Call me crazy, but I contacted her again. I need closure

[Depression = 72% of members]

So yeah, after a month gathering the courage, I contacted her again, as a last resort to get me the closure i desperately need to move on with my life.

All I can do now is hope for a positive reply (if any) and hope I get the closure I think I deserve. Atm I'm even too scared to check if I have an reply.

This is what I sent her:

You're probably gonna hate me even more than you already do for contacting you. But what do you expect me to do?

You know how I stand in life, how I thought you was different. How I've opened up to you like I never have before to anyone else.

I trusted you, and although its anyone's right to make their own decisions, I have never gotten any closure whatsoever. I still have days when I ask myself: what did I do wrong?

It made me extremely insecure. After almost 1.5 years I just wanna know the truth. I already gave up on you ever wanting to be a friend so don't worry about that.

For some reason it seems like you suddenly in a week time or so turned from loving me to hating my absolute guts, which of course is your desicion, I just wanna know why.

All I want to know is why, and what I did wrong. I need closure, I wanna try and make the best out of my life aswell. But with these questions still haunting me at times,

I can't. All I can say is I'm sorry I couldn't make you happy. I tried.

Though there's one thing really bothering me, I have to get off my chest. I can't understand, how you always claimed you was diffrent. That you couldn't understand how people

could jump from one person to another in a short period of time. I don't even know how many times we've talked about that and how much 'we' hated it. Yet you do that exact thing

you always claimed you hated. I just don't understand, I just need to know the truth, I just need your side of the story, the honest truth, so I can try and understand

it from your point of view and get closure. We have never 'closed' this the right, appropriate way, and I think we should. We shouldn't be this awkward and hateful against each other after the

good times we had. You know i'd love to become your friend but I respect If you don't want that, all I really want is closure. Please just read this and don't just block me right away.

We should close this the right way, this is hard for me as well. I rather not contact you because of course it brings up memories. It took me a month to gather the courage to send you this.

It's not like i'm: "oh let's contact H for fun just to piss her off or something" It's extremely hard for me as well, but I need the closure. I want to be able to look back and see the good memories,

, I don't want the last thing to remember being that day it all happened. I wanna look back and say: Yes, it hurts like a ___er, but we closed it the right way, and we had an amazing time.

I wanna be able to just wish you a happy birthday without being scared to piss you off, or being awkward.

I'm gonna stop talking now or this will turn into a ___ing encyclopedia. Please, don't just block me right away. we should close this like adults


There's probably some things in there which are better not to say to a borderline person, but this is how I feel right out my heart.

Extremely scared atm for the response.

Advice is always appreciated

[LostInMemories]

So yeah, after a month gathering the courage, I contacted her again, as a last resort to get me the closure i desperately need to move on with my life.

All I can do now is hope for a positive reply (if any) and hope I get the closure I think I deserve. Atm I'm even too scared to check if I have an reply.

This is what I sent her:

You're probably gonna hate me even more than you already do for contacting you. But what do you expect me to do?

You know how I stand in life, how I thought you was different. How I've opened up to you like I never have before to anyone else.

I trusted you, and although its anyone's right to make their own decisions, I have never gotten any closure whatsoever. I still have days when I ask myself: what did I do wrong?

It made me extremely insecure. After almost 1.5 years I just wanna know the truth. I already gave up on you ever wanting to be a friend so don't worry about that.

For some reason it seems like you suddenly in a week time or so turned from loving me to hating my absolute guts, which of course is your desicion, I just wanna know why.

All I want to know is why, and what I did wrong. I need closure, I wanna try and make the best out of my life aswell. But with these questions still haunting me at times,

I can't. All I can say is I'm sorry I couldn't make you happy. I tried.

Though there's one thing really bothering me, I have to get off my chest. I can't understand, how you always claimed you was diffrent. That you couldn't understand how people

could jump from one person to another in a short period of time. I don't even know how many times we've talked about that and how much 'we' hated it. Yet you do that exact thing

you always claimed you hated. I just don't understand, I just need to know the truth, I just need your side of the story, the honest truth, so I can try and understand

it from your point of view and get closure. We have never 'closed' this the right, appropriate way, and I think we should. We shouldn't be this awkward and hateful against each other after the

good times we had. You know i'd love to become your friend but I respect If you don't want that, all I really want is closure. Please just read this and don't just block me right away.

We should close this the right way, this is hard for me as well. I rather not contact you because of course it brings up memories. It took me a month to gather the courage to send you this.

It's not like i'm: "oh let's contact H for fun just to piss her off or something" It's extremely hard for me as well, but I need the closure. I want to be able to look back and see the good memories,

, I don't want the last thing to remember being that day it all happened. I wanna look back and say: Yes, it hurts like a ___er, but we closed it the right way, and we had an amazing time.

I wanna be able to just wish you a happy birthday without being scared to piss you off, or being awkward.

I'm gonna stop talking now or this will turn into a ___ing encyclopedia. Please, don't just block me right away. we should close this like adults


There's probably some things in there which are better not to say to a borderline person, but this is how I feel right out my heart.

Extremely scared atm for the response.

Advice is always appreciated

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[jdtm]

My thoughts - if you get a reply, do not respond.  Let it lie. 

[LostInMemories]

My thoughts - if you get a reply, do not respond.  Let it lie. 

Altho I hate to say it there's a very big chance you're right, and I never ever get to know the truth. But I can't just sit here slipping in depression and not trying to fight for it. I have always been the kind of person that would fight and do anything to achieve a goal. I take relationships very serious and would sacrifice anything to make it work if I really love someone. That on it's own is tough in today's  'hookup culture' let alone with a BPD person.

