How common is it for Borderlines to change and be normal?

[Pretty Woman]

I was thinking more about this... .

How has your personality changed in ten years? Dramatically? Likely not. Someone with a disorder who lives in "la la land"? Slim to none.

[hergestridge]

I was thinking more about this... .

How has your personality changed in ten years? Dramatically? Likely not. Someone with a disorder who lives in "la la land"? Slim to none.

That's it. A personality disorder is a disodered personality, not a personality that has caught a disorder.

Most of us has attached to our BPD partners because we think they are something (or can BECOME something) that they are not. They were not "normal" to begin with. "Normal" is something they will have to learn. It is like it would be for you or me to learn to live "disordered". Learning through imitation.

A personality disorder means you don't learn by trial and error - which is the normal mechanism for learning - so they have to learn like you do at school. Not everyone will have the motivation to do that.

For a person with a personality disorder, change to "normal" won't come natural.

A lot of facts like "x % of people with BPD don't show the symptoms x years later" are bandied about a lot, but that doesn't take into account that pwBPD change their life situations. BPD symptoms appear in situations where a person live under preasure and the pwBPD is likely to run into trouble in a close relationship, a parenting situation or in workplace conflicts. Under the right circumstances everything seems to work OK.

[apollotech]

What disappoints me most is that she will admit she's BPD and she "isn't right" (her words), but she refuses to do anything about it.  So, in my case, no... .she'll never be better. She's willfully hurting/using people and doesn't seem to care about it.

Lonely_Astro,

That is pretty much the same conclusion that I have come to accept about my BPDexgf. Although she has not been diagnosed with BPD, that I know of, and therefore, doesn't admitt to having BPD, she does admitt to "having issues" (her words).

Like yours, with that knowledge in hand, she makes no attempt to address her "issues." Like yours, she seems to just not care about how others are affected by her "issues." Those affected include her mother, siblings, and, saddest of all, her own children. Of course, those same people have enabled her behavior for years. It's a toxic pool no matter where you jump in.

Because of the very long relationship that we had (friends since childhood), it saddens me that she has resigned herself to this life. Of course, I have to remind myself that her life works for her; although, it appears broken to me.

[FannyB]

A lot of facts like "x % of people with BPD don't show the symptoms x years later" are bandied about a lot, but that doesn't take into account that pwBPD change their life situations. BPD symptoms appear in situations where a person live under preasure and the pwBPD is likely to run into trouble in a close relationship, a parenting situation or in workplace conflicts. Under the right circumstances everything seems to work OK.

I think a lot of pwBPD might associate it as being a relationship issue as they get older and simply gravitate toward hermit status. If they've retired by then and the kids have flown the nest then they will have eliminated many of the BPD triggers from their lives.

Just a thought!

Fanny

[rotiroti]

A lot of facts like "x % of people with BPD don't show the symptoms x years later" are bandied about a lot, but that doesn't take into account that pwBPD change their life situations. BPD symptoms appear in situations where a person live under preasure and the pwBPD is likely to run into trouble in a close relationship, a parenting situation or in workplace conflicts. Under the right circumstances everything seems to work OK.

I think a lot of pwBPD might associate it as being a relationship issue as they get older and simply gravitate toward hermit status. If they've retired by then and the kids have flown the nest then they will have eliminated many of the BPD triggers from their lives.

Just a thought!

Fanny

That's a pretty interesting thought! I met an older woman at the nursing home, told me how she was wild and promiscuous until her 51st birthday and just stopped everything. She became a hermit. I don't think she ever married nor have kids, but was close with her brother. She had a very successful life until then

[FannyB]

In such a scenario they wouldn't be exhibiting BPD behaviours - but you couldn't say they were cured either! Life/circumstances would effectively be managing the disorder for them. Maybe this explains the theory that BPD lessens with age? 

[klacey3]

What disappoints me most is that she will admit she's BPD and she "isn't right" (her words), but she refuses to do anything about it.  So, in my case, no... .she'll never be better. She's willfully hurting/using people and doesn't seem to care about it.

