End of DBT Therapy Loss of Hope STUCK

[Thread]

His last week of Intense 6 month DBT therapy has ended. And with that the cycle has started up again. He, BPD husband proclaiming I make him take anxiety meds and all three therapists say he is not borderline.

I had him sign off on a release of information to his DBT therapist who I wish i could see for myself because she reminds me of the one I had where we lived before - strong female, very empowering. So we did w little over the phone chat.

To sum up the convo, it was that BPD husband was never forth coming in therapy. That he wasn't going to change or be able to get help unless he saw his actions as a problem and took responsibility for them. I explained the most recent issue of him yelling at me for buying groceries so that I wouldn't eat out as much stating, "I should have never brought you here." I was explaining to her how it was hurtful how these comments are passive agressice abuse. I work 17 hour days averagely 3-4 days a week. I deserve to eat. I work hard. Also I am thin. I eat often but like a bird.

She had told me I was being emotionally and verbally abused. I asked if I was enabling the behavior and she said yes. Even my best friend said so you say please stop or please be kind, or else what... .Or else nothing. Nothing will change. She also said she hates to see me in this kind of relationship.

His therapist advices that we see the DBT couples therapist as a final effort. And get my own not for anxiety or depression - she said just to have someone by your side, on your side. Then went off about how amazing and talented and strong and extraordinary i am. I burst into tears and told her I'm afraid the longer I stay the more I will feel I deserve this and feel as if ta okay. She told me to run with that and run fast.

:'(

I did find a personal therapist for next week.

[Cat Familiar]

Are you interested in trying to work something out with the DBT couples therapist, or are you at the point where you're done and grieving this relationship?

 

[Thread]

Cat,

I honesty don't know. I honestly feel stuck. It's not as easy as just walking away and divorcing. We own a business together. Orders confirmed through November. I can't do it all

Solo. I also am dong this full time as he has another job to pay our bills. There is also the suicidal threats that happened last time we separated. I didn't understand BPD enough when I took him back.

[gotbushels]

Hi H 

I'm sorry to hear about what you're going through. I'm not able to offer a professional suggestion like the ones you've probably heard from the Ts you've had, but I'd like you to know that you have my support.

What might help here is providing the basic self-validation for yourself. In the absence of someone to do it for you in a conflict dialogue with a partner, I think it's a good tool. It might not solve your bigger problems but it will certainly help to put yourself at ease during difficult days. I wish I could offer you more. Stay well and I hope you have some peace:)

[Cat Familiar]

Hanging,

I get how your life is entangled with your husband. My husband and I owned a business together and when I broke up with him, he immediately found a girlfriend (which I was happy about since I thought it would get him out of my hair). Then I think he thought it would be good to sabotage the business by dumping it entirely upon me.

I didn't know how I was going to manage, but I did, even with the responsibility of taking care of a mother with dementia and flying hundreds of miles to pack up her home, buy a house for her near me, and sell the house I grew up in.

I finally got a company to manufacture for me and the day I set that up and felt I could take a breath, I received in the mail a notice that my soon to be ex husband was suing me for support and 50% of the money I had recently inherited.  

It was ugly, expensive, and draining, but it all worked out and I was finally free of him.  

Oh, and he also made suicide threats. The last one happened before I broke up with him and I was with my mother; my father had just died. He told me if I didn't fly home immediately, he'd kill himself. That was the final straw. I asked him how he planned to do it, if he wanted to be buried or cremated, if he wanted his sister and his mother to view his body, and if so, he'd have to be embalmed. That was the last time he ever threatened me with suicide, but sometime later his new girlfriend confided that he was "holding her hostage" with suicide threats.

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Hanging, My BPDxW threatened suicide many times.  It is the ultimate manipulation, in my view, and was incredibly stressful so I understand where you are coming from on that issue.  I agree with Cat Familiar.  There is no "good time" to make the break from a person w/BPD.  Nevertheless, somehow things get untangled, so I wouldn't let that stop you.  Do what is right for you, is my suggestion.  I'm glad you have your own T, which is an important part of your support system.  As Cat Familiar wrote:

It was ugly, expensive, and draining, but it all worked out and I was finally free of him.

