Just about had enough of her behaviour

[Yaffle]

This morning I'm feeling like it may be time to change to the leaving board.  Just fed up with the constant ridiculousness of her.

Last night my uBPDgf was just moaning about her life, how ill she feels etc with a few digs at me thrown in along the way.  I managed to stay with her without biting back and giving the occasional suggestion as to how she could possibly help herself (which she never listens too).  She also moaned about how we hadn't ordered certain stuff for Christmas such as cheese and chocolates. 

At 8.30 our grocery shopping for Christmas was delivered.  Unsurprisingly, there were a few things out of stock which started a bit of a panic in her as most of it was our food for Christmas eve.  Then I noticed there was no turkey delivered either.  Oops.  Normally I do the weekly food shop online but as this was for Christmas we sat and did it together but I let her choose the turkey and it turns out she hadn't pressed the button to order it.  I should have checked as our computer does play up a bit.  Anyway this obviously triggered her and the usual tirade of swearing and general verbal abuse followed about all sorts of things.  I just said I've had enough of you swearing at me so I'm going out for a bit.  While I was getting changed I actual thought that I could pop to our local supermarket and pick up the missing things.  I told her I was going to do this.

I did the shopping including picking up some chocolates and cheese for her (which I actually thought may cheer her up! Ha!) and got back to find she was still in a rage and picked holes in the shopping I'd done.  Eventually she went to bed and I stayed up later than I should just to have some time to myself.

I got up this morning and left for work while she was still in bed.  As I opened the front door I noticed chocolates spilled over the drive; looked in the bin and low and behold, the chocolates I'd bought her were in there.  Driving to work I seriously considered putting her Christmas presents in there too put that would just be petulant so I won't.

At the moment evenings like this are all too frequent and I'm just fed up with it and am really exhausted.

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[enlighten me]

Shopping was always a nightmare for me with my ex. I never got it right and when like you I tried to do something nice it was thrown back at me.

The fact that the turkey didn't register probably triggered her because she knows its her fault. She didn't notice it. The fact that you are trying to take the blame because your computer sometimes plays up and you should have checked it sounds like I used to be. Walking on eggshells.

These things happen and when they do you work around them. This is what I couldn't get my head around with my exgf. It wasn't the end of the world, things could be done. To her though it was the end of the world.

[Yaffle]

I didn't actually say anything to her about whose fault it was.  Its more that this sort of thing is happening too often and I'm just tired as I don't get a moments peace.

[enlighten me]

I didn't actually say anything to her about whose fault it was.  Its more that this sort of thing is happening too often and I'm just tired as I don't get a moments peace.

Hi Yaffle I was on about how in your post you said you should have checked. It just reminded me on how I would shift the blame onto myself when these sort of things happened. I wouldn't voice it either but would beat myself up for not doing it. I see now how I wasn't responsible for her mistakes and when things like this happen now I don't think that way.

[Yaffle]

Sorry if that came across a bit blunt/wrong.  Bit rushed typing that as I'm at work.  I'm not really beating myself up over it as I'm quite happy with the solution I came but I could have saved myself the hassle by checking as I know her mind is in chaos a lot of the time.  I do spend too much time trying to make her happy though in ways that would cheer me up(i.e. the chocolates) so perhaps shouldn't strive to do that so often.  One of the things she accuses me of a lot is not being a proper boyfriend as I don't do nice things for her.

As you say shopping with them is an absolute nightmare.  If I disagree with something she wants to buy or even say we'll buy it at a later date then I'm a killjoy.  Another thing at the moment that's bugging me is the amount of times that she's in a shop and buys things that we might need but it turns out we've got plenty already or she writes stuff down for me to order, I order it then she goes and buys some herself anyway.

[Notwendy]

I am sorry this is upsetting you. My mother with BPD gets very stressed when people are coming over or she has to have a holiday meal. Everything has to be perfect. Inevitably something goes wrong- we get the wrong soup, or crackers, and even if it is delicious, it has to be tossed out because it isn't perfect. I think she fears being judged by the guests.

She will also throw out things we give her if she is angry at us.

Still, we send her holiday and birthday gifts, because, well she is our mother. I recently sent her some fruit, but it's gone. She said she "shared it" with someone. It may have gone in the trash for all I know.

We have even joked about it at this point, but that is kind of dark humor as it is hurtful. We have just come to accept that if we give her a gift, then it is hers to do what she wants.

Also with the turkey, I think enlighten me is right that something that is her fault is triggering to her, and she is projecting it on to you. She may even have projected it on to the chocolates.

It helps to not take this personally, if you can.

[enlighten me]

No need to apologise Yaffle. I can completely understand as I was exactly the same. What I realised is the amount of things I did to avoid conflict like making sure nothing was missed. This would backfire if I was caught as it meant I didn't think her capable of doing it properly.