[patientandclear]

Hey there. I think it's actually a well-framed message; it is respecting yourself and respecting her choices. Just asking what happened.

Here's the thing though: it's highly likely SHE doesn't really understand what happened and why. You're on this board because you believe she has a personality disorder that plays out in relationships. If you're right about that, the answer to your question "why" is that she has a personality disorder.

It took me a while to figure out the importance of this: the stated reason is NOT the reason. It's what the pwBPD is hanging the decision on because it's an explanation that works with their coping mechanisms of denial, dissociation, projection. My ex was gracious enough to tell me four years after the fact "I don't know why I couldn't stay with you. It doesn't make a lot of sense. There are the reasons I gave to you at the time, but those don't make sense." So, there you have it. That is an advanced answer from someone wBPD: I don't know why. I'm still impressed he managed that one because normally, he is deep into his various story lines of why he leaves the women in his life.

So whatever she tells you, if she replies, what matters is less (in my opinion) whether you reply, and more that you not take it to heart. She likely cannot explain this accurately. And a lot of people go chasing around feeling bad about this thing they supposedly did or were (in my case, a bad parent and controlling, variously) when that is just the way the dysfunction churned the perception of the BPD former partner.  Remember, often their perception distortions stem from events long ago with other people (their parents in particular), but they are not conscious of that. They are going to explain in terms of what YOU did.

I also want to flag her adamant stance while you were together that she doesn't like or respect people who hop from person to person. My ex portrayed himself as someone who had been alone for years, waiting for me to come along. That was a sales job and a courting pitch; with lots of mirroring thrown in because that is MY life trajectory and those are my values. Actually, he'd been wooing and breaking the hearts of many women during those years, while waiting for me/The One to come along. To him--same thing. He liked thinking of himself as a person with those values or he liked me thinking of him that way. I tend to think your ex's views on that may be projecting her discomfort with her own past actions. Are you sure she has not hopped from person to person before?

Nothing wrong with your letter, BUT don't take to heart anything in any reply she might send.

[LostInMemories]

Thanks for your reply patiendandclear.

Your message makes a lot of sense. Although in the back of my mind I know her BPD (she's been diagnosed with) is the reason, it's hard to understand for me. There must be something that triggered her to start hating me so sudden? Most likely the reasons she will give me (if reply) won't make sense indeed. But they might give me a little closure , who knows... I can't sit back and do nothing, I want to fight for it. It's been 1.5 years now since she broke up, and I'm still asking myself if it wasn't something I did wrong.

About the switching from person to person, hard to say... .When I met her, she was with the same guy she's back with now (slimy mother*****. My ex is extremely manipulative and he knows it and he is abusing it. Honestly, horrible guy, I think most people who would see him would run away as fast as they could, but back to topic. When I met her I only found out a week or 2 later she was still with this guy. He was abusing her physically and mentally. (I know for a fact this is true, pwBPD tend to lie about these things to get attention, that was not the case). She left him and got with me, claiming she didn't loved him for months and was just scared to leave (partly true). So yeah that basically was a 'jump' from him to me which I didn't see like that/noticed at the time. We was together for about a year when she basically had her first major 'BPD switch' if I can call it like that. SO she decided we was on a break and started talking to this guy,she tends to pick the slimy manipulating kind of men that take advantage, you know where I'm talking about. She claims they didn't do nothing, but I still doubt it. It gone on for about a week or so until she came back crying begging me to forgive her. me (loving her to death) obviously forgave her. Then we was happy for another year, really doing well, improving our relationship and me getting used to dealing the right way with her BPD traits. I accepted them and dealt with them according to what my doc told me. Life was just good, and then suddenly, boom, it was over. There's much more to it but I already have a topic about that.

So yeah excuse my ability to give an overly long answer to a relative simple question, but yes, I could have noticed some 'switching' behavior, but obviously love makes blind... .

And if I'm really honest, what I sent her is as much as 'getting closure and knowing the truth' as a last resort to get her back... .Or, at least get her to talk to me without calling me names when I ask simple, non-offending questions.

[Fr4nz]

Hey Patient,

your reply struck me on several levels.

Here's the thing though: it's highly likely SHE doesn't really understand what happened and why. You're on this board because you believe she has a personality disorder that plays out in relationships. If you're right about that, the answer to your question "why" is that she has a personality disorder.

It took me a while to figure out the importance of this: the stated reason is NOT the reason. It's what the pwBPD is hanging the decision on because it's an explanation that works with their coping mechanisms of denial, dissociation, projection. My ex was gracious enough to tell me four years after the fact "I don't know why I couldn't stay with you. It doesn't make a lot of sense. There are the reasons I gave to you at the time, but those don't make sense." So, there you have it. That is an advanced answer from someone wBPD: I don't know why. I'm still impressed he managed that one because normally, he is deep into his various story lines of why he leaves the women in his life.

I can relate; while towards the end of the r/s (and after the breakup) my ex uBPD/HPD gf was constantly fighting and creating nonsensical drama, so much that I was incredibly stressed and I really didn't know what was going on -- with the exception that I perceived there was really something off in her, she said to a friend of her after the breakup: "He's perfect, a really good boy, but in this moment I want something else"  (this friend reported to me the fact several months later).

So there you have it: she was making me believe I was defective, always in mistake and incapable of communicating, while the truth was quite far from it.

