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Author Topic: You may not want to wait too long  (Read 1410 times)
OutOfEgypt
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« on: June 20, 2014, 09:53:48 AM »

This message is for people who are on the edge of deciding to leave their BPD partner but just can't bear to do it, keeping alive some kind of knowingly irrational belief that some miracle will happen around the next bend in the road.

I'm sure this will pass as I continue to heal and grow in my new life, but here is one thing you will likely face with deeper and deeper intensity the more you put off leaving them.  You will one day look in the mirror and not know who you are anymore, and you will realize that the relationship with your BPD partner was irreparably bad from YEARS before today but you chose to live in fantasy land, and now you are that much older and that much further away from healing and from potentially finding a relationship with a healthy person, if EVER.  I know most of us stay partly because we always have that dream of a companion and of a family, even if we know that our BPD partner is not going to really ever help us hold that dream together but only destroy it.  But the longer you wait, the longer you keep yourself from any possibility of that dream being realized with someone healthy.  And you will probably come to a day of deep regret and feel all of the discouragement that I feel right now.  You will feel like you were robbed, but the thing you will kick yourself for is that you were partly the one robbing from yourself.  You kept the insanity going because of your refusal to face reality and place reality and truth above your undying need to keep an impossible relationship alive.  Your refusal to face and live through loss keeps you from the possibility of finding a newer and better life.

I knew the ship was sinking long ago, but in spite of exhortations from counselors who saw what I was unwilling to see, and in spite of what I knew deep down, I wouldn't let go.  And I don't totally fault myself -I loved her as best I could even though I knew it would not last.  And I do believe that is noble and right.  However, now I'm that much older and alone.  I look at all the energy spent being wrapped up in this person.  Some of it one could argue is good.  Again, loving a broken person that you promised to love is noble.  However, there is also a sense in which the limited time and gifts and light given to me were consumed in a bog of tar for 15 years as I was completely wrapped up in dealing with this woman.  That is not just a waste.  It is idolatrous.  That is a hard thing to swallow.  And now there is that much less time to redeem.  I know you love them, but don't prolong the inevitable and don't rob yourself or them of the opportunity to change simply because you wouldn't do something.
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« Reply #1 on: June 20, 2014, 10:45:33 AM »

I have read your post over and over. I am tormented everyday with this. It breaks my heart when I know way down inside of my wife's soul she doesn't believe anyone really truly wants her. I want her but what I struggle with is the emotional abuse I receive in the form of the neglect of my needs. When I discuss my needs they are quickly dismissed. I am the type of person who cares about the people that me leaving would have an effect on especially my wife. I don't want to let her down. If there is someone in this life that won't give up on her (is that me?) did God give her to me because he knew I would not leave her? I seek those answers everyday. When she cries it tears me to pieces but you are right I have already looked at my self in the mirror and I don't see the person I once was. I am tired of crying on my way to work everyday. I am weary in my mind. I am a born again christian and she is also. I truly keep waiting on God it's the only thing I am holding onto.
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« Reply #2 on: June 20, 2014, 11:10:38 AM »

OOE -- Your point about not being able to recognize yourself if you stay under certain conditions really resonates with me.  I was constantly facing the knowledge that there would be catastrophic consequences for the relationship if I behaved like myself.  I was really addicted and committed and thought we were special, so for quite a while I didn't behave like myself, and our r/s flourished, except for that little problem that it was tearing up my insides.

Eventually the terms he was offering reached a point where it would have contorted me beyond recognition to continue to do it, so I stopped.  But before then, yes, it was quite destructive to my sense of who I was.

Byfaith -- if "not giving up on" someone (which I also have struggled with) requires tolerating treatment that distorts who you are at a deep level, I'm not sure that is really a gift to one's partner, you know? Having boundaries around unacceptable treatment seems like a way of showing respect to your partner as well as yourself.  Definitely, to set boundaries is to accept the possibility of losing the relationship if your partner cannot deal with them and chooses to leave.  Mine did.  But my point is that establishing a line past which you are not willing to go IS a way of communicating love and respect for your partner.  It says "I want better for us and I believe better is possible."  Then, the decision is theirs and we have to accept they may not choose to come with us along the road to a less abusive arrangement.  But you have still shown respect and warmth for your partner in drawing those lines.
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OutOfEgypt
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« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2014, 11:12:06 AM »

