master manipulator

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

The stress from my uBPDH's new job is mounting.  He comes home from work every night (he's been at the job 2 weeks) and plays an online game pretty much until he goes to bed. Not that this is different than when he doesn't have a job; then he literally plays all day long.   I work 12 hour shifts and get home much later than he does, but still manage to make lunches for the next day, clean up the dishes, etc.  Yesterday was a particularly stressful day for me at work and I stopped on the way home and got a bottle of wine.  I had a glass and a half when I got home. the whole time my uBPDH played his game.  He even had a glass of wine as well.

On the phone on the way home from work, uBPDH told me he was "busy" (playing his game), but that he needed me home because he was stressed about work and I was "his safe place" and that he wanted me to talk to him when I got home. I have a very demanding job where people literally need me all day long, so it is exhausting to be needed all the time.  He talked to me about being stressed at work and I told him that it would be ok and that was that, but when I wanted to talk about my day I was "interrupting" him (while he was playing said computer game).  My feelings were hurt, but I did not say anything because I just didn't want to deal with it last night.

My uBPDH got up this morning to go to work ( I am off work today and was trying to sleep-in a little).  He went in the kitchen and then he yelled into the bedroom "NO MORE WINE".  I said "ok" and stayed in the bed.  when I didn't get up he then yelled "YOU BETTER GET UP".  He was mad that I had had a glass and a half last night and that turned into a fight that lasted until he had to go to work.  uBPDh gets extreme anxiety when he cannot control things.   He is perfectly fine buying a bottle of wine and bringing it home, but he has a problem if I do. We don't drink all that much, maybe 1-2 drinks a week if even that some weeks not at all. 

I told him that he hurt my feelings last night and of course it is my fault that he ignored me to play his game because I was not clear in voicing that I wanted to talk to him about my day.  Someone please confirm for me that this is completely irrational that I should have to specifically tell my husband that I want to talk about my day?

How does every conversation in which I express some emotion other than love and happiness get turned around on me and how dare I have a negative feeling or emotion about him.  It always leads back to what he says is a fact that "I don't like him or care about him or want to be around him" I feel like we are always in a circular argument... . no matter what the topic it is essentially always about the same thing: him feeling unloved.

I don't think that my husband has it easy.  I know that every minute of every day his mind is bombarded with thoughts of every mistake and bad thing he has ever done.  It is almost like he has PTSD.  I don't know how to help him turn his thoughts off.  In every situation he is analyzing every negative outcome and formulating a plan as to how he is going to handle it.  I tell him that he is never in the moment and truly living in an alternate reality.  I just don't know how to help him.  He refuses to get help. (He did in the past while with his exwife after he attempted suicide, but received no diagnosis other than depression/anxiety.  His psychiatrist was really bad and only wanted to put him on meds that zoned him out and made him a zombie.  Now if I mention getting help he says that I just want to drug him up.

Frustrated and tired and still don't know what to do.  I have fantasies about leaving.  I just don't know what's stopping me.

[lotus74]

The stress from my uBPDH's new job is mounting.  He comes home from work every night (he's been at the job 2 weeks) and plays an online game pretty much until he goes to bed. Not that this is different than when he doesn't have a job; then he literally plays all day long.   I work 12 hour shifts and get home much later than he does, but still manage to make lunches for the next day, clean up the dishes, etc.  Yesterday was a particularly stressful day for me at work and I stopped on the way home and got a bottle of wine.  I had a glass and a half when I got home. the whole time my uBPDH played his game.  He even had a glass of wine as well.

On the phone on the way home from work, uBPDH told me he was "busy" (playing his game), but that he needed me home because he was stressed about work and I was "his safe place" and that he wanted me to talk to him when I got home. I have a very demanding job where people literally need me all day long, so it is exhausting to be needed all the time.  He talked to me about being stressed at work and I told him that it would be ok and that was that, but when I wanted to talk about my day I was "interrupting" him (while he was playing said computer game).  My feelings were hurt, but I did not say anything because I just didn't want to deal with it last night.

