Borderline/Narcissitic?

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

This is a bit of a long story

 I met a girl at my work. She is 19 and i'm 28. I know she is young. I looked at it like age doesn't matter.People do it. I found out her mom drank when she was little and what she told me she was touched by her dad. Needless to say she doesn't like her parents. They weren't there for her. When she was in High School. Her Parents took in this guy whose foster parents kicked him out. They went out for 4 years. When i met her she graduated high school and this guy left for a school a hour or so away. This guy is a real winner. He's stolen and got into trouble with the law a real loser. This guy is a joke.He doesn't have a car and can't even pay for anything.  Her and i started dating and everything was fine. A few months later this guy moved back and her and i were in school. I of course wanted to see her and didn't get to see her as much as i would like. We would see each other but it wasn't enough. She talked about her ex both good and bad.Throughout the time of being together She would rag on him and then bring him up at random times. I took her out to restaurants and treated her amazing... . Like a women should be treated. She had never been treated like this before.

 I met her parents and such and got along really good with them. Summer rolls along and in June she brings up marriage. We had been seeing each for almost a year. We agreed and talked about it. Ideas and thoughts. I was shocked. But i went with it. I only saw her a few times in the summer. I knew something was up. I didn't like her ex. And this is where she became somewhat sorta distant.She was in summer school.But how hard is it to see someone you say you love? I would get texts here and there. Some days would go by without a text or call. We still saw each other at work. I didn't understand why. Then sometimes out of the blue i would get a random text that says i've been thinking about you.I love you. stuff like that.

The Fall rolls around and I begin to notice she starts talking to this other guy. I knew something was up. I confronted her about it. And at work she thinks she is invisible to everyone except him and I.  My last relationship ended with me being cheated on. I knew with this girl i wasn't going to give up on her. I had repeatedly told her that i will never give up on her. I wasn't ok with this.I told her i wanted to put our relationship on Facebook but she didn't want people knowing her private life.I felt this will tell people if we do this that.She's with me and would clear the air and set boundaries.She wouldn't. Her mom come to find out still thinks she's a virgin doesn't know all the things she's done.Smoke pot,etc.   The semester went by and more red flags were popping up. So i'm getting more and more frustrated and depressed.People can start to tell i'm changing and i didn't like this guy.Him and i would always be eying each other at work. I finally decided to confront the guy. I knew him for quite awhile he was a bit younger but him and i were cool.

We met up and i explained to him everything that was happening. And he told me she was making up stories on her end.Making excuses on her end about me. Things that weren't true. She was cheating on me with this guy. Pitting us against each other and such. Backstory on this other guy.He was in his first real relationship when his girlfriend broke up with him because he wasn't spending enough time with him. Come to find out she ended up getting pregnant shortly after or before they broke up. So he was down in the dumps about that.We decided that if she was playing us both,she was prolly doing it to others as well. I found out that night that she moved in with this guy back in august.This was January  when we talked.  this guy was a good guy,he felt bad he did it. But he never would have done it if he would have known.  

I'm so low right now at this point. This girl knew how bad my ex had treated me and she know wasn't any better than her.

So at this point we team up and decide to confront her about these things. I would try to get her to come over and he would with her.We almost got her but decided to meet up and text her both at the same time and tell her we knew what she was doing.I also was a little worried about this guy screwing me over and trying to go out with her. He assured me over and over he wouldn't.

She would tell him i never meant anything and such.Like she wishes she never would have met me.Stuff like that. She went on to say things to me. You call this a relationship? I did because i never did anything wrong and she said  i can't talk to you anymore.I'll talk to you tommorrow. I was stunned and didn't know what to think. I think she was only trying to say things to cover her butt.

After all this happened i didn't see her for 3 weeks.She tried obviously avoiding me.a week after everything happened Her mom came in to pick up her check.I hadn't seen her mom in a while. And I was so upset and lost at this point and her mom was like no hug?. I wanted to shed tears and have her look into my eyes.If you only knew what your daughter is doing.I was short and hollow. I was only around her for a minute but it lasted forever.      Over the 3 weeks she would text me and such and never have the guts to talk to me or meet me in person. Power over text right?  I'm talking to her and stuff. Still trying to get her to meet with me and talk. This went on for a couple of weeks. Then one night i get a usual text from her.I didn't answer and then the next day she sends one in the day. then another one a few hours later. I go on the rest of the day without responding. By night she had sent another one. She within 3 hours had called me 3 times and left a voicemail.  That was 4 texts 3 calls and a 1 voicemail. Is this her freaking out fearing abandonment? I decided to text her back and say you can't miss someone you don't care about.

I get a text the next day that said she cared and such more stuff. I told her we need to talk and we finally agreed to meet on a time. Once again she makes up excuses. Homework.She was sick. Her being sick was true,it was pneumonia.    So a week ago. I decided to call her mom and decide to apologize for being short and cold. She said it was ok. I asked her if her daughter was living with this guy. She told me yeah she is. I told her you know there isn't much i wouldn't do for your daughter and i care about her alot. She said yes i know. Your a sweet man. She went on to say.It's best your her friend. She doesn't have alot of friends.   She continued on and said i gotta let go and let her leave the nest eventually. She tells me she wasn't a huge fan of this guy. Which i knew already.I was thinking about blowing it up and telling her everything her daughter has been doing. For all i know her daughter could have said something completely untrue about me and her mom could believe it.

She asked me if i wanted to tell her about the conversation we had. I go i don't think it's a good idea. Which i knew at some point her mom would say something.She hasn't responded to me since. Which makes me think she's avoiding me because her mom told her something.She hasn't tried contacting me.


Which brings me to this. Does she possess borderline/narcisstic qualities?

Her are the reasons I think so.

She has some background trauma from her past.

She is wreckless with things in her life. Sex,Pot

She fears abandonment. (She tells me everyone leaves her life,And when we first started hang out she goes most people leave me.)

She has been with girls.I don't know if this is a trait.

She won't admit she's in the wrong only when it involves me not talking to her anymore.This has happened twice in the year and a half since we've been together.

I'm sure there are some others but these are the ones off the top of my head.

Narcissistic Qualities

She lacks empathy. For me.


I have been doing alot of research on Bpd a little on Narcissism.I have learned about object constancy and splitting and and such. I almost certain she has this. Which has brought me here to you good people. I am very curious on your thoughts as to why she is doing this.  I have some questions of my own.

Does she have BPD?

Why is she with her ex? Because she's been through so much with this guy? Or the fact she can control him? Or he's a bad boy?

Does she actually care and love me?

Is she splitting me?Because she knows i know?

Why is she doing this to me? The best thing in terms of a guy to her. Is it because of all the messed up stuff that has happened and she only knows how to be treated bad?

During all this.I'm paranoid of the other guy Because he's friends with her still. I use to be bright and chipper at work.But now after all this has happened. i try avoiding everyone and have become a loner.I think everyone knows. But at this point i felt like i'm the boy who cried wolf. Like i'm a psycho or something.How can anyone be ok with talking to her after all this happened.Seriously why am i being shut out in the cold like this? I'm not ok with this.

How can the bad overcome the good. How am i suppose to just walk away from this? How can she just not care about me and not talk to me?  What does she get from her mom telling that i called?   Should i tell her mom what's been going on with her? Does she hate me?

Has she cut me out for good?

I want to thank you all for reading this and hope to hear positive responses and good answers so i can become sane again.

[Anomaly1]

This is a bit of a long story

 I met a girl at my work. She is 19 and i'm 28. I know she is young. I looked at it like age doesn't matter.People do it. I found out her mom drank when she was little and what she told me she was touched by her dad. Needless to say she doesn't like her parents. They weren't there for her. When she was in High School. Her Parents took in this guy whose foster parents kicked him out. They went out for 4 years. When i met her she graduated high school and this guy left for a school a hour or so away. This guy is a real winner. He's stolen and got into trouble with the law a real loser. This guy is a joke.He doesn't have a car and can't even pay for anything.  Her and i started dating and everything was fine. A few months later this guy moved back and her and i were in school. I of course wanted to see her and didn't get to see her as much as i would like. We would see each other but it wasn't enough. She talked about her ex both good and bad.Throughout the time of being together She would rag on him and then bring him up at random times. I took her out to restaurants and treated her amazing... . Like a women should be treated. She had never been treated like this before.