Byfaith,

I know how you feel.  It is awful.  For me, I waited on God for years.  I prayed for something like 10 years... . "please help things get better.  if it's me, then please fix me.  please open her eyes, too, to what she needs to see", etc. etc.  Eventually, I realized, as things only got worse and worse over the years, that I was using God as a crutch to avoid having to make real decisions about life.  Sometimes we think that having "faith" means that we sit and wait for God to zap some miracle juice into our life somewhere.  But I tend to think of faith more as living in the grey areas of life and making the best decisions we can given the truth He has given us and the decision-making faculties he has given us (like a functioning mind, wise friends and counselors, etc.).  In other words, I believe faith is more organic than I once thought it was.  I believe it means letting God be God but tending to our lives on the horizontal in the way that we ought to as good stewards.  Being passive and waitng for answers, though noble in some ways, is sometimes a crutch to avoid being active stewards of our own lives and the relationships He has given us.

Nothing changed until I did something.  That is all I can say.  Many people warned me.  They told me "the best indicator of tomorrow is yesterday," but still I hoped against hope in the possibility of God somehow zapping the both of us and fixing everything.  While God may sometimes do something like that, ordinarily God works much, much slower through very ordinary means -such as someone finally saying "enough is enough".  In that sense, our inactivity and passivity can actually be thwarting things.  We aren't letting God be God to them.  We are too busy rescuing them (and perhaps ourselves) from consequences.  Maybe your wife *needs* the effect of your loss, otherwise she will remain like this for the rest of her life.

I'm not even saying divorce.  If she has not cheated on you, I can see why you would feel uneasy about just divorcing her.  But there are other ways.  Separation is one.  I know of a couple (non-BPD's however) who were separated for 3 years, but they finally got back together and have a much better marriage.

I know it breaks your heart for her.  It used to break my heart for my wife, too -sometimes it still does.  But everybody has a broken heart in some way.  It doesn't make it okay for them to be how they are in hurting and destroying everybody close to them.  At some point, they need to be held to the same standard as everybody else... . which is, yes... . I understand you are broken inside, but will you ever face the fact that your brokenness destroys others and do something about it?

I know exactly how you feel.  You feel guilty leaving her, like she is a victim.  Part of that is how she paints herself, however, and I believe another part of that is your codependency.  You abandon yourself instead of abandoning her.  You abandon the light given to you from God in order to literally do *anything* for her.  You are so caught up in how hurt and broken she is that you are numbing yourself out to all of the trauma you are facing.  And that is what I am warning of in my message.  When it all finally falls apart, and apart from a miracle it almost certainly will, a day will come when all of the trauma and destruction you are putting yourself through will come back to you.  It will hit you in the face, and you will finally realize how much of your life you actually gave up... . and how much damage you will have to work through.  And you will likely weep bitterly for putting yourself through it.  A day will come when you finally realize what you have done to yourself.  And it will SUCK.

I believe when we give that much devotion to someone other than God, we are guilty of idolatry.  Our love is misplaced.  We aren't God, and we can't rescue or fix them.  That is God's job or their job to take responsibility for their own hurting.  If we don't recognize that, our hanging on actually can hurt them more.
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OutOfEgypt
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« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2014, 11:21:03 AM »

patientandclear,

Yes that sounds all too familiar.  We give up and contort ourselves in unimaginable ways to just make it work, and the BPD partner eats it up and then puts us down for it.  I would even be told "You have no identity of your own".  By the time she was saying that, it was an exaggeration because I had made great strides in myself while working with a T, but it was still partially true.  However, what she left out was how everything in her dynamic demanded that I completely sacrifice my identity on the altar of her wants and needs in order to keep her.  That is not a relationship.  That is idolatry and slavery. 
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OutOfEgypt
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« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2014, 11:29:38 AM »

Here's an analogy that my T used.  You and your BPD partner are both living in a cave.  In that cave, the BPD partner writes all the rules, controls the light and darkness, traps the air, and keeps you trapped.  You, however, are so enamored with keeping her and hoping that the cave somehow magically turns into an open field with bright shining sun and blue skies that you stay in the cave with her and do everything you can to make that cold, dark, clammy cave comfortable for her.  Meanwhile, you are suffocating, being bitten by spiders, suffering from hypothermia, and wasting away.  Still, you are so focused on her and this fantasy that you stay in the cave.

