How to stick to a boundary without setting her off.

[Depression = 72% of members]

OK I tried a post here a few weeks ago and didn't really get an answer, I have nowhere else to ask about this which is really frustrating. So I am trying to be as succinct and brief as possible.

How do you stick to a boundary when the pwBPD sneaks in a question unexpectedly and you know saying "no" will set them off?

I have always had a hard rule that my mother cannot be alone with my children for any reason. (I seriously believe she would hurt/kill them)

I was talking to her on the phone, actively practicing validation and things were going well, I wasn't stressed, when she pipes up "maybe I can babysit one night and you and DH can go to a movie!" I immediately froze and panicked because I knew after this neutral conversation if I said "NO" it would spark her raging at me, so I said, "We'll see." and got off the phone quickly. Of course immediately I am kicking myself. Not that she got a foot in or anything; she will never, EVER be around my children without at least two other people in the room (I will not even let her drive them to a place where others are) but because I wasn't assertive verbally.

So while there is no danger of the actual boundary lapsing, how can I verbally stick to my boundaries without her being hurt because she is denied access to her grandchildren? Later on if she brings it up I can say, "I discussed it with DH and decided not to accept your offer."  but I'd like to be consistent and try to word it in a compassionate way.

[Rusalka]

OK I tried a post here a few weeks ago and didn't really get an answer, I have nowhere else to ask about this which is really frustrating. So I am trying to be as succinct and brief as possible.

How do you stick to a boundary when the pwBPD sneaks in a question unexpectedly and you know saying "no" will set them off?

I have always had a hard rule that my mother cannot be alone with my children for any reason. (I seriously believe she would hurt/kill them)

I was talking to her on the phone, actively practicing validation and things were going well, I wasn't stressed, when she pipes up "maybe I can babysit one night and you and DH can go to a movie!" I immediately froze and panicked because I knew after this neutral conversation if I said "NO" it would spark her raging at me, so I said, "We'll see." and got off the phone quickly. Of course immediately I am kicking myself. Not that she got a foot in or anything; she will never, EVER be around my children without at least two other people in the room (I will not even let her drive them to a place where others are) but because I wasn't assertive verbally.

So while there is no danger of the actual boundary lapsing, how can I verbally stick to my boundaries without her being hurt because she is denied access to her grandchildren? Later on if she brings it up I can say, "I discussed it with DH and decided not to accept your offer."  but I'd like to be consistent and try to word it in a compassionate way.

[joleeboo]

 I am sorry to hear about your situation.  I have had the same problem with a sister in law who has threatened suicide.  I try to have a pre planned reason for these types situations. Like "right now we don't have any plans to do anything" or I will invite her do stuff with us. She hates me and does not want to be around me so I know she will not accept.

[ScarletOlive]

Hey Rusalka,

I understand what you're saying. It can be so hard to stick to our boundaries when our family members with BPD try to get around them. What would you say you are most afraid of? Part of it can be that we still are stuck in the FOG - fear, obligation, and guilt. If we say no, we worry that our parents will yell, that we are failing our obligations as children, that we should feel bad for holding our ground. There's no shame in what you are doing, Rusalka.

It's okay to say "We'll see." You didn't say yes.  Another idea might be to say, "Mom, I don't feel comfortable with you watching my kids while I'm not there." This article gives some more options for respectful ways of voicing boundaries. Boundaries Tools of Respect

[GeekyGirl]

It's very wise of you to set this boundary, especially if you have the slightest suspicion that your mother would do something to harm your children. It's also very sad that you have to protect your children, but I understand why you feel the way you do--DH and I have made a similar rule with my mother.

I agree with the others' advice, especially ScarletOlive's suggestion of using a vague answer like, "We'll see." You may reach a point where you have to tell your mother that you're not comfortable with having her babysit, so you might want to brush up on SET. When she offers, you could always say something like, "That's so nice of you to offer! DH and I would prefer it if we could all spend time together," if you're comfortable with having her over or meeting up with her instead.

[Rusalka]

Thank you all for your answers, I am very grateful!  

My mother is VERY aware of the boundary that she cannot be alone with my children. I have set it in both respectful (and, uh, not so respectful) terms. I'm glad saying "we'll see" was acceptable.

My motivation doesn't come from obligation. I don't care if I am a good daughter.   BUT I am afraid of her anger, because she doesn't do the silent treatment like a lot of BPDs do when she is mad. (I wish!) She is uNPD as well and will snap into a full out rage and I am just not up to being told I am a worthless waste who is a horrible mother and I should just give my kids up blah blah. She goes right for the jugular. I don't have the self esteem yet to just shrug it off.  :'(

So I am trying to work the tightrope between standing up for myself and protecting my children and keeping her validated and calm.

I just feel like everytime I'm not setting the boundary in stone she tries to wiggle her toes over to test the waters, you know?

[hoping4hope]

Thank you all for your answers, I am very grateful!  


I just feel like everytime I'm not setting the boundary in stone she tries to wiggle her toes over to test the waters, you know?

When I was a kid, our dog was not allowed in the living room (not sure why now that I think about it.) anyway he would lay down and then just stick his nose in, then a paw, then his head, then bit by bit until there as a dog in the living room!

[GeekyGirl]

She goes right for the jugular. I don't have the self esteem yet to just shrug it off.  :'(

So I am trying to work the tightrope between standing up for myself and protecting my children and keeping her validated and calm.

I just feel like everytime I'm not setting the boundary in stone she tries to wiggle her toes over to test the waters, you know?

Ouch. It's hard when someone knows just how to get under your skin that way, and I know how tough it can be to shrug off the comments. You're doing the right things, though, by setting boundaries and working on yourself. Those are the two things you can do to make it easier in the long run.

In the meantime, can you continue to set the boundaries in stone, but consistently do it in the respectful way? It sounds like your mother likes to test the waters, and the more consistent, considerate, and firm you are, the more likely she'll be to adhere to them. I know it's hard, but it does get easier.

[Levi78]

This may be a controversial tactic, but I would say LYING is the cornerstone of my boundary maintenance with my uBPD mother. The lies center around our schedule: We are just "too swamped" to visit. We have "work conflicts." I have "school obligations." The bottom line is that we are continually "unavailable." Mom has slowly accepted this "crazy schedule" of mine. Like boiling a frog, I've trained her to believe that I am the busiest woman on earth. I now see her less than 5 times a year -- voila, instant LC boundaries!

I know lying won't work for everyone. Some may even see it as unhealthy or dishonest. The truth is my mother is not capable of logical conversations. You can't reason with her AT ALL. She has exactly two reactions to any serious conversation: rage or extreme depression. If I were to tell her that I need "boundaries" with her, it would be WW3! It's just not worth it. Lying is just easier.

 

[Rusalka]

I just wanted to come in and say thank you to everyone for their advice and help. I won't be on the boards for a little bit because my husband has had another breakdown and became increasingly abusive. It sucks to be surrounded by mental illness and always feel unsafe, but I'm working on a long term solution, thank god all the lessons I have learned here also help me not feed into his rages either (he is not BPD but is bipolar with severe anger) so thank you guys, I can see at least I am keeping well in the way I am handling my mother and it's ok to be flexible while still keeping to my boundaries. Thank you.