 I met her parents and such and got along really good with them. Summer rolls along and in June she brings up marriage. We had been seeing each for almost a year. We agreed and talked about it. Ideas and thoughts. I was shocked. But i went with it. I only saw her a few times in the summer. I knew something was up. I didn't like her ex. And this is where she became somewhat sorta distant.She was in summer school.But how hard is it to see someone you say you love? I would get texts here and there. Some days would go by without a text or call. We still saw each other at work. I didn't understand why. Then sometimes out of the blue i would get a random text that says i've been thinking about you.I love you. stuff like that.

The Fall rolls around and I begin to notice she starts talking to this other guy. I knew something was up. I confronted her about it. And at work she thinks she is invisible to everyone except him and I.  My last relationship ended with me being cheated on. I knew with this girl i wasn't going to give up on her. I had repeatedly told her that i will never give up on her. I wasn't ok with this.I told her i wanted to put our relationship on Facebook but she didn't want people knowing her private life.I felt this will tell people if we do this that.She's with me and would clear the air and set boundaries.She wouldn't. Her mom come to find out still thinks she's a virgin doesn't know all the things she's done.Smoke pot,etc.   The semester went by and more red flags were popping up. So i'm getting more and more frustrated and depressed.People can start to tell i'm changing and i didn't like this guy.Him and i would always be eying each other at work. I finally decided to confront the guy. I knew him for quite awhile he was a bit younger but him and i were cool.

We met up and i explained to him everything that was happening. And he told me she was making up stories on her end.Making excuses on her end about me. Things that weren't true. She was cheating on me with this guy. Pitting us against each other and such. Backstory on this other guy.He was in his first real relationship when his girlfriend broke up with him because he wasn't spending enough time with him. Come to find out she ended up getting pregnant shortly after or before they broke up. So he was down in the dumps about that.We decided that if she was playing us both,she was prolly doing it to others as well. I found out that night that she moved in with this guy back in august.This was January  when we talked.  this guy was a good guy,he felt bad he did it. But he never would have done it if he would have known.  

I'm so low right now at this point. This girl knew how bad my ex had treated me and she know wasn't any better than her.

So at this point we team up and decide to confront her about these things. I would try to get her to come over and he would with her.We almost got her but decided to meet up and text her both at the same time and tell her we knew what she was doing.I also was a little worried about this guy screwing me over and trying to go out with her. He assured me over and over he wouldn't.

She would tell him i never meant anything and such.Like she wishes she never would have met me.Stuff like that. She went on to say things to me. You call this a relationship? I did because i never did anything wrong and she said  i can't talk to you anymore.I'll talk to you tommorrow. I was stunned and didn't know what to think. I think she was only trying to say things to cover her butt.

After all this happened i didn't see her for 3 weeks.She tried obviously avoiding me.a week after everything happened Her mom came in to pick up her check.I hadn't seen her mom in a while. And I was so upset and lost at this point and her mom was like no hug?. I wanted to shed tears and have her look into my eyes.If you only knew what your daughter is doing.I was short and hollow. I was only around her for a minute but it lasted forever.      Over the 3 weeks she would text me and such and never have the guts to talk to me or meet me in person. Power over text right?  I'm talking to her and stuff. Still trying to get her to meet with me and talk. This went on for a couple of weeks. Then one night i get a usual text from her.I didn't answer and then the next day she sends one in the day. then another one a few hours later. I go on the rest of the day without responding. By night she had sent another one. She within 3 hours had called me 3 times and left a voicemail.  That was 4 texts 3 calls and a 1 voicemail. Is this her freaking out fearing abandonment? I decided to text her back and say you can't miss someone you don't care about.

I get a text the next day that said she cared and such more stuff. I told her we need to talk and we finally agreed to meet on a time. Once again she makes up excuses. Homework.She was sick. Her being sick was true,it was pneumonia.    So a week ago. I decided to call her mom and decide to apologize for being short and cold. She said it was ok. I asked her if her daughter was living with this guy. She told me yeah she is. I told her you know there isn't much i wouldn't do for your daughter and i care about her alot. She said yes i know. Your a sweet man. She went on to say.It's best your her friend. She doesn't have alot of friends.   She continued on and said i gotta let go and let her leave the nest eventually. She tells me she wasn't a huge fan of this guy. Which i knew already.I was thinking about blowing it up and telling her everything her daughter has been doing. For all i know her daughter could have said something completely untrue about me and her mom could believe it.

She asked me if i wanted to tell her about the conversation we had. I go i don't think it's a good idea. Which i knew at some point her mom would say something.She hasn't responded to me since. Which makes me think she's avoiding me because her mom told her something.She hasn't tried contacting me.


Which brings me to this. Does she possess borderline/narcisstic qualities?

Her are the reasons I think so.

She has some background trauma from her past.

She is wreckless with things in her life. Sex,Pot

She fears abandonment. (She tells me everyone leaves her life,And when we first started hang out she goes most people leave me.)

She has been with girls.I don't know if this is a trait.

She won't admit she's in the wrong only when it involves me not talking to her anymore.This has happened twice in the year and a half since we've been together.

I'm sure there are some others but these are the ones off the top of my head.

Narcissistic Qualities

She lacks empathy. For me.


I have been doing alot of research on Bpd a little on Narcissism.I have learned about object constancy and splitting and and such. I almost certain she has this. Which has brought me here to you good people. I am very curious on your thoughts as to why she is doing this.  I have some questions of my own.

Does she have BPD?

Why is she with her ex? Because she's been through so much with this guy? Or the fact she can control him? Or he's a bad boy?

Does she actually care and love me?

Is she splitting me?Because she knows i know?

Why is she doing this to me? The best thing in terms of a guy to her. Is it because of all the messed up stuff that has happened and she only knows how to be treated bad?

During all this.I'm paranoid of the other guy Because he's friends with her still. I use to be bright and chipper at work.But now after all this has happened. i try avoiding everyone and have become a loner.I think everyone knows. But at this point i felt like i'm the boy who cried wolf. Like i'm a psycho or something.How can anyone be ok with talking to her after all this happened.Seriously why am i being shut out in the cold like this? I'm not ok with this.

How can the bad overcome the good. How am i suppose to just walk away from this? How can she just not care about me and not talk to me?  What does she get from her mom telling that i called?   Should i tell her mom what's been going on with her? Does she hate me?

Has she cut me out for good?

I want to thank you all for reading this and hope to hear positive responses and good answers so i can become sane again.

[Turkish]

Hi Anomaly1 

Thanks for sharing your story. It sounds like you've processed a lot through what is a very confusing and frustrating situation. Even more so due to her Triangulation you with another guy. A lack of empathy is certainly a narc trait, but it also is typical of a BPD. Think of them through the lens of a 3 year old and it makes a little more sense, since that is around the age where the attachment disorder begins. Here are some links that may help process your diagnosis:

BPD: What is it? How can I tell?

The Symptoms and Diagnosis of Borderline Personality Disorder [NEW]

What is the relationship between BPD and narcissism (NPD)?

How a Borderline Personality Disorder Love Relationship Evolves

Keep in mind that aside from the few professional members here, we are all armchair therapists. Focusing on the disorder helps us understand many issues in our relationships (and us as well), but in the end, the behaviors are what counts. The behaviors are what hurt us. And in reality, the DSM labels are really just groupings of specific behaviors.

As for her, do you think she is going to split you white again and try to recycle you? That whole push-pull cycle is incredibly frustrating (mine started it from our first date,  ). I'm glad you are here and we have a lot of information to help you sort through what's going on. I look forward to be hearing more from you.

Take Care,

Turkish

[Turkish]

Hi again... . one thing I forgot to add is that I would not tell her mom. Her mom is probably aware of a lot anyway, and has probably enabled a lot of her behaviors. Denial is a powerful drug, and you may just cause her mom more pain. There is no fixing your gf... . the only person you can fix or change is yourself.

[Anomaly1]

I didn't think it was my place. But how is she ok with this?

[Turkish]

I didn't think it was my place. But how is she ok with this?

Are you talking about her mother, or her? If about her mother, ,the dysfunctional coping behaviors may be in full effect.

[Anomaly1]

What did you think about what i wrote? Do you think she has BPD? What's going through her head right now? Why is she acting this way?

[Turkish]

What did you think about what i wrote? Do you think she has BPD? What's going through her head right now? Why is she acting this way?

I'd say your assessment is more than likely correct. We all found this site for a reason. Here is some info on the BPD mind if it helps you understand, and we can go crazy trying to understand the disordered mind:

BPD Behaviors: How it feels to have BPD



Do you think she will come back, and would you take her back?

