Do they really believe the lies they tell about you?

[lanfair]

My ex has painted me black to anybody who will listen. Our breakup was so nasty it ended up in court bc I took an EPO out on her when she had her dad start texting me death threats bc she lied and convinced him I put my hands on her. In response, she filed an EPO chock full of made up tales of abuse and violence. She's also told this everybody in our social circle. She actually ended up winning a DVO against me at the hearing bc of her sobbing as she told completely fabricated stories.

This week I have to go to court bc she filed criminal stalking charges against me, claiming I stalked her by texting her hundreds of times during the week between the breakup and EPO and bc I happened to run into her at a cafe while walking my dog in MY OWN NEIGHBORHOOD that she doesn't even live in anymore. She doctored her phone records to make it look like she hadn't responded to any of my texts, but I have my own phone records and screen shots that show she exaggerated about how many times I texted and that she was, in fact, responding to my text messages. We were primarily going back and forth about her getting the rest of her things out of my apt. and returning my key.

My question is does she really believe the things she is saying? I've seen her convince herself that other made up stories were true because she told them so many times she started to believe it herself. I also saw her start to act out all of the symptoms of bipolar disorder after being diagnosed as bipolar when she had her first mental breakdown over two years into our relationship. She began acting it out and exhibiting stereotypical bipolar behaviors that she never had before. I believe if a doctor were to lie and tell her she had cancer or some other malady she would begin to act out all of the symptoms of that disease.

Has she convinced herself that I really am stalking her and used to physically abuse her, or does she know it isn't true and is just doing it to get revenge now that she has painted me black and hates me?

[DrJones]

I think they really believe them. It has been written that BPDs create facts from emotions, and not the other way around, as nons. Sometimes my wife tells other people about something that happened to us together (on holidays, street, shops, etc... . ) and I simply can't believe what she is telling, because I was there besides her and I know that it was not that way. Nevertheless, it is useless to tell her that it was not like that. She is totally sure of her version.

[goldylamont]

well, it is true that someone can lie so much that over time they can actually start to believe some of the lies are true. or lose track of what's true or untrue because there's so many lies so they just choose to believe what they want. but, no i wouldn't say that she fully believes all of the lies she's telling. what you know is that she fully believes that you should be punished... . for, whatever.

she fully believes you deserve the treatment you're getting, lies be damned. they are just an easy tool to get the job done.

i feel there is a tendency for some to not want to believe that pwBPD are capable of lying while being conscious of it. because this way somehow removes some of their culpability and would make them less 'evil'. yet, pwBPD themselves will admit to consciously telling lies (read up on their forums). some have lots of shame for doing this. others see it as an asset at times.

in my opinion, if the lies being told always serve the purpose of the person doing the lying then there is some conscious component to it, at least initially, whether this person convinces themselves of it or not.

no doubt, she probably "feels" like you abused her and "feels" like you deserve punishment, so the lies aren't really that important. just an expression of baseless emotions.

[Mutt]

Hi lanfair,

I'm sorry that your going through some very difficult things. It's confusing, hurtful and highly stressful situation when your life is turned upside down and your being threatened by her father. You have to defend yourself in court for false charges. Court is tremendous pressure against an invisible disorder. You're going through a BPD smear campaign and false accusations / distortions after a severe break up. You're split black. She is disassociating (lying) to avoid her feelings. I share a similar experience with a Queen / Disassociate and BPD smear campaigns / falsely accused DV charges. Do you have a L?

Hang in there  


- Mutt

It strikes me that the borderliners in our lives have so much negative behaviour in common.

A couple of weeks ago I came to a conclusion that most of that behaviour is due to a single defense mechanism with lots of faces: Dissociation.  I have been reading about dissociation ever since.

Common behaviour:

- Daydreaming, fasing out = dissociation

- depersonalised sex = dissociation

- "Black and White" thinking = dissociation

- Self mutilation, cutting = dissociation

- Remembering things differently than others do, lying = dissociation

- Raging = dissociation

We all have our occasional dissociation in the form of daydreaming, meditation, dancing on music until we get in a trance state... . But I believe BPD's do it quite often without having control over it as we do; and their dissociation does not limit itself to occasional daydreaming; it has a lot of different faces.