Same could be said for my divorce.  I note that many here have a "fear of the unknown" when it comes to leaving their BPD SO, which is understandable.  What I've discovered, however, is that the unknown is often where happiness resides, which is what its all about, in my view.

LuckyJim

[JQ]

Hi Hanging,

I'm happy to hear that you have found a therapist to help YOU through your feelings, thoughts, emotions and someone there for YOU!   

you've received some good guidance here ... .Cat, Lucky Jim ... .as they say it's the fear of the unknown that WE all experience ... ."what if".  For me like Lucky Jim pointed out, the "Unknown" was better then ALL the BPD behavior. NOTHING could or would be that bad down the path of "UNKNOWN".   You got this ... .and the group here has your back ... .just turn around and look at ALL of our smiling faces           

You point out some of the obstacles you face ... .but nothing is unsurmountable as Cat points out.  And at the end of it all you'll be in a better place ... .you look down the tunnel and all you see is darkness ... .look again ... .and you'll see the group lighting the way to the other side and we're all waiting for you 

As the others have pointed out and what my exBPDgf has done is that the suicide threats are a way to manipulate you ... .interesting approach from Cat on her suicide threat.  I would also contact the authorities because BPD have the highest attempt & completion rate of suicides of all the Serious Mental Illnesses, so don't play. Just pick up the phone for a health and welfare check and the police will do it. Then if is in a bad place, unstable, raging, they'll take him for an average of 72 hours depending on where you live in the world.  The important thing is to NOT let him manipulate you ... .learn to set your boundary, and the consequences for breaking those boundaries. Cause & affect if you will.

Happiness as Lucky points out is just on the other side ... .   

J

[flourdust]

My wife actually stopped making suicide threats when I put the crisis hotline on my speed dial. I called them during one of her threats, and they spoke to her and made her admit she wasn't suicidal.

When she threatened suicide again, I said if she was serious, I'd call the crisis line. She backed down.

The next time she threatened suicide, I offered to call the crisis line, and she said she had already called them twice. I checked the phone logs and discovered she was lying.

That was the end of suicide threats. YMMV.

[patientandclear]

My wife actually stopped making suicide threats when I put the crisis hotline on my speed dial. I called them during one of her threats, and they spoke to her and made her admit she wasn't suicidal.

When she threatened suicide again, I said if she was serious, I'd call the crisis line. She backed down.

The next time she threatened suicide, I offered to call the crisis line, and she said she had already called them twice. I checked the phone logs and discovered she was lying.

That was the end of suicide threats. YMMV.

Same -- with my H who has some sort of disorder though probably not BPD.  He would manipulate with suicide threats often.  It stopped when I started taking them literally.  I would just call the police.  End of that particular dynamic.  (He was still horribly problematic and I should have gotten out then, if not sooner.)

[an0ught]

Hi Hanging,

changes are hard and so is the loss of an important relationship. The strong T in his live was stabilizing. Now the T is gone. Some acting out is to be expected.

I'm really not saying you should be leaving - that is up to you and also I'm too much a staying guy to do that often. However I still would like to echo the voices in the thread: Leaving is possible. And from what you said the T said: You need boundaries.

Implementing boundaries is much easier if you have an alternative or at least can imagine it without breaking out in sweat. Leaving would be painful, disruptive, embarrassing, upsetting and costly. You may be able to avoid this pain by taking a stand now and be strict about boundaries in your relationship. That also will be costing you. There is no free lunch when it comes to getting serious about boundaries and people prone to testing and stepping over them. But you have a choice in what and how you do things.

I did find a personal therapist for next week.

