Filed for Primary Custody Today

[jac8949]

I just returned home from the attorney's office.  I paid a retainer and he is filing a complaint for primary custody.   This basically marks a clear turning point in the relationship.  I expect that once she is served with the papers she will take the children on one of her visits and not return them.  I also expect her to file a domestic violence charge against me.

[livednlearned]

What were your lawyers thoughts if either of those things were to occur? Any tips on how to respond?

[jac8949]

What were your lawyers thoughts if either of those things were to occur? Any tips on how to respond?

I didnt ask my attorney about that stuff.  If I get arrested, I guess I will need a criminal defense attorney also.

I cannot worry about this.  It is fear of this specific scenario that has been leading me in to poor decisions over the last 9 years.

[ForeverDad]

First, don't tell her you have started the process.*  This way, if she does make allegations, they will be made after you filed.  Then you could take the position that her actions are a knee-jerk sour-grapes response to the filing and not out of genuine concern she belatedly makes for some event involving the children.

* Sharing information is fine during a relationship, sharing helps it work.  However, if separating or setting some parenting change in motion then you don't share information that the other person could use to sabotage you.

From now on you probably would do well to (quietly) record any encounters, just in case she tries to create an incident to thereafter make allegations.  I say quietly, no microphone or device waved in her face!  It is solely to prove you're not misbehaving and that you're not the one misbehaving.

She may feel abandoned (despite her having her current relationship(s) with other men) and her metaphorical back against the wall.  Her solution may be to make you look worse than her.  Many of us mere targeted that way.

Based on her willing to let you keep the children overnight so much in the past and her ongoing adult pursuits, it's possible that things can get worked out.  Maybe you can make a 'deal' sooner rather than later, you never know.  However, she may refuse to 'lose' custody.  Many states are reluctant to grant sole custody without substantive basis, just being a wandering mother may not be enough.  Ask your lawyer if joint custody but with you having Decision Making or Tie Breaker status is a feasible option in your court.  That way she can 'save face' by having joint custody but you get to make the major decisions and aren't whipsawed as drastically when her emotions run rampant.  Sure, try for sole custody, but be open to fallback options if necessary.

Don't give her any excuse to trigger an incident.  You most definitely don't want to enable her to get you arrested.  You currently have many overnights, anticipate that she will be very likely to try to find some way to make you look bad to counteract that good history.

Also, my court was far less concerned — at least parenting-wise — by adult-to-adult DV allegations than ones directly impacting the children.

[livednlearned]

From now on you probably would do well to (quietly) record any encounters, just in case she tries to create an incident to thereafter make allegations.  I say quietly, no microphone or device waved in her face!  It is solely to prove you're not misbehaving and that you're not the one misbehaving.

Other recommendations here include keeping all receipts in case you have to prove you were somewhere when she alleges you were engaged in DV.

Keep a binder with sleeves, and label them by month, slipping receipts in there just in case you need them later.

[david]

My ex ran away in 2007. From that time on she did things I never imagined. I had three protection orders against me, accused of physically bruising our youngest, Calls from the police numerous times, etc. In 2010 she actually kicked our oldest (12 at the time ) out of her residence and called me to tell me if I didn't pick him up she would call the police and have him taken away. I went to get him. He was sobbing by the curb with two bags, his school bag and some clothes. She came out when I finally calmed him down and had him in my car. Yelled at me, blamed me, etc. I said and did nothing. I had my back towards her and she "fell". She called the police and I was arrested. Went to jail for a few days and was released when I posted bail. I was charged with a misdemeanor of assault. I was convicted of disorderly conduct and put in jail for two weeks. The first thing I did after getting out was to purchase an audio recorder. I then purchased a video recorder. Since that time I have only been accused of things in emails. I've been in court several times since then and ex has complained I am breaking the law for recording which is not allowed in our state. I got yelled at by the judge and that has been it. However, I have not been accused of anything legally since that time. It's five years and counting.

Protect yourself. Listen to what everyone is saying here.

[jac8949]

Thanks for all the great advice guys.  I have several friends that will be coming with me during the child exchanges from here on out. If I have another person with me that will help reduce the chance of a physical confrontation. 

[scraps66]

If it hasn't been said, and I know difficult in this situation, reduce contact to an absolute minimum if not none.  Keep your distance at all times.

[livednlearned]

It might also be a good idea to have a conversation with the kids about some what ifs.

