How about revenge?

[Jonie]

Maybe it's the Christmas spirit  : i was wondering if you had any (serious) thoughts about revenge.

And did you do anything with it? Or did you do anything which you later realised was out of revenge?

At the moment I'm writing and polishing my That's-It letter. I've written numerous texts with understanding, compassion and ways to reach out - so, pushing his warmth-buttons. But this letter is different and will push some of his cold-buttons. Mostly because this is the only way to really end things, but probably also out of revenge, punishment, sense of justice or something like that... .

Having read the stories on these boards I wouldn't be surprised if any of these thoughts came up with you as well.

[vangirl60]

Jonie- Thought about doing it a few hundred times over the last 2 years but never have- sometimes, I still want to but he'd take what I'd say and spin it so fast into being my problem, my fault, etc. He's a master at this-does it with his own daughter. It's a no win situation. They might privately think about what you say but it would turn into a long drawn out battle and really it doesn't help the healing one little bit. I'd say don't do it- they feast on that kind of drama. Don't set yourself up.

[Perfidy]

I suppose I thought about it. I suppose it's a kind of normal thought to want revenge. What's not so normal, I suppose, is acting on it. My revenge is this. I am a whole person. I take good care of myself. I have my own life and I don't prey on people to survive. I have a LOT to be thankful for.

[bpdspell]

Wanting revenge makes you human but seeking revenge will not give you what you ultimately desire to have from this person: their respect, unconditional love and validation.  It's because of their mental illness that they lack the capacity to be there for anyone except themselves and this is ultimately what is so heartbreaking for us.

There were many emotional low points after the breakup where I wanted to mirror my ex's inner ugly and give him a dose of his own medicine but ultimately I knew I would lose trying to beat my ex at his own game. Being mentally ill is punishment of itself. That tit for tat back and forth with them is only fuel to their mentally ill fire. You win by taking yourself out of the toxic dance.

There is no revenge sweeter than living your life and making your dreams come true and moving on without them in it.

Spell

[Ironmanrises]

Revenge is only temporary. Then you would have to look at yourself in the mirror. Would you like the person you see after the revenge was undertaken? I have thought many times of ripping my exUBPDgf a new one for her godawful treatment of me in 2 rounds of devaluation. But what would that achieve? It would only serve to give her ammunition to further use against me in her distorted depiction that is/most likely presented in front of her enablers/replacement(?)/family/and other ___faces. I will not help her sustain that false image of me. Just my opinion.

[fromheeltoheal]

As we know there is no closure in a relationship with a borderline; hell, if we had developed a relationship based on openness and honesty during it we wouldn't have broken up.

But remembering fear of abandonment is at the core of the disorder, leaving entirely is actually the best pain you can inflict.  I disappeared without a trace because I was lost in the dysfunction and going insane, I was saving myself, but it had the added benefit of hurting her to her core.  I now know she's been in so many relationships because a boatload of men have left her, which is confirmation and reinforcement of what she expects anyway, a self-fulfilling prophesy.

She was also much better at the caustic dysfunction than I was; she'd save up things she didn't like, and if I brought up an issue I wanted to talk about, she'd hit me with 4 or 5 things she'd been saving.  The constant mental turmoil she's in causes her to be hypersensitive to the games people play and she's great at it; I would always lose.

So better off to disappear, be satisfied that I hurt her where it hurts the most, and focus on healing.

[Jonie]

Perhaps I gave the wrong impression, I’m not writing a vile and mean letter painting him black or anything, it’s just saying : ‘I’ve been patient and understanding the whole year, but didn’t get anything from you, so this is where it has to end’.  Even so, there are eggshells that I always tried to avoid, but  that I now (have to) put my foot on.

This is what set me thinking about revenge in general – I didn’t intend to have a discussion on my letter specifically.

All of us are aware that revenge=wrong. Even so, after all we’ve been through, it seems only natural that thoughts about this come up, and maybe have even led to actions. We’re only human, aren’t we? The boards are mostly full of understanding and compassion, both for ourselves and for our partners, so I just wondered if anyone has taken another road.

[Ironmanrises]

Jonie,

Do realize he will/most likely use that against you. It won't be translated and understood in the manner in which you sent it.

[MrFox]

I have thought about revenge.  I think its very normal to want to lash out at the person who has hurt you.  I know I could severely hurt her business, could damage a great deal of her relationships with her "friends" and do a great deal of damage to her reputation in general.  I haven't and won't do those things, but sometimes I feel the temptation.  I don't because... .

I'm an adult.  To do those things would make me no better than her.

Unlike someone with BPD, I can't justify such actions.  I would have trouble looking myself in the mirror.

It's attention, which is what she craves.

