Filed for divorce, not sure I want to do it

[Ulysses]

I'm sorry this is a long post, I'm new here and don't know what to do.  I wonder if anyone has been in a similar situation and can talk about their experience, or can see issues I'm missing.

My H had an affair and after a year of MC and IC counseling I discovered he's back in touch with OW.  My IC told me over a year ago that she thinks H is borderline, H saw an autism specialist for a diagnosis and was told he meets traits for NPD, not autism. The first time I found out about H affair, H had rented a home (his mother paid for it) in another county (relevant for filing divorce, and H is a prominant attny), opened joint accounts with OW and business license with OW.  Also ran a distortion campaign against me, I now realize.  OW and her 3 kids were set to move across the country to live here with H, OW emailed me how she was looking forward to my 2 children (4 and 9) living with her.  OW and H were/are into bdsm and OW made her 12 yo daughter aware of these activities, exposed daughter's full name and photo on her pornographic websites/twitter/facebook.  H and OW published their activities online and were cheered on by their online friends and H brother. H often sexted OW while watching or bathing our daughter.

This was all a complete shock to me.  H never said he was in to that type of sex, always said he couldn't stand it when men cheated, etc.  He was Sunday school director at our church for awhile.  I felt so bad for him and I wanted him to get help because I thought even if we end up divorced, if he lives with this OW he'll probably kill himself in 5 years or something (my T said it would probably only have taken 5 months judging by what this OW said and posted online).  Also H mother lived near by and I didn't want her near my kids after I found out the significant role she played in supporting the affair.  She moved away without notice last year.  Weird.

I filed for divorce because H would not give up contact with OW.  I gave him 3 weeks in the house (6 weeks the first time, one year ago, and when I threatened divorce he freaked out and ended it supposedly).  During the 3 weeks I didn't talk much to him and he slept on the couch.  I didn't tell him I was going to file, just told him how much it hurts that he's having an affair (he says he's not having an affair). 

I also filed because of fear that he would end up with OW and our kids would be exposed to inappropriate material/people/craziness (my T says OW is probably borderline).  I've been trying so hard not to act out of fear but jeez, these are my kids.  My lawyer filed for parent evaluators and a clause (H told me the clause is in the child abuse section, and he's angry about that) that my kids aren't to have any contact with people my H has written or engaged in pornograpgic/erotica activities with (he also wrote pornographic ebooks with OW).  I asked for H to have kids every other weekend in the temporary orders for the stability of my kids.  I'm a sahm, have been since our first child was born, and my H often is gone 12 hrs/day or more. 

He has lied to me about our finances and we are in a ton of debt.  Since being served he's spent money on a lawyer, apt, furniture, which all seems ok.  He redirected his paychecks out of our joint acct without telling me.  Since being served I haven't spent much except for Christmas and bills.  I told him he can see the kids anytime, that I want stability for them.  He comes home for dinner and the kids' bedtime, but sleeps at his apt.  He comes over on the weekends anytime/hours he wants to, and stayed all night Christmas eve.

I don't want a divorce but I don't know what to do.  He has secret emails accts again and online activities. He intimates he's a sex addict but won't confirm that.  I've asked for the last 10 months, what do you want/need and he won't say.  He says he doesn't want a divorce but needs more time to create the transparency I need.

He was angry that I filed for divorce and that my lawyer had him served at work and that I asked for parent evaluators, full custody, and that OW not have access to my kids.  He's asking for 50/50 custody, which means daycare for our kids (one child is special needs Aspergers traits and would probably be eaten alive at daycare if public school is anything to go by; both kids are in private school).  He's also asked that the court order me to find a job in 3 months.  I work part-time evenings and weekends in the arts but I don't earn much.  Our youngest just started kindergarten.

On the way to my lawyer's office I got sick from the stress I think and therefore we haven't had a hearing yet.  I want to take it all back and keep my kids from this but I wonder if he'll retaliate, and what it will do to me to live any longer with a H who I think is cheating on me (again, he says he's not having an affair).

Has anyone filed for divorce and then unfiled?  Any feedback you can offer?  I'm so sick of the drama but I'm afraid it will never go away.  I'll probably also post on the undecided board because sometimes I'm undecided, also scared and very very sad.

