loved her every single day.  The worst I did was detach a little bit when she started geting a bit mental, for my own sanity.  And she picked up on this (typical fear of abandonment) and accused me of not loving her.

Obviously I'm not replying to this email.

But it has hit me hard.

The fact she GENUINELY sees me as a monster... .  that hurts.  This girl was the love of my life, I wanted to be with her until the day I died.  But she's sullied that, painted it black, painted ME black and made me feel like I have ruined her life.

I actually don't think I want to date anyone again, ever now.  I feel I may ruin them the way I clearly ruined her.  I don't know what I did wrong.  I don't even think I did anything she could PERCEIVE as being bad!  I treated her like a princess.  I was 100% loyal.  All I did was to not buy into her attention seeking drama towards the end.

It actually hurts me inside.  To think she thinks these things of me.

I don't understand where this has come from.

She is engaged to her new fiancee (we've been split 7 months now, and she's been going out with her the whole time, they got engaged about the 3 month mark).  She even had her fiancee's name tattooed on her arm last week. (I know this because one of my friends saw it on fb and thought I should know, I actually laughed and just said "Thanks, I actually don't want to know these things though" and my friend has promised she won't tell me anything else".

She's soo happy now, so she says.

Well, that's about it.

Just feeling kind of rubbish.  And I just don't understand what triggered this outburst AT ALL!

Thanks for listening guys xxx

[LetItBe]

I don't understand where this has come from.

And I just don't understand what triggered this outburst AT ALL!

My guess based on my experience with my uBPDxbf and what I've read since educating myself about BPD is that she just unloaded all of her bad feelings about herself onto you, that it's not about you at all.  Typical BPD projection and blame... .  

I know it hurt when you read that email.  You sound like such a loving woman, and I hope you know you deserve so much better.  Big hugs to you. 

[Lucky Jim]

Hi Mango-Flower, As nonGF says, it's all projection, so don't carry the ball.  In my view, you will drive yourself crazy trying to figure out "where this has come from."  The fact is, in my experience, the triggering events are constantly changing so there is no way to predict when a sudden squall will capsize your boat.  You are better off sailing in other waters, in my view.  Hang in there, LJ

[mango_flower]

Thank you so much guys

I hated reading that, in my heart I know it's not true, but it just makes me so sad that somebody out there hates me and thinks bad things, when I tried so hard to treat her so well! It's like a massive kick in the teeth! x

[Clearmind]

mango, strip away the words she says and all I hear is "Please Mango I feel terrible, please soothe me because I cannot do this for myself".

She has written to you, all projections, what are some tools you can use to self soothe yourself rather than take on board all that she throws because she cannot self soothe.

[GreenMango]

Cross posted with Clearmind  

It's sounds like things might not be so great in her relationship.  Id guess the emotional baggage she's towing around is catching up and causing problems.  It could be her behavior, it could be the honeymoon engagement is disappointing... .  really who cares.  This is her's to deal with.  If she's not willing to deal with herself then its a good bet most other people aren't going to want to.

That out of blue email, while it was addressed to you, is really just an a way for her to inappropriately soothe herself.  It's not about constructive problem solving or making amends or it would have been approached differently.  My guess she's shifting emotions and blame around because she knows she screwed up with something either you or the new woman. She can't own this but it sure isnt yours to own.  :)elete it - the only thing personal in that email was your name was written on it.  That's it.  

Reframe that email accordingly - a person whos struggling and needs help.  People like that do things that are wacky.

Keep moving forward - that email isn't a set back ... .  It's a gift.

[mango_flower]

mango, strip away the words she says and all I hear is "Please Mango I feel terrible, please soothe me because I cannot do this for myself".

She has written to you, all projections, what are some tools you can use to self soothe yourself rather than take on board all that she throws because she cannot self soothe.

That's a really interesting take on it, thank you Clearmind.  I honestly don't know the answer to that, and I hate to think of her in pain. I wish I could understand why she feels that I guess. Because if I DID anything wrong that I am unaware of, I would like to know exactly what it was, so I don't make the same mistake in the future with anyone else.

I wish I knew what sort of answer she was looking.  I know the likely response I will get will be "Why does it matter?".  Well, to me it matters because I need to know whether she's feeling sad, angry, or whatever.  Because that gives me the benefit of foresight I guess, whether she's going to carry on with more of the same, or whether she will finally leave me alone... .  

[mango_flower]

Thank you Green Mango -

Yes, I have been doing so well and been so happy lately!  It's crazy how one accusation such as this can mess up my whole day... .  still, I got out with friends this evening, and had fun.  Trying to forget about it now and move on.