But the longer you stay in the cave, the longer you delay the possibility of finding that open field with the bright shining sun and blue skies.  She's not going to budge, but you feel so "guilty" for leaving her behind that you won't leave the cave.  She's suffering, though you do your best to make it comfortable, and you are suffering more than you can even allow yourself to see.  And there is no hope in the cave.  The only hope is in ONE of you actually leaving the cave, and that means leaving her behind -because you know she isn't going to do it.  If you don't get up, open the door, and leave the cave behind, you will never find the open field, and neither will she.  However, if you do emotionally say goodbye to the cave and move ahead with your life, you can find the open field for yourself.  It will be a long, hard journey, but it can be done.  And then you can finally shed your light to the world.  And who knows... . your loss may prompt her to get up and start finding her way out of the cave, too.  It may not.  She may just find another cave-dweller to be with her.  But there is no chance otherwise.  The longer you stay, the longer she is likely to stay, too.  You are the only one who probably sees how screwed up things are, so you unfortunately bear the responsibility of making the hard choices.  The long, hard journey to the open field... . or the comfortable stay in the cave where you are completely numb to how your own flesh is rotting out from inside you?
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« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2014, 11:53:33 AM »

You will one day look in the mirror and not know who you are anymore, and you will realize that the relationship with your BPD partner was irreparably bad from YEARS before today but you chose to live in fantasy land, and now you are that much older and that much further away from healing and from potentially finding a relationship with a healthy person, if EVER.  I know most of us stay partly because we always have that dream of a companion and of a family, even if we know that our BPD partner is not going to really ever help us hold that dream together but only destroy it.  But the longer you wait, the longer you keep yourself from any possibility of that dream being realized with someone healthy.  And you will probably come to a day of deep regret and feel all of the discouragement that I feel right now.  You will feel like you were robbed, but the thing you will kick yourself for is that you were partly the one robbing from yourself.  You kept the insanity going because of your refusal to face reality and place reality and truth above your undying need to keep an impossible relationship alive.  Your refusal to face and live through loss keeps you from the possibility of finding a newer and better life.

My story is one of experiencing multiple types and events of abuse.  Physical, emotional, finanicial and verbal for over 10 years.  I wanted to prove to myself and to others we had the perfect life.  but it wasn't. It was hell for me and my children. 

I lost a lot of years, money (to her and lawyers) but have my adult children D20 & S24 and peace.  I'm in my fifties and realize that although I don't have alot of years left, I do have some.  With her I had none.
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« Reply #7 on: June 20, 2014, 02:08:59 PM »

I wouldn't be to hard on yourselves for waiting. Your PARTNERS have already been too hard on YOU. Keep this in mind, if you rushed to get out of the relationship before you were truly ready, you would have second guessed your decision and lived with that what-if the rest of your lives.

I would submit that each of you are on YOUR OWN schedule as it should be. You will make your move when you are ready and not a minute before. This is truly is like a death, the death of what you thought the relationship would be. Take the time you need to grieve.

Do NOT be down on yourselves for waiting ! ! ! Stand tall and be proud that YOU are the ones looking for answers.
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« Reply #8 on: June 20, 2014, 02:11:41 PM »

I agree.  Beating yourself up for waiting too long won't help.  It only hurts.  It further keeps you down, in fact.

That said... . I share this experience here to help those who are on the fence.  I however certainly do not judge you.  It is unbelievably mind-numbing and difficult, as we all know.
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« Reply #9 on: June 20, 2014, 04:03:53 PM »

Do NOT be down on yourselves for waiting ! ! ! Stand tall and be proud that YOU are the ones looking for answers.

Thank you for your supportive comment.
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« Reply #10 on: June 23, 2014, 03:44:55 AM »

Thanks, lots of points well worth considering. I was going to start a new thread titled "reality check" but this deals with a lot of what I wanted to write.

My relationship with my uBPDw feels pretty much doomed, yet I feel paralyzed when it comes to actually doing something to move on, i.e. separate. She hasn't cheated on me (that I know of) so divorce feels like a very drastic move. But it dawned on me the other day, when my wife was away for the evening and I was home with the kids, how much I dreaded her coming home. And how that's not supposed to be the way to live one's life.

I've managed to calm things down around the house. I'm able to pursue interests on my own (or with the kids). But it doesn't feel sustainable. It's not a real relationship, more like we're living together.

