He finally reached out and wants to meet

[Tangy]

Hey everyone,

I've been gone for a few weeks. I had really started feeling better... .and excitingly have been going on quite a few days and am now seeing someone. I have been doing a lot of internal work... .and my friends picked this guy. We haven't rushed sex... .we've been talking about important things... .he's a match to my education level, interests, values, etc... .he's not rushing me and we're taking it one day at a time

And now it finally happened... .he reached out after 97 days NC. He wants to meet up and talk. He waited too long to reach out. I'm over it. I'm just sitting here trying to figure out how to handle the situation. Because there is a part of me that would like to talk to him to process our three year relationship almost marriage... .and we need to deal with the cell phone/credit card situation... .but I don't want my new guy to get the wrong idea or anything like that... .

He's still the same guy I can tell from his message. He already set a time and place and asked me to meet him there... .without asking my availability or preference... .and said "I know it's selfish for me to be messaging you" then why are you doing it? Just like it was selfish to cheat on me and call off our wedding plans... .


I just can't. He messed up too bad. Grrrrrrrr but yet there is a part of me that feels guilty and obligated to see him... .

[AsGoodAsItGets]

Hmmm.  Wow,  mayb discuss it with the new guy.  Be honest.  I recently encouraged my new partner to see her ex,  closure is a nice thing some times.  I also love reality, and the feeling of honesty from the truth we can share with someone, increasing the trust bond.  Its very normal to be hesitant, three years is a long time, and a new person is a lot. Yet, being honest with yourself and other about situations in your life isn't a bad way to live,  please keep coming back.  We here.

[Creativum]

If you're over it, wish him well, and tell him there's no need to talk about anything. My concern - though I don't know the circumstances of your relationship with this person - is that you could get sucked back in. Remember, when we are with a person with BPD, it isn't a healthy love that we feel nostalgic about when we look back on it. No, it's a drug that we need to remain sober from. We are all in recovery. That's why recycling is so common. As soon as a recovering junkie has his favorite drug shoved under his nose, he craves it, even though he knows it could kill him.

My advice? Just say no.

[Mutt]

Hi Tangy,

That's good to hear that your connecting with a new guy, if you trust your friends and they picked them, it sounds like he has good qualities and you share similar interests.

You could meet your ex and could set a boundary with yourself that you want to discuss your cell phone / credit card and if he strikes up personal questions ib your meet-up, you can choose to not discuss personal stuff in your life.

I see another option, if it feels like it may illicit feelings of obligation maybe you could sort out bills and credit out by email?

There are alternative ways to communicate that are less personal, email, text, chat... .

[Lucky Jim]

there is a part of me that feels guilty and obligated to see him... .

Hey Tangy, Remember that a pwBPD uses F-O-G (fear, obligation and guilt) in order to manipulate.  Don't fall for it.  You don't owe him anything and have no reason to feel guilty.  He's already dictating the time and place, without your input.  Suggest you stay away.

If you feel the need to see your Ex, suggest you tread carefully, as you will be walking through a minefield that is likely to cause you pain.  On some level, I think you know that already, so I'm just reminding you.

LuckyJim

[Tangy]

So I told him I would meet with him but I needed to wait 8 weeks until I graduate with my masters. So much havoc was caused over the summer... .I just didn't want to deal with any upset. He agreed to my boundary... .but said "That's not what I want to do, but if I have to wait I guess I will" Which was so upsetting because I was like... .really? As if I was doing something wrong after all this time.

So then he broke my boundary and wrote me a lengthy lengthy email yesterday... .saying everything I wanted to hear 2 months ago. He is still seeing my replacement, but he knows now I am the love of his life... .and he was going to talk to her about how he was feeling... .

I sent him a short reply today, telling him I would reply, but it would take some time (Because school has to come first). And I essentially expressed to him the pain and gut wrenching reality that the beginning of the break up period was for me... .as well as how I am truly sorry he is hurting and that I don't wish that pain on him.

I just received an even longer reply... .with him telling me how much he misses me and that this was the email that he mentioned I am the love of his life that I am supposed to be with until the end... .how he cant do anything without thinking about me etc... .