[Anomaly1]

I don't know i'm still trying to figure out what her mom could have told her. Because she never tried talking to me and i avoided her the entire day.Never looking at her and such.

[Turkish]

I don't know i'm still trying to figure out what her mom could have told her. Because she never tried talking to me and i avoided her the entire day.Never looking at her and such.

Hi Anomaly1, how are things going with you now? Have you had a chance to talk to her?

T

[Anomaly1]

Turkish, I had been for the longest time trying to meet up with her. And in my first post. A few weeks ago I decided to call her mom and ask her if she's moved out.Which she did with her ex. Who is a poor excuse for a human being.This guy was born to fail.I said cause she's been acting different towards me. Anyways I told her how much i care about her and all.I would do anything for her. Her mom said yes she knew. Said she wasn't a huge fan of this guy. I ended the conversation.

Her mom told me she wouldn't tell her.But I think she did because she hasn't tried texting or trying to get my attention. It's the first time this has happened. I ran into her at work. I didn't speak or talk to her. I'm sure she's looked at me a few times the other day. But Nothing. Silence.   

Has She painted me "Black" Or is embarassed to face the truth? She's left me hurting. What do you think it is?

[Turkish]

Turkish, I had been for the longest time trying to meet up with her. And in my first post. A few weeks ago I decided to call her mom and ask her if she's moved out.Which she did with her ex. Who is a poor excuse for a human being.This guy was born to fail.I said cause she's been acting different towards me. Anyways I told her how much i care about her and all.I would do anything for her. Her mom said yes she knew. Said she wasn't a huge fan of this guy. I ended the conversation.

Her mom told me she wouldn't tell her.But I think she did because she hasn't tried texting or trying to get my attention. It's the first time this has happened. I ran into her at work. I didn't speak or talk to her. I'm sure she's looked at me a few times the other day. But Nothing. Silence.   

Has She painted me "Black" Or is embarassed to face the truth? She's left me hurting. What do you think it is?

Hi Anomaly1, thanks for reporting back. Painting you black, looks like it. It may or may not be permanent, as BPDs often tend to "recycle" the ones they once felt safe with. Many members here have been recycled many times (going back, leaving, going back). A few never get recycled. Mine did it to me (more correctly, to each other) once in Year 1. The embarassment, perhaps, but more like toxic shame which has more to do with her than with you. Painting you black, or the silent treatment is a dysfunctional coping mechanism that enables them to not face their own emotions, which they feel more severly than we nons.

Perhaps you can read this article on the 10 beliefs that can get us stuck to help you understand what they think when a relationship ends, regardless if she re-engages with you (I can't say, each person is a little different).

Keep in mind that she may contact you again, and you will have to decide what to do at that point, and how to best re-engage with her. With a pwBPD, however, there are no guarantees. In the meantime, I encourage you to share you story and your thoughts on the Disengaging Board, as senior members there have gone through similar relationships and have similar feelings that you are experiencing now. We can help you work though them.

Take Care,

Turkish

[fromheeltoheal]

Hi Anomaly-

You sound a little overwhelmed by your situation, and I'm sorry you're going through that.

Interesting, the first time I was with my borderline ex she was 19 and I was 26.  I had no clue at the time, and it took until round two 25 years later, more pain, and then learning a lot about the disorder to understand what the hell was going on.  You've got a lot of questions, so I figure you can relate.

It's hard to tell if someone that young is actually disordered or is just standard-issue 19 year old craziness.  Most girls I knew at that age had 'experimented' with other girls and that's too young to be monogamous for both men and women, it's a time of exploration and experience, but hey, that was just my world.  I recommend you read all of the articles on this site to see if they lend greater understanding to your situation.

The diagnosis doesn't really matter though, and we can't formally diagnose anyway, but if you do see an echo of your girl in these pages it will help you gain understanding and feel not alone, important things as you heal.  You guys work together and that may make it difficult, but it sounds like you're not together now.  What would labeling BPD give you?

[Anomaly1]

I think it's the idea that everyone is dismissing it as she cheated on me. But hearing everything and seeing her behavior has brought me here. I truly think it is something because she displays these BPD traits

1. Wreckless Behavior - Sex. she cheated on me with a guy i work with.He didn't even know she was with me.She lied about it.Her also experimenting with girls too at a young age.  Pot/Drinking- she's been smoking and drinking.

2. Abandonment - She has said and brought up stories of people leaving her life.

3. Lying - She has lied about a guy who did things to her.When i very well know he never did.

4. Cheating - Self explantory

5. Denial - She won't own up to what she's done to me

6. Trauma - She has had trauma from her past. Her mom drank when she was little and her dad she said has touched her. She started smoking and drinking at a young age.

She has mirrored me and split me. Numerous times. After I contacted her mom.She hasn't even tried speaking with me for what i assume is her not wanting to confront what she's doing and right now she has painted me black?She won't even talk to me.    Thoughts ideas? IS she going to try to contact me.

  For me to know she has BPD. Will help me get on with my life. She obviously isn't in that stage where she wants to listen to people. I'm so sure it's BPD. And the sad thing is i seem to be the only one who cares.I think her parents are just whatever and they know how i feel about her. She lives with a pathetic excuse for a boyfriend. This guy doesn't even have a car and spends all her money.

[Anomaly1]

Turkish, Does her eventually seeing me her way of facing me? Especially if it's through text and her never willing to meet me face to face? And when she does leave work. Does me being out of sight out of mind really go into effect. Alot of people that i have talked to have said that she probably won't delete my number.    She doesn't want to admit she's lost.Hence why she will keep it. And she has told me she's not ok with this. What's gone on between us. IS that her saying that to say it along with her saying i hate giving up on this?   Your thoughts on this because that is really driving me wild.

I appreciate the kind support.

[Skip]

For me to know she has BPD. Will help me get on with my life. She obviously isn't in that stage where she wants to listen to people. I'm so sure it's BPD. And the sad thing is i seem to be the only one who cares.I think her parents are just whatever and they know how i feel about her. She lives with a pathetic excuse for a boyfriend. This guy doesn't even have a car and spends all her money.

Anomaly1, you are flooded right now - emotionally overloaded.  It's OK, many of us have been there.

It's going to take a while to work through this - and there is a lot to work through - there is no miracle cure for the broken heart you have right now.

We'll talk to you 24/7.  Stay with you as log as it takes.

You think we're not hearing you - but we are.  We've been there and worked through everything you are going to work through.

Is she BPD?  Will knowing that ease the pain?

1. Is she BPD?  She sounds like she may have some BPD traits - but BPD is a spectrum disorder and she sounds like she might on lower end of the spectrum.  But it may not be BPD at all - it could simply be emotional immaturity - she's 19.  Or it could simly be that she never let go of the first guy.

If you a real answer, watch this video. This is a world exert answering questions like what is the difference betwen teenage behavior and BPD.

https://bpdfamily.blogspot.com/2013/05/bpdfamily.html

2. Will knowing she has BPD ease the pain?  Probably not.  We have hundreds coming here that hope - I can't think of one case where it stopped  the pain of a broken heart.  Including my own.

We hear you.  But we can't tell you what you want to hear as you are looking for simple answers to very complex questions.

One day at a time.

[Anomaly1]

If this isn't BPD but emotional immaturity. I don't understand how someone can cheat on another person and hide it behind their back and treat somebody like they don't matter or dead to them at the drop of a hat.

And if she has painted me this horrible terrible person.Will she contact me down the road? Realizing whatever she's chasing isn't worth it? And i was right all along and maybe she will face whatever demons are inside her?

[Skip]

If this isn't BPD but emotional immaturity. I don't understand how someone can cheat on another person and hide it behind their back and treat somebody like they don't matter or dead to them at the drop of a hat.

19 year old girls do this sometimes.  Older women and men too.  

And if she has painted me this horrible terrible person.Will she contact me down the road? Realizing whatever she's chasing isn't worth it? And i was right all along and maybe she will face whatever demons are inside her?

She's got a lot of years invested in her old boyfriend.  She obviously sees something there.  She's not finished with him.  But even if she does decide he is not worth it - that doesn't mean she is coming back to you.

You are thinking that everything was great and suddenly it changed and that the change is related to mental illness.  But you most likely have a role in this too.  Something wasn't working for her.  :)id stalking her at school make her made?  That's all on you.

Look, this is really hard.  You love her.  That's a beautiful thing.  And when someone you love steps away - wow - crisis.

