Anyone have experience with parenting counselor?

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

Hi,

It's been awhile since I've posted or been here.  ExNPD/BPDh continues to violate the parenting plan.  I have collected enough to send to my L, who has started contacting exhL.  I wanted, and my L agreed, to avoid dispute resolution and try to work out the grievances between the L and the parents.  There are three or four issues where he has a pattern of not following the parenting plan.

Today my main sticking point is exH will not let me speak to the children.  Parenting plan says I can call 2x/day, I only ever ask for 1x/day.  This is spring break and it's been days since I've talked to either child, 12 and 7.  Twice I've reached my D7 but she just repeats "hi" over and over, and when I ask her if she feels free to talk she says no.  I ask her if there are other people there and she says yes.  Last week she called me, totally excited, telling me about April Fool's Day, and then someone came into her room, said something, she said, "my mom," got totally quiet, stopped talking, and then had to go.  This occurs often when I reach her.  Latest email from exH (actually his wife sends the emails, although I've asked that contact be between the two biological parents) stated that the children don't want to talk to me.  I don't take this personally.  I think she might be a narcissist, too.

S12 received bullying (based on sexual orientation) and threatening text messages from someone at school.  His friends turned it in to the school when they saw it.  Principal and counselor called me late Friday night to discuss it, felt it was very serious.  They also then called exH.  I have only been able to reach my S once since then.

My daughter told me a few weeks ago that sometimes she misses me.  In December, when she spent a lot of time with exH, she sometimes called and didn't say anything, just sat on the line.  

I think exH actions are hurting the children and my relationship with them.  My L asked me today if I want to request a parent counselor.  I'm not sure what this involves or if it's worth it.  :)oes anyone have experience they can share?  Thanks.

Also, I feel like his antics are a way to keep me wrapped in his drama, and I don't want to play into it.

[Ulysses]

Hi,

It's been awhile since I've posted or been here.  ExNPD/BPDh continues to violate the parenting plan.  I have collected enough to send to my L, who has started contacting exhL.  I wanted, and my L agreed, to avoid dispute resolution and try to work out the grievances between the L and the parents.  There are three or four issues where he has a pattern of not following the parenting plan.

Today my main sticking point is exH will not let me speak to the children.  Parenting plan says I can call 2x/day, I only ever ask for 1x/day.  This is spring break and it's been days since I've talked to either child, 12 and 7.  Twice I've reached my D7 but she just repeats "hi" over and over, and when I ask her if she feels free to talk she says no.  I ask her if there are other people there and she says yes.  Last week she called me, totally excited, telling me about April Fool's Day, and then someone came into her room, said something, she said, "my mom," got totally quiet, stopped talking, and then had to go.  This occurs often when I reach her.  Latest email from exH (actually his wife sends the emails, although I've asked that contact be between the two biological parents) stated that the children don't want to talk to me.  I don't take this personally.  I think she might be a narcissist, too.

S12 received bullying (based on sexual orientation) and threatening text messages from someone at school.  His friends turned it in to the school when they saw it.  Principal and counselor called me late Friday night to discuss it, felt it was very serious.  They also then called exH.  I have only been able to reach my S once since then.

My daughter told me a few weeks ago that sometimes she misses me.  In December, when she spent a lot of time with exH, she sometimes called and didn't say anything, just sat on the line.  

I think exH actions are hurting the children and my relationship with them.  My L asked me today if I want to request a parent counselor.  I'm not sure what this involves or if it's worth it.  :)oes anyone have experience they can share?  Thanks.

Also, I feel like his antics are a way to keep me wrapped in his drama, and I don't want to play into it.

[livednlearned]

That is so heartbreaking, Ulysses  :'( To have your D miss you, and not be able to call. And your son being bullied and not being able to talk to him. That went straight to my heart.

I've had a coparenting therapist, and a parenting coordinator (who was a child psychologist). Both were very different, which made me conclude that effectiveness depends entirely on their expertise dealing with high-conflict people. The first one was clearly in over her head, and I ended the sessions. We couldn't even get on the same page to establish ground rules, like whether or not either party could meet with her separately. I think some of these therapists can't see that one party has no boundaries (N/BPD) and the other party has weak boundaries (LnL). Same for appeasing. One party never appeases (N/BPD) and the other party always appeases (LnL). I didn't need help learning how to appease, and she seemed to approach coparenting as an opportunity to teach us both how to compromise, which completely missed the point of why we had to be there.