[maxen]

hi ulysses.   first, holy moly. second,  .

third, although my situation doesn't have the horror yours does, i too have had to face the decision to file without really wanting to divorce. (i filed because my w went from being my w to a lunatic of narcissism within 2 weeks after she left and i was scared.) from a legal point of view, the situation will differ state to state. in my state, one files and then has 120 days to serve. i used 119 of those days to work through my emotions, and when the time came for service i had half a mind to pull and re-file. i was utterly adrift, i had more or less been told to just sit over there while my w was living with her homewrecking friend and sorting through her feelings. (she revealed 3 months after d-day that she hadn't filed.)

at this point the diagnosis becomes important. my T has worked with pwBPD and spotted it in my w. my T has had to bang it into my head repeatedly that BPD is characterological, that i have no real basis for thinking that my w would be capable of increased emotional awareness or maturity if we were to reconcile, short of intensive and long-term therapy which seems very unlikely to happen (because to my T's frustration i'd still listen if my w were to want to return). not knowing what other way to go, i served.

so do you think your husband could live a different life if you were not to divorce? because this:

My H had an affair and after a year of MC and IC counseling I discovered he's back in touch with OW.  My IC told me over a year ago that she thinks H is borderline, H saw an autism specialist for a diagnosis and was told he meets traits for NPD, not autism. The first time I found out about H affair, H had rented a home (his mother paid for it) in another county (relevant for filing divorce, and H is a prominant attny), opened joint accounts with OW and business license with OW.  Also ran a distortion campaign against me, I now realize.  OW and her 3 kids were set to move across the country to live here with H, OW emailed me how she was looking forward to my 2 children (4 and 9) living with her.  OW and H were/are into bdsm and OW made her 12 yo daughter aware of these activities, exposed daughter's full name and photo on her pornographic websites/twitter/facebook.  H and OW published their activities online and were cheered on by their online friends and H brother. H often sexted OW while watching or bathing our daughter.

is pretty bad.

you also mention something that comes close to home with me:

I don't want a divorce but I don't know what to do. He has secret emails accts again and online activities. He intimates he's a sex addict but won't confirm that. I've asked for the last 10 months, what do you want/need and he won't say.  He says he doesn't want a divorce but needs more time to create the transparency I need.

not-communicating is my w's long suit. you've been blindsided by your h's activities, as i was by my w's activities, and the ground would have to be cleared of the deceit before you can rebuild.

others here have children and lots of experience and will be able to give you insights. all strength to you, ulysses.

[livednlearned]

Hi ulysses,

I'm sorry you're going through this, so let me add a   to maxen's. I remember my own process leading up to divorce, how undecided I felt, and it's a really, really tough place to be. Having competing values like "honoring marriage" and "condemning infidelity" creates a lot of internal conflict, and that can make us second-guess ourselves, become doubtful, or feel paralyzed to make a decision. I think the senior members on Undecided are really skilled at helping people work through these decisions. Here on Family law, you'll find people who have (for one reason or another) ended the marriage, so our perspective will be very influenced by how we're experiencing life on the other side.

How old are the kids? How are they doing right now?

I was also married to an attorney and was terrified of going up against him in court. It does add an extra level of stress -- are you taking care of yourself? It's easier to handle these life-changing decisions when we can think straight, and stress is a terribly insidious state of mind that makes it hard to think straight. Are you eating? Sleeping?

Also, what does this mean?

He says he doesn't want a divorce but needs more time to create the transparency I need.

Hang in there, ulysses. It's going to be really rough for a while, but you have people here who understand what you're going through and genuinely care. We've been there. And plenty of people come here to Family law for advice, then go away for a while, come back. It's a process. Gather lots of information and take care of yourself as best you can. We're here for you.

[Free One]

I don't want a divorce but I don't know what to do.  He has secret emails accts again and online activities. He intimates he's a sex addict but won't confirm that.  I've asked for the last 10 months, what do you want/need and he won't say.  He says he doesn't want a divorce but needs more time to create the transparency I need.

I am so sorry you are going through this. What you have described is a person who is unwilling to do what is necessary to save the marriage. He's not in it any more, and seems to want to have it both ways - marriage and OW. You don't deserve that. You deserve a partner who is committed and willing to do what it takes to make it work.