If the feelings of the BPD do not match the situation or reality, the BPD will alter the situation/reality to the point it does match.  They do this because they do not want to be confronted with their out-of-place feelings.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=68392.0

[free-n-clear]

she had her dad start texting me death threats... . This week I have to go to court bc she filed criminal stalking charges against me, claiming I stalked her by texting her hundreds of times  She doctored her phone records to make it look like she hadn't responded to any of my texts, but I have my own phone records and screen shots that show she exaggerated about how many times I texted and that she was, in fact, responding to my text messages. We were primarily going back and forth about her getting the rest of her things out of my apt. and returning my key.

   If you still have the texts from her Dad in your phone, and you have a half-decent lawyer, you should be sweet when it comes to Court. I was once charged with assault following an extended loud raging rant by uBPDxgf which went on so long the neighbours called the Police so they could get some peace and quiet. When they arrived, she lied through her teeth and after my first-ever ride in the back of a paddy-wagon, I spent the next several hours in a cell at the cop shop. When it got to court a few weeks later, I was able to prove that much of what was in her statement was untrue - she'd even lied about real basic stuff like her address.   The neighbours also gave evidence that supported my case, and the charges were dismissed.

[lanfair]

I do have a very good lawyer that a good friend whose dad was a retired judge hooked me up with. He's fairly confident that this will get dismissed since I have the screenshots of her dad threatening me and screenshots of her replying to my texts and my phone records that show that she obviously has doctored hers to omit her replies to me. I honestly cannot even believe she was foolish enough to think she could do that and I wouldn't be able to disprove it. Unfortunately, before I ran into her that night at the cafe, I had deleted her number and all texts from her, so I only have the replies from that night until four days later when I took out the EPO, but I do have phone records showing all the other times she replied. I guess she got so bold bc she got away with blatant perjury at the EPO hearing and doesn't realize the magnitude of what she is doing- playing games and lying in court when in this case it is so easy to disprove. My lawyer said it probably won't get dismissed at this first court date bc prosecutors are always cautious when there are situations in which people are supposedly violent or suicidal (she also put in the statement when filing the charges that I threatened to kill her and myself), but that the prosecutor will probably postpone until another court date a few months from now to make sure nothing else happens and then dismiss the charge. The unfortunate part is it has cost me a grand so far just to prove my innocence, and I still ended up with a DVO against ME in spite of filing an EPO first. The lawyer I had for that hearing was useless, he sat there like a block of concrete while her and her lawyer painted me out to be a vicious monster. Luckily my friend has connected me with this new lawyer that is supposed to be a very high powered and well respected attorney that would normally cost me a whole lot more than what he's charging me bc of my friend.

The main reason she was able to get the DVO against me is bc she turned lesbian immediately after we broke up and she brought her new gf and another friend that were with her the night I ran into her while walking my dog as witnesses that I supposedly grabbed her and violently shook her. This all supposedly happened on a crowded cafe patio around 9 pm in the most popular part of the city where there are tons of passersby and yet somehow nobody called the police. I was completely blindsided by the accusation bc in the EPO she filed all she said was that I came to the cafe she was at while walking my dog, no mention of violence. The cafe has security cameras on their patio that I tried to get after the hearing to get the DVO reversed, but they re-record over themselves after a week unless there's an incident that they need the footage for. So unfortunately by the time we got to court and I find out she's claiming this happened, the footage from the cameras had been wiped out. 

It does help that nobody from our social circle or any of our mutual friends believe all the things she's said about me- that I abused her, I'm on drugs, I'm on steroids (I'm fairly big and muscular bc I spent 6 years transforming myself from a very skinny guy and she knew how much it used to annoy me when people would accuse me of being on steroids). It damages her credibility that for 3 and a half years she would constantly post on FB about what an amazing guy I am and she was so completely enamored with me, then I break up with her and suddenly she's a lesbian who has dyed her blonde hair rainbow colors and claims I was abusing her the whole time. Meanwhile I'm acting as consistent as always and refuse to say anything bad about her or participate in the smear campaign. I also have a note from my shrink saying that he has been seeing me for 11 years and I have never shown any signs of being violent or suicidal. My lawyer thinks that will go a long way in court as well. Most of our friends know that she was in the psych ward a year and a half ago bc after she got diagnosed as bipolar it became her explanation for everything in life and all she talked about.