Did you watch the video?  If not, OK.

Does any of this sound like what you are going through?

1: SHATTERING - Your relationship is breaking apart. Your hopes and dreams are Shattered. You are devastated, bewildered. You succumb to despair and panic. You feel hopeless feelings. You feel Symbiotically attached to your lost love, mortally wounded, as if you’ll die without them. You are in Severe pain, Shock, Sorrow. You’ve been Severed from your primary attachment. You’re cut off from your emotional life-line.

[Anomaly1]

I am watching the video. I've never stalked her in anyway. I only see her at work.  Why would she cheat on me with a guy.Then cheat on him with me and then cheat on us both with her ex.?

Signs of a Borderline? She jumps from guy to guy fear of abandonment right?    In the year and a half. All i did was walk the straight and narrow for this girl. She has been throwing excuses at me why she did what she did. It's an excuse because she doesn't want to face what she's done.

Signs of a borderline?   

Now she won't even talk to me paint me black?She acts like nothing is wrong.

I don't know what she sees in her ex. The guy does drugs.Can't even pass his classes,trouble with the law.uses her money. I'm distraught because she's pretended like everything is fine. It took me and another guy to confront her about it.

[Anomaly1]

And on top of this.I've done more than this guy ever has for her. All she has done is lie and try to mirror me just tell me what i want to hear.

[fromheeltoheal]

If she has a personality disorder, you get to say you're right and she's wrong, validating.  That would explain everything, and gets you off the hook, it doesn't mean that other guy is better than you, it means she's sick.  Any of that ring true?

For me what you've described could be someone with a disordered personality, or it could be a young girl screwing around and partying; honestly it can be very difficult to tell at that age.  But it still doesn't matter, other than you are in mental and emotional turmoil over it.  Better to focus on you a little: is this girl going to meet your needs?  :)o you trust her?  :)oes she respect you?  :)oes she show you she cares about you?  Answer those questions truthfully to yourself and then act accordingly.  Make it about you, she isn't.

[Turkish]

And on top of this.I've done more than this guy ever has for her. All she has done is lie and try to mirror me just tell me what i want to hear.

I  feel you dude. I made a home,  bought ( well, a  huge down payment that I ended up losing) her a $37k suv  two weeks before she told me we are done,  then I  found out about her affair.  got her through severe depression  no bf  before me ever did,  encouraged peace between her and her family,  took care of our kids while she went out and played teenager ( she's in her early 30s),  and runs of other stuff ( like two beautiful children  and  being a  mature,  responsible father) in the end,  it wasn't enough.  she ran to a  guy about your age,  who isn't half as together as you sound, nor close to how together I  was at the same age (I'm in my early 40s). I  triggered her,  and she ran to someone who provided something to her that I  didn't,  or  stopped doing.  on the surface,  it's utterly nonsensical,  but then a  disorderedperson doesn't think like one who is not.  their feelings are real... .  to them,  no matter how illogical they might seem.

add a  little over a  decade to  her age,  and  about two to yours,  and you and yours could be  me and my uBPD (who was diagnosed with depression  three years into our r/s,  but I  didn't need that dX  to validate what we were going through).

As for your other question, I  can't say if she will contact you or not.  we can help you sort through your feelings  either way and give you clarity in perhaps what is going in if she does.

[Skip]

Anomaly1,

If I went through what you went through, I'd be really upset, too.  Cheating is a huge betrayal.

You didn't deserve that.

Skip

[Anomaly1]

Turkish - that's really rough. My question is do you know is she's truly happy with this guy? I'm not trying to press but what is that inspired her to do so. Cause obviously your sound. And she isn't. Mine even brought up marriage and then when she was seeing this guy behind my back she would tell him i brought up marriage and that i proposed obviously lying about it. What gives?

I'm wondering if things would be different though in all of this if her mom knew. It's like her parents don't even know what she does.She told me her parents would kill her if they knew what's going on. But if even they knew what she's done to me.

Would she just say to her mom.Yeah,he stopped talking to me.And write me off as someone else in this world who shared moments with her.  This guy she's living with for life of me is a thug. I don't honestly know how this could possibly work out between the two unless she wants to be married in jail. 

Skip- I agree cheating is a huge betrayal,because my last girlfriend cheated on me as well. Which my ex knows.She knows exactly what she did to me. I knew for awhile there were some red flags raised as to her behavior but i was patient and played my card when the time was right.  I called her out on times when we were suppose to hang out.Even showing her the texts she sent. And all i get was sorry. She can text me but meeting me is out of the question.  I take it that her form of texting is a form of something she can control?  Like when I decided to not answer her texts and i got 6 texts 3 calls and 1 voicemail in one day. Her way of losing control?   Yet she'll say things like i need to know what's going on with us because i need to move on with my life.  This right here is a prime example of her being maniupulative and trying to use that and my heart to shove her weight around.   Stuff like this with what i also wrote makes me believe she has BPD or something else judging but what you guys have said.If i can't save her.I need to know what it is. Truly know so i can walk away from this. 

In all of this,I feel like i'm the boy who cried wolf. I am a one man army fighting something,Nobody seems to give a damn about or turns a blind eye to. This includes her family and friends around us that we work with. I wonder though would her parents still ask me to be a friend to her knowing what she's  done with me? Sometimes i wish i would run into her mom so she could see the pain in my eyes, And i could look at her and say these things.

[Skip]

Are you thinking that if the truth is that she has BPD, everyone around her will try to bring hr back to you - she will see the error of her ways?

[Anomaly1]

I'm trying to get her help because she honestly wasn't like this when her ex was around. She truly wasn't . I can't imagine how this girl is so ok with this. When she has said she's not ok with it. I don't know if that's mirroring or not but.  But i'm a used tissue at this point. She won't talk to me or acknowledge me.Prolly because of me knowing the truth about it all. I'm assuming she's just going to go down this downward spiral of being like she is until she hits rock bottom?

How can she be so blind to all this and not acknowledge how selfish and heartless she's acting. 

[Turkish]

Turkish - that's really rough. My question is do you know is she's truly happy with this guy? I'm not trying to press but what is that inspired her to do so. Cause obviously your sound. And she isn't. Mine even brought up marriage and then when she was seeing this guy behind my back she would tell him i brought up marriage and that i proposed obviously lying about it. What gives?

I'm wondering if things would be different though in all of this if her mom knew. It's like her parents don't even know what she does.She told me her parents would kill her if they knew what's going on. But if even they knew what she's done to me.

Would she just say to her mom.Yeah,he stopped talking to me.And write me off as someone else in this world who shared moments with her.  This guy she's living with for life of me is a thug. I don't honestly know how this could possibly work out between the two unless she wants to be married in jail. 

Skip- I agree cheating is a huge betrayal,because my last girlfriend cheated on me as well. Which my ex knows.She knows exactly what she did to me. I knew for awhile there were some red flags raised as to her behavior but i was patient and played my card when the time was right.  I called her out on times when we were suppose to hang out.Even showing her the texts she sent. And all i get was sorry. She can text me but meeting me is out of the question.  I take it that her form of texting is a form of something she can control?  Like when I decided to not answer her texts and i got 6 texts 3 calls and 1 voicemail in one day. Her way of losing control?   Yet she'll say things like i need to know what's going on with us because i need to move on with my life.  This right here is a prime example of her being maniupulative and trying to use that and my heart to shove her weight around.   Stuff like this with what i also wrote makes me believe she has BPD or something else judging but what you guys have said.If i can't save her.I need to know what it is. Truly know so i can walk away from this. 

In all of this,I feel like i'm the boy who cried wolf. I am a one man army fighting something,Nobody seems to give a damn about or turns a blind eye to. This includes her family and friends around us that we work with. I wonder though would her parents still ask me to be a friend to her knowing what she's  done with me? Sometimes i wish i would run into her mom so she could see the pain in my eyes, And i could look at her and say these things.

Anomaly1, she may be happier now, but that is on the surface. And who are we to judge another's happiness? What is happiness to us, may be different to them. I'm sure mine is happier now with her boy toy. I know what lies beneath, though, and no one ever will ever know her as well as I do.

I triggered her core unhappiness with herself, and she bolted. I like to think, "if it wasn't me, it would have been someone else. If not her boy toy, then another." She is soothing now to cover up the feelings of core shame with herself. Though we triggered, it ultimately has nothing to do with us.