She'll never make the move to separate or divorce. Partly I think it is because she doesn't think she'll find someone else to put up with her ways. Myself, I don't know if I ever want to be in a relationship again.

Today I feel a bit more down than usual as me and the kids would have been going on a trip for a week starting today, if I hadn't cancelled the plans due to my wife breaking down crying over it (as I wrote in another thread). I now regret doing so. My wife told me just the other day "oh aren't you going?" because she'd made some plans for those days. Of course she mentioned this when it was already too late to book anything. Blah.

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« Reply #11 on: June 23, 2014, 09:20:06 AM »

Dear Empathic,

I so agree with your quote:

"But it dawned on me the other day, when my wife was away for the evening and I was home with the kids, how much I dreaded her coming home. And how that's not supposed to be the way to live one's life."

While my kids are all now out of the house, I used to live in fear and terror (I'm ashamed to say) of her coming home so I had to track her cell phone so I could get myself mentally prepared for her arrival. How sick is that? And sure enough, when she got home within an hour the terror would start. The only solution I had was to remove myself from the terror and fear by leaving. I'm now 4+ weeks out of the house with limited contact. No more fear and terror, just sadness for the 28+ year relationship loss.

The only thing that kept me there in numbness was the kids. Now they're all gone, I became the object of her rage. I still miss the woman I married, but not the woman she became. Hang in there and know you have friends here.
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But God does not just sweep life away; instead, He devises ways to bring us back when we have been separated from Him. 2 Samuel 14:14(b) NLT
OutOfEgypt
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« Reply #12 on: June 23, 2014, 09:47:01 AM »

Empathic,

I'm sorry about those things you are going through.  I remember things like that too well.  I wrote this post not to pressure people or condemn them for being stuck.  It took me YEARS to finally get to that point.  I understand completely.  I wrote it because as I'm healing I'm realizing that the damage done to me as a person, and by extension to our whole family, was deeper than I thought.  Numbing is a typical defense mechanism to deal with trauma, and that numbness eventually starts to wear off as we work through things and heal after leaving.  And that's when we see the extensive damage.  The haze lifts, and we see ashes.  I think we may tend to underestimate exactly how important we are and how important our own health is, especially to our kids.  They really need at least one stable, connectable parent.  I simply could not survive the chaos of trying to hold together the relationship (because it was truly one-way) and being as effective for the kids.  So, for my own sanity and for the health of the kids, I finally had to walk away.

I'm sorry about the plans you made, too.  In the past, I cancelled plans, too.  Or usually, she simply didn't want to go and insisted I went without her.  Well, you get tired of doing everything alone after about 12 years.  Church, trips, family dinners, playing with the kids.  If I complained, she would of course point out all of the things we did together -like she had a memorized list in her head to pull out and rattle off when she needed to justify herself and make me think I'm crazy and overreacting- but it was rare and only the things *she* wanted to do.  It was all her way, on her terms, and on her time.  Everything had to revolve around her.  Everything else, we did without her.  However, she always retained the right to say, "Well, but what if I don't want you to go?" and the mere thought of her actually wanting me (or us) was enough to make me ready to cancel all the plans in a heartbeat, just to have her want to be with me/us.  How sad.  I would literally move heaven and earth just to jump at the chance of her loving me and our family.  And so we learned that only happened when we let mommy have total control.  But that was a lie, too, because though it *seemed* like she would love us, it was really all about her.  And she would bail on us when she was done and then use it against us so that we would not bother her.  "I just did all of that for you, and now you need to leave me alone, everybody." (guilt, guilt, guilt)

And that hurts even still.  It felt like the family was not really a family.  And so many of us would wait around for mommy to decide to be with us.  What an awful experience that was.  For someone that can be so sweet, I've never met such a monster quite like that.
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« Reply #13 on: June 23, 2014, 04:58:13 PM »

But it dawned on me the other day, when my wife was away for the evening and I was home with the kids, how much I dreaded her coming home. And how that's not supposed to be the way to live one's life.

I totally feel that.

I'm able to pursue interests on my own (or with the kids). But it doesn't feel sustainable.