Whether she's lying or truly believes the stuff she's saying, she's obviously a very dangerous person and I've finally seen the whole picture of her. In the big picture it doesn't matter which is true, I was just curious if she genuinely believes these things happened. Obviously she had to be conscious enough to manipulate her phone records, so I guess she is aware that not all of it is true, but possibly in her mind she believes I'm so dangerous that the ends justifies the means. I'm assuming that's how she convinced her new gf and friend to come to court and lie. Something along the lines of "Look, I know this isn't how it really happened but he really is dangerous and I'm afraid he is going to kill me but I have no proof. I need you all to vouch for me so I can get protection from him before he kills me!" I would imagine the new gf is pretty unhealthy herself bc if I just started dating a girl and she asked me right off the bat to perjure myself in court for her in order to get her ex in trouble, I would run for the hills and think if she did that to him after 3 and a half years, what will she do to me when it's over? I guess my replacement will learn that the hard way. I remember when I met her she claimed her ex was stalking her and called me freaking out while I was in New York bc she ran into him at Target while she was with her mom. As far as I know all he did was try to talk to her and she was so shaken and fearful of the experience she was ready to call the cops.

[enlighten me]

I do believe that they think some of the stuff is true.

I wont go into details with mine as I still find it traumatising but mine had me do something which at the time I wasn't comfortable with (minds out of the gutter please). Afterwards she threw it back in my face and blamed me for it and how she felt. Her version of events follows the true event but misses out three key events. In this way she has completely rewritten what happened but has avoided lying. Those three events transform what happened from me being uncomfortable, loving and caring to a heartless selfish b'stard.

I have seen her do this a lot.

There are also the "I told you" events where they really believe they told you something and your in trouble for not remembering. This is not an intentional lie as they truly believe they did tell you.

I find that conventional lies weren't that common as both my ex wife and ex gf weren't very good liars so avoided it.

[OutOfEgypt]

There was actually a post in another thread by someone who HAS BPD, and they explained it from their point of view.  It went something like this (paraphrasing):  They don't really believe their lies, but facing their lies means facing the truth (and all the terribly intense feelings of guilt and shame, etc.), and they don't want to face the truth.  So, it is easier to lie.

[strong9]

There was actually a post in another thread by someone who HAS BPD, and they explained it from their point of view.  It went something like this (paraphrasing):  They don't really believe their lies, but facing their lies means facing the truth (and all the terribly intense feelings of guilt and shame, etc.), and they don't want to face the truth.  So, it is easier to lie.

That's interesting. So is this part of the reason BPD is so hard to treat? I would think that the longer they live with the lies and the more lies that are needed to cover up prior lies and explain subsequent events, not only do they start to believe it but to unravel everything would elicit such shame as to be tantamount to emotional suicide. Do they get to the point of no return? Is that why my uBPDw always wants to hit reset and forget the past (other than my supposed transgressions of course)? I've heard others though state their pwBPD will candidly accept their transgressions and hurtful behavior but blame you for it. Others will deny deny deny and lie. Are there studies as to the different pathologies? Is it a factor of upbringing and values that may still resonate, the level of dependency they have on you, how you react to things, culture, etc?

[TheBPDSurvivor]

They don't really believe their lies, but facing their lies means facing the truth (and all the terribly intense feelings of guilt and shame, etc.), and they don't want to face the truth.  So, it is easier to lie.

This ^!

I'm not an expert but from my deep understanding of how their mind works, Its pretty clear that they are very much aware of the lies and false accusations they're putting on us but they don't feel sorry for that. They don't really care what you think/feel about them. They do this because of all the guilt and don't want to get shamed for their behaviours. Also they don't really believe in their lies but a coward tactic to make people around them to believe whatever they say about us so they'll put up whatever lies comes on their mind to cover their shame.