As for telling her mother... . One, her family may have enabled her bad behaviors. Two, and more likely, this is her daughter, and legally an adult. What can a mother do?

The father of mine is a serial cheater, My uBPDx even caught her dad in bed with another woman when she was a little girl. About a year ago, he again got caught with a "kept" woman, and it was no shortage of pain to the whole family. I supported well. It was terrible... . but they know their dad. That is why the affair hit me out of left field. After I found out, I "forced" her to go tell her mom this was why she was leaving me. I was so pissed about it, also because she hurt not only me (and our children, though they are too young to understand), but also her family and her mother. How could she do this? I HATE lying, just hate it. She told her mom a day later. She told me her whole family was crying over it (probably not her suspected uBPD dad, hard to tell what is going on with him). Even two months later, she said her mom vacillated from day to day saying "you're my daughter, and I love and support you" to almost yelling at her "why don't you just work it out?"

No matter. My x, though older than your gf, but like my x, is still an individual and an adult responsible for both her own decisions and is capable of making them. I was, and am still "in" with her family, too. It never made a difference, and will never make a difference. It is about them, not us. Their feelings and decisions. We can't control them, we can only control ourselves and our own decisions. Hell, I have trouble enough "controlling" my S4 and D1 kids. How much harder can it be to control a person with the intellect and body of an adult, but who may have the emotional maturity of a little girl? We can't. No one can. Resistance is futile.

As for the texting... . yes, I agree with you that it is a form of control. How can you take back control?

[Turkish]

I'm trying to get her help because she honestly wasn't like this when her ex was around. She truly wasn't . I can't imagine how this girl is so ok with this. When she has said she's not ok with it. I don't know if that's mirroring or not but.  But i'm a used tissue at this point. She won't talk to me or acknowledge me.Prolly because of me knowing the truth about it all. I'm assuming she's just going to go down this downward spiral of being like she is until she hits rock bottom?

How can she be so blind to all this and not acknowledge how selfish and heartless she's acting. 

Your gf is what, 19? Mine is in her early 30s and a pretty successful woman on the surface. Taking responsibility pretty much like politicians say they take responsibility, which is that they don't. Mine said she took responsibility for her "mistake" as she calls it, but proceeded to carry out falling in love (need) with her boy-toy while she was living in my house pretty much expense free for the past four months... . ( having kids and custody issues complicate matters, I would have loved nothing better than to have put her stuff on the lawn and burned it) and I was painfully aware of it all as it was going on real time.

[Anomaly1]

The only way i can think of taking control back is to not talk to her. Deep down she has to know why i'm not trying to talk to her. IS her not talking to me a sign of a disorder or her being emotional immature and her facing it when she chooses to. Why is she feeding me what i want to hear?She's even told me that everyone leaves her. Does she even comprehend it's her whose doing it?   Does she know what love is? And yes when i didn't respond to her texts and calls she freaked out and left a voicemail.She's only done it once. Maybe she realizes she's gone as far as she can go and tossed me out for someone else, who doesn't know her. I still don't know how to act around my work peers.All they see if pain and sadness in me. But i don't even want to be around them or talk to them. I feel in a way broken and just want to be a hermit so to say.

[Turkish]

The only way i can think of taking control back is to not talk to her. Deep down she has to know why i'm not trying to talk to her. IS her not talking to me a sign of a disorder or her being emotional immature and her facing it when she chooses to. Why is she feeding me what i want to hear?She's even told me that everyone leaves her. Does she even comprehend it's her whose doing it?   :)oes she know what love is? And yes when i didn't respond to her texts and calls she freaked out and left a voicemail.She's only done it once. Maybe she realizes she's gone as far as she can go and tossed me out for someone else, who doesn't know her. I still don't know how to act around my work peers.All they see if pain and sadness in me. But i don't even want to be around them or talk to them. I feel in a way broken and just want to be a hermit so to say.

That is it, "no contact" (NC). Be prepared, however, for desperate attempts and escalations on her side. That is what may happen, and you want to be prepared for how you respond (or don't). Sound like you are already at that point.

Does she know what love is... . I've been there with mine, and she could only point to the fairy take definition as a response, though she cried when I read her the chapter on unconditional love from The Love Dare book. Admitted I showed her unconditional love after I found out about her paramour, but it made no difference... . do you know what love is? I can say, but I don't know. So confusing and disorienting a r/s with a BPD or other PD is, or even enough with a non! If I didn't have kids with mne, I might feel like joining a monastic order. I was pretty much a hermit before I met her, so now I don't know... . those feelings are natural, but are they healthy? At this point, maybe not the question to answer, but maybe to file for later... .

[Anomaly1]

Wouldn't i already see attempts and escalations from her?I mean it's been over a week since i've talked to her. I mean would it be out of the ordinary in 6months? a year? etc. But that may not even be the case. Out of sight out of mind right?

I still don't know what she means by she isn't ok with any of this? Just a line? The only thing that i would say to her is to get help and i would consider trying.

I can see how your situation is hard because of having kids.It's like it bridges that gap. I assume you two don't stay in touch? Does she pull that crap with this other guy?

[Turkish]

Wouldn't i already see attempts and escalations from her?I mean it's been over a week since i've talked to her. I mean would it be out of the ordinary in 6months? a year? etc. But that may not even be the case. Out of sight out of mind right?

Hi Anomaly1, I can't say. Some nons here have been contacted out of the blue after 6 months or more. They fall back to that which was safe when they are in need of soothing. Some recycle, some just feel like their Exes are just torturing them to get that BPD validation. I can see you are torn up about this, like "what's coming next? When will it come?" But you can only wait and see and then deal with it then. Yes, out of sight, out of mind... . for now. That's the "object constancy", the child-like attachment with pwBPD. If they are strongly attached, the need to validate that you are there when not physically present. Mine even felt abandoned when I would go into the other room to read.

I still don't know what she means by she isn't ok with any of this? Just a line? The only thing that i would say to her is to get help and i would consider trying.

She has to want to get help. It would take a very mature and self aware pwBPD to get to that point. We see them occasionally, post here. Mine is very high functioning, WANTS to get help, couldn't do it with me because she felt I threw her "sickness" (a word I never used with her) in her face. More like being with me was a constant trigger of her bad feelings. Now she is soothing, and will cut back on her therapy a lot. It was her pattern with me with her depressions. She told me her T told her to NOT leave me, that it wasn't the right thing to just run (I'm sure it was said more gently, but this is what my Ex told me). She did it anyway. She fancies herself a wise woman "of character" but as my T said, she has made one unwise decision after another. And there was no use talking to her about such things (as I tried to do to save our r/s back in October), because she wouldn't hear them.

For pwBPD, we like to say around here that "feelings are not facts." For a pwBPD, feelings are facts. When feelings become facts, reality becomes an illusion, and the truth, a lie. That is the horror of suffering with BPD. The same emotions we feel, they feel, but theirs are so much more intense (hence the love/hate), and they also can't control them.

I can see how your situation is hard because of having kids.It's like it bridges that gap. I assume you two don't stay in touch? Does she pull that crap with this other guy?

We check in with the kids once/night to say goodnight. I still have a lot of anger towards her (like she got off scott free and I'm left with all of the responsibility and no r/s), but I found it strangely soothing last night to talk to her a few minutes about the kids. And got angry at myself for feeling that way. Her r/s with the other dude was pretty much thrown in my face for the past 4 months she was living in my home. It was torture, and mental abuse. Conversations in the other room with her laughing on the phone, him calling her phone and me seeing his number and name, a few times when she didn't know I saw. The constant texting. She sending me a text meant for him two months ago "Hey Love!... . " etc... . Some here thought she did it on purpose. Some blame the Disorder taking control. I think it may have been that or more likely she was scatter brained. Nothing I can do about that. The good thing is that I realized first, and now she does, that other than the short phone convos (where we each put the other on speaker phone right away to talk to the kids), we might not have to see each other for weeks since we drop off and pick up at the baby sitters.

All in all, she is good at compartmentalizing her life, and will keep it "secret' for a while, though he was on her FB as soon as I blocked her, pretty much, which was three months before she moved out. I got sick of seeing her back handedly devaluing me on FB. I found the whole thing disgusting, and her neglect of the children despicable. Yes, I still have a lot of anger! My anger, other than being mentally and financially abused (and verbally before for almost 6 years) stems more out of me expecting my Ex to be someone she is not. How can I expect someone with the emotional maturity of a child to think like I do? Why would I? I'm still processing this... .