My revenge has been to disappear, move on with my life, and do my best to become a healthier person.  The best revenge is living well.

[love4meNOTu]

Every email, heartfelt letter and text I sent to my xhwBPD was twisted in his mind.

Nothing I ever said, did, or my deepest personal revelations got through to him.

Instead? It was used against me to hurt me.

If you really want to hurt a borderline, then your best bet is to move on with your life. I know it sucks, but it's the truth.

Not only will you stop hurting faster, but you will stop trying to make sense of insensible behavior.

I know how you feel, and have a ton of compassion for what you are going through.

He is broken, was broken before you met him, and will be broken long after.

I'm sorry.

L

[Jonie]

Ironmanfalls, yes, I’m very much aware of that. He has interpreted all of my letters in his own way. Still, I need to send this letter for myself, to get closure. And there are some material things that need to be setteled. But again – perhaps your reaction crossed with my post – my question was not about my letter, but about the wish for revenge, justice etc in general.

[Ironmanrises]

I totally understand your need for closure. Your wish for revenge is totally understandable too, he has hurt you. It is normal to wish that. In dealing with a pwBPD though, we have to think a few steps ahead of them. Almost like chess. Sending that will get you checkmated in a sense. Don't leave that opening for that very real possibility. It is why so many people on here go complete NC in the aftermath. A strategic retreat.

[arn131arn]

Maybe it's the Christmas spirit  : i was wondering if you had any (serious) thoughts about revenge.

And did you do anything with it? Or did you do anything which you later realised was out of revenge?

At the moment I'm writing and polishing my That's-It letter. I've written numerous texts with understanding, compassion and ways to reach out - so, pushing his warmth-buttons. But this letter is different and will push some of his cold-buttons. Mostly because this is the only way to really end things, but probably also out of revenge, punishment, sense of justice or something like that... .

Having read the stories on these boards I wouldn't be surprised if any of these thoughts came up with you as well.

Texted her this, "You are a baby killer.  When you wake up in the morning you will be a baby killer.  And matter of fact, every morning you wake up you are still going to be a baby killer."

Well, to tell the truth, when I woke up in the morning I regretted ever saying those words to her.   Not only becasue I didn't want her to feel bad about the abortion but later realized that when I do things like that, I am the one who loses, and I think I lost a little bit of my good self that night.

Anyway, my revenge is getting on with my life, becoming fitter both in body and mind.  Becoming a success, and NEVER going back to her again.

[Soldier Of Sorrow]

Hi guys,

I agree with what has been posted so far about refraining from acting out on any of our hurt/ angry feelings about our pwBPD.

Any interaction with them will only mean that we are re-entering into their crazy-making waltz. I personally believe that if I was to show my ex any of my residual negative sentiments towards her, that would only provide her with more cues as to my emotional vulnerabilities for her to exploit and manipulate further.

Regarding revenge and "justice"-

I think our pwBPD are such a self-defeating, self-sabotaging bunch of individuals that something bad is bound to happen to them anyway, with or without the intervention from us (in-the-process-of-healing) non's.

I have been playing the co-dependent rescuer/ fixer in the past years 10 years, and I have wrecked my brains to help prevent the many consequences of the irresponsible words and actions of my ex in her personal life as well as her work life. And if my efforts in crises prevention were not enough, I would have given my all to bail her out of any tight corners that she has driven herself into.   

A fine example is the phone call I received right before X'mas from the psych ward of the local hospital.

Apparently, my ex has had a psychotic break down and has admitted herself into hospital. As a result, she would spend the X'mas and New Year in there under observation, and be subject to any sedative or anti-psychotic drugs that the authority sees fit.

Now, did I have to do anything actively to utterly ruin her Holiday Season?

Not a thing.

The flip side of this is of course, the daily harassing voice messages on my phone from her, nagging me to sign her out of the hospital ASAP... .

But on my part, I am sticking to my guns of NC (since 2 months ago) and will not respond to these requests. I'm sure the doctors in charge of her case with discharge her when she is no longer a threat to others and herself.

[Littleopener]

I once sent a message to my ex telling him that I was always there for him, I didn't understand why he discarded me, and asking how he could do this to me when he knew how scared I was of loving someone.


His reply? "You don't care for me, you only cared for me to get into a relationship with me, stop trying to blackmail me into becoming close with you, this is all your fault"


No closure, just blame.


Though, it was closure in a way. It was the point when I realised I didn't want to get back with him. Stupidly though I still wanted to be his friend. Why? Because I wanted to be there for him because I cared.

They will never see anything from your point of view. They will accuse you of trying to force it on them yet will never even attempt to see anything but what they want.