I am also doing this to some extent. But there is a dark side. I cannot express my love and passion in front of her. I fear she will say why don't I spend nearly enough time on her but rather on my hobby. I'm working very hard to study a number of online courses (my hobby is learning). She is saying I would never stay late for her but now I'm working late for these works. What can I say. I cannot tell her the truth. I am really driven on these classes and I feel great working hard and learning new stuff. And I dread to be with her because too often things go down the wrong path and we argue all night for no reason. I even curtail my affection to my kids because I fear it will trigger her.

I can analyze the relationship in 50 different ways. But the results are all the same. This is just the wrong way to live the life.

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« Reply #14 on: June 23, 2014, 11:01:48 PM »

Excerpt
I can analyze the relationship in 50 different ways. But the results are all the same. This is just the wrong way to live the life.

This sums it up nice and tight.

My wife gave me the best father's day gift I ever got. She asked me to take off Friday & Monday and left for a four day weekend. I am a had the entire long weekend to spend with my kids all by myself! A four day weekend full of day trips.
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« Reply #15 on: June 25, 2014, 07:49:41 PM »

Empathic,

... . I wrote it because as I'm healing I'm realizing that the damage done to me as a person, and by extension to our whole family, was deeper than I thought.  Numbing is a typical defense mechanism to deal with trauma, and that numbness eventually starts to wear off as we work through things and heal after leaving.  And that's when we see the extensive damage.  The haze lifts, and we see ashes.  I think we may tend to underestimate exactly how important we are and how important our own health is, especially to our kids.  They really need at least one stable, connectable parent.  I simply could not survive the chaos of trying to hold together the relationship (because it was truly one-way) and being as effective for the kids.  So, for my own sanity and for the health of the kids, I finally had to walk away.

I'm sorry about the plans you made, too.  In the past, I cancelled plans, too.  Or usually, she simply didn't want to go and insisted I went without her.  Well, you get tired of doing everything alone after about 12 years.  Church, trips, family dinners, playing with the kids.  If I complained, she would of course point out all of the things we did together -like she had a memorized list in her head to pull out and rattle off when she needed to justify herself and make me think I'm crazy and overreacting- but it was rare and only the things *she* wanted to do.  It was all her way, on her terms, and on her time.  Everything had to revolve around her.  Everything else, we did without her.  However, she always retained the right to say, "Well, but what if I don't want you to go?" and the mere thought of her actually wanting me (or us) was enough to make me ready to cancel all the plans in a heartbeat, just to have her want to be with me/us.  How sad.  I would literally move heaven and earth just to jump at the chance of her loving me and our family.  And so we learned that only happened when we let mommy have total control.  But that was a lie, too, because though it *seemed* like she would love us, it was really all about her.  And she would bail on us when she was done and then use it against us so that we would not bother her.  "I just did all of that for you, and now you need to leave me alone, everybody." (guilt, guilt, guilt)

And that hurts even still.  It felt like the family was not really a family.  And so many of us would wait around for mommy to decide to be with us.  What an awful experience that was.  For someone that can be so sweet, I've never met such a monster quite like that.

Very well said.
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If YOU don't change, things will stay the same


« Reply #16 on: June 26, 2014, 02:18:39 AM »

I think out of this it is important to stress that if you stay then you have to work on changing. Starting the process of changing you so that you become more clear about what is right for you, and what can be changed, and what cant.

As the topic says if you just try to "wait" and weather it out and hope for improvement, your life will become sicker, and the scars deeper.

YOU MUST DO SOMETHING, change needs to be forced. Regardless of the direction you take, you have the choice to reassess. Who knows where you will end up, but the only certainty is that if you dont put your own hands on the wheel you will get nowhere except closer to destruction
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  Reality is shared and open to debate, feelings are individual and real
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« Reply #17 on: June 26, 2014, 04:38:46 PM »

There is a common parable in my country... . it has different variations and I'd like to share the modern, 20th Century version of it.

"There is a man who is extremely devout.  Every day he prays to the deity to become rich and asks to win the lottery.  Nothing happens and he intensifies his prayers by adding fasting to it.  Nothing happens and he intensifies his efforts again by adding various other types of self effacement, whipping himself with 20 lashes a day, giving up sex, giving up his family, sleeping by the roadside, visiting the holy places, feasting the holy men, pilgrimages, feeding less fortunate than him, taking care of the lepers... .

Nothing happens still... . no lottery.

He dies a disappointed broken hearted man.