My uBPDH got up this morning to go to work ( I am off work today and was trying to sleep-in a little).  He went in the kitchen and then he yelled into the bedroom "NO MORE WINE".  I said "ok" and stayed in the bed.  when I didn't get up he then yelled "YOU BETTER GET UP".  He was mad that I had had a glass and a half last night and that turned into a fight that lasted until he had to go to work.  uBPDh gets extreme anxiety when he cannot control things.   He is perfectly fine buying a bottle of wine and bringing it home, but he has a problem if I do. We don't drink all that much, maybe 1-2 drinks a week if even that some weeks not at all. 

I told him that he hurt my feelings last night and of course it is my fault that he ignored me to play his game because I was not clear in voicing that I wanted to talk to him about my day.  Someone please confirm for me that this is completely irrational that I should have to specifically tell my husband that I want to talk about my day?

How does every conversation in which I express some emotion other than love and happiness get turned around on me and how dare I have a negative feeling or emotion about him.  It always leads back to what he says is a fact that "I don't like him or care about him or want to be around him" I feel like we are always in a circular argument... . no matter what the topic it is essentially always about the same thing: him feeling unloved.

I don't think that my husband has it easy.  I know that every minute of every day his mind is bombarded with thoughts of every mistake and bad thing he has ever done.  It is almost like he has PTSD.  I don't know how to help him turn his thoughts off.  In every situation he is analyzing every negative outcome and formulating a plan as to how he is going to handle it.  I tell him that he is never in the moment and truly living in an alternate reality.  I just don't know how to help him.  He refuses to get help. (He did in the past while with his exwife after he attempted suicide, but received no diagnosis other than depression/anxiety.  His psychiatrist was really bad and only wanted to put him on meds that zoned him out and made him a zombie.  Now if I mention getting help he says that I just want to drug him up.

Frustrated and tired and still don't know what to do.  I have fantasies about leaving.  I just don't know what's stopping me.

[woodsposse]

 

I typically don't post on this board, but there is somethign in your post which spoke to me, so I'm going to go ahead and share.

First off, I understand and know the feeling which you are having right now.  I have lived in that for years and if I knew then what I know now I would have been much better off and in a much better position to help both me and my wife.

Depression and Anxiety are very difficult things to navigate through.  I don't know your entire back story, if your husband had been diagnosed BPD, or if it is your thought that this is what it is.  But none of that really matters.  Depression and Anxiety are at parts of the root of what you are dealing with and once this is 'understood' - there are other direct questions you could ask (either other members here, or other health professionals) on what you could do to maybe better help him and yourself.

People, generally, when depressed (whether due to a PD, major life event, loosing a job, too much stress, too much time on hands, etc) tend to ruminate on all sorts of negative things.  Unfortunately... . that is natural. It is just how our brains are hard wired.

The key is to understand this and find better managmement tools to help deal with it.

I didn't understand this for a very long time.  I do tend to get into all the negative things which happened, all the unresolved issues in my life tend to pop up and I either want to ruminate on it, resolve it, or try and forget about it.

Getting lost in video games is a great escape.  Drinking... . not so much (but it can "help" inthe very short term, but can have devestating effects later on).

Just know this.  You are not alone.

Keep posting.  Keep reading.  You are among people who eitehr are going through what you are going through - or have gone through it and come out on the other side like Andy the night he crawled through his wall (movie reference).

How are you handling your needs? 

[tiredndown]

I told him that he hurt my feelings last night and of course it is my fault that he ignored me to play his game because I was not clear in voicing that I wanted to talk to him about my day.  Someone please confirm for me that this is completely irrational that I should have to specifically tell my husband that I want to talk about my day?

I am very sorry for what you are going through. I will try to make it as simple as possible.

Trust . your . gut. If something he says makes you feel _____, bad, upset, sad ( fill in the blank ) YOU are JUSTIFIED in feeling that way. If he tries to minimize it in ANY way, it is abusive. If he tells you that you are too _____ ( sensitive, touchy, fill in the blank ) it is abusive. YOU will know if it rare and out of character ( meaning that he comes to you later and apologizes to you ) or if it is a repeating pattern. Again, TRUST your gut, your gut doesn't EVER lie to you, unlike HIM.