[BorderlineMagnet]

I became obsessed with it for awhile. I wanted my last BPDexgf to pay for hurting me so much, when all I did was love her with all of my heart. I guess at the end of our r/s I kind of got some by telling my replacement she was cheating on us with each other, but it really didn't matter. She must have spun her way out of it. Back in Aug. she actually gave me all the ammo I needed for revenge in the emails she sent looking for sex from me, and admitting we would have kept having sex if I hadn't had told him. I could have just sent him those new emails, but I couldn't bring myself to do it. I just felt like ultimately it wouldn't matter. She would get out of it somehow, or just replace him too. There's times I still think about it, but most times I just find myself missing her.

[ShadowDancer]

I totally understand your need for closure. Your wish for revenge is totally understandable too, he has hurt you. It is normal to wish that. In dealing with a pwBPD though, we have to think a few steps ahead of them. Almost like chess. Sending that will get you checkmated in a sense. Don't leave that opening for that very real possibility. It is why so many people on here go complete NC in the aftermath. A strategic retreat.

No truer words on this subject were spoken. Thanks Iron.

Living in the moment. Living well, living long and prospering is about justice for YOU.

To do otherwise is to live like a hungry ghost entangled in the chains of the past. That is hell on earth.

Ask Scrooge about charity.

Be your own Tim.

[Jonie]

Guys, guys, this is not about my letter or my closure. Forget that please, I should not have mentioned that. It was just what got me thinking about this subject. I’ll rephrase my question:

You probably become angry with what your pwBPD has put you through. Did that ever give you any ideas on punishment, revenge or justice? It may be a wish to lash out to the one who hurt you, a whish to ‘get even’, but it may also be motivated by a wish for justice and honesty?

[ShadowDancer]

Guys, guys, this is not about my letter or my closure. Forget that please, I should not have mentioned that. It was just what got me thinking about this subject. I’ll rephrase my question:

You probably become angry with what your pwBPD has put you through. Did that ever give you any ideas on punishment, revenge or justice? It may be a wish to lash out to the one who hurt you, a whish to ‘get even’, but it may also be motivated by a wish for justice and honesty?

Well yes... .of course. These thoughts seem completely normal and rational for a certain time and then we process and hopefully move forward and away from from these circular thoughts and start living and loving our own lives.

What I remember now as the as the number one lesson in all of the PD "stuff"  is that my perceptions of such things as honesty and justice are different than theirs. As had been said elsewhere on the boards... .they are a different "breed". Radical acceptance.

[fromheeltoheal]

Guys, guys, this is not about my letter or my closure. Forget that please, I should not have mentioned that. It was just what got me thinking about this subject. I’ll rephrase my question:

You probably become angry with what your pwBPD has put you through. Did that ever give you any ideas on punishment, revenge or justice? It may be a wish to lash out to the one who hurt you, a whish to ‘get even’, but it may also be motivated by a wish for justice and honesty?

OK, I see where you're coming from.  Yes, I wanted to kill the fcking btch, I'm not kidding, a natural response to abuse BTW, and very healthy.  The good news, I found out later, was she uncorked a flood of anger over past slights that had nothing to do with her, the result of decades of passive behavior.  I'm proud to report that I am no longer passive, thanks BPD; aggressive is better than passive but not as good as assertive, I'm working on that, but for now I'm liking the progress.

I was considering payback, not justice.  She was given the ultimate injustice by her parents; the disorder they formed for her makes her entire life a living hell and I couldn't improve on that.  And I was honest for the entire relationship, part of what hurt so much; we expect that when we are open and honest it will be reciprocated, but not by a person with a serious mental illness.  Note to self: pay attention next time.

[ShadowDancer]

Guys, guys, this is not about my letter or my closure. Forget that please, I should not have mentioned that. It was just what got me thinking about this subject. I’ll rephrase my question:

You probably become angry with what your pwBPD has put you through. Did that ever give you any ideas on punishment, revenge or justice? It may be a wish to lash out to the one who hurt you, a whish to ‘get even’, but it may also be motivated by a wish for justice and honesty?

OK, I see where you're coming from.  Yes, I wanted to kill the fcking btch, I'm not kidding, a natural response to abuse BTW, and very healthy.  The good news, I found out later, was she uncorked a flood of anger over past slights that had nothing to do with her, the result of decades of passive behavior.  I'm proud to report that I am no longer passive, thanks BPD; aggressive is better than passive but not as good as assertive, I'm working on that, but for now I'm liking the progress.

Nice!

Ah the "gifts" to be found. Like a wounding near death experience we come away and the paradigm... .shifts.