Proving her guilty on the court will really make her go insane because all the plans she has made so far will get lost.

[OutOfEgypt]

That's interesting. So is this part of the reason BPD is so hard to treat? I would think that the longer they live with the lies and the more lies that are needed to cover up prior lies and explain subsequent events, not only do they start to believe it but to unravel everything would elicit such shame as to be tantamount to emotional suicide.

I think so, yes.  My T says it like this:  having someong with BPD (or NPD) face all of their guilt and shame is like forcing them to stare directly into the sun.  They have massive unconscious resistance... . MASSIVE.  The thing is... . I'm sure all of their horrible behavior, and subsequent rejection by others, only compounds it all.  Another way my T says it is like this:  BPD's (and NPD's) survive by taking all of their internal conflicts and putting them externally onto those closest to them.  In that sense, everybody around them becomes a crutch, and boy... . we feel the weight, and so do our kids, don't we?  If everyone would actually stand up, stop taking all the blame, stop taking all their projection, and stop being around to fill their ego up by slathering them with all the attention and adoration they crave, they would crumple.  That likely won't ever happen in this life, though.  They'll always find someone to suck in and depend upon in this way.  From what I have read, the few "success" stories happen when a pwBPD hits rock botton after losing someone.

But from what my T says, many psychologists believe that true BP and NP's are not ultimately treatable.  The resistance to letting go of the false self, which allows them to avoid their true self and all the shame filling the gulf between the two, is too massive and too engrained.

[AlbertS]

My exgirlfriend has apparently said some bad things about me to three people. But I do not know what she was saying, since none of them seems to want to talk to me. Two of them are our mutual online friends (we have met online), and they ignore me or lie to me, and one is my high school friend (who has previously seen us together just twice), and he does not seem to understand why I consider what he has done (talking to her in secret from me, inviting her to parties and introducing her to more people, asking only her for explanations, contacting her after telling me that they have broken contact, not explaining to me what actually happened and why he does not respect my wishes) to be not respectful of our friendship. I do not know whether they believe her or me, or whether what she is saying is mountain-out-of-molehill, projections, or lies with no basis in reality. I don't care about the online friends, but I wonder what happened between her and my highschool friend.

Interestingly, I was stalked by another girl later. I immediately classified her as a personality disordered person and broke contact with her. She blamed her friend, who has decided to contact me, I explained the friend what actually happened. She believed me, thanked me for breaking the illusions, and told me some details about the distortion campaign conducted against me.

[Changingman]

I see it more as... . no they don't believe the lies they say, but they believe the feelings they have.

dissociation is a powerful defence, we should know. How else could we ignore their behaviours, how could we be so blind.

The smear campaign... . awful, just awful.

[lanfair]

The smear campaign... . awful, just awful.

Yeah. It doesn't help that she's 4'11 and 100 lbs and I'm a 220 lb meathead that's pretty introverted and quiet until I get to know people well. She's very bubbly and outgoing and bc of the way I look I think I tend to come across as surly and intimidating until people actually get to know me. It looks fairly credible to passive onlookers that I'm probably some roid-raging maniac that roughed up this sweet little girl. I make sure to wear very baggy slacks and dress shirts to court for that reason.

[goldylamont]

I see it more as... . no they don't believe the lies they say, but they believe the feelings they have.

i think this is the most concise and beautifully clarifying ways of understanding the original poster's question. i may have to repost this when the question is asked again.

[Infared]

I could never tell if they believe the lies they tell or not.

When I confronted mine with irrefutable evidence of her lying (she ran off with new hero but said there was no one), she said "oh, well those were lies I told you after I left you!" So I guess that makes them OK?... . oh the joy of dealing with a 5-year-old.

But... . then... . she stated to me that she met (name) after she left me (yeah right, they are living together 2 weeks later, according to her they are not)... . and I bring up all the times that she talked about this person when we were living together (she met him 2 years before and was probably involved with him the entire time), she gets silent and acts confused. I could never figure out if she was dillusional, confused about keeping her lies straight, or was just caught ineptly lying and did not know what to say.  I will never know.  