On a different note, the new guy asked me to be his girlfriend today. We spent the weekend together and it was really nice. We had a lot more conversations. We're still not rushing sex. But there is plenty of chemistry between  us. I notice its not as intense... .but I have been doing enough inner work over the last year and a half as well as having good friends with good relationships to serve as a model, that I am not relying on intensity any more. I have been talking openly and honestly with him about all of what has gone on about this since Friday. I am still seeing my counselor.

I do plan to reply. New guy said he would too because that's the kind of person he is. I plan to reply because I do still have hope for former fiance. Not hope like us together. But hope for him. Hope that he can at least make enough improvements to better his life at least to some degree. I want him to be happy. I want him to know love.

[OnceConfused]

it looks to me like the old guy wanting to come back with all the  talks about you are the love of his life. If you don't want that recycle, then stop it dead on its track. Don't give the old guy the false hope to recycle you again. Don't give the signal that you will be willing to talk about reconcile after your master graduation.

If you like the new guy and feel in your gut he is the right one, then KILL THE OLD DOG now. Text the old guy to tell him, sorry it is over you are having a new r.s.

[Mutt]

On a different note, the new guy asked me to be his girlfriend today. We spent the weekend together and it was really nice. We had a lot more conversations. We're still not rushing sex. But there is plenty of chemistry between  us. I notice its not as intense... .but I have been doing enough inner work over the last year and a half as well as having good friends with good relationships to serve as a model, that I am not relying on intensity any more. I have been talking openly and honestly with him about all of what has gone on about this since Friday. I am still seeing my counselor.

Tangy,

Nice going  I can see how BPD clingy behavior triggers feelings of guilt.

Waiting until you graduate sounds like a good idea.

I share similar feelings. I hope that my ex wife gets better and I want her to find out what the meaning of self-compassion and love is.

Have you heard of radical acceptance?

[cloudten]

Ugh Tangy,

My heart breaks for you as I know what you are going through.

I beg you... .BEG YOU to just cut him off. I got myself involved in a love triangle with my dBPDxbf. He was writing me to me telling me what a mistake he made and that he missed me... .AND I BELIEVED HIM.  Maybe I was the love of his life, but maybe I wasn't as he went on to try to kill me. I think the love triangle was the worst thing that ever happened to me... .and guess what... .  If he is going to write letters to you like that when he is seeing someone else, then he will write letters to someone else when he is seeing you.

Please... .please end the cycle. You are the only one capable of ending it.

I think we all have kind yet bruised hearts here... .and we all wish these people find the help they so desperately need... .but be very very very very careful about responding to him now and seeing him later. I don't feel good about that for you, especially if you like the new guy.

Love yourself more!

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Tangy, I find it ironic that the old guy is professing his love for you while continuing to see your replacement.  Of course he misses you and you are the love of his live, but just in case he has someone else on the line.  Talk is cheap and his past actions should tell you something.  Only you know what is right for you, though I doubt that this will play out well after the eight weeks are up.  Suggest you tread carefully.

LuckyJim

[Tangy]

I think I should clear something up. I think I was thinking/feeling a certain intention of posting this without expressing it. I am not feeling torn or hoping to get back with him. I absolutely am ready to move on with this new person. I was kind of hoping to post this for those that are still in NC that have been cut off and are hoping to hear from their ex. THese are all the words I longed to hear 2 months ago. And as many have stated, it didn't hit me the way I thought it would. It doesn't change anything. I honestly don't even feel moved. If I could sum it up... .I genuinely feel scared for him. I love him, but not in the way that I did. I just want him to get better. Not for me. I know I can't fix him. But I do hope that some of what I say in my final reply to him will impact him in some way. I am going to tell him we can't be friends. Because truth be told, I don't really want to be his friend. I can't be his friend. He wouldn't even make a good friend... .at least not now.

This is the first time he has ever apologized (he did so in the second email) and actually said he is the problem and he needs counseling. So I'm hoping if I can validate his feelings and treat him with love and respect than it will at least be better than just blatantly ignoring him. I know my limits and I know my former patterns... .and I don't feel inside attracted to the danger like I used to. I feel like the new person I am with is stable, calm, healthy, and what I was hoping exBPD would be. I am very in touch with the fact that this new person is the right direction for me. I'm not feeling any doubt the way that I would have in the past because of "intensity vs intimacy." I feel healthy and that feels good.