Sorry to make that about myself when I should be answering you. I don';t know if you got anything out of that, but I hope so. Our stories here are similar to many, different from others. The underlying factor seems to be BPD, diagnosed or not, and the behaviors associated with them.

[Anomaly1]

   I can see our relationships being the same minus the kids. I really don't think she will stay with him because he is a chain dragging her down. she does have Bi tendancies she is supposedly seeing this girl she comes over to there apartment. I don't know if it's true or not. But honestly in 3 years down the road will it even matter? Or is it all her trying to find herself. Another Borderline trait.   I had a situation with her. Where i was trying to talk to her about coming over and talk about things.        And she responded with BE thankful for what you have.

Now that was before i confronted her about the cheating.  Another thing. Was she just going to cheat and justify herself and not tell me at all and play along like everything is ok?   I would say a majority of people know because of the other guy telling them. 

[Turkish]

   I can see our relationships being the same minus the kids. I really don't think she will stay with him because he is a chain dragging her down. she does have Bi tendancies she is supposedly seeing this girl she comes over to there apartment. I don't know if it's true or not. But honestly in 3 years down the road will it even matter? Or is it all her trying to find herself. Another Borderline trait.

BPD experience emotions more intensely than we do. A PD is a grouping of extreme behaviors out of the distribution. Don't we all try to find ourselves? It's the manner in which we do it which tells others something about us. Or the seemingly desperate need to trumpet to the world that we are, which is validation seeking.

I had a situation with her. Where i was trying to talk to her about coming over and talk about things.        And she responded with BE thankful for what you have.

That's odd. Maybe it was her way of saying, "be thankful for what you had?" It's hard to understand feelings with logic.

Now that was before i confronted her about the cheating.  Another thing. Was she just going to cheat and justify herself and not tell me at all and play along like everything is ok?   I would say a majority of people know because of the other guy telling them. 

I don't know about your last statement. After I confronted mine, and it took seven tries, three tries after me quoting verbatim the text he had sent to her, to admit it. Then she said she didn't mean to hurt me, and that she was going to tell me about it after she had left (really? Why would someone do that?). her thoughts were disordered and all over the place. What is said one day, or felt at one moment, can switch polarity. I saw it play out over months and months. My T said about everything she said, "she is trying to justify the unjustifiable." Betrayal is unjustifiable. Engaging in argument about it is the honey trap of our own feelings needing answers. I've constructed a narrative in my mind of how she justified it, but that is me. Who knows, ultimately, what is going on in their minds?

[Anomaly1]

Is it uncommon for a borderline to justify everything for the reasons they make for what they did? Was and is it that hard for her to just say i don't want to be together? She gave me when i'm with somebody i'm with them for good and i don't like giving up on them?   That right there might be the biggest head scratcher for me. Because she obviously didn't live up to that.  I can see why her trying to throw out every excuse in the book to justify why they did what they did. They do that right?

Were her feelings or were your Bp. feelings so intense that's why she possibly bailed? I feel like it was like she was doing anything to get me to break up with her.So she didn't feel bad. If she does contact is it just to try to see how i am? Like yeah i still live with him but just wanted to see how you were,Like you really care.     

What do you think she meant by this. In the beginning of January she came over to my place.She was talking about how she just wanted to up and leave.Get out where no one knew her. And then she would say and of course i'm taking you with me. 

[fromheeltoheal]

A borderline has an unstable sense of self, meaning who she thinks she is changes on the fly.  That's a result of never having successfully detached from their primary caregiver when in infancy, to become an autonomous individual, so they seek attachments to make themselves 'whole'; an attachment to a borderline is a fusing of two psyches into one person, to create one person, which is also why they can literally feel they don't exist when they're alone.  Think of it like having half a self, which is hard to get your head around initially.

That unstable sense of self makes long term commitments, conflict resolution, and lasting contentment impossible.  Think of it like you're having a conversation with a different person than you were last time you spoke, if any time has elapsed between, and sometimes they can completely change, mood, affect, demeanor, while you're talking to them, based on the emotional content of the conversation.

And since attachments are so important to borderlines, they don't ever like to lose them.  In practice what that looks like is you may show up on her radar at any time as someone who can soothe whatever she's feeling, make her feel better, and she will reach out to see if there's still an attachment there.  It means nothing more than she's trying to feel better in the moment; she isn't aware of the way she's wired, it's all subconscious, and she may be completely sincere one moment, but feel entirely differently the next, which doesn't mean she wasn't sincere to begin with, it means who she thinks she is just changed.

No sense trying to make rational sense of it, and you're the only one who can control how she makes you feel, usually by leaving, unless you have extremely strong boundaries, are a glutton for pain and chaos, and prefer dating emotional children.  :)oesn't sound like you, and you're the only rational one in this paring, if any of the above rings true.

[Anomaly1]

Does she "hate" me that i found out between her and the guy i was working with and we both confronted her for her cheating ways. I'm still sold on the narcissistic ways of having a couple of guys at her disposal.

Or hate me for that fact that she's been lying and i found out everything she's been doing? I think it 's childish and petty she's acting this way.I am rational and have done what any normal adult would do in a relationship.Adult mature thinking.I feel like other people at my work wouldn't understand where i'm coming from with my thinking or this whole personality disorder. It weirds me out knowing that other girls can chat it up with her like nothing is wrong and then later on to have a good night and feel sympathy for me.    Me telling her the only way i will talk to you will be if you talk to someone. But i asked her to go to talk to someone with me .And she later on said she would say the same thing to me that she would to a therapist... . So what's that all about?

[fromheeltoheal]

Does she "hate" me that i found out between her and the guy i was working with and we both confronted her for her cheating ways. I'm still sold on the narcissistic ways of having a couple of guys at her disposal.

Or hate me for that fact that she's been lying and i found out everything she's been doing? I think it 's childish and petty she's acting this way.I am rational and have done what any normal adult would do in a relationship.Adult mature thinking.I feel like other people at my work wouldn't understand where i'm coming from with my thinking or this whole personality disorder. It weirds me out knowing that other girls can chat it up with her like nothing is wrong and then later on to have a good night and feel sympathy for me.    Me telling her the only way i will talk to you will be if you talk to someone. But i asked her to go to talk to someone with me .And she later on said she would say the same thing to me that she would to a therapist... . So what's that all about?

She doesn't hate you, she hates herself.  Or more accurately, you called her on lies, she feels ashamed, so ashamed she can't deal with, so she projects it on you.  The her she hates becomes you, so she hates you, which has nothing to do with you.

You're still trying to think rationally man; gotta let go of the rational.  I recommend you read a bunch on the clinical side of the disorder, and once you start to understand it, you will see just how irrational a borderline is.

Then again, I've known very few teenage girls who are capable of an adult relationship, girls just wanna have fun, and you know her, but maybe you're more emotionally invested in her than she ever was in you just because she's young and not able to 'go there' yet.  I've been in exactly the same spot you are, it hurts a great deal, and assigning a mental illness to someone who is not behaving the way you want or expect feels better, when maybe she's just still a kid screwing around and you got in over your head and tried to assign more to her and the relationship than is possible.  I dunno, you decide, and I haven't read every post in this thread, maybe there's more I don't know.  Take care of you!

[Anomaly1]

She shows many signs heel of BPD traits. Here's what i've experienced since i've been with her.

1. Wreckless Behavior - Sex. she cheated on me with a guy i work with.He didn't even know she was with me.She lied about it.Her also experimenting with girls too at a young age.  Pot/Drinking- she's been smoking and drinking.

2. Abandonment - She has said and brought up stories of people leaving her life.

3. Lying - She has lied about a guy who did things to her.When i very well know he never did.Along with telling lies to me.

4. Cheating - Self explantory

5. Denial - She won't own up to what she's done to me or responsibility for her actions.

6. Trauma - She has had trauma from her past. Her mom drank when she was little and her dad she said has touched her. She started smoking and drinking at a young age.

[fromheeltoheal]

She shows many signs heel of BPD traits. Here's what i've experienced since i've been with her.

1. Wreckless Behavior - Sex. she cheated on me with a guy i work with.He didn't even know she was with me.She lied about it.Her also experimenting with girls too at a young age.  Pot/Drinking- she's been smoking and drinking.

2. Abandonment - She has said and brought up stories of people leaving her life.

3. Lying - She has lied about a guy who did things to her.When i very well know he never did.Along with telling lies to me.