The worst part is, I still miss her... . but I promised me that I will NEVER talk to her again.Always too damaging.

[Changingman]

Ianfair,

Good luck in court. This stuff is hard, be yourself, tell it how it is, keep your emotions level in court.

Goldy,

I find that the nursery rhyme/horror story that my relationship was, needs new ways of expressing the crazymaking. People can't imagine the truth of a BPD relationship, it's too crazy.

Infared,

'I could never figure out if she was dillusional, confused about keeping her lies straight, or was just caught ineptly lying and did not know what to say.  I will never know. '

This is something I had to face almost immediately we broke up. 'I will never know', about her, her cartoon like character, other RSs, Friends ( ha ha ha ), the abortion, her near sackings at work, her stories of childhood, etc... .

But what is obvious is that all the worry and b___ing that she told me night after night about how her coworkers hated/conspired/tried to get her sacked etc were just part of the disorder.

When I put the fragments of what I knew together with the new awareness of BPD... . hand in glove.

As a friend pointed out for instance: The Abortion!

Did she actually have one?

Did she just use it as a manipulation/trauma bond and spend the money

Was it yours?

Was it someone elses?

Why did she tell you she couldn't have Babies when you know she had an abortion at 19?

Why was she drinking and drugged up for 3 weeks until she told you?

Why was it such a shock that her behaviours were 'normal' ( ha ha ha ) for that 3 weeks?

Why did she recover with almost no effect from it and go into an affair within 3 weeks?

Did she have any other abortions while with you?

How many people had she slept with while with you?

This is one tiny part of our time 'together' ( ha ha ha ).

I had a secret way of knowing for a while how her next relationship progressed, and it was amazing how it was the same behaviours, the same crisis/drama making etc. I thought she loved going out, but even that was just me. She liked drink and drugs and talking about herself. We are just bodies to them, later corpses.

But I'll never know any particular truth, just the truth about Borderline Personality Disorder.

I love that you caught her Infared, and STILL it was like looking into a hall of mirrors.

I don't miss her, she is gone from within me, I don't miss the 'good times' they were as ridiculous and as fictional as the bad times. I look back and it seems really really dark, really dizzy, half seen, stunted, poisonous and to be honest boring, keeping her from going... . numb.

Her best friend, an exBF obviously, is still wandering around as friendless as her trying to reconnect with me and my friends, not a chance, miscalls all of them.

If I saw her though, I'd probably have a panic attack.

[Frankcostello]

I also had to go through something very similar.  My exBPDgf tried to file a restraining order against me for stalking. Mind you her version of me stalking her was when I saw her two blocks from MY house with another guy.  When I ran into her that night, I didn't talk to her nor bother her when she was walking by with this other guy.  I just left her alone.  As it turns out she was so scared of me stalking her from that night (two blocks from MY house) that she waited six days to go to the court and filed for a restraining order.  The judge granted her a temporary restraining order until the hearing three weeks later for a permanent restraining order.  The judge quickly dismissed the restraining order claim at the hearing.  It was absurd and it affected me emotionally for a long time.  I felt betrayed and alone from having to go through something so horrible with all her lying, cheating, abuse, bad mouthing me to anyone who would listen, accusations.  I know how you feel having to go through the court process, it seemed like my exBPDgf enjoyed seeing me cringe at the hearing because of the embarrassment and sadness from not doing anything wrong, it was some sort of evil satisfaction that she got out of it. 

[enlighten me]

I also had to go through something very similar.  My exBPDgf tried to file a restraining order against me for stalking. Mind you her version of me stalking her was when I saw her two blocks from MY house with another guy.  When I ran into her that night, I didn't talk to her nor bother her when she was walking by with this other guy.  I just left her alone.  As it turns out she was so scared of me stalking her from that night (two blocks from MY house) that she waited six days to go to the court and filed for a restraining order.  The judge granted her a temporary restraining order until the hearing three weeks later for a permanent restraining order.  The judge quickly dismissed the restraining order claim at the hearing.  It was absurd and it affected me emotionally for a long time.  I felt betrayed and alone from having to go through something so horrible with all her lying, cheating, abuse, bad mouthing me to anyone who would listen, accusations.  I know how you feel having to go through the court process, it seemed like my exBPDgf enjoyed seeing me cringe at the hearing because of the embarrassment and sadness from not doing anything wrong, it was some sort of evil satisfaction that she got out of it. 