So whatever she tells you, if she replies, what matters is less (in my opinion) whether you reply, and more that you not take it to heart. She likely cannot explain this accurately. And a lot of people go chasing around feeling bad about this thing they supposedly did or were (in my case, a bad parent and controlling, variously) when that is just the way the dysfunction churned the perception of the BPD former partner.  Remember, often their perception distortions stem from events long ago with other people (their parents in particular), but they are not conscious of that. They are going to explain in terms of what YOU did.

Again: SO, SO, SO true! Mind that, towards the final months of our 1,5 years relationship, she started telling me I was so similar to her mother... .

In fact, give it enough time, in their mind we become an hyper-critical parent, the one who treated them "so badly" (usually... .the mother; my ex has a love/hate r/s with her). Somewhere I read that (perhaps from one of 2010's posts), the more they identify you with their primary care-giver, the more they cared about you (and the more you become a trigger afterwards). I don't know if this is true, but my experience says so.

[Fr4nz]

Thanks for your reply patiendandclear.

Your message makes a lot of sense. Although in the back of my mind I know her BPD (she's been diagnosed with) is the reason, it's hard to understand for me. There must be something that triggered her to start hating me so sudden? Most likely the reasons she will give me (if reply) won't make sense indeed. But they might give me a little closure , who knows... I can't sit back and do nothing, I want to fight for it. It's been 1.5 years now since she broke up, and I'm still asking myself if it wasn't something I did wrong.

Hey Thijmen,

you're pretty much in my position: I had the chance to reconnect with her after 13+ months of NC, and it didn't go so well; please, read these topics, maybe they will help you to shed some light on the situation:

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=292690.0

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=293643.0

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=293415.0

In general, don't count on her to have closure or reconnect... .probablities of success are very low; instead, you have to get closure by yourself, gaining knowledge about the disorder and going to a therapist if you think you need some support.

[LostInMemories]

Hey Fr4nz. Thank you for your reply. I have read the topics, scary how similar all these stories sound... .You're an excellent writer, you know how to put certain feelings into words, which I fail at miserably (obviously language barrier plays a part in there).  I can't believe how quickly they can switch from painting you white and black again. I have experienced that aswell, it's scary.

I know getting back with her, or trying to, is very likely sooner or later gonna end up in the same, though, I am not strong enough to ignore my feelings for her. It's been 1.5 years since the breakup now and I'm still struggling to handle it. I'm pretty sure I have co-dependent traits, and sometimes it feels like I'm the one who's crazy. Especially in nowadays hookup-culture, it actually seems 'strange' to take relationships seriously.

I could very much relate to this topic: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=289136.0

I think I'm addicted to this kind of 'love' , especially because it was my first serious relationship that I fully committed to (yes I have the fear of commitment, things like this being the reason)

[Leonis]

I tried to get some closure from my ex last year when we first broke up in May. The only thing that eventually came out of it was extending the relationship and pushing it to the next level. Then, the second crash was even worse than the last one simply because instead of breaking up a relationship, she broke up an engagement.

[LostInMemories]

Hey Leonis,

I'm so sorry to hear that! Can't imagine how hard that must be. I see alot of stories, and feel like pwBPD tend to 'switch' just before a major event. In my case my BPD ex broke up just 3 days before she was coming to visit me (we was in a long distance relationship). It seems like big events get them scared, or trigger them or something. It's hard for ppl like you and me to understand. Hope you're doing okay

[Ashwin]

Hi first of all be happy that u did get an opportunity to send her a mail with ur thoughts be happy that atleast you were able to do so ... .in my case that bridge is broken ... .she had sort of warned me if I make any contact either direct or indirect I will be thrown behind bars... .consider urself very lucky... .

   

      If she gets back to u with a positive reply consider urself lucky. ... .we are only human beings and we are prone to making mistakes so don't worry. ...

[LostInMemories]

Hello Ashwin, thanks for your reply.

This is about the 4th fb account I made in 1.5 years, all the other ones got blocked right away. She didn't threaten me with legal sh*t like that yet, but who knows what she will try to do in the future. I'm very sorry that she behaves that way towards you. They tend to do that because they can't handle the truth, and made their own 'truth' and actually started to believe it. Then, when you try and confront them with the actual truth; what actually happened and not their 'fairy tale' they panic, block you or in your case even worse. I hope things will turn out okay for you.

[john83]

Hello Ashwin, thanks for your reply.

This is about the 4th fb account I made in 1.5 years, all the other ones got blocked right away. She didn't threaten me with legal sh*t like that yet, but who knows what she will try to do in the future. I'm very sorry that she behaves that way towards you. They tend to do that because they can't handle the truth, and made their own 'truth' and actually started to believe it. Then, when you try and confront them with the actual truth; what actually happened and not their 'fairy tale' they panic, block you or in your case even worse. I hope things will turn out okay for you.

Hi Thijmen... .I'm really sorry to hear that you're still seeking closure from your ex partner. Unlike mine, yours has been diagnosed, so there's some solace in that. Given all the information and collective experiences shared on this forum, you must be aware that your ex's 'version' of events will rarely, if ever, correlate to yours. This particular aspect of a r/s with a pwBPD is the cause of a great many fall outs and arguments... .think back to a time when she made you feel inadequate, or you were made to feel solely responsible for some issue or other. At the time, you would no doubt fight back, argue your corner, or eventually blow your top through sheer frustration... .regardless of your actions or the truth of the matter, did she ever actually see it from your perspective? Did she ever admit that perhaps she was wrong, or truly apologize for the slander? Mine certainly didn't. She was vehement in her grasp of 'the truth', and the truth was I was ALWAYS at fault.