When he meets his maker face to face, he complains long and hard and lists every thing he did to appease God and God did not fulfill his one little wish... .

God listened to him with a gentle expression and when the man was finished complaining,  God gently replied,  "My son... . I was just waiting for you to buy a lottery ticket... . "

Moral of the story is simply that God does intend us to use our free will and will only help us sustain the choice we have made.  If we change our choice and show that change not just in our heart and wishful thinking... . if we are committed to that choice by showing that commitment by active action, the God supports that choice too and will help in sustaining that.  God has enormous respect for sentience.  The price of the choice and free will was great... . the knowledge of evil and good was bought with tears.  The most moral action for God would be to recognize the price that was paid... . and to allow the existence of choice.

The man confused his wishful thinking, his hope, his dreams, his fantasy, with prayer and devotion and neglected to perform the most fundamental action that would exemplify completely his hopes, dreams and fantasy.  Suppose he had spent the same passion and energy and intelligence and imagination in actually working hard for the rest of his life while simultaneously enjoying the healthy nutritious fruits of filial and marital and communal relationships... . perhaps he would have become quite wealthy at last. 

There are many facets to your dilemma.  Misplaced altruism hurts the altruistic person as much as it hurts the receiver of that altruism.

--------------------------------------------------

The analogy of the cave dweller stuck with me the whole day today.  I do not think that God wants anyone to suffer and who knows, when a co-dependent leaves, it may be the impetus for the BPD sufferer to seek wellness... . and who knows it may be an impetus for the sufferer to simply replace one co-dependent with another.  However, at least one of them has made an active, conscious and deliberate choice to seek light and open green spaces.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

We can argue the existence of God ad nauseum.  It is a belief and a faith.

However, no one can deny that Divinity exists... . it works though and between us human beings, it is an energy, an imagination, an impulse to do something good, something better.  And simultaneously Evil exists too.

So how about if we deliberately choose one by first, at the most fundamental level, respecting ourselves.  "Ahem Brahamasmi"... . I am the supreme creator... . this is what we need to admit... . that divinity resides in us.  It is a divine mandate not to deny that divinity.  Let us not roll in the ashes of sorrow and blood and destruction and horror permanently.  For losing hope, being despondent, not believing that there are choices and not believing that the choice to walk towards the open green spaces is the right choice... . this is the first step towards denigrating everything that is sacred and holy.

We sacrifice ourselves at the alter of cold stone statues... . what we made that sacrifice to water the living breathing life... . just LIFE itself.

A seed sown in sand will not blossom whether watered with  sweat or tears or blood.

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Humanity is a stream my friend, and each of us individual drops.  How can you then distinguish one from the other?
AimingforMastery
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« Reply #18 on: June 28, 2014, 04:18:29 PM »

I think this so right and must be taken into account by everyone facing this.

Hoping will not work.

Your BPD getting help is a minimum first step.

But even that is not enough if you don't see solid behavior change.

And in therapy often it gets worse before it gets better.

Also as I said in another thread, but it is relevant here too... . :-

There is one more thing, when you see the pattern of behavior escalating I believe YOU MUST LEAVE.

Chances are the whole escalation has nothing to do with you anyway, it's just their unconscious wounds being regurgitated.

Of course, it will be directed at you as the whole thing is that it comes out at the people she or he is closest to. It is re-enacting. Plain and simple. I personally think it is re-enacting the anger from the original (often sexual) abuse that is so common place as the underlying cause(s).

But even though it is directed at you it has nothing to do with you... .

However, it is almost impossible for you to feel that if you are sleeping with them or living with them - as you are deeply attached and with that always comes normal expectations of what love means - empathy, consideration, respect and basically put - caring for you and your feelings... .

BUT, of course if someone is living from, and coming from a place of deep, deep hostility (to original shadows and wounds) as opposed to genuine caring - the blame, torturing, attacks and abuse will be (unconsciously) directed at YOU.

Even if the causes of that hostility, as is so often the case, has nothing to do with you.

Sometimes you just have to say enough is enough and LEAVE THEM

And worst of all, it may carry on for years without them realizing it. That is because borderlines rarely get better... .

It isn't your crap after all anyway... .