I too had the I never buy her anything which switched to Im trying to make her fat and unattractive by buying her things.

[Yaffle]

Thank you both.  To be fair, very little of what she says hurts me now.  Once I first heard of BPD and read up about it I managed to take a bit of a reality check and most things now go in one ear and out of the other.  The chocolates I did find annoying rather than hurtful.  The main problem I have now is that these incidents are happening too often.  Its at least three or four times a week and usually quite late at night and then even later by the time I've relaxed again.  Just very tired of it and often feel stressed because of it which sometimes means I'm a bit snappy with the kids which isn't fair on them.

Oh, as an aside - she text me earlier to say she doesn't think the turkey I bought will be defrosted in time for her to cook so I wouldn't be surprised if she's off buying another one! 

[enlighten me]

Just curious if the ramp up in behaviour has coincided with your discovery of BPD?

It could be a case that you are reacting differently and that is triggering her more.

Just a thought.

[Notwendy]

First of all, I support your right to be fed up- and to decide how you wish to deal with this behavior. It is aggravating. I think one issue we nons have is to have our own emotions invalidated, as if we don't have the right to feel aggravated.

I don't have this particular issue in my marriage, but I do post about some of these issues if they were present with my mother.

However, we know we can't change another person's behavior. We only have our own choices about it, and we can make them. This is something I also had to learn, as growing up in my FOO, I didn't believe I had a choice.

I recall, feeling very hurt and scared by this behavior, but I can't change it. Now, I see it as a result of my mother's mental illness. My sibs and I coped with some humor, and also with detachment. Buying something for mom to "make her feel better" or to try to redeem ourselves can backfire because we are invested in the result. Now, if we buy something, we know it is possibly going to end up in the trashbin, or she may possibly enjoy it, but we have to accept that.

I get that the turkey you have may not be able to be saved, once it is painted black. Once my kids, when little, accidentally put a spot on mom's couch. Her response was not to clean it ( which was possible) but that she had to throw the whole thing out and get a new couch. The couch, once deemed "not perfect" was permanently flawed to her. We've been yelled at for buying the wrong brand of aspirin at the pharmacy, and even if it is exactly the same medicine as the other brand, it is wrong. Once I bought ice cream for my father, she threw it out because I didn't ask her first.


This makes no logical sense, but trying to figure out how it makes sense to her takes a lot of thinking and wondering. We just don't go there anymore. As a kid, I had no choice, but as an adult, I decide to only buy her things I don't care what she does with. A gift from me is a gift from the heart, but she may not want it, and I can't change that.

[Notwendy]

The ramping up may be a response to new boundaries. The extinction burst is typical.

[Yaffle]

No I don't think its that.  It's a couple of years since I found out about BPD.  It seems to get worse every Autumn but has gone on longer this year.  She's drinking too much at the moment which definitely isn't helping.  She's also got various ailments that she complains about but won't go to the doctors about as they haven't done anything in the past.  I personally think its not the ailments that are making her state of mind worse but the other way round, her state of mind is making her other illnesses feel worse to her.

Its possible its down to the drink, its coming up to the anniversary of her fathers death too which I know plays on her mind and there are a few other things but I don't know of one thing in particular that should make her any worse at the moment than at any other time.  Unless of course she is actually drinking even more than I'm noticing and she now has a real problem with that.  She's also not really ever come to terms that I now walk away from her when she starts getting nasty with me.  That could explain some of the length of time she stays in a rage but not really the frequency I don't think

[Skip]

My ex had a cyclical pattern too. I finally figured it out and what drove it. In my case it had to do with stress associated with events that re-occurred at certain times each year.

She's also not really ever come to terms that I now walk away from her when she starts getting nasty with me.  That could explain some of the length of time she stays in a rage but not really the frequency I don't think

Do you walk away in a neutral or positive manner? I found this really helped. It eventually brought apologies instead of raging (after the extinction burst and a cooling period).

[Notwendy]

Having any company over is a major stressor for my mother, and this kind of behavior would increase during that time, and also during any preparation. Naturally, this would coincide with holidays.


Autumn also heralds the onset of less sunlight, more darkness, colder weather. This can cause shifts in circadian rhythm and mood. Some of this might have a biological influence.

In general, holidays can be stressful for anyone too.

I think Skips suggestion to be neutral and not angry is a good one. We've (kids)  learned to not be reactive to this. But we do sometimes vent to each other- as a positive support group to remind us to not take it personally.