The reason I'm mentioning this here, is because closure requires real objectivity and genuine insight from both partners, if you are to stand any chance of exorcizing the demons that appear to be troubling you right now. I seriously doubt whether she will have the objectivity necessary to answer your questions, since her entire narrative (and thus her very being) relies on perpetuating the story (to both herself and others) that you were the monster, the liar, deceiver, manipulator, game-player, abuser, gas-lighter (insert your own wrong-doings here... .).

So perhaps it's time to simply accept that you had this experience, it was most likely very painful, confusing and emotionally draining, you were left saddled with self-doubt, unresolved issues and questions, the answers to which you will probably never get from her.

Instead, consider why you entered into the relationship in the first place, look to understand what aspects of your nature clouded your vision and better judgement, when you could see that things were not right, think why it was that despite all the hurtful remarks and ___ty behaviour, you opted to stay, or try even harder to accommodate her ways... .

And now that you've managed to escape her skewed psychological clutches, remind yourself that you are, and will be, so much healthier emotionally, when you're not hitched to a serial manipulator. Don't expect much, if she does actually reply... .it will be either more of the same, or no response whatsoever... .which will set you back a little on your road to recovery. Remember that wielding the power is very much a part of the BPD modus operandi... .you've just given some of yours away by making contact... .a fact that won't be lost on her, assuming she reads it

Chin up Thijmen... .you're not alone... .

[Leonis]

Hey Leonis,

I'm so sorry to hear that! Can't imagine how hard that must be. I see alot of stories, and feel like pwBPD tend to 'switch' just before a major event. In my case my BPD ex broke up just 3 days before she was coming to visit me (we was in a long distance relationship). It seems like big events get them scared, or trigger them or something. It's hard for ppl like you and me to understand. Hope you're doing okay

It does seem to make sense. The first time we broke up was after discussing about the direction our relationship was going. Then, a month later, in May, she broke it off. She came back because I was "persistent" in trying to understand her. Ironically, everything fell apart again this year around the same time. It's almost like a seasonal thing.

[LostInMemories]

Hi Thijmen... .I'm really sorry to hear that you're still seeking closure from your ex partner. Unlike mine, yours has been diagnosed, so there's some solace in that. Given all the information and collective experiences shared on this forum, you must be aware that your ex's 'version' of events will rarely, if ever, correlate to yours. This particular aspect of a r/s with a pwBPD is the cause of a great many fall outs and arguments... .think back to a time when she made you feel inadequate, or you were made to feel solely responsible for some issue or other. At the time, you would no doubt fight back, argue your corner, or eventually blow your top through sheer frustration... .regardless of your actions or the truth of the matter, did she ever actually see it from your perspective? Did she ever admit that perhaps she was wrong, or truly apologize for the slander? Mine certainly didn't. She was vehement in her grasp of 'the truth', and the truth was I was ALWAYS at fault.

Exactly this. All the arguments we had, she always made it look like I caused them. In the beginning i tried to 'fight' back, yet in a very calm way, trying to make her understand that it's not all my fault. After a few tries I gave that up. She knew something was wrong with her, so we made an agreement that everytime we had an argument, I would just leave her alone for 30 mins or so, to let her cool down, and then after we would just not talk about it anymore. This was a great solution for her, because this meant there was no need for her to be 'forced' to see the actual truth. She could just curse at me, and afterwards we wouldn't talk about it. I learned to live with this, because I love this girl. I was like: Okay, if this is what it takes, so be it.

The reason I'm mentioning this here, is because closure requires real objectivity and genuine insight from both partners, if you are to stand any chance of exorcizing the demons that appear to be troubling you right now. I seriously doubt whether she will have the objectivity necessary to answer your questions, since her entire narrative (and thus her very being) relies on perpetuating the story (to both herself and others) that you were the monster, the liar, deceiver, manipulator, game-player, abuser, gas-lighter (insert your own wrong-doings here... .).

So perhaps it's time to simply accept that you had this experience, it was most likely very painful, confusing and emotionally draining, you were left saddled with self-doubt, unresolved issues and questions, the answers to which you will probably never get from her.

I think you're right. I probably won't be getting closure from her answer. I have to admit tho that its as much as a last try to get her to talk to me and work things out, as it's getting closure.

Instead, consider why you entered into the relationship in the first place, look to understand what aspects of your nature clouded your vision and better judgement, when you could see that things were not right, think why it was that despite all the hurtful remarks and ___ty behaviour, you opted to stay, or try even harder to accommodate her ways... .

This, is pretty simple. I was a wreck when I met her. I suffer from anxiety attacks, and was in a very bad way. When I met her, she gave me so much strength. She gave me the feeling I was actually 'someone'. She made me feel honestly like I was 'her man' and therefor HAD to be strong (in a good way). She 'cured' my anxiety problem for 80% (meaning I could very well live with it). It's hard to explain in words really how much she helped me conquer this anxiety, and how much she made me feel 'needed'. Basically she gave me an extreme self-esteem boost. This definately played a part of putting up with the things you mentioned above (and obviously loving this girl to death)

Needless to say all this progress collapsed when she left me.

And now that you've managed to escape her skewed psychological clutches, remind yourself that you are, and will be, so much healthier emotionally, when you're not hitched to a serial manipulator. Don't expect much, if she does actually reply... .it will be either more of the same, or no response whatsoever... .which will set you back a little on your road to recovery. Remember that wielding the power is very much a part of the BPD modus operandi... .you've just given some of yours away by making contact... .a fact that won't be lost on her, assuming she reads it

Chin up Thijmen... .you're not alone... .