I know divorce can be scary and overwhelming, but something prompted you to file? What was it that finally made you make that move?

[ForeverDad]

Wow, you've got a lot to handle.  Frankly, he will do what he will do, he is what he is.  There's little or nothing you can do to change him, he has to want to change and that's very unlikely based on the history you've described.  Sad but that's what the reality is.  So to protect yourself and your children, you have to do what you have to do: If he's not on the path to recovery then divorce is the only realistic option.

Contemplating 50/50 parenting time with him is not wise for you or the children.  Yes, depending on the unpredictable vagaries of the court process it could eventually turn out that way, but only take that road if all other options are exhausted.

These days most states don't care about the adult behaviors (except DV).  What used to once be kept in the closet are now virtually flaunted in today's society.  However, if you've documented his actions and behaviors, especially at they affect children, then some of that might tip the balance on how his future parenting would be viewed.

As for finances, you may need a Special Master, a forensic accountant, to determine whether he's hidden money away, even stashing it with the OW, while publicly claiming he's in debt.

Beware of being too fair, too polite, too thoughtful, too whatever.  You may wish otherwise but you know in your heart of hearts that he won't reciprocate your good deeds.  And many here have learned that hard way that the misbehaving spouse seldom faces consequences and the well behaving spouse seldom gets credit.  So don't 'gift away' any advantages you might have.

Beware that he will try to make you appear worse than him.  Especially just before a court appearance or anything he's just made a major flub-up.  That's what happened with me, that's often when my ex made a new but unsubstantiated allegation.

He wants you to work or earn a better income.  It's hard to say what the courts will say about that.  Likely even if it happens he can't force that during the divorce.  In fact he might even have to continue support for a couple years if you state you want to get career training or a degree.  Strategize!  Asking for the ex-spouse to seek a job and get independent is something many of us working spouses have sought in court.  Court will be slow to act on his 3 month request or may allow you to do as I mentioned above, waiting until the divorce is final and then allowing you a few years to complete a degree or career training.  So figure out Options A, B, C, D, etc for the numerous factors of your situation.  Bounce ideas off your lawyer as well as here in peer support.

If the children have always been in private school, then quite possibly the court will listen to you and your lawyer that the children continue in private school.  And if he's been paying for it before and he still has income then he could be required to continue paying for it.  Courts often like the status quo and so they won't want to 'upset' the children with school changes.

Accept that he has made (and will continue making) many demands and ultimatums.  Partly because that's the disordered way to keep you off balance.  Partly because out of the many demands a few make get through, just like a classroom of unruly kids can expect that at least some of their many spitballs will stick to the blackboard.  Partly because some normal things will be mixed in just to keep you doubting yourself and distracting the professionals, evaluators and court.

[livednlearned]

Also:

Read Splitting: Divorcing a BPD or NPD Spouse by Bill Eddy (co-authored with Randi Kreger, who wrote Stop Walking on Eggshells). It's part of the routine around here -- it will help you understand how personality disorders and the family court system work (or don't). Eddy was a family therapist and then became a family law attorney, so he has a particularly helpful perspective.

We have a book review on it here on bpdfamily: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=47078.0

[Ulysses]

Thank you for your replies.  I've not talked to anyone except MC, IC and a few family and one friend until I filed for divorce.  This is so personal it's hard to talk about, plus I wonder what's wrong with me that I'm involved in this situation.  It's a relief to get my thoughts out and have feedback.

I haven't figured out how to quote text on my phone, so here goes without that.

Re:  Bill Eddy's book - a friend sent it to me and it just arrived today.  I've been told this will be a difficult process and I'm really scared.  Some days I take care of myself, many days I have trouble.  I don't drink and have never done drugs.  The most I do is eat too many sweets.  Sleep isn't regular.