Restraining orders seem to be a common thing with BPDs. Ive been thinking about this and my thoughts are theyre not to hurt you they are to prevent the BPD from being hurt. Not in a physical way by you but emotionally. Her bumping into you with her new boyfriend probably brought up so much guilt that she wanted to avoid having to go through it. The fact that she seemed to enjoy the court case was probably more the fact that she enjoyed seeing you still had feelings for her.

They are not heartless monsters they just cant handle who they really are and we remind them of that so they do everything they can to avoid it,

[goldylamont]

... .I know how you feel having to go through the court process, it seemed like my exBPDgf enjoyed seeing me cringe at the hearing because of the embarrassment and sadness from not doing anything wrong, it was some sort of evil satisfaction that she got out of it.  

Restraining orders seem to be a common thing with BPDs. Ive been thinking about this and my thoughts are theyre not to hurt you they are to prevent the BPD from being hurt. Not in a physical way by you but emotionally. Her bumping into you with her new boyfriend probably brought up so much guilt that she wanted to avoid having to go through it. The fact that she seemed to enjoy the court case was probably more the fact that she enjoyed seeing you still had feelings for her.

They are not heartless monsters they just cant handle who they really are and we remind them of that so they do everything they can to avoid it,

enlightened one i do think your perspective can be true in some cases. in other cases i would take Frankcostello's perspective as true.

sometimes a pwBPD behavior can seem heartless to us when in actuality it wasn't meant to be, they are just trying to survive and we are collateral damage. this possibility however does not mean that pwBPD are *never* heartless monsters--in fact it's their behaving like one which is why there are so many of us here.

pwBPD often do things to seek punishment and revenge against someone they feel has wronged them. and their idea of justice to punish you is way harsher than what a normal person would do. perhaps a pwBPD could actually feel unsafe, be paranoid or feel shame/guilt and file a restraining order to push these feelings away. at the same time they can just be full of hate and take joy in seeing you suffer--they can relish in the "justice" of seeing you suffer.

revenge and punishment is a large part of disorder as well abandonment and shame. we have to use our own instincts and wisdom to try and parse out what the motive may be.

[enlighten me]

Hi Goldy

While I agree some will take pleasure in punishing you I would like to throw another layer onto the confusion.

By punishing you could they not also be projecting that they need to be punished?  

I should stop this before my head explodes.

[eagle755]

Is this punishing thing true?

I was wondering about that

It seemed like my ex almost wanted to be punished and abused. Like, she had positive responses to abuse to her.

As well as abuse to me. Whenever I broke down crying, she actually did whatever she could to comfort me. Which is weird, knowing how they are

[enlighten me]

In all honesty I cant say.

It does make sense though that for some the only time they would have got attention is when they were being bad as a child. Therefore why cant that behaviour continue into adult life.

Also they may feel the need to be punished but not want to actually have to be. Theres a lot of BPD behaviour that almost goes all the way but doesn't quite make it. What I mean is like the veiled confessions posed as a question. "What would you do if I'd cheated on you with some guy I met at the bar last weekend?" There are other things like this where they appear to want to tell the truth but cant quite do it.

[antjs]

I see it more as... . no they don't believe the lies they say, but they believe the feelings they have.

i think this is the most concise and beautifully clarifying ways of understanding the original poster's question. i may have to repost this when the question is asked again.