[Lucky Jim]

Great!  Sounds like you are in a good place.     LJ

[cloudten]

Yay! That sounds great!

[klacey3]

I think I should clear something up. I think I was thinking/feeling a certain intention of posting this without expressing it. I am not feeling torn or hoping to get back with him. I absolutely am ready to move on with this new person. I was kind of hoping to post this for those that are still in NC that have been cut off and are hoping to hear from their ex. THese are all the words I longed to hear 2 months ago. And as many have stated, it didn't hit me the way I thought it would. It doesn't change anything. I honestly don't even feel moved. If I could sum it up... .I genuinely feel scared for him. I love him, but not in the way that I did. I just want him to get better. Not for me. I know I can't fix him. But I do hope that some of what I say in my final reply to him will impact him in some way. I am going to tell him we can't be friends. Because truth be told, I don't really want to be his friend. I can't be his friend. He wouldn't even make a good friend... .at least not now.

This is the first time he has ever apologized (he did so in the second email) and actually said he is the problem and he needs counseling. So I'm hoping if I can validate his feelings and treat him with love and respect than it will at least be better than just blatantly ignoring him. I know my limits and I know my former patterns... .and I don't feel inside attracted to the danger like I used to. I feel like the new person I am with is stable, calm, healthy, and what I was hoping exBPD would be. I am very in touch with the fact that this new person is the right direction for me. I'm not feeling any doubt the way that I would have in the past because of "intensity vs intimacy." I feel healthy and that feels good.

Wow tangy I am so happy to hear this.

It sounds like you are doing really well and you have come so far. I think its lucky he didn't say all this to you 2 months ago because you may have been sucked in then. It is so great you have found someone who is healthy for you. I wish you all the best. The inner work you have been doing has paid off.

Like others have said, the fact your ex is messaging you all this stuff when he is with someone else shows alot... .if you do meet him just be careful as I know you say there is no part of you that wants to go back, it could change in person.

[Tangy]

I think I should clear something up. I think I was thinking/feeling a certain intention of posting this without expressing it. I am not feeling torn or hoping to get back with him. I absolutely am ready to move on with this new person. I was kind of hoping to post this for those that are still in NC that have been cut off and are hoping to hear from their ex. THese are all the words I longed to hear 2 months ago. And as many have stated, it didn't hit me the way I thought it would. It doesn't change anything. I honestly don't even feel moved. If I could sum it up... .I genuinely feel scared for him. I love him, but not in the way that I did. I just want him to get better. Not for me. I know I can't fix him. But I do hope that some of what I say in my final reply to him will impact him in some way. I am going to tell him we can't be friends. Because truth be told, I don't really want to be his friend. I can't be his friend. He wouldn't even make a good friend... .at least not now.

This is the first time he has ever apologized (he did so in the second email) and actually said he is the problem and he needs counseling. So I'm hoping if I can validate his feelings and treat him with love and respect than it will at least be better than just blatantly ignoring him. I know my limits and I know my former patterns... .and I don't feel inside attracted to the danger like I used to. I feel like the new person I am with is stable, calm, healthy, and what I was hoping exBPD would be. I am very in touch with the fact that this new person is the right direction for me. I'm not feeling any doubt the way that I would have in the past because of "intensity vs intimacy." I feel healthy and that feels good.

Wow tangy I am so happy to hear this.

It sounds like you are doing really well and you have come so far. I think its lucky he didn't say all this to you 2 months ago because you may have been sucked in then. It is so great you have found someone who is healthy for you. I wish you all the best. The inner work you have been doing has paid off.

Like others have said, the fact your ex is messaging you all this stuff when he is with someone else shows alot... .if you do meet him just be careful as I know you say there is no part of you that wants to go back, it could change in person.

Hi! Yes I am very happy. I don't intend to meet him in person anymore. He lost the right to see me when he violated my boundary of asking him to wait. I haven't replied to his last two messages. The one I got last night was intense. He was telling me its taking everything he has not to get in his car. I am just trying my best not to provoke him at the moment. I never spent much time learning the communication skills on here, because I never thought I'd have to talk to him again. I just don't understand, if I asked him to wait until December... .why does he think pushing will change anything?

[cosmonaut]

I just don't understand, if I asked him to wait until December... .why does he think pushing will change anything?