[Thread]

Thank you everyone. I am implementing the necessary steps to be in a good place and get out of this one. I'm going to be moving over to the leaving board. I have Come to realize this isn't worth it and it's only been 5 years. And I feel like it's been an eternity. Sometimes I feel bad saying this because I know some of you have it worse mine being high functioning. But this roller coaster ride is making me ill. Physically and mentally breaking down. Where I feel id rather actually be ill than deal with this anymore. I've tried more than enough. I have been using my boundaries in many other situations lately so that is positive.

My therapist and I decided we need to help me make a plan of action. To leave. I just hope like  some of you have said, that I don't just get in another emotional and verbally abusive relationship or choose worse. Seems to be I like artistic minds and that comes w BPD or some sort of disorder  I also need to start working on allowing nice things to happen to me. I'm so used to being chewed up and spat out. I have two friends who are checking in on me regularly and just told off my BPD sister who was attacking me recently about a job she asked me to do and continued to network with that person. Boundaries! She is undiagnosed BPD as all my Ts seem to believe which is why I probably feel my husband's treatment is normal.

[JQ]

Hi Hanging,

You're making some great steps forward in your own recovery & well being. NEVER feel guilty, bad, for what you're going through compared to others. We all are different, we all have different pain tolerances both physical, emotionally and mental.  You might be able to walk on broken glass with bare feet, but I get carpet burns on my bare feet just walking across the room.     Your BPD r/s, your emotions that come with it is very personal to you and no one can or will judge you on how to react or to feel or what direction you want to go because those are YOUR feelings!  What we can do is give you a hug when you want one     and give you a thumbs up when you make a plan of action   

You are self aware and much more educated on BPD, other mental illness, but more importantly you are very much self aware of your codependent behavior and THAT my friend is soo important in moving forward in a healthy manner.  You can recognize when you're starting to revert back to care giving behavior and change it. You can recognize BPD, manipulative, behavior from others and that is MONEY IN THE BANK!

You have a couple of amazing friends who are looking out for you, you're lucky to have them in your life!   

J

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Hanging, Sounds like a plan.  At one point my T asked me whether I thought that I had tried everything.   I said that, Yes, I thought I had.  She replied that she thought so, too, which was uncharacteristic for my T to express her personal opinion, yet there it was.  It made a big impression on me.  Keep us posted!  Many of us have been down this path before you.

LuckyJim

[Ceruleanblue]

Funny, I get that same impression from my therapist. Every week she asks me how long I can keep doing this, and what I'm getting out of it. She thinks BPDh has outright admitted that he "tries", but isn't getting better(she and I both think he isn't truly trying due to not admitting the full extend or taking responsibility, sort of like Hanging's therapist said of her husband). My therapist(who is also our MC), says he seems to lack motivation.

She knows how hard I've tried, and somehow, that makes me feel so much better. I mean, so much of this goes on without much witness, that it's hard to believe.

You can get out of this Hanging. So can I, eventually, and like Lucky Jim said, lots of others have. We don't always want to, but sometimes, it's really the only option.

[JQ]

Hanging, CeruleanBlue, L.J., Group,

Do not try to apply logic to your BPD & their therapy sessions when they are not forth coming, don't take responsibilities for their actions or inactions, lack motivation or fail to complete the prescribe homework on themselves and or their behavior. They are mentally ill with BPD and as we all know the best anyone can hope for is some level of management of the behavior.  So don't beat yourself up for not being able to "fix or cure" their mental illness. 

One of my Clinical Physiologist friends have told me that many T, Ph.d's have referred their BPD patients out to other mental health professionals because it is a never ending project. Imagine the job you do, "whatever it is" had a never ending project that would never be completed. There would be no job satisfaction of completion of it, you would move on to something that would provide for it. It's a basic human need, to feel a sense of accomplishment and she told me not to feel discourage in my thoughts.   

Therapist aren't suppose to point you in a direction, tell you what to do, they're there to give you the tools to help you find your own way, and when you finally find your way down your path they commend you on the work you did to get there. They commend you on YOUR thought & decision making process that you've improved on and they might agree with you on your choice as they did with you. They wanted you to get there without them actually telling you.   

j