Thats the reason for the crazy making or rage. When the feelings do not match the fact they have to do something about the facts happening right now to suit the feelings. My ex once made a crazy making infront of my friend to suit her bad feelings cause we had a conflict before meeting him and i then tried to ignore what happened and acted cool infront of my friend. She could not take it raged and made some crazy ___ (suddenly she accused me of being over jealous and took of my friend's tshirt )

[lanfair]

Just an update on the most recent BS of the Domestic Violence Order she has against me. A couple weeks ago we had court for the made up stalking charge she also filed against me. Well, she has befriended a lawyer that she used to be completely disgusted by. I only had one enemy in this world, and it's this guy who is a NP who couldn't stand the fact that I had slept with and was really good friends with his gf before he started dating her. So he has hated me for 4 years now. I never respond to his trashing me and people see him for what he is, a terrible person. He's almost been disbarred in the past for trading legal services for sex and getting blackmailed by Craigslist hookers that found out he's a lawyer. A real class act.

Anyway, she has now befriended and sought his help in trying to put me in jail. She tagged him in a status on FB the day we had court for the stalking charge (even though a prosecutor is handling that case), and everybody being aware of how much this guy hates me and what her motives were, a friend called her out on her FB status telling her to grow up, this has gotten out of hand and gone way too far, etc. A couple days later I get a motion in the mail to go back to family court claiming I violated the DVO by either posting the comment under that girl's name or putting her up to do it bc she threatened to release pornographic pictures of my ex (she never threatened or knew such pics existed) and that it had to be as only my ex and I knew of the existence of the pics. We had the hearing last Tuesday, should have been simple enough, I brought the girl as a witness to say she never made the threats and posted her comment completely of her own accord. That's when I find out the real reason for my ex and her lawyer filing the motion: they had a surprise witness there stating he saw me at an AA mtg that my ex was under the mistaken assumption I am banned from because she sometimes goes there. She wasn't at the mtg that night, and even if I were to go and she is there, I just have to leave immediately. If their little stunt had worked, I would have gotten 6 months in jail for going to a mtg my ex WASN'T EVEN AT. That is the extent to which she wants revenge on me.

Luckily even the judge was annoyed at her attempt to get me locked up for being someplace she wasn't even at, and I think he realizes now that my ex is just out for revenge. My attorney, who I believe up to this point thought I was just being overly paranoid, now sees that my ex and this lawyer are conspiring to get me locked up in any way they can. Every time we have gone to court they have had a last minute surprise that we were unprepared for, so my lawyer was able to get the judge to agree that they have to file an affidavit 2 weeks before court with any evidence they attempt to use so that we have time to prepare for it. That shoots down her and her attorney's entire strategy of last minute surprises, which is how she got the DVO in the first place, showing up the morning of the hearing for the EPO I filed first, in which she responded with an EPO full of lies, with surprise witnesses claiming they saw me manhandle her outside a cafe, which never happened, wasn't in her EPO and for which I had no time to prepare a defense against. At least now my attorney sees that I'm not just being paranoid, my ex and this attorney both have personal vendettas against me and will stoop to any low to frame me and have me locked up. I don't even think their "witness" was at the AA mtg I went to that they were referring to, he's just a friend of the attorney's, who is also in AA.

And to think just 4 months ago I was the only person stopping this girl from being homeless and starving on the street bc she lost her job and apartment and her own family wouldn't take her in. She was also on crutches at the hearing, but I can't find anybody to confirm she's been on crutches or posted anything on FB about being injured recently, so that may have been a ploy for sympathy as well.  These really are some sick, sick, people.

[free-n-clear]

Well, she has befriended a lawyer... .He's almost been disbarred in the past for trading legal services for sex and getting blackmailed by hookers. A real class act... .

Luckily even the judge was annoyed at her... .my lawyer was able to get the judge to agree that they have to file an affidavit 2 weeks before court with any evidence they attempt to use so that we have time to prepare for it. That shoots down her and her attorney's entire strategy... .At least now my attorney sees that I'm not just being paranoid.

   On the whole, I'd say it's looking pretty good. You only have to be yourself and be truthful, and justice should prevail.

And to think just 4 months ago I was the only person stopping this girl from being homeless and starving on the street... .her own family wouldn't take her in.

   I trust you understand why, now?   