Not sure what the court will decide re: working.  I'm well educated and had a nice career before kids, but it was 8-5, some evenings and weekends (too many hours for infants, I felt).  I interviewed last year for a position and the 3 days leading up to it my H was mean and aggressive. H apologized the night before my interview and said he didn't know why he was being so mean.   I've documented and told my L.  I've turned down paid arts jobs because H conducted affair while I worked, the turmoil was too much for the kids, and D4 would regularly sob, scream and hold on to my leg begging me not to leave in the evenings.  She can't say why except H makes her go to bed too early.  She did it again this fall at age 5. She's ok with my family members.   I've documented this with MC, T, and L.  H tells me the kids are afraid of me, that I'm a bad mother.  Other times he tells me I'm a great mother, "a better parent than he is."  WTH?  I've never thought of it as a competition.  I'm not perfect, I'm well aware of that. 

One thing he did was send OW video I think  a la Anthony Weiner.  Last year she threatened to send everything to the local news (H is technically a public servant).  I wonder if she's blackmailing him sometimes.  My T says that his compulsion is more to him than I am.

I think he usually has to provide support 1 yr for every 4 yrs we've been married.  I've asked for support for retraining. 

Our S10 was in public school for awhile and it was a disaster.  We almost lost him emotionally and intellectually, he was regularly threatened and targeted.  I was the one who taught him every day after school, because the social atmosphere was so destructive he was shutting down.  A psychologist told us S won't make it in public school.  H and I agree the kids should stay in private school.  They are both flourishing.

Why did I file?  H took off his wedding ring this fall, in Aug started saying OW would be a good influence on our kids, as would her kids, H couldn't promise me we'd "make it" as a couple, I started to feel beat down like I did during the affair, started having nightmares that OW was taking our children and H let her, nightmares of being raped.  Sex suddenly felt emotionally empty, when I tried to tell him he got angry, and told me he hoped my T could help me with it.  H wanted to get back in touch with his mother (he agreed last year she was "toxic" for him, this fall said he'd be a good influence on our kids), then I found out he was back in touch with OW and meeting a secretary before work at his office, and taking her to lunch.  I gave it 3 weeks and found myself getting angry inside and felt it was creepy to have him in the house.  He was going to move out but I filed because I felt it offered me security re: the kids' safety and financially.  Not sure if it does but at least there are other people involved who know the law.  Honestly I felt he was on his way out and I would once again be blindsided.  Fool me once type of thing.

MC has said things privately to me like, "I don't know where you find the strength" and "marriages like this can sometimes last until the kids graduate college." But MC has also said he feels H is progressing and that it takes a LONG time and there will be relapses. 

H says he loves me and wants to stay married.  He says he needs time to get strong and be the kind of man I want to be married to.  He also says because I filed for divorce and because I "ask every day" for transparency he hasn't had time/strength to give me his passwords to his online stuff and proof he's not in contact with OW.  That doesn't sound right to me.

My T and L say we can work on the marriage while divorce is pending.  H doesn't think so, MC seems to think that's weird.  I know we can't if there are other women involved.

H hasn't offered postnup although I've asked about it.  My L told me last year it really isn't enforceable in our state.

I'm just trying to figure out if I give him another chance will I regret it legally.  I realize I might emotionally but I have hope I can stick it out if I build support in other areas of my life, and someday H will improve (he's in IC but I'm not sure what good it does him).  So many tough decisions.  Thank you again for your replies.

[momtara]

I went back and forth on it after I filed.  I emailed my lawyer and said to ask me before serving him.  She served him anyway.  Then he asked for custody of the kids, so from then on we were adversaries.  So make sure your lawyer knows not to serve him yet, if you want to think about it more.  You can still do it later (figure out the rules for how long).

However, it sounds like a bad situation.  The porn stuff is not good.  I know that it's hard to leave someone you loved, and battling that person is scary too.  I don't really know what advice to give - only that you will be ok, even if the short run will suck.

You can post legal questions for free on avvo.com, FYI.

[ForeverDad]

If you go back now, then for sure the past will be a predictor of the future.  Sorry, that how it looks like from here.

He also says because I filed for divorce and because I "ask every day" for transparency he hasn't had time/strength to give me his passwords to his online stuff and proof he's not in contact with OW.  That doesn't sound right to me.