4. Cheating - Self explantory

5. Denial - She won't own up to what she's done to me or responsibility for her actions.

6. Trauma - She has had trauma from her past. Her mom drank when she was little and her dad she said has touched her. She started smoking and drinking at a young age.

Just to play devil's advocate, lots of teens exhibit those behaviors.  Hell, when I was 19 I was having sex with several girls, drank and smoked pot, cheated on my girlfriend, was abandoned by girlfriends, lied and was in denial that anything was wrong.  Plus, my behavior was exactly the same as almost everyone I knew, so in that context nothing was 'wrong', it was what it was and I had a blast.  And I don't have a personality disorder, just some PTSD from my time in borderline hell, so says the professionals.

But again I ask, Why does it matter?

[Anomaly1]

Why does she feel the need to play games? to keep me along? She knew my last ex cheated on me. Why keep trying to text me and keep things at bay.With false things.

[Anomaly1]

Obviously. she is young that could be the cause for the games. This guy has said he would be her friend and she told me he wants nothing to do with her. Lies?  But yet she won't talk to me once i find out all about her.  There's not a possibility of trying to be her friend after what she's done to me.  And in her messed up mind if it's not BPD. I don't know why she would try to contact me down the road. She can't get upset or stay silent because i'm not talking to her.

She brought it upon herself.

[fromheeltoheal]

Why does she feel the need to play games? to keep me along? She knew my last ex cheated on me. Why keep trying to text me and keep things at bay.With false things.

BPD is an attachment disorder, borderlines are terrified of being abandoned and find it difficult to let go of any attachment, so when you pop up on her radar as someone who can soothe her, make her feel better, she'll turn to you.  Young girls, on the other hand, love attention from boys and men, simple as that.  It's up to you to decide where she might be on the spectrum.

Regardless of her mental state, it's up to you to take control of your emotions; she only has as much power as you give her.  You may be strong enough to do that when she's around, or you may need to distance yourself, but it's up to you to fix it, she will take whatever she can get.

[myself]

There's not a possibility of trying to be her friend after what she's done to me.

Sounds like it's time to live your life without her.

[Anomaly1]

She obviously finds me not important anymore. It feels like everything was lie from her. I have a feeling she will get what's coming to her in the end.  Would any of you be able to be her friend after something like this? No wonder she doesn't have any friends. Have any of you gotten positive responses by actually by breaking no contact? Or ran into them down the road?

[fromheeltoheal]

She obviously finds me not important anymore. It feels like everything was lie from her. I have a feeling she will get what's coming to her in the end.  Would any of you be able to be her friend after something like this? No wonder she doesn't have any friends. Have any of you gotten positive responses by actually by breaking no contact? Or ran into them down the road?

Someone who lies to me, cheats on me, abuses me, rages at me, is disrespectful to me, continuously tries to manipulate me is not qualified to be my friend.  If I stuck around anyway What the hell is wrong with me? would be a very valid question.  And come to think of it she never was a friend, we just created a toxic bond based on fantasy.

[Turkish]

She obviously finds me not important anymore. It feels like everything was lie from her. I have a feeling she will get what's coming to her in the end.  Would any of you be able to be her friend after something like this? No wonder she doesn't have any friends. Have any of you gotten positive responses by actually by breaking no contact? Or ran into them down the road?

Someone who lies to me, cheats on me, abuses me, rages at me, is disrespectful to me, continuously tries to manipulate me is not qualified to be my friend.  If I stuck around anyway What the hell is wrong with me? would be a very valid question. 

This is why I ultimately, "technically" ended my r/s instead of continuing to try and salvage it. Fr the first time in a long time, I valued myself.

Truth be told also, I valued our children, and was sick of mine mirroring her parents' toxic r/s to them. Because I, and a few others watching our situation, think she would be perfectly ok with staying in our house, status quo, for who knows how long? Enough! The generational cycle stops with my kids. Take control back. You are worth it, Anomaly1, assuredly so. Remember your self worth if she does try and recycle.

[Anomaly1]

I don't think she will try to recycle me turkish. I was at work today and she avoided me and didn't make an effort to try to acknowledge me and such. Has anyone dealt with a weird possible BPD girlfriend at the workplace. I think she's just ashamed to deal with me either that or she doesn't care.

And i'm going to stick to no contact. And not break it.

[fromheeltoheal]

I don't think she will try to recycle me turkish. I was at work today and she avoided me and didn't make an effort to try to acknowledge me and such. Has anyone dealt with a weird possible BPD girlfriend at the workplace. I think she's just ashamed to deal with me either that or she doesn't care.

And i'm going to stick to no contact. And not break it.

I've experienced and read here from others that the primary emotion is shame in situations like that.  Borderlines have a lot of shame, in fact it's a full time job to keep the lid on it, and after a break-up, especially if we leave them, in those quiet times they connect with all the sht they pulled and eventually see why we left, have little clue why they behaved like that, and hate themselves a little more.  Seeing us triggers that, and one way to cope is to act like they don't care.  But they do, deeply, and it's all bad, another lost attachment.

[Turkish]

I don't think she will try to recycle me turkish. I was at work today and she avoided me and didn't make an effort to try to acknowledge me and such. Has anyone dealt with a weird possible BPD girlfriend at the workplace. I think she's just ashamed to deal with me either that or she doesn't care.

And i'm going to stick to no contact. And not break it.

Good for you. Just be prepared if she does. Someone like this is an unknown quantity.

[Anomaly1]

Heel, I'm taking it she only feels bad when she's around me? I only see her once a week if that. It's because management can tell something is going on so they schedule us at different times and such.  She can only feel shame when she's around me right? So those other 6 days she doesn't care right? Only when she has to see my face and such does she feel down and upset?  What happens when she or i quit? Out Of sight out of mind?    I assume after i'm no longer in the picture. Her memories of me fade or i slowly become someone she use to know and i'm just another person in life? And if she is feeling bad,she isn't able to talk it out with me? Because she knows she's lost or done something horrible?she uses her silence towards me as a defense? While she cant chat it up with others. She's just not wired like that?  Do girls use that as a tool to weed out people they don't want in there life? I'm just baffled that this is how it's ending.  At work she can see how i am and others too. Nothing is being done.except for me going no contact. This girl has something affecting her,I think it's growing pains,possible teen angst towards her parents. She wants to hit the ground running with no parental supervision.


Let's say she did try to contact me. 5 months randomly And she said hi. If i broke contact and said the only way i will talk to you is if you go talk to someone.

[fromheeltoheal]

Heel, I'm taking it she only feels bad when she's around me? I only see her once a week if that. It's because management can tell something is going on so they schedule us at different times and such.  She can only feel shame when she's around me right? So those other 6 days she doesn't care right? Only when she has to see my face and such does she feel down and upset?  What happens when she or i quit? Out Of sight out of mind?    I assume after i'm no longer in the picture. Her memories of me fade or i slowly become someone she use to know and i'm just another person in life? And if she is feeling bad,she isn't able to talk it out with me? Because she knows she's lost or done something horrible?she uses her silence towards me as a defense? While she cant chat it up with others. She's just not wired like that?  Do girls use that as a tool to weed out people they don't want in there life? I'm just baffled that this is how it's ending.  At work she can see how i am and others too. Nothing is being done.except for me going no contact. This girl has something affecting her,I think it's growing pains,possible teen angst towards her parents. She wants to hit the ground running with no parental supervision.


Let's say she did try to contact me. 5 months randomly And she said hi. If i broke contact and said the only way i will talk to you is if you go talk to someone.

Standard borderline is you are a trigger, a negative one at this point, and she's probably got a few others, and positive triggers too.  That's not limited to borderlines, we all do that; I'm sure you can think of people who make you feel good when you see them and ones who make you feel bad, it's all about the associations we make in our head towards a person.

Anyway, it's still time to shift the focus to you.  Forget the words, or the lack of words, look at the actions.  She doesn't want to be with you, or she wants to be with you once in a blue moon when she feels like it, whatever.  Are you getting what you need and want long term from someone who treats you like that?  If not, you can't change her, the only thing you can change is how you feel about her.  And you've probably gotten a great education on life and women from this situation, which you can use as you take your more evolved self forward.  Take care of you!

[myself]

NC is a way for you to find clarity and balance, to end the cycles of abuse.

Those walls do not have to become permanent unless that's best for you.

[Anomaly1]

Have any of you dealt with your ex's have a histrionic personality disorder? I've tried seeing the ways it could be mixed with BPD NPD.  Heel you said Silence is her way of coping?