To think of her struggling actually makes me sad - I wish she could find inner peace and happiness.  I still remember my sweet girl, the side of her I loved so much. I wish she could find that again and just enjoy her life, and harbour no bitterness.  I wish she could get well.  I hate to think of her struggling, because beneath the craziness there is a scared little girl who just wants to be loved.  But you're right - it's about her, this is her problem and I can't help her.  I have my own life to live too! x

[GreenMango]

That email seemed to elicit all kinds of guilt and rescuer thinking in you.

Remember that old saying kids used to say "I'm rubber you're glue... .  "

While some things merit thoughtful consideration - an email lashing doesn't.

Consider working on those coping things Clearmind suggested - there's a time and a place to be rubber.

[schwing]

Hi Mango_flower,

The email was basically her telling me how she REALLY felt (7 months after the breakup, and we haven't spoken in about 6 weeks, other than an email back and forth about cancelling a contract we have together).

Here's how I see this.  These are delusions, all a product of her disorder.  She needs to believe these things because this is how she's always interpreted her relationships: first through idealization, then through devaluation.  Before, she idealized you.  Right now, she's devaluing you and idealizing her new fiancee.  Later on she'll devalue her new fiancee and forget exactly where she stands with you.

I broke her

She never thought I'd break her heart the way I did but she's over it now

She's broken.  That much is right.  People don't get over broken hearts like that.  She just needs to believe that her heart was broken because probably that's the narrative she's been selling her new fiancee.  Think of how many people here write about how awful their BPD loved one's ex'es are.  We are all, ex'es of pwBPD, and we have all been devalued.

She hated me so much but never told me

This is perhaps an indication of BPD.  When pwBPD experience an intense emotion towards someone, they can't recall ever feeling differently towards that person: thus "I've *always* loved you", "I've never stopped feeling for you", "I never felt loved by you", "I always hated you" ... .  but "never told you."  As I see it, it's preferable to think that you're deceptive rather than to think that you're mentally ill.

She hopes I find somebody who gives me the bits she was obviously missing, as she believes she was never enough for me

She will never ever forgive me for what I did (?)

This is another indication of BPD.  You see, pwBPD have a disordered fear of abandonment.  That is, a pwBPD, will *imagine* abandonment even if that abandonment only exists in their mind.  In their mind, they're afraid that we're going to run off.  And as their disordered feelings increase, they get to the point that the only way for them to avoid being abandoned by you (in their imagination), is to abandon you first.  Thus, they often dump first.  Or get involved in another relationship first.  Very rarely do they get caught off guard and not see it coming -- because you'd be paranoid too, if everyone was after you.

So in her mind, you were always the person who was threatening to leave her (even though you never told her).  And so she cannot forgive you for putting her through that.  The truth is, however, she will feel this way towards anyone who ever gets close to her.

Can I just point out, she dumped ME?  All I did was say I wanted to wait a year for the wedding. She was dramatic, childish, shouted and called me names, stayed away from home (around about the time she met her new girl), was suicidal... .  attention seeking... .  

Your wanting to wait a year was "confirmation" for her that her disordered feelings were justified: that you were planning to abandon her.  When her disordered feelings get intense enough, reality will give way to her feelings; for pwBPD feelings = fact.

Obviously I'm not replying to this email.

But it has hit me hard.

The fact she GENUINELY sees me as a monster... .  that hurts.  This girl was the love of my life, I wanted to be with her until the day I died.  But she's sullied that, painted it black, painted ME black and made me feel like I have ruined her life.

I know this hurts.  But realize that this is the perception of someone with a mental disorder.  She thinks this way of you, because she *needs* to think this way of you.  If she didn't, she might not be dealing with BPD.

I actually don't think I want to date anyone again, ever now.  I feel I may ruin them the way I clearly ruined her.  I don't know what I did wrong.  I don't even think I did anything she could PERCEIVE as being bad!  I treated her like a princess.  I was 100% loyal.  All I did was to not buy into her attention seeking drama towards the end.

Well, it's probably too soon to date seriously anyway.  But I think the only lesson you can take home from this is to not get involved with someone with BPD again.

It actually hurts me inside.  To think she thinks these things of me.

I don't understand where this has come from.

This is her disorder.  Her feelings about you, have nearly nothing to do with you.

Best wishes, Schwing

[schwing]

Remember that old saying kids used to say "I'm rubber you're glue... .  "

... .  things bounce off me and stick to you.

[mango_flower]

GreenMango - you hit the nail on the head!  Funny, these sorts of emails would make most people angry, yet in me they trigger some rescuer complex for sure!  I am not doing anything about it though. That email will not be getting a reply!

Schwing - beautifully put.  It all made so much sense.  Thank you, thank you, thank you x

[Clearmind]

Mango, self soothing comes in all forms -

Most notebly validation that you are not to blame. We get that here on bpdfamily which is great. However, in time we need to process these things on a conscious level where we don't need the validation, we simply know that it's not us.