Lonely_Astro,

That is pretty much the same conclusion that I have come to accept about my BPDexgf. Although she has not been diagnosed with BPD, that I know of, and therefore, doesn't admitt to having BPD, she does admitt to "having issues" (her words).

Like yours, with that knowledge in hand, she makes no attempt to address her "issues." Like yours, she seems to just not care about how others are affected by her "issues." Those affected include her mother, siblings, and, saddest of all, her own children. Of course, those same people have enabled her behavior for years. It's a toxic pool no matter where you jump in.

Because of the very long relationship that we had (friends since childhood), it saddens me that she has resigned herself to this life. Of course, I have to remind myself that her life works for her; although, it appears broken to me.

Mine admitted to "having issues" aswell. What do they even really mean by this?

In relation to the thread, I think it depends on how much therapy they have and their medication.

[hergestridge]

A lot of facts like "x % of people with BPD don't show the symptoms x years later" are bandied about a lot, but that doesn't take into account that pwBPD change their life situations. BPD symptoms appear in situations where a person live under preasure and the pwBPD is likely to run into trouble in a close relationship, a parenting situation or in workplace conflicts. Under the right circumstances everything seems to work OK.

I think a lot of pwBPD might associate it as being a relationship issue as they get older and simply gravitate toward hermit status. If they've retired by then and the kids have flown the nest then they will have eliminated many of the BPD triggers from their lives.

Just a thought!

Fanny

I would guess a fair percentage of the hermits of this world are people like that.

[Lonely_Astro]

What disappoints me most is that she will admit she's BPD and she "isn't right" (her words), but she refuses to do anything about it.  So, in my case, no... .she'll never be better. She's willfully hurting/using people and doesn't seem to care about it.

Lonely_Astro,

That is pretty much the same conclusion that I have come to accept about my BPDexgf. Although she has not been diagnosed with BPD, that I know of, and therefore, doesn't admitt to having BPD, she does admitt to "having issues" (her words).

Like yours, with that knowledge in hand, she makes no attempt to address her "issues." Like yours, she seems to just not care about how others are affected by her "issues." Those affected include her mother, siblings, and, saddest of all, her own children. Of course, those same people have enabled her behavior for years. It's a toxic pool no matter where you jump in.

Because of the very long relationship that we had (friends since childhood), it saddens me that she has resigned herself to this life. Of course, I have to remind myself that her life works for her; although, it appears broken to me.

Mine admitted to "having issues" aswell. What do they even really mean by this?

In relation to the thread, I think it depends on how much therapy they have and their medication.

In my pwBPD, she told me that she always knew what she was doing wasn't right and our relationship 3 years ago made her realize that she was hurting herself and everyone so she entered therapy where she was diagnosed BPD. She claimed to have been in "serious" therapy and was on meds to regulate. She honestly seemed normal to me. She took responsibility for her past acts and would often mention her therapist. Once we started getting serious again, she said her therapist had taken the sessions from once a week to every two weeks to once a month. Then she eventually stopped talking about therapy altogether.  At this point, I don't believe she ever went "seriously" to therapy, but I do know she was on all sorts of meds as she showed me the bottles (there were about 6).

To answer your question, it's been my experience that she always knew that what she was doing/feeling wasn't normal. Fine. I could accept that before she was diagnosed. But now?  No. Now she knows what's wrong and feels like everyone else should not hold her accountable for what's she doing because it's "not her fault she's sick" (her words).  When she broke down Monday, she was crying hysterically and saying how she hated being sick and her brother wasn't ("why do I have to be the sick one and not him?" and how she hated taking meds all the time to feel "normal", and how she hated this and that and how no one would ever love her (which isn't true)... .it went on like that for about 10 mins. It actually got under my skin because she knows why she's this way (we talked about it ad nauseam), she's just refusing to do anything about it. She blamed me for seeing the new guy, her "ex" husband for being abusive, and even blamed the new guy for not loving her like I do.  It was total meltdown unlike I've seen before.  