[Frankcostello]

Just an update on the most recent BS of the Domestic Violence Order she has against me. A couple weeks ago we had court for the made up stalking charge she also filed against me. Well, she has befriended a lawyer that she used to be completely disgusted by. I only had one enemy in this world, and it's this guy who is a NP who couldn't stand the fact that I had slept with and was really good friends with his gf before he started dating her. So he has hated me for 4 years now. I never respond to his trashing me and people see him for what he is, a terrible person. He's almost been disbarred in the past for trading legal services for sex and getting blackmailed by Craigslist hookers that found out he's a lawyer. A real class act.

Anyway, she has now befriended and sought his help in trying to put me in jail. She tagged him in a status on FB the day we had court for the stalking charge (even though a prosecutor is handling that case), and everybody being aware of how much this guy hates me and what her motives were, a friend called her out on her FB status telling her to grow up, this has gotten out of hand and gone way too far, etc. A couple days later I get a motion in the mail to go back to family court claiming I violated the DVO by either posting the comment under that girl's name or putting her up to do it bc she threatened to release pornographic pictures of my ex (she never threatened or knew such pics existed) and that it had to be as only my ex and I knew of the existence of the pics. We had the hearing last Tuesday, should have been simple enough, I brought the girl as a witness to say she never made the threats and posted her comment completely of her own accord. That's when I find out the real reason for my ex and her lawyer filing the motion: they had a surprise witness there stating he saw me at an AA mtg that my ex was under the mistaken assumption I am banned from because she sometimes goes there. She wasn't at the mtg that night, and even if I were to go and she is there, I just have to leave immediately. If their little stunt had worked, I would have gotten 6 months in jail for going to a mtg my ex WASN'T EVEN AT. That is the extent to which she wants revenge on me.

Luckily even the judge was annoyed at her attempt to get me locked up for being someplace she wasn't even at, and I think he realizes now that my ex is just out for revenge. My attorney, who I believe up to this point thought I was just being overly paranoid, now sees that my ex and this lawyer are conspiring to get me locked up in any way they can. Every time we have gone to court they have had a last minute surprise that we were unprepared for, so my lawyer was able to get the judge to agree that they have to file an affidavit 2 weeks before court with any evidence they attempt to use so that we have time to prepare for it. That shoots down her and her attorney's entire strategy of last minute surprises, which is how she got the DVO in the first place, showing up the morning of the hearing for the EPO I filed first, in which she responded with an EPO full of lies, with surprise witnesses claiming they saw me manhandle her outside a cafe, which never happened, wasn't in her EPO and for which I had no time to prepare a defense against. At least now my attorney sees that I'm not just being paranoid, my ex and this attorney both have personal vendettas against me and will stoop to any low to frame me and have me locked up. I don't even think their "witness" was at the AA mtg I went to that they were referring to, he's just a friend of the attorney's, who is also in AA.

And to think just 4 months ago I was the only person stopping this girl from being homeless and starving on the street bc she lost her job and apartment and her own family wouldn't take her in. She was also on crutches at the hearing, but I can't find anybody to confirm she's been on crutches or posted anything on FB about being injured recently, so that may have been a ploy for sympathy as well.  These really are some sick, sick, people.

Lanfair when my exBPDgf tried to get a bogus restraining order against me the best advice I got was to stay as far away as possible from her.  If she knows where you frequent such as aa meetings, see if you can find another aa meeting you can go to while this thing blows over, or any other place she knows you frequent stay away for a while at least.  In other words disappear for a while.  That's what I did for a long time after my exBPDgf tried to get a bogus restraining order against me because I knew that if I went to a place she knew I frequented and she miraculously showed up in her own warped up mind she would've said I was stalking her even though nothing could have been further from the truth.  During that time they are not rationale, they almost seem as you said paranoid.  It's horrifying to go through the restraining order process when you know you've done nothing wrong.  I saw my exBPDgf two blocks from my house with another guy even though she lived about 10 miles away and she said I was stalking her, go figure. Stay away from her and don't bring her up to any of your friends nor anyone else, disappear and don't talk about her to friends or family.