There is something learnt in us that believes these projections - this is part of who we are - carry over from childhood. You may already know why you self blame, not sure - Its worth exploring.

There maybe a day where you need to pull on this knowledge to self soothe - life is packed full of invalidation. How we process it is testament to the amount of inner work we have done.

I am 2 years post break up and 2 years in therapy. As you may know I have a BPD parent. I'm still finding ways to manage triggers. Had two massive ones just this week. I'm working on not allowing my inner critic to rule! I'm not perfect but I sure as heck won't allow others to dictate my happiness and worth.

Plenty on the net about self soothing techniques.

[babyducks]

Oh My Goodness, had I gotten this email I would have ended up on the floor under the desk.  Yikes. 

[Iced]

I'd bet anything at all something else or even someone else (whoever she's with now more than likely!) triggered her into running back to you (yes, running back to you) to hopefully trigger a response from you - ANY response - so she can re-engage you... .  and possibly get you to become her Rescuer again.

Ooof.

I'm so sorry; that must have been quite a doozy to receive such an email all of a sudden.   

You're not alone in your feelings and confusion and feeling that dysfunctional tug coming from a sideways manner of attempting to re-engage; some of us have had the same thing happen to them... .  me included.

[mango_flower]

Thank you so much all, it's nice to just be heard

I think the thing that confuses me is the fact that I don't know her intention here.  I always like to know people's intentions (not too sure why!)

She didn't ask any questions in that email, so I wonder if she's expecting a response?

She did something like this a few months back, and I didn't reply. But then she got really sick and was hospitalized (non BPD related) and I texted to say "Hope you feel better soon".  She replied "Why did you feel it was ok to text me, but not to reply to my email? You can't pick and choose, it's not fair!" so I reckon she probably does want a response to this.

I am not engaging though.

I'm quite confused about how attacking me like this is a way of re-engaging?  Surely she could just send me a nice email, being friendly, and then I probably would have replied... .  

The way her mind works baffles me!

[LetItBe]

I think the thing that confuses me is the fact that I don't know her intention here.  I always like to know people's intentions (not too sure why!)

She didn't ask any questions in that email, so I wonder if she's expecting a response?

I am not engaging though.

I'm quite confused about how attacking me like this is a way of re-engaging?  Surely she could just send me a nice email, being friendly, and then I probably would have replied... .  

The way her mind works baffles me!

Yes, it is very confusing to a non that anyone would try to get you to re-engage by attacking and blaming you.  It's a disordered way of doing things.  The strong desire you feel to understand is common among us.  It's part of what we do as 2010 described in her posts here about the "Lonely Child."  If you haven't already read those posts, it might be helpful now.

My uBPDxbf wrote a couple of letters to me after he broke up with me, and I'd requested NC.  Mostly, in the letters, he was pontificating his own recovery process, and while he was claiming responsibility for his own upsets (which were usually a reaction to me being upset about feeling rejected by him or him stomping all over my boundaries), the letters were still laced with blame and projection.  These letters were clearly all about him.  He asked me no questions like how I was doing.  He didn't ask for a response as it is very rare for him to put himself in a position to be so vulnerable to rejection.  My T's take on it was that yes, these letters were all about him, that he wrote them to get a response (any response) from me, and that he would keep trying to contact me.  She was correct.

I found out when we reunited that yes, he was hoping all along that we'd get back together.  He was even putting odds on the chances of that happening after we ran into each other once (50%) and after I finally responded to him after several months (90%), then his estimate dropped (30%) when I was quiet again for awhile.  So, I think I'd be making a mistake to think that he isn't quite calculating and that his letters weren't well-crafted to try to elicit a response.

Our ex's know us very well.  They know our rescuer tendencies and how to appeal to them.  I've decided to stop playing rescuer, mom, and therapist.  Doing those things has precluded me from having the equal partnership that I'd much prefer. 

[mango_flower]

Thanks so much NonGF for taking the time to share that.

I agree she is trying to get a response, the drama of "goodbye and good luck" at the end.  Maybe she's being genuine though, who knows!

I don't think she wants to reconcile ever, she has told me before that she "never goes back" and when I was really down and desperate a few months after she'd left, I BEGGED her, wrote long emails, and she was just like "You know I still love you but I NEVER go back, and if you think I would, then you don't know me as well as I thought".

I've come to the conclusion that she wants me to still want her back, so she has that power, even though she never would.  She can't stand the fact I'm moving on, have changed my phone number and have moved out of the flat we shared together.  And I do wonder if the shiny newness of her relationship is wearing off.  Not sure.