[Loosestrife]

What disappoints me most is that she will admit she's BPD and she "isn't right" (her words), but she refuses to do anything about it.  So, in my case, no... .she'll never be better. She's willfully hurting/using people and doesn't seem to care about it.

Lonely_Astro,

That is pretty much the same conclusion that I have come to accept about my BPDexgf. Although she has not been diagnosed with BPD, that I know of, and therefore, doesn't admitt to having BPD, she does admitt to "having issues" (her words).

Like yours, with that knowledge in hand, she makes no attempt to address her "issues." Like yours, she seems to just not care about how others are affected by her "issues." Those affected include her mother, siblings, and, saddest of all, her own children. Of course, those same people have enabled her behavior for years. It's a toxic pool no matter where you jump in.

Because of the very long relationship that we had (friends since childhood), it saddens me that she has resigned herself to this life. Of course, I have to remind myself that her life works for her; although, it appears broken to me.

Mine admitted to "having issues" aswell. What do they even really mean by this?

In relation to the thread, I think it depends on how much therapy they have and their medication.

In my pwBPD, she told me that she always knew what she was doing wasn't right and our relationship 3 years ago made her realize that she was hurting herself and everyone so she entered therapy where she was diagnosed BPD. She claimed to have been in "serious" therapy and was on meds to regulate. She honestly seemed normal to me. She took responsibility for her past acts and would often mention her therapist. Once we started getting serious again, she said her therapist had taken the sessions from once a week to every two weeks to once a month. Then she eventually stopped talking about therapy altogether.  At this point, I don't believe she ever went "seriously" to therapy, but I do know she was on all sorts of meds as she showed me the bottles (there were about 6).

To answer your question, it's been my experience that she always knew that what she was doing/feeling wasn't normal. Fine. I could accept that before she was diagnosed. But now?  No. Now she knows what's wrong and feels like everyone else should not hold her accountable for what's she doing because it's "not her fault she's sick" (her words).  When she broke down Monday, she was crying hysterically and saying how she hated being sick and her brother wasn't ("why do I have to be the sick one and not him?" and how she hated taking meds all the time to feel "normal", and how she hated this and that and how no one would ever love her (which isn't true)... .it went on like that for about 10 mins. It actually got under my skin because she knows why she's this way (we talked about it ad nauseam), she's just refusing to do anything about it. She blamed me for seeing the new guy, her "ex" husband for being abusive, and even blamed the new guy for not loving her like I do.  It was total meltdown unlike I've seen before.  

WOW - I can relate to this - the " I can't help it I'm ill" routine and then blaming everyone from her past... .Until someone starts accepting responsibility for their behaviour and not blaming a disorder or meds or others, they will never really recover or be normal

[skittles22]

Mine admitted to "having issues" aswell. What do they even really mean by this?

Mine also. She was diagnosed and knows everything that's wrong with her, admitting to everything she puts people through at the end of our relationship, then jumps into a new one 1 month later and moves in with him just weeks after that. Seems very calculating... .sometimes I do wonder if she just couldn't resist. Maybe she thought he was really nice or really good looking, and just had to be with him or something... .it's mind blowing how she can admit everything that's wrong with her and still just twist the facts in her own head to suit her own needs. I spoke to her ex-best friend after we broke up, I found out that my ex cut her off after she called the paramedics and saved her life. This was someone my ex called a "horrible person", and as it turns out she was projecting. In reality, her old best friend is one of the nicest people I've ever met. I wonder what she says about me to the new guys... .

[SummerStorm]

Mine admitted to "having issues" aswell. What do they even really mean by this?

Mine also. She was diagnosed and knows everything that's wrong with her, admitting to everything she puts people through at the end of our relationship, then jumps into a new one 1 month later and moves in with him just weeks after that. Seems very calculating... .sometimes I do wonder if she just couldn't resist. Maybe she thought he was really nice or really good looking, and just had to be with him or something... .it's mind blowing how she can admit everything that's wrong with her and still just twist the facts in her own head to suit her own needs. I spoke to her ex-best friend after we broke up, I found out that my ex cut her off after she called the paramedics and saved her life. This was someone my ex called a "horrible person", and as it turns out she was projecting. In reality, her old best friend is one of the nicest people I've ever met. I wonder what she says about me to the new guys... .