I really hope I will be healthier in the long run. Atm i'm doing very bad, my anxieties got worse, my self-esteem is at it's lowest. All I wanted to do is make this girl happy. I would go to the moon and back for her. Yet she drops me and gets back with someone that abuses the f*ck out of her. No, I'm not an 'angel' myself, but at least I was loyal, and would have done literally anything for her. Such a shame she doesn't see that... .

Thanks alot for your reply John, for some reason it really touched me.

[john83]

Hi Thijmen... .I'm really sorry to hear that you're still seeking closure from your ex partner. Unlike mine, yours has been diagnosed, so there's some solace in that. Given all the information and collective experiences shared on this forum, you must be aware that your ex's 'version' of events will rarely, if ever, correlate to yours. This particular aspect of a r/s with a pwBPD is the cause of a great many fall outs and arguments... .think back to a time when she made you feel inadequate, or you were made to feel solely responsible for some issue or other. At the time, you would no doubt fight back, argue your corner, or eventually blow your top through sheer frustration... .regardless of your actions or the truth of the matter, did she ever actually see it from your perspective? Did she ever admit that perhaps she was wrong, or truly apologize for the slander? Mine certainly didn't. She was vehement in her grasp of 'the truth', and the truth was I was ALWAYS at fault.

Exactly this. All the arguments we had, she always made it look like I caused them. In the beginning i tried to 'fight' back, yet in a very calm way, trying to make her understand that it's not all my fault. After a few tries I gave that up. She knew something was wrong with her, so we made an agreement that everytime we had an argument, I would just leave her alone for 30 mins or so, to let her cool down, and then after we would just not talk about it anymore. This was a great solution for her, because this meant there was no need for her to be 'forced' to see the actual truth. She could just curse at me, and afterwards we wouldn't talk about it. I learned to live with this, because I love this girl. I was like: Okay, if this is what it takes, so be it.

The reason I'm mentioning this here, is because closure requires real objectivity and genuine insight from both partners, if you are to stand any chance of exorcizing the demons that appear to be troubling you right now. I seriously doubt whether she will have the objectivity necessary to answer your questions, since her entire narrative (and thus her very being) relies on perpetuating the story (to both herself and others) that you were the monster, the liar, deceiver, manipulator, game-player, abuser, gas-lighter (insert your own wrong-doings here... .).

So perhaps it's time to simply accept that you had this experience, it was most likely very painful, confusing and emotionally draining, you were left saddled with self-doubt, unresolved issues and questions, the answers to which you will probably never get from her.

I think you're right. I probably won't be getting closure from her answer. I have to admit tho that its as much as a last try to get her to talk to me and work things out, as it's getting closure.

Instead, consider why you entered into the relationship in the first place, look to understand what aspects of your nature clouded your vision and better judgement, when you could see that things were not right, think why it was that despite all the hurtful remarks and ___ty behaviour, you opted to stay, or try even harder to accommodate her ways... .

This, is pretty simple. I was a wreck when I met her. I suffer from anxiety attacks, and was in a very bad way. When I met her, she gave me so much strength. She gave me the feeling I was actually 'someone'. She made me feel honestly like I was 'her man' and therefor HAD to be strong (in a good way). She 'cured' my anxiety problem for 80% (meaning I could very well live with it). It's hard to explain in words really how much she helped me conquer this anxiety, and how much she made me feel 'needed'. Basically she gave me an extreme self-esteem boost. This definately played a part of putting up with the things you mentioned above (and obviously loving this girl to death)

Needless to say all this progress collapsed when she left me.

And now that you've managed to escape her skewed psychological clutches, remind yourself that you are, and will be, so much healthier emotionally, when you're not hitched to a serial manipulator. Don't expect much, if she does actually reply... .it will be either more of the same, or no response whatsoever... .which will set you back a little on your road to recovery. Remember that wielding the power is very much a part of the BPD modus operandi... .you've just given some of yours away by making contact... .a fact that won't be lost on her, assuming she reads it

Chin up Thijmen... .you're not alone... .

I really hope I will be healthier in the long run. Atm i'm doing very bad, my anxieties got worse, my self-esteem is at it's lowest. All I wanted to do is make this girl happy. I would go to the moon and back for her. Yet she drops me and gets back with someone that abuses the f*ck out of her. No, I'm not an 'angel' myself, but at least I was loyal, and would have done literally anything for her. Such a shame she doesn't see that... .

Thanks alot for your reply John, for some reason it really touched me.

You're most welcome Thijmen... .

Here's a thing! You were at a low ebb when you first met... .(maybe feeling that you were coasting, life passing you by a little?), you were aware that you have unresolved anxiety issues and low self esteem, and yet here was this beautiful, charming, creature that didn't mind at all... .in fact she seemed to 'love' you all the more for your honesty and vulnerabilities. You begin to feel that here, at long last, is someone who really 'gets' you... .cares for you, despite your 'failings'. You feel like she may well be 'The One'... .This is a major hook for what is to follow. I'm guessing that she was very good at getting you to open up to her, disclose your innermost concerns and fragilities (pwBPD seem to be experts, based on the evidence on this forum). Moreover, this process probably happened very quickly, much more so than in previous relationships with nonBPDs. To feel valued, cherished and needed is profoundly potent medecine, especially to those (like myself) who generally have a low opinion of themselves by default. If it's coming from the right place it's at once a soothing balm and life-giving elixir... .if it's coming from a pwBPD, it feels fantastic, initially, but it's short lived. Pretty soon, all those wonderfully intimate conversations and shared 'griefs' turn to accusations about how little you actually care for them, how you don't live up to the person you claimed to be... .as I'm sure you experienced. I think what has happened here (and bear in mind this is only my opinion, based on my own personal experience) her initial 'Lovebombing' has enabled you to begin to 'love' yourself again... .for which you would feel indebted. This has set you up to accept all manner of abuse  

But here's the rub: with a rekindled sense of self worth, and growing self confidence, you become less of an easy 'mark', so she then starts to undermine the good progress that has been made, with accusations, perceived slights and demeaning remarks. Remember that this isn't about you... .it's about her... .I'm reminded of that old line when a narcissist is having a conversation with someone in the bar... ."Anyway, enough about me... .So tell me... .What do you think about me?"