Hope not, as she is now stuck with that name tattoo on her arm!   x

[patientandclear]

I've come to the conclusion that she wants me to still want her back, so she has that power, even though she never would.  She can't stand the fact I'm moving on, have changed my phone number and have moved out of the flat we shared together.  And I do wonder if the shiny newness of her relationship is wearing off.  Not sure.

Hope not, as she is now stuck with that name tattoo on her arm!   x

I bet she got the tattoo as a last ditch effort to make herself "be committed" and not want to leave.

Side note on that: My ex seemed to be at war with his tattoos.  He had one that he had even had tattooed over.  I think they were an effort to make permanent a sentiment or affection that in fact was fleeting, and that didn't work, and sometimes he acted puzzled or unhappy that they were even there.

Back to the main issue: MF, hang on to that insight that she wants you to want her back.  Which is way different than her being prepared to really reunite.

My ex was so focused on me after our breakup.  I accepted his decision relatively quickly and though I was devastated, I stopped trying to change his mind or argue with him after about two weeks.  It became clear two months later that this period, in which we stayed in touch by email but I wasn't raising any issues about the r/s and was letting it go, really bothered him.  Finally we talked on the phone and he wanted to discuss getting back together.  But.  As SOON as I agree that yes, I would like to, but we'd have to deal with what had happened -- I'd have to find some way of feeling safe, I'd need him to try to figure out why he'd left so precipitously -- he got cold feet and drew back.  Partly I think it was because of my request that he "look within."  But it was also revealing that his drive to get back with me was, I think, more a drive to get confirmation that I wanted to be back with him.  It's a subtle difference but it explains so much.

It's why pwBPD will send longing wistful messages to an ex, then when the ex replies --- there's no response!  Yes, as you said, she wants you to want her.

When I reconnected with my ex as a friend, I was scrupulous about never pursuing him and never initiating contact.  I think this is why we had 7 relatively good and stable months in an intimate and valuable friendship.  He didn't feel smothered and I didn't feel abandoned, because I always let him show me he wanted to be together or be in contact.

It "worked" well but it bugged him.  Finally he asked me to initiate more contact.  My smart self knew that would be a mistake but my regular person self thought "well, we've been doing so well, and in a real r/s things are more reciprocal, and he's asking, and I should respect him enough to honor that request."  So I tried, just a little bit, to initiate.

Nope.  Didn't work.  He still asked to see me, but when I would ask to see him -- no. No. No.  It's as if what he wanted from me was just that validation that I also wanted him, and then it gave him some sort of satisfaction to say no.

Power and control are a BPD safety blanket.

I think your ex is likely to make an overture to get back together, MF.  She's clearly in some sort of crisis with the new r/s and you are there both as a possible explanation ("I couldn't make it work with the new girl because actually it's always been you" and an device to reduce the intensity and anxiety of the new r/s, as it verges on becoming real.

[mrclear]

Dear Mango,

Let's analyze this:

"I broke her"

She blames you for showing her how broken she is and hates the fact that she broke you

"She never thought I'd break her heart the way I did but she's over it now"

She broke your heart, but wants to know whether you're over her.

"The words I said to her and the way I said them, still ring in her ears"

The words you said to her, showed her, her flawed self. She wants you to think she's perfect and take the blame.

"She hated me so much but never told me"

She hated herself so much, but never told you.

"She hopes I find somebody who gives me the bits she was obviously missing, as she believes she was never enough for me"

She hopes you won't find anybody, so she can recycle you and show you that you'll never be enough for her.

"She will never ever forgive me for what I did "

She'll never forgive you for showing her what she did.

"That we shouldnt be friends as I'd suggested"

That she doesn't want you to control her connection to you

"goodbye and good luck"

Come back and be unlucky

Pretty standard BPD. Don't try to understand it, don't respond and get on with your life. The best thing you can do for yourself is be happy. That doesn't include her... .  

mrclear

[Lucky Jim]

Hello again, Mango, Mr. Clear puts it well: don't waste time trying to figure out something that is extraordinarily complex.  Be happy, as he suggests, and move on with your life.

If I could add my two cents, I think all of the statements cited above (in bold by Mr. Clear) are more or less efforts at manipulation.  Don't let the FOG (fear, obligation and guilt) cloud your thinking.  You are on the right path; so stay on it!  LJ

[mango_flower]

Patientandclear - thank you!  Beautifully put and it all made sense to me

Mrclear - that was great - it is interesting to see it that way.  I guess I'll never really know, but it's interesting to see the possibilities.

LJ - yes, you're so right!  I am doing so well and I agree this was manipulation. It worked in that it did make me get stuck in the FOG, but at least I didn't show her that! (I haven't replied, and will not)