Because he's not thinking; he's feeling.

Have you ever read the novel Dune by Frank Herbert?  It's a classic science fiction novel about the far, far future.  In the beginning of the book there is a scene where the young hero is given a terrible test by an old crone.  He is ordered to stick his hand into a mysterious box.  When he asks what is inside he is only told "pain".  If he removes his hand from the box, the old woman will kill him with a poisoned needle held at his neck.  At first there is a slight itching sensation that the hero feels, then heat, then burning, then an agonizing burning of his flesh, and finally unimaginable pain as his hand is consumed entirely.  He manages to pass the test, and when he removes his hand it is unharmed.  The pain was entirely in his mind.  This might be a way to think of what your ex is experiencing in regards to his abandonment fears.

While we may struggle to understand why our loved one with BPD acts the way that they do, we must understand that they are in pain.  It is invisible, but to them completely real.  After all, pain is a product of the mind.  His hand is burning and he wants the pain to stop.  Now.  He can't wait until December, because the pain is here right now.  Does that make sense?

Until he can realize that the pain is the product of his own mind and learn how to overcome it, he will be controlled by it.

[Tangy]

I just don't understand, if I asked him to wait until December... .why does he think pushing will change anything?

Because he's not thinking; he's feeling.

Have you ever read the novel Dune by Frank Herbert?  It's a classic science fiction novel about the far, far future.  In the beginning of the book there is a scene where the young hero is given a terrible test by an old crone.  He is ordered to stick his hand into a mysterious box.  When he asks what is inside he is only told "pain".  If he removes his hand from the box, the old woman will kill him with a poisoned needle held at his neck.  At first there is a slight itching sensation that the hero feels, then heat, then burning, then an agonizing burning of his flesh, and finally unimaginable pain as his hand is consumed entirely.  He manages to pass the test, and when he removes his hand it is unharmed.  The pain was entirely in his mind.  This might be a way to think of what your ex is experiencing in regards to his abandonment fears.

While we may struggle to understand why our loved one with BPD acts the way that they do, we must understand that they are in pain.  It is invisible, but to them completely real.  After all, pain is a product of the mind.  His hand is burning and he wants the pain to stop.  Now.  He can't wait until December, because the pain is here right now.  Does that make sense?

Until he can realize that the pain is the product of his own mind and learn how to overcome it, he will be controlled by it.

No I haven't but I have been wanting to watch the David Lynch version of the film. I would like to read it too. :D

With that said, I understand what you are saying. This is exactly where I was when he ended in July. I wrote him so much stuff, but I never sent it because I knew two things: one it would only hurt me more, and two told me he wanted her. So what was the point?

So should I reply to that most recent message of the void in his soul, the pain, etc... .and use SET? I kinda started a new forum for this about communication advice. Where essentially I offer support/empathy/validation for what hes feeling, but then truthfully state, I cannot talk to you in December. If you cannot respect that this is what the consequence will be etc... .?

[cosmonaut]

So should I reply to that most recent message of the void in his soul, the pain, etc... .and use SET? I kinda started a new forum for this about communication advice. Where essentially I offer support/empathy/validation for what hes feeling, but then truthfully state, I cannot talk to you in December. If you cannot respect that this is what the consequence will be etc... .?

I'm always hesitant to give firm advice on what to do, because everyone with BPD is different and every situation is different.  So, take this as what it is: what I would do with my own relationship.

SET is a great tool and there's a reason it is widely recommended here and elsewhere.  In my view, the empathy is the most critical component.  Without the empathy, nothing else matters.  My ex wanted me to understand her pain and struggles.  More than anything.  And when I did, she responded beautifully.  It had a soothing effect on her.  It told her that she mattered, that she was heard, that she was worth listening to and caring about.  All of those things that she has such trouble believing herself.  Validation is the key to the kingdom here.  Validate, validate, validate.  That's how we most clearly express our empathy.

So, yes, I would just tell the truth.  There's no reason to lie and doing so won't spare his feelings in the end.  But try to understand the mindset of who you are dealing with.  Try and put yourself in his position.  How would you want to be treated if you had a chronic disorder that time and again tore your life to shreds, destroyed all of your relationships with the people you love, and left you in tremendous pain and shame?  Then do that.