The initial idealization was a hook, especially because you were at a low point.


For what it's worth, you don't need her help, to overcome any anxiety issues you may have. You may feel like she helped, but by your own admission, they're still alive and kicking, so go figure! Get some counselling... .be yourself... .

Then when the time's right you can go to the moon and back for someone who really loves you for who you are

[LostInMemories]

Thanks again John,

You're right, she took advantage of me opening up to her. She made me love myself again. She was the only person I have ever trusted to fully open up to.

I know it's better to stay away from her, my mind knows but my heart says the opposite. All I'm thinking about is finding ways to win her back... .Why? Because I could handle the borderline traits throughout the relationship. I could handle the mood-swings, accusations, arguments. I'd rather have her with these things to handle than not have her at all. I really don't know what to do at the moment. I'm thinking of maybe just showing up at her doorstep one day, but that's a big step because I live overseas. I don't know. I know everybody would say to stay away from her and they are probably right, but the fact is I love this girl as she is and I can't help it. I mean, I would forget her if I could, but it's been over 1.5 years now and I'm still struggling... .So maybe I shouldn't forget her, maybe I should fight for it because maybe even after all this sh*t we are meant to be. I don't know, sometimes it feels like I'm the one that's crazy instead of her.

[john83]

sometimes it feels like I'm the one that's crazy instead of her.

Welcome to the world of falling for someone with BPD... .

I know there are specific pages on here for people who choose to work through the issues with their BPD partner. The fact that she has had a formal diagnosis and must therefore be aware of her traits and behaviour, suggests that there may be scope for improved relations. However, I'd strongly recommend that you seek counselling before trying to reconnect with your ex. The reason for this is twofold: firstly, in order for you to come to terms with your underlying self esteem and anxiety issues, you need help and support from someone who fully understands the nature of it, yet has NO ULTERIOR MOTIVE, save to help you to heal. Secondly, unless you resolve your issues in your own time and on your own terms, if (and it's a big if) your ex partner agrees to resurrect your relationship, you are at the mercy of her condition, as well as your own. Insecurities feed off insecurities. I'm not saying it can't work, and your willingness to try is laudable, but as you know from your own experience, it's an emotional minefield.

Don't assume that you 'should' be over your ex after 1 & 1/2 years... .'Should' is a tyranny... .you feel what you feel, after all, but by the same token, don't assume that she is 'the One' for you... .the world is full of 'Ones'... .in time, after the pain of break up has settled, it's natural to look back with fond memories; it's also easy (and foolhardy) to gloss over the turmoil as we tend to avoid revisiting painful experiences, until we're able to fully accept them and move on.

Get your own house in order... .talk to a counsellor, explain how you're feeling, how you're still enamoured with the idea of a loving relationship with your ex.... .but remember, be honest with yourself, your relationship wasn't great, it was out of balance, it was damaging and painful... .it has left you 'stuck' for nearly two years... .Harsh, but true

[KarmasReal]

Hey Thijmen and all other members,

I was reading through your post and I felt compelled to address a couple of topics. Your message to your ex for one, it's exactly what every fiber in my being wants to do right now. It's only been a month for me, but I want closure and understanding just like you do. But I have heard just like you have that they really don't know, and if they do they probably won't tell you the truth, so I refrained from doing so. I did ask for some stuff I left at her place she basically said she was sad over the break up didn't want me to get my stuff and told me not to text her. Somewhat strange behavior but for BPD strange behavior is normal. So now I'm just going about my life as best I can, dating and trying to get back to a normal me. I think the only thing you can do is what I'm doing, wait it out. You will heal at some point, we all will, also your absence is the only way you can know whether your ex had feelings for you or just used you. If you're gone and she doesn't reach out or miss you, you know it's over and maybe by that time you will be healed and moving on anyways, and if she does you decide to do whatever you think is right for you.

On another topic, the post before mine describes something I'm starting to see a pattern in. Big events and life changes absolutely trigger BPD. Holidays, anniversaries, bad memory days, weddings, moving in together, and engagements. The fact you all were in the process of taking the step to get engaged could have severely triggered her or every slowly over time. Just a thought. Hope this helps.

[Mars22]

Hello Ashwin, thanks for your reply.

This is about the 4th fb account I made in 1.5 years, all the other ones got blocked right away. She didn't threaten me with legal sh*t like that yet, but who knows what she will try to do in the future. I'm very sorry that she behaves that way towards you. They tend to do that because they can't handle the truth, and made their own 'truth' and actually started to believe it. Then, when you try and confront them with the actual truth; what actually happened and not their 'fairy tale' they panic, block you or in your case even worse. I hope things will turn out okay for you.