Frustrated and tired and still don't know what to do.  I have fantasies about leaving.  I just don't know what's stopping me.

I forget where I herd this, but on average it takes about 7 tries before you actually leave someone. You really have two choices

1) explain to him it hurts you when he acts that way and hope he sees the errors of his ways

2) leave him

Notice changing him isn't an option.

I'm sorry, I don't know your story or if you have children, What if your daughter told you what you just wrote on this board ... . What would your advice to her be? Why do you not deserve that same advice to yourself?

[woodsposse]

You really have two choices:

1) explain to him it hurts you when he acts that way and hope he sees the errors of his ways

2) leave him

Notice changing him isn't an option.

Although at one point in my life I would have probably concurred with the two choices - I can not now.  The thought process is entirely too black and white.  While it is true you can't "change him" - that is an exercise in futility with just about anyone... . there are more options and choices besides the two.

For whatever the reason (children, other family, financial, security, love, etc) - there are other things you can do... . all of which start with you. 

You are justified in feeling however you feel - but depending on the "minimizing" - it is not always abuse.  If he tells you you are too sensitive, touchy, whatever... . it may not be considered abuse.  There are time where a person can be too hypersensitive, touchy or whatever (and it can be due to a whole smattering of reasons) - but it isn't necessarily abuse.

Maybe they are being to insensitive to how you are feeling - maybe they are going through some thing in their own head which make you two run on different planes.  Maybe he is hot when you are cold.  Maybe you are hot when he is cold. 

It's called unshared expectations.

Another option, choice you could have is to focus some time on yourself and what you need - take some time to calm down and maybe back away from some of the chaos so you have time to clear your head.

Maybe you can speak with someone (I know I have had a counselor/therapist for two plus years and it has really helped me).  Maybe there is marriage counseling.  Maybe there can be a gentle nudging to get him into sessions.

I look at it like this - if I were married to a problem drinker and her substance abuse was "getting out of hand"... . I don't think there are only two choices (stop drinking or leave).  There are other options.

Now... . if those other options are exhausted... . then the list get whittled down.

But a true, healthy r/s means you look at your options to try and obtain the wellness balance you want and need.  And a simple one-two punch (fix it or I'm out) may not be the best way to obtain a resolution.

If he is suffering from a Personality Disorder - then he is ill.  If you love him, love yourself (your family and all the like) - there is a choice to "work the problem".  Not try and fix him or make him change... . but work the problem... . if that is something you want to do.

But you have to get to a place, even for a little bit, where you can focus and slow down some of the chaos so you can think, heal and feel.

[tiredndown]

woodsposse -

Thank you for sharing your perspective with me. I hope to get to the point where you are eventually, but I am just not there yet. I guess the black & white thinking of the undiagnosed wife is rubbing off on me. When I deal with her I can not leave any room for discussion or else she will spend the rest of the night with her trying to make me agree with her.( Conversations used to start just as I was falling asleep )

What I have found is that when I display NO wiggle room it helps cut the discussion short.

You are justified in feeling however you feel - but depending on the "minimizing" - it is not always abuse.  If he tells you you are too sensitive, touchy, whatever... . it may not be considered abuse.  There are time where a person can be too hypersensitive, touchy or whatever (and it can be due to a whole smattering of reasons) - but it isn't necessarily abuse.

Maybe they are being to insensitive to how you are feeling - maybe they are going through some thing in their own head which make you two run on different planes.  Maybe he is hot when you are cold.  Maybe you are hot when he is cold. 

It's called unshared expectations.

I define this as abuse when it fits a pattern of re-occurrence where they make no attempt to address the fact that you are hurt by something they said. Again though, I really appreciate you sharing your thoughts. What I find most useful is being able to express an opinion that someone disagrees with and not being called an idiot for it.