Mine cut me out a week after I visited her in the hospital after her suicide attempt.  I held down the fort at work on the day it happened, ran around keeping everyone updated, tried to keep it together in front of my students.  I canceled plans to see one of my students in a play and disappointed the poor girl, just so I could spend an hour talking to her. 

Now, I'm not to contact her at all. 

[Lonely_Astro]

What disappoints me most is that she will admit she's BPD and she "isn't right" (her words), but she refuses to do anything about it.  So, in my case, no... .she'll never be better. She's willfully hurting/using people and doesn't seem to care about it.

Lonely_Astro,

That is pretty much the same conclusion that I have come to accept about my BPDexgf. Although she has not been diagnosed with BPD, that I know of, and therefore, doesn't admitt to having BPD, she does admitt to "having issues" (her words).

Like yours, with that knowledge in hand, she makes no attempt to address her "issues." Like yours, she seems to just not care about how others are affected by her "issues." Those affected include her mother, siblings, and, saddest of all, her own children. Of course, those same people have enabled her behavior for years. It's a toxic pool no matter where you jump in.

Because of the very long relationship that we had (friends since childhood), it saddens me that she has resigned herself to this life. Of course, I have to remind myself that her life works for her; although, it appears broken to me.

Mine admitted to "having issues" aswell. What do they even really mean by this?

In relation to the thread, I think it depends on how much therapy they have and their medication.

In my pwBPD, she told me that she always knew what she was doing wasn't right and our relationship 3 years ago made her realize that she was hurting herself and everyone so she entered therapy where she was diagnosed BPD. She claimed to have been in "serious" therapy and was on meds to regulate. She honestly seemed normal to me. She took responsibility for her past acts and would often mention her therapist. Once we started getting serious again, she said her therapist had taken the sessions from once a week to every two weeks to once a month. Then she eventually stopped talking about therapy altogether.  At this point, I don't believe she ever went "seriously" to therapy, but I do know she was on all sorts of meds as she showed me the bottles (there were about 6).

To answer your question, it's been my experience that she always knew that what she was doing/feeling wasn't normal. Fine. I could accept that before she was diagnosed. But now?  No. Now she knows what's wrong and feels like everyone else should not hold her accountable for what's she doing because it's "not her fault she's sick" (her words).  When she broke down Monday, she was crying hysterically and saying how she hated being sick and her brother wasn't ("why do I have to be the sick one and not him?" and how she hated taking meds all the time to feel "normal", and how she hated this and that and how no one would ever love her (which isn't true)... .it went on like that for about 10 mins. It actually got under my skin because she knows why she's this way (we talked about it ad nauseam), she's just refusing to do anything about it. She blamed me for seeing the new guy, her "ex" husband for being abusive, and even blamed the new guy for not loving her like I do.  It was total meltdown unlike I've seen before.  

WOW - I can relate to this - the " I can't help it I'm ill" routine and then blaming everyone from her past... .Until someone starts accepting responsibility for their behaviour and not blaming a disorder or meds or others, they will never really recover or be normal

I agree.  No, they won't.  At first, she was very lucid and took full responsibility for her actions.  I mean, I honestly believe that in those moments she was lucid and she meant what she said.  At least thats what I choose to believe.  Unfortunately, I don't think that may have been the case.  Any way I slice it, she is still the same damaged to the core girl I once knew.  Unfortunately I bit the hook the second time.  I'm more angry with myself for that than anything else.  

Im sorry that you all have had to deal with violent/suicidal BPDs.  My psBPD never really exploded in violence toward me, but she would cuss about people around me, but never at me if that makes sense (I guess she was more passive aggressive... .   ) or has ever made any suicide attempts (I think she's to NPD for that).  I guess she was an inward rage type rather than an outward rage type?