Thijmen - believe me when I tell you, it's been 2 months for me and I'd love to send a letter like that to my uBPDxgf. But, i guess i see the answers here already. Please clarify — you having been blocked 4 times with 4 different Facebook accounts kinda gives me all the answers i need. I'm not at all trying to be negative here, please know I'm equally as crushed as you with my breakup but, if she's blocking you each time you make a new account on fb, is this not a sign she doesn't want to talk? Is it really worth it to chisel away at her 'truth' until she concedes? Is that even possible given she has new bf? It feels like your the one trying to break INTO prison so you guys can be together in the same cell. I just don't want to see you get hurt brother. If this guy(her bf) is as bad as you say then, perhaps let things naturally go as they will? Are you expecting her to suddenly just break it off with him?

Again, my apologies I'm not trying to be the sand in the ointment here but, I'm curious to know what your end game is.

[Ashwin]

Thijmen understand one thing I really don't know about BPD ... .I mean scientifically it's been proven is what they say ... .but if u ask me it's right down to the mindset of a person at that particular time ... .times varies so does people's mindset. ... .time changes everything

    One example is let's look at things from a materialistic aspect guys you want a BMW u decide to go ahead and get it someone steals it or worse u go n crash it and she refuses to start won't you be upset ... .but u do eventually get over it won't you I mean u will fatser than an animate object ... .the same applies I know this is not a very good example. .

    The whole scenario is like a heisenbergs uncertainty principle. ... .eventually in time if she thinks about you she will get back to u man stay strong ... .and remember that u have to love ur self first in order for someone else to do so

     Get ur self together bro. ... .if she is meant for u she will come back... .remember one thing "there are better sweeter maidens waiting for u in cleaner greener neater pastures"... .

[Leonis]

     Get ur self together bro. ... .if she is meant for u she will come back... .remember one thing "there are better sweeter maidens waiting for u in cleaner greener neater pastures"... .

I agree. After many attempts and she's not responding, it's a lost cause. I'm only holding onto my ex as long as she's willing to interact and perhaps do something about her issues since I don't believe she's not full on BPD, but displaying odd behaviors similar to it.

[LostInMemories]

Thank you everybody for replying. I can't even explain how much support you guys and this forum are giving me. It's good to talk about it, and good to see people with similar stories, see ppl putting feelings into words that I failed to to, and people giving me advice.

Mars22, you are probably right. This is what I meant with sometimes it feels like I'm the one who's crazy. Why do I contact her over and over again? Well, because I feel like she is running away from the truth. Because I need closure, and because I have this little bit of hope, that something I say might trigger her to 'fall back' into her 'old' personality. It's probably very stupid, but it's mostly rash decisions.

I know for a fact she is getting abused (physically and mentally) by her new bf. I know she is very unhappy (I still have contact with her environment). If she was happy with a new bf that treated her right, I would have never sent even 1 of these messages, just out of respect. But this guy, he is garbage. I shouldn't even care after all she put me through, but I do.

Don't apologize either, you're probably right.

Still, I believe she would react very different when I'd actually show up in person. Secondly, looking at previous answers I got a few months after the breakup, I felt like she wasn't really talking freely. Answers were short, and very vague, but still a bit hinting. It could be very well that her new BF is looking over her shoulder and telling her what to do. He's done worse things, so it wouldn't surprise me a bit if she had nothing to say whatsoever about her entire life. Further hints to this is she has lost a lot of friends the weeks after the breakup, who all contacted me to ask what was going on with her. Like she kicked everybody out of her life she had a bond with... .This probably is more BPD behavior, but I feel like there's some degree of influence.

While I'm writing this I'm thinking by myself: why do I even care, how crazy do I make myself look. Like I'm obsessed with her. I don't know, this girl gave me so much, it's hard to live without. It's like a drug... I probably sound pathetic and like an attention seeker. That's why I never talk about it to my friends and family, I feel like an attention seeker when I do... But it's just, I need to get things off my chest as well. Again, you people and this forum helped me incredibly with that. I found so much similarities and people who are going through the same and actually understand. Thank you all. I could go on for hours, but I'm getting stuck again (language barrier and I'm not good in putting feelings into words).

Btw: to this day I did not get an reply OR get blocked. Nor did she read it (awesome job from Facebook's part of not notifying non-friended messages)

[Leonis]

Thank you everybody for replying. I can't even explain how much support you guys and this forum are giving me. It's good to talk about it, and good to see people with similar stories, see ppl putting feelings into words that I failed to to, and people giving me advice.

Still, I believe she would react very different when I'd actually show up in person.

That's why I never talk about it to my friends and family, I feel like an attention seeker when I do... But it's just, I need to get things off my chest as well.

Btw: to this day I did not get an reply OR get blocked. Nor did she read it (awesome job from Facebook's part of not notifying non-friended messages)

The thing is, if someone wants to sabotage their life, they will find a way to do it. You may feel bad about it and may feel responsible... .DON'T. You can feel bad, but never responsible for her choices. My ex-fiancée obviously desired intimacy and closeness with someone despite of her exclamation about how much easier it is to be alone than deal with all the "stress" that come with relationships. She pretty much live like a hermit with few casual acquaintances such as roommates and coworkers as "friends" for the time being. Hell, when I first met her, she was renting out some basement room from an old couple by herself.

I'm the THIRD guy she's engaged to since she was 18 (she's 25 right now) and the FOURTH guy she's had 6+ months relationships with, but she never questions if the issue is with her. All her previous 3 boyfriends are now married to someone else and have kids. She only repeats the same cycle of "it's been a while, maybe I can do relationships" ever since the first guy. But, she seems to progress a little bit each time as I was her first physical relationship. I can only imagine she'll progress to marriage/divorce in the future.