The second one seemed to catch on very quickly that there was a PD involved. She leaned into him pretty hard, and he leaned back just as hard. It actually taught me so much about boundaries I can genuinely call it life changing. To have someone basically coach me on how to handle my ex in my personal encounters with him was very informative and also validating. In my state, a parenting coordinator has extension of judicial authority, and is bound by an official order. She eventually went back to court to ask to withdraw the order, and told me she had never dealt with anyone so difficult, and that she would do a disservice to me financially when our case really needed a judge to decide whether it was possible to coparent.

I guess to summarize, what I'm trying to say is that high conflict people recruit negative advocates, so you want to be darn sure that whomever you hire cannot be bamboozled. They can become third-party professionals whose word matters more in court than yours, and you don't want them siding with the disordered parent.

If you do go with someone, pick wisely! I asked many, many people for recommendations and kept hearing the same name (the parenting coordinator). She turned out to be the person who trains PCs for our state, and is considered highly ethical. Most importantly, she was a child psychologist, so I knew she would understand the developmental implications of parental alienation and chronic conflict on our son.

[Ulysses]

Thanks, Lived n Learned.  I cried a lot for my daughter after she told me (not in front of her).  It gets to a point where I can't imagine it will get more painful, and then it does.

Your reply has a lot of valuable information.  My exH is very good at initial impressions and, as a trial attorney, excellent at playing to the court.  So I will carefully consider the counselor option, and try to see what would be the best route for my kids. 

The latest response from his email, posted from his wife's ip address, states that if I were nicer, I could get in touch with my kids.  Ah, well.

[david]

I had a parent coordinator. She was an attorney. The way that worked was if one parent had an issue they were to send an email to the pc and also to the other parent. The other parent had 48 hours to reply. The pc than made a decision based on the two emails. It was like a mini court. The pc's ruling was considered just as actionable as a judges order. The Pennsylvania Supreme court ruled a few years ago that only judges could make custody orders and basically eliminated pc's. I didn't think it worked very well even though most of the rulings went in my favor. Ex brought up most of the issues (engagement) and they were inconsequential issues. However, it did cost a lot.

We also had a co parent counselor. He was a psychologist. My attorney recommended him. He actually worked in the same hospital my ex worked at and that made me a little concerned. My attorney (my second and current one) is very good and I trusted his judgement on that. We were ordered for around ten months. After 4 or 5 meetings he realized there was no use to attend any more meetings and asked me if I wanted to end the meetings. He wrote a note to the judge and that ended that. Ex attacked me and constantly changed her positions during the meetings so it was not possible to co parent.

I think the important thing is that you have to find a good one.

Our boys were 4 and 9 at the time my ex ran away. I had the same concerns and similar issues in the beginning. As they got older they got to see two different parenting styles. I focused on our boys needs and acted accordingly. Ex has her own needs and issues which drive her in everything she does. The boys figured it out, for the most part, and we have a great relationship now. They are 17 and 12 now.

The first 3 or 4 years were the most difficult. However, it has taught me to be a much better listener and a better parent. So I do give my ex credit for helping me there.

[Ulysses]

Thanks David, this is also helpful information.  It's encouraging to hear that you weathered through the first few years and things have gotten better for your children, and I'm truly glad for you guys.  My L wants to speak with me before making any requests for one, and I want to also speak with my children's Ts to see if they think it would be helpful for the kids.  Part of me thinks it's not worth my time and energy (and money, which is very tight since I'm in school), and, like your children, my children will see the two different parenting styles and make their own decisions eventually.  I'm glad you feel you've become a better listener and parent.  I also feel that I'm becoming a much better listener when it comes to my kids, and I would say better parent, but who can improve on perfection?  (Just kidding!)

[david]

When ex ran away in 2007 we had a custody eval. I had a terrible atty. The eval was extremely biased and I became an EOW dad.

Three years later I found a good atty and went back for more time. My new atty had a list of evaluators he said were good and fair. This evaluator talked to both boys extensively and also talked to ex and I quite a few times. Ex actually threatened the evaluator with a lawsuit when she realized she was showing her true colors. I was tempted to thank and hug her for helping me and our boys.

[Stolen]

The latest response from his email, posted from his wife's ip address, states that if I were nicer, I could get in touch with my kids.  Ah, well.

Boy, does that theme sound familiar.  They know just how to twist the knife.  I hope there is a special place in Hell for those that alienate children from a loving and supportive parent.