[fromheeltoheal]

Have any of you dealt with your ex's have a histrionic personality disorder? I've tried seeing the ways it could be mixed with BPD NPD.  Heel you said Silence is her way of coping?

Could be, in a passive aggressive way, or maybe she just doesn't want to talk to you.  My take is you're still trying to fit her in a disordered box, or boxes, to explain her behavior and understand what is going on, which is fine and can help, but at some point it's just better to let it go.  We've all wanted to sit down with our exes and get some kind of closure and the validation that comes with them taking responsibility, owning their sht, and showing us that they care about us, want the best for us, and it just didn't work out.  If she does indeed have a personality disorder, or even if she's just a young immature girl screwing around and doing what she wants, you will never get those things from her; better to shift the focus to you, the lessons learned, and your future.  What can you do right now to start that?

[Anomaly1]

I've been trying to get out of my job so i don't have to be around her. Thing is she went from contacting me by text.once a week and then just stopped because i talked to her mom.I can definitely say it's that.  My other option is by not talking to her.

[Anomaly1]

Does anyone ever receive a sincere apology in situations like these? Or is it they just stop talking to you and possibly contact you when they feel like disregarding there behavior.

[fromheeltoheal]

Does anyone ever receive a sincere apology in situations like these? Or is it they just stop talking to you and possibly contact you when they feel like disregarding there behavior.

It's up to you to decide if it's sincere or not.  The core of BPD is a fear of abandonment and the corresponding need to attach to people to feel whole, so apologies are usually attempts to reconnect and form or reestablish an attachment.  Borderlines are great actors, they have to be to survive, so creating the illusion that they are aware of how you feel and care about you is an effective tool in pulling on your heart strings and creating an emotional bond.  It's up to you to decide if it's sincere or not; trust your gut.

[Anomaly1]

I should say even though she's not talking to me. I know the reason why she's not is because i know and doesn't want to face it. As messed up as it she'll prolly find a reason as i was bad and that's why she stopped talking to me. Even though she's at this stage. Is there ever a point where she offers a sincere apology?  I got a half assed one at work. But a non text face to face type apology? OR is it what there comfortable with?

[fromheeltoheal]

I should say even though she's not talking to me. I know the reason why she's not is because i know and doesn't want to face it. As messed up as it she'll prolly find a reason as i was bad and that's why she stopped talking to me. Even though she's at this stage. Is there ever a point where she offers a sincere apology?  I got a half assed one at work. But a non text face to face type apology? OR is it what there comfortable with?

Again, you need to decide if it's sincere or not.  If someone is disordered and focusing exclusively on her own sht, she isn't aware of how you feel, so there's no need to apologize.  And like I said, if what sounds like a sincere apology seems to be a good attachment tool, she may use it.  If, on the other hand, she's a young immature girl, she may not yet be capable of a sincere adult apology and will avoid it, or maybe she doesn't think she owes you one, for whatever reason.

I know you're hurting and looking for answers, and it's tempting to want to put her in a personality disorder box to clear things up, although honestly I haven't read much here that indicates extreme BPD behavior.  Women are always confusing to men, and sometimes it's easier to keep your side of the street clean, act with integrity, learn what you can and move on.

[Anomaly1]

Ok, So i'm still confused but got a chance to talk to her on Sunday.  I of all people had to work right next to her.So at work she noticed me ignoring her and said. So are you going to make this awkward?I broke contact and told her no matter what i do or say it's not going to change you.

We agreed and met after work and talked.   She told me she's mental.She isn't happy with her life.That was from her own mouth. I asked her if she thinks the reason why she took me for granted was because everyone in the past had treated her horribly. And she said yes. I did take you for granted and you treated me good.    She said she feels horrible. Her entire body and face was almost in a catatonic state. Her mom never told her i called and talked to her. Her mom the other day brought up if she has talked to me or the other guy at work. Quick note this other guy has started seeing some other girl at work.  She said to me that she misses the attention he would give her. I thought that was messed up.He doesn't want anything to do with her and doesn't talk to her.  So she told her mom no i don't talk to them. Her mom went on to say that she has better options out there other than the guy she's living with. Which makes me think her mom knows what's going on.Atleast a pretty good idea. She told me that she's trying to get rid of this other guy. She mentioned that this guy hates me because he knows he has nothing to offer her. He went through her phone a long time ago and found out that she said she loves me through text and such. She can connect with me on a different level than him. If it weren't for me. She would still be stuck with him. In her words you have me. I don't see how that's possible if she's living with him. Their lease is due up in August. So If she knows he's a waste and she's getting it from her mom then theres some searching she needs to do.   She went on to say I love you you know i do. And i would marry you. I don't know how to get you to trust me on that.  We talked some more and I said do you think that because of the things i've done that it's caused you to think negatively or positively towards me. She said alot more positively.   

She goes i don't know what i want.I asked if she wanted to see someone.She said no. I told her that it would tear me up inside knowing if she saw somebody else.She said the same for me. She wants to work on her problems and issues. I asked her to talk to someone with me.She said she wouldn't,she said she didn't have the money. Then i said i would pay.The only person she will talk to her is her mom.  She said just give me time to figure this out. 

I have a friend who has a degree in psychology and told me that she is stressed and struggling to be a young adult and needs some guidance on how to manage her life.

Thoughts?  I'm still keeping my distance. But know that every building has been smashed and i got a chance to say everything i need to say. I think it's eating at her.And she knows she's messed up and she knows she has options out there and needs to change herself around. I do think if she does leave it will still eat at her knowing what she's done to me and i don't think she'll be able to shake something like that.

[Turkish]

I have a friend who has a degree in psychology and told me that she is stressed and struggling to be a young adult and needs some guidance on how to manage her life.

She needs to find that guidance herself. In a romantic r/s, this complicates matters. Did you need someone to guide you, or did you mostly figure it out on your own, most likely with input from people you respect and trust?

Glad you got a chance to talk (for you). But it sounds like she is looking for a safe landing with you due to she and the other due having problems. Do you think this is respectful behavior, or more like that of a child running back home for safety after smashing the neighbor's windows? The question is, do you respect yourself enough to keep your boundaries strong and clear?

[Anomaly1]

I should also report that she said why didn't you tell me off? I said because i care and love you.

She ended the conversation with can i text you.

I agree she does and i think when she changes schools. She's going to my college here in the fall. I think things will turn around. Maybe her being away from me will make her think about things.Once she changes jobs.

On the topic of the other guy.I think it's a attention thing.I can't see her liking him more than me. And i told her when we had the conversation the other day that i don't want you doing this because you feel bad for me or you've seen the way other people are seeing me just to cover your butt.  Or doing this just to please yourself.    She said i'm not.You have to trust me.   

Does any of this sound like a personality order? I am going to support her. I don't think she will text me.  I don't want it to just be about me trying to talk to her at work.So everyone can see that she's made me better and such. 

[Turkish]

I should also report that she said why didn't you tell me off? I said because i care and love you.

She ended the conversation with can i text you.

I agree she does and i think when she changes schools. She's going to my college here in the fall. I think things will turn around. Maybe her being away from me will make her think about things.Once she changes jobs.

On the topic of the other guy.I think it's a attention thing.I can't see her liking him more than me. And i told her when we had the conversation the other day that i don't want you doing this because you feel bad for me or you've seen the way other people are seeing me just to cover your butt.  Or doing this just to please yourself.    She said i'm not.You have to trust me.   

Does any of this sound like a personality order? I am going to support her. I don't think she will text me.  I don't want it to just be about me trying to talk to her at work.So everyone can see that she's made me better and such. 

All I can say is good luck, A1. PD or not, focus on the behaviors. The communication tools (SET, etc... . ) here are tailored for pwBPD, but they work well on anyone. Keep your boundaries, respect and focus on yourself, and work on those Rescuer traits. There is nothing wrong with being a Rescuer (I'm one, my T admitted to being one). It's when we become enmeshed in a r/s with someone who desperately needs it where we may get lost. Maybe you will be friends later on, probably something more, it sounds like. If not a PD, then sometimes people just need more time to grow up. My 32 year old pwBPD tried desperately to grow up, but I triggered her, and she reverted to teenage behavior. She just couldn't keep it up. Now she needs to fall (again), and perhaps someday the high functioning uBPD mother of my children will get better deep down. On the surface? My problem due to my children. Deep down? 100% her problem. There is nothing more I can or will do for her. But that is me, in a nutshell.