Hogwash.  That's guilting you, posturing that you(!) are the reason he can't have the "time/strength" to divulge his passwords.   On the other hand, you don't want to be placed in the position of Monitor, that's no way to build a trusting marriage.  Asking for passwords is a two-edge sword, necessary to verify compliance but at the same time also a condemnation that the marriage is unhealthy.  And if he refuses, likely no court would force him todivulge them to you, he does have a right to privacy even from his spouse.  (Thank you HIPAA.)  Look at it from another direction, you have a right to privacy from your spouse.

Be very aware of the slick manipulative ways he has used to guilt you... .where his misbehaviors are somehow turned around, distorted and blamed as your fault.  It is also known as Gaslighting.  Have you watched the 1940s movies Gaslight?  There were two, one British and later one American.

One reason I figure you might need to request the court to assign a forensic accountant is that appearing to be mired in debt seems strange if he had gone into business with his OW.  I'm guessing he's diverting all his spare money there or even multiple other places?  He wants you to believe there's no money left, he wants you to be saddled with debt or for the court to order less support due to the seemingly low assets to debts ratio.

EDIT:  We here can certainly understand your reluctance to pursue divorce.  Bu when all other options are exhausted, then what is left?  You will find that nearly all of us here who have divorced had to be virtually dragged kicking and screaming into accepting that divorce was the only option left.  We wish it weren't so but that was out reality.  Apparently yours too.  So don't blame yourself, you couldn't have diverted this impending train wreck.

[livednlearned]

If your H is a narcissist, he is no longer getting enough supply from you and will be forever seeking it elsewhere. He has already shown you on multiple occasions that he is fully prepared to draw supply from other women. Narcissists live with a false sense of self -- the feeling of having no self is terrifying, so they feed their false sense with some kind of narcissistic supply, driven to find someone or something that will make them feel like they are someone. If your H did not have a PD, maybe you could reason with him and explain that having affairs is bad for the kids, bad for the family, and is hurting you. But if your H has a PD, you are essentially dealing with someone who feels driven, at all costs, to protect his false self. Without it, he is no one. Literally. It's hard to fathom how powerful that is. It is difficult for someone who does not have PD to confront a hard truth. It is doubly so for a person with a PD whose most powerful coping mechanism is designed to keep out negative feelings.

Can you accept that he is like this? That's essentially the question from which all other questions follow.

[maxen]

hi again ulysses.

I wonder what's wrong with me that I'm involved in this situation.

many (most? all?) of us here have asked themselves this very question. and, there is nothing wrong with you. please, if at all possible, don't let yourself dwell in this line of thinking. you seem to have something of a support network in place, and you have this board now too. keep reaching out.

[Free One]

I'm just trying to figure out if I give him another chance will I regret it legally.  I realize I might emotionally but I have hope I can stick it out if I build support in other areas of my life, and someday H will improve (he's in IC but I'm not sure what good it does him).  So many tough decisions.  Thank you again for your replies.

You may need the divorce to protect yourself at this point. That doesn't automatically mean that it isn't possible to work something out with your H down the road, but that is difficult to do when you don't feel safe. Sometimes relationships get so dysfunctional that a legal separation or divorce is the only way to safely give either party the space to work on what they need to work on.

[Ulysses]

Thank you for all the comments, information and support.  As an update, I met with my lawyer and will offer to my H to postpone divorce proceedings to give him the time he says he needs.  I'll continue to go to MC if it seems worthwhile.  Our children will be able to stay in our house (vs going to H apt overnight, which I don't want them to do) and H can continue to come to our house anytime.  Since H wanted to move out before I filed I think this should work for us.  He'll have the time he's asking for.  I can keep getting stronger, focus on me and our children.  H could move forward on his end with proceedings, but I'm trying to accept I can't worry about that because I have no control over it.  If I  think about divorce, it breaks my heart.  If I think about what he did, it breaks my heart and scares me and makes me angry and sometimes really disgusted.

I still have a lot to come to terms with.

I've been offered a very part-time job I'm going to consider.  It's not in the field I want eventually and won't ever be enough to support me but I can begin to build my resume again and shift my brain from full-time mommy mode a few hours/week. 

This site has so much great information, and I'm so grateful for the support from people here.  Between the bouts of crying and immense heartache today I could at least appreciate the beauty of a bald eagle by a lake near my house, and Dvorak's cello concerto on the radio, and enjoy being with my kids.