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brokenbutalive
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« Reply #19 on: July 01, 2014, 06:14:29 PM »

Here's an analogy that my T used.  You and your BPD partner are both living in a cave.  In that cave, the BPD partner writes all the rules, controls the light and darkness, traps the air, and keeps you trapped.  You, however, are so enamored with keeping her and hoping that the cave somehow magically turns into an open field with bright shining sun and blue skies that you stay in the cave with her and do everything you can to make that cold, dark, clammy cave comfortable for her.  Meanwhile, you are suffocating, being bitten by spiders, suffering from hypothermia, and wasting away.  Still, you are so focused on her and this fantasy that you stay in the cave.

But the longer you stay in the cave, the longer you delay the possibility of finding that open field with the bright shining sun and blue skies.  She's not going to budge, but you feel so "guilty" for leaving her behind that you won't leave the cave.  She's suffering, though you do your best to make it comfortable, and you are suffering more than you can even allow yourself to see.  And there is no hope in the cave.  The only hope is in ONE of you actually leaving the cave, and that means leaving her behind -because you know she isn't going to do it.  If you don't get up, open the door, and leave the cave behind, you will never find the open field, and neither will she.  However, if you do emotionally say goodbye to the cave and move ahead with your life, you can find the open field for yourself.  It will be a long, hard journey, but it can be done.  And then you can finally shed your light to the world.  And who knows... . your loss may prompt her to get up and start finding her way out of the cave, too.  It may not.  She may just find another cave-dweller to be with her.  But there is no chance otherwise.  The longer you stay, the longer she is likely to stay, too.  You are the only one who probably sees how screwed up things are, so you unfortunately bear the responsibility of making the hard choices.  The long, hard journey to the open field... . or the comfortable stay in the cave where you are completely numb to how your own flesh is rotting out from inside you?

Is it wrong of me as I slowly and pain-stakingly claw my way out of the cave towards the open green field and blue skies, that I want to roll a gigantic boulder back over the exit so that she's stuck down there forever, never to see the light of day again, and never to be able to drag any other poor soul down there with her?

I'll answer my own question. Yes it's wrong. But right or wrong that's where I'm at right now  Smiling (click to insert in post)
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AimingforMastery
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« Reply #20 on: July 02, 2014, 12:27:55 AM »

Here's an analogy that my T used.  You and your BPD partner are both living in a cave.  In that cave, the BPD partner writes all the rules, controls the light and darkness, traps the air, and keeps you trapped.  You, however, are so enamored with keeping her and hoping that the cave somehow magically turns into an open field with bright shining sun and blue skies that you stay in the cave with her and do everything you can to make that cold, dark, clammy cave comfortable for her.  Meanwhile, you are suffocating, being bitten by spiders, suffering from hypothermia, and wasting away.  Still, you are so focused on her and this fantasy that you stay in the cave.

But the longer you stay in the cave, the longer you delay the possibility of finding that open field with the bright shining sun and blue skies.  She's not going to budge, but you feel so "guilty" for leaving her behind that you won't leave the cave.  She's suffering, though you do your best to make it comfortable, and you are suffering more than you can even allow yourself to see.  And there is no hope in the cave.  The only hope is in ONE of you actually leaving the cave, and that means leaving her behind -because you know she isn't going to do it.  If you don't get up, open the door, and leave the cave behind, you will never find the open field, and neither will she.  However, if you do emotionally say goodbye to the cave and move ahead with your life, you can find the open field for yourself.  It will be a long, hard journey, but it can be done.  And then you can finally shed your light to the world.  And who knows... . your loss may prompt her to get up and start finding her way out of the cave, too.  It may not.  She may just find another cave-dweller to be with her.  But there is no chance otherwise.  The longer you stay, the longer she is likely to stay, too.  You are the only one who probably sees how screwed up things are, so you unfortunately bear the responsibility of making the hard choices.  The long, hard journey to the open field... . or the comfortable stay in the cave where you are completely numb to how your own flesh is rotting out from inside you?

Is it wrong of me as I slowly and pain-stakingly claw my way out of the cave towards the open green field and blue skies, that I want to roll a gigantic boulder back over the exit so that she's stuck down there forever, never to see the light of day again, and never to be able to drag any other poor soul down there with her?

I'll answer my own question. Yes it's wrong. But right or wrong that's where I'm at right now  Smiling (click to insert in post)

It's not wrong to want to end and have no part of that behavior ever again.

If she can leave that behavior behind I am sure you would feel different?

I hope that makes you feel better... .:-)
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