[Yaffle]

Can you give me some examples of what you mean by a positive or neutral manor please? - not quite sure what you mean but I do try not to be angry (doesn't always work that way though unfortunately).  Usually along the lines of saying 'I'm not going to listen to you swearing at me anymore'.  When she's started bringing up things that I've done in the past (she usually does this just before she gets really mad) I've started saying something like 'I'm not having this conversation now as we've been over this before' and walk away

[Notwendy]

It isn't always easy to distinguish between walking on eggshells and recognizing that when someone is triggered, they are not filtering what you say clearly.

Once you feel the need to walk away ( which is a good thing to do), the person is agitated and already triggered. The importance of staying neutral is not to protect yourself or avoid making the other person upset ( which is WOE) but not to say or do something that adds to the drama- and which draws you into it.

In this context, your responses are not entirely neutral because you are still making her the reason for you walking away- her swearing, "we've been over this before". These are statements that put you on the drama triangle- she is the cause of the issue ( in the role of persecutor)which puts you in the role of victim in this context. Any reference to her behavior adds fuel to the drama.

To get off the triangle, you need a statement that reflects that you are 100% responsible for the decision to walk away. This is a new tool and it takes practice. I good rule of thumb is to not use the word "you" or any reference to the behavior that is not yours. This does not mean she is not accountable or that you can not bring up behaviors. It is a recognition that, in the moment, she is agitated and not processing and the only outcome of doing this is to increase the agitation in the moment.

A neutral statement might be " I need to walk away at the moment". " I am not able to have this conversation". She may come back with an arguing statement, an attempt to draw you in, but once you have declared this- this is a boundary, you do not JADE or engage, but walk away. Nothing more needs to be said at that time.

[Yaffle]

Thank you.  I really do struggle using the correct language. I'll get practicing on that

[Icthelight]

I tried enforcing my boundary of walking away by saying, "I will not allow you to rage and scream at me," and then walk away. This upset her more. When I returned, she was even more upset or I received the full blown ST. When I used "you" statements, it triggered her more.

NotWendy is right, use "I" statements. What's more effective for me now is when I tell her, "I'm feeling frustrated right now, I need a time out. I will return to continue our conversation in 30 minutes." At first, she would still get triggered because she didn't like the interruption and said some angry and mean things as I walked away. She now sighs and slightly complains, but she lets me go. She knows that no matter what she does or says, I'm still walking.

Early in our marriage, I remember buying my wife flowers and a card as a way to make peace and apologize (don't remember what we were arguing about. Or more specifically, don't remember what I did that time ) and found rose petals throughout the hallway and bathroom and the card ripped to pieces in the bathroom sink. I was deeply hurt and since then, I hesitate to buy her anything when I believe she is upset for fear that it will trigger her further. Because I don't usually buy her flowers, chocolates or anything else when we argue, she's complained to me at times that if I would've sent her flowers, it would've made everything better   

I feel for you Yaffle, hang in there.

[Skip]

I tried enforcing my boundary of walking away by saying, "I will not allow you to rage and scream at me," and then walk away. This upset her more. When I returned, she was even more upset or I received the full blown ST. When I used "you" statements, it triggered her more.

Absolutely - its throwing gas on the fire. This is not the time for effectingvalues / boundaries - you're right.  

In conflict the goal is to lightly defuse and give space. It's not a time to draw lines in the sand. In time, she will learn that unloading on you doesn't really affect you (give her a payoff), she will not always go to it for relief.

These are cycle conflicts. We spin the wheel too. They trigger. We trigger.

It has to come from the heart and your gut - you have to re-train yourself a bit.  Its more about your attitude and air than the words. When you do learn this, you will wonder why you didn't learn it earlier and be surprised on how it works with others. With a pwBPD it is an essential skill.

This is a good short term action plan:

https://bpdfamily.com/content/ending-conflict (video)

Her: Look what you did! You are a _____.  A real _____.  What good are you?

You: I will not allow you to rage and scream at me," (then walk away)

Her: You ass!

Her (later): You ass!

Her: Look what you did! You are a _____.  A real _____.  What good are you?

You: Hey I'm sorry (light, confident, benevolent, and not sucked into the drama). I understand that is upsetting. Let me run out and get us some cream for coffee in the morning. Hug (sometimes hug works, sometimes not). Gone.

Her: Grumble... .

Her (later): Thank you for getting the cream.

I look at it like golfing.  It takes a little time to not hit it too wide or too short or two long - just keep experimenting to find things that work.

Lastly, it has to come from a place of strength. When you are strong and do this, you are benevolent and it is eventually appreciated.  If you do this from a place of weakness, you signal "I'm a doormat" and that will bring on more of the same.

[Yaffle]

I do really struggle using the correct language but I'll keep trying to learn and improve.  If I try to say something that doesn't sound natural to me then she picks up on it and will say that I've been looking at the BPD forum again!  But its got to be worth trying it in the long run.

Right - that's me finished at work for Christmas.  Thanks everyone for your help and suggestions and have good Christmases