[sadinnc98]

Jonie- Thought about doing it a few hundred times over the last 2 years but never have- sometimes, I still want to but he'd take what I'd say and spin it so fast into being my problem, my fault, etc. He's a master at this-does it with his own daughter. It's a no win situation. They might privately think about what you say but it would turn into a long drawn out battle and really it doesn't help the healing one little bit. I'd say don't do it- they feast on that kind of drama. Don't set yourself up.

This are exactly my thoughts ^^^^^

[isseeu]

Jonie  

For some reason, I haven't thought about revenge much-I haven't been angry much.  I wish I was because I think it would help  me really be done with this guy who spent 2.5 yrs with me and my family and friends, then raged and disappeared with out a word-six months ago now.  As you know, all loving texts, a letter... .go ignored.  No message on Christmas-I'm sure I won't hear from him Saturday, my birthday.

I was doing better until I saw some unmistakable proof that he's out there again looking for a new person.  One consolation for me I guess is that he didn't cheat and didn't jump right into a new relationship.  My anger, when I have it, is with the lack of empathy, closure, one molecule of kindness of connection when he knew how much I needed that, not one thank you for all I did for him (and it was a LOT).  I haven't been in contact now for about 1.5 months-his new seeking just started about a week ago... .maybe there's a correlation.  dunno.

You've got me thinking tho-what would revenge even look like for me.  I know that he's locked up in his dark mind with no self-until he attaches again to someone he can shape himself around.  There isn't anything I can say or do that will make me feel better than NC.  If this really is a disorder with abandonment fear at it's core, not hearing from me may be making some kind of an impact.  My therapist told me not to be surprised if he surfaces once I'm really back on my feet and have moved on.  My true revenge will come when/if I hear from him and can let him know something like "that ship sailed."  I hate this... .had a hard Christmas and I thought I was really in a better place.  

[isseeu]

although now that I think about it, slashing the tires on his precious Shelby Cobra has some appeal... .

[love4meNOTu]

Here's a thread I started on Justice and retribution.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=215092.msg12355234#msg12355234

[damage control]

With this ex ... yes ... I fantasised about contacting his ex (who is his boss) to fill her in on some home truths, contacting the current for the ame but, really ... there seemed no point.

I did exact revenge on one ex however - not a BPD but a narc that I dated for 6 months/lived with for a few more:

This particular guy was (like current ex) addicted to women online. I was going to work and I KNEW that he was online all day talking to women. He wasn't working so I was also supporting us both.

I told him that I didn't really care about him talking to women online, but that I needed him to tell me it wouldn't go further than that and to be honest about it ... he denied and denied and denied - gaslighted me for months.

Eventually one day he forgot to shut down his browser and was logged into a sex site. I could see that he had taken pictures of his erection and had sent it to about 10 women - that day alone.

So, I printed about 25 A4 (legal) copies of the picture, got a bucket of wallpaper glue and pasted them all over the hood and windscreen of his car ... put his things in the back seat, wrote 'f&ck off' in lipstick on the driver' window and locked the  front door.

I never heard from him again.

A$$hat (and no, I don't regret it ... it was kinda beautiful to see him driving around with remnants of those pictures all over his precious car.

[Jonie]

Wow, that's a great story, DC, had to laugh out loud!

For me, that would never have crossed my mind - I wish I had your creativity 

I did get angry lots of times, but I never had the wish to hurt him or to get even. I did – and still do – have a strong urge for justice: it’s simply not right how he has treated me and I want that to be clear. (Yesyes, I know that he will never acknowledge that openly, but I think he is very much aware of it deep down in his heart. I think that's also the reason why he has stopped contacting me). Every time I got angry with him, even yelled at him and grabbed him by his collar, this was my motivation. And it's also part of my motivation to write this letter.

What it has brought me is similar to FromHtoH. Being in a relationship where I have not been respected, having seen how his family and friends play a part in this, and having witnessed how his children got entangled in a web of conflicting loyalties, all helped to sharpen my ideas and values about being responsible for other people.

[damage control]

I never had the wish to hurt him or to get even. I did – and still do – have a strong urge for justice

There really isn't any justice for us Jonie ... we can hope that they feel at least some regret at what they have done (mine has apologised but it didn't help) ... .folks here say that living with their issues/behaviour is punishment/justice as well ... .

Still wanting something from them keeps us enmeshed in the R/S I think

[Perfidy]

although now that I think about it, slashing the tires on his precious Shelby Cobra has some appeal... .

Babe? That you?   

[isseeu]

Perfidy... .now that's funny!  Did that actually happen to you?  I was trying to think of where I would even "hit him where it hurt"  and it would be his precious Mustang, his pick up truck or his stupid Harley... .  not that I would ever do any of this dumb stuff-can't blame a girl for imagination

    back atcha