"Mom might have some ideas about how to solve problems in the upcoming weeks -- when she gets emotional she doesn't solve problems very well. If that happens, then I want you to ______."

I walked my son through some options (altho I just said if anything happens, whether at my place or his dad's, here's what he should do, in order to neutralize his anxiety somewhat), like which neighbor to walk to, and made him memorize my phone number, call 911 in this kinds of situations, etc.

Eventually I gave him his own phone although phones can create a whole new set of problems... .

[SamwizeGamgee]

Protect yourself for sure.  Record as has been suggested.  As for taking the kids away, once she is served if she flees with the kids you have a whole world of legal recourse.  You should clearly put into your separation papers a limit to the geographical restrictions for mom traveling with the kids.  If she flees it will show extremely bad behavior on her part.  Of course, no one wants the kids to suffer, but, if they do, there will be consequences.

Praying for safety and stability for you!

[scraps66]

I'll add this, from my own experience and how to manage/control, expectations.  Being able to anticipate and predict what at BP will do is tough in some cases, but predictable in others.  If she is a flight risk, there isn't a lot you can "physically" do to stop her.  No Order or agreement will stop a BP from acting irrationally.  So, until this happens and I hop it never does, don't get fixated on this one possibility.  Put controls in place to limit what she can do and the damage she can inflict, control what you can.   

[livednlearned]

It doesn't sound so much like she is a flight risk, as much as a mom who might not willingly bring the kids back to jac.

That's a slightly different issue  

The only thing you can do in my state (because custody matters are civil issues) is to have the police do a well-child check to make sure the kids are ok. I think you can also get domestic assistance, where the cops will come with you to the house, but they won't enforce the custody order/visitation. The kids would have to willingly come of their own volition, which can be hard if they don't want to anger mom. The police are only there to make sure that mom and dad don't harm each other or the kids.

Schools also cannot prevent kids from going with either parent unless there is a court order that specifies.

Hopefully, your ex won't do any of these things. It sounds like she has not done much to care for the kids as it stands, and it's very likely she will try to keep the kids temporarily as her emotions sky rocket, only to relent after she recognizes that she is now responsible for them. If that's the case, it might be better to grit your teeth and weather through it, waiting for her dysregulation to cool down.

[FamilyLaw]

If you do think your soon-to-be ex might file a DV complaint against you, and you own any firearms please make sure that they are out of you possession and locked away safe somewhere.  I recently had a client tell me that I saved him a lot of grief because of this recommendation.  His wife did go get an order of protection (even though she had been arrested for DV) and when the cops came to serve the order, they were very concerned about his guns.  He was able to show them that there were no guns in the house of vehicle because he had given them to his brother for safe-keeping on my advice.

[ForeverDad]

I'll add this, from my own experience and how to manage/control, expectations.  Being able to anticipate and predict what at BP will do is tough in some cases, but predictable in others.  If she is a flight risk, there isn't a lot you can "physically" do to stop her.  No Order or agreement will stop a BP from acting irrationally.  So, until this happens and I hope it never does, don't get fixated on this one possibility.  Put controls in place to limit what she can do and the damage she can inflict, control what you can.

Agreed. Even if she isn't a flight risk, do be alert to any changed or negative behaviors.  Then ponder the implications.  Likely you can't got to court complaining about her intentions, you generally have to wait for the actions before seeking court intervention. Remember too that courts often don't give much in the way of consequences, not until there have been repeated noncompliance.  (The person behaving poorly seldom gets consequences and the person behaving well seldom gets credit.)

However, Threat of DV may be actionable.  My ex was arrested for Threat of DV, triggering our separation.  After a few continuances we had the trial.  My recording was played.  She admitted it was her but tried to excuse it as "that's how we argue".  The judge was so passive.  Not one word of admonishment to her.  He ruled her Not Guilty stating that Case Law superseded Written Law and since she didn't have a weapon in her hands her vociferous death threats were not "imminent" threats.  I figure if it was me making death threats it would have turned out differently. We of the male gender persuasion have to be very careful in what we say and do.  Over in family court they ignored her DV case and assigned her temporary custody.

I recall telling my lawyer every single infraction of the order and his usual response was to tell me court didn't care about the little things, they weren't 'actionable'.  One time he asked me, ":)o you want a $5K divorce or a $30K divorce?"  So ponder the issues, reviewing them periodically, choose to fight the important battles.