What good does it do for her to keep the cancelled wedding a secret from coworkers and wear the ring when she broke off the engagement? I have no idea. Just an appearance? Why even wear that ring? It's not like she's too poor to accessorize herself. I mean, she even bought the ring off of me with the EXACT price I bought it for.

My ex acted very differently too when she saw me. Whatever happened the restraining order threat? Nope. Turned into unprotected sex and full on intimacy until she got frustrated that she can't orgasm due to her own psychological block? Yeah, that's the sort of crazy we all have dealt with. All those goodbyes, and yet a response when I actually initiate contact.

You should talk to a few of your trusted friends/family about this. It helped me to see how absurd my situation was.

And FYI, if you are not connected on Facebook, chances are, the recipients won't see the message because the way the message inboxes are organized. I sometimes find messages I didn't know I received from months, or even years, ago.

[LostInMemories]

The thing is, if someone wants to sabotage their life, they will find a way to do it. You may feel bad about it and may feel responsible... .DON'T. You can feel bad, but never responsible for her choices. My ex-fiancée obviously desired intimacy and closeness with someone despite of her exclamation about how much easier it is to be alone than deal with all the "stress" that come with relationships. She pretty much live like a hermit with few casual acquaintances such as roommates and coworkers as "friends" for the time being. Hell, when I first met her, she was renting out some basement room from an old couple by herself.

I guess you're right. There's nothing I can or could have done about it. I'm so sorry for your situation, it seems alot worse than mine. Can't imagine how tough it would be after being engaged.

I can relate to the "relationships are so overrated, stressful, and only cause pain, I rather be on my own, I'm a very independent person" kind of sh*t. The way you wrote it sound like it was coming out of my ex's mouth... Seems like an BPD trait aswell, wanting to be 'alone and independent' yet being afraid to be alone.

My ex acted very differently too when she saw me. Whatever happened the restraining order threat? Nope. Turned into unprotected sex and full on intimacy until she got frustrated that she can't orgasm due to her own psychological block? Yeah, that's the sort of crazy we all have dealt with. All those goodbyes, and yet a response when I actually initiate contact.

Yeah that's how I feel what would happen if I'd show up. If not for my anxiety issues, i'd have shown up a long time ago already. (shows how severe them anxiety attacks are, I'd do anything to get this girl back, but this I can't do, but that's a whole different story). Though, I think I could do it even though my anxieties for long traveling. The thing is, I have no guarantee how she will react. If she reacts badly, my anxieties kick in 10 times worse, and I probably end up in a body bag. That's the reason really why I didn't show up yet. Maybe I should just go there, but I wanna keep it as a last resort, because of the serious risk I'll take of getting even worse when the reaction is bad.

What do you think? My heart is telling me to do it ever since, but my mind reminds me of the 'risks' as a direct result from my anxiety issues.

You should talk to a few of your trusted friends/family about this. It helped me to see how absurd my situation was.

I do talk to my parents about it, sometimes. Not often though, because I do feel ashamed sometimes (altho I know my parents fully understand me and would never judge). Also I do have counselling for both my anxiety issues as depression, and understanding this whole BPD thing. This forum helped me understand it more than my councilor tho, you see BPD isn't getting alot of attention in my country, and few ppl know about it what it really means. (I have thought about setting something up for my country for BPD 'victims' since there is no real place for ppl in my country to go)

And FYI, if you are not connected on Facebook, chances are, the recipients won't see the message because the way the message inboxes are organized. I sometimes find messages I didn't know I received from months, or even years, ago.

Yeah, that's exactly what I meant... You tend to get notifications on the messenger app on your phone tho, but I don't know how it works exactly (I'm not the best with computers etcc)

[Leonis]

Yeah that's how I feel what would happen if I'd show up. If not for my anxiety issues, i'd have shown up a long time ago already. (shows how severe them anxiety attacks are, I'd do anything to get this girl back, but this I can't do, but that's a whole different story). Though, I think I could do it even though my anxieties for long traveling. The thing is, I have no guarantee how she will react. If she reacts badly, my anxieties kick in 10 times worse, and I probably end up in a body bag. That's the reason really why I didn't show up yet. Maybe I should just go there, but I wanna keep it as a last resort, because of the serious risk I'll take of getting even worse when the reaction is bad.

What do you think? My heart is telling me to do it ever since, but my mind reminds me of the 'risks' as a direct result from my anxiety issues.

Personally, I wouldn't unless she does something that warrants it, or somehow your conversations lead to you meeting up. I think there will be more harm in store for you than any other unpredictable behavior your ex may do.

But, it's your life. If it makes you feel like you've finally done all you can, all the power to you.

[Mars22]

Yeah, I can dig it... its a process brother. I'm really impressed you went 1.5 years NC and still had the urge?  I cannot wait for time to heal me from these deep wounds. But, the real key here is, yeah you're going to lapse every time you try and reach out to her. Like starting over from day#1 every time. A very good friend who has been 22 years sober from alcohol explained it to me in these terms. As an alcoholic you have constant cravings... "Just one more sip and I'm done... I can handle it... just one more sip". Well, one more sip turns into finishing the whole bottle and then the cycle continues... .and your off 'sipping' of the new bottle. Try and stop taking the sip. You get it man. You sound like you really know its bad for you but you can't pull away because, Jeez - it is a withdrawal, no doubt. Thiamin, buddy these are ALL normal feelings to have from this kinda attachment. So, don't beat yourself too much. But, try and begin to see and focus a little time each day towards seeing that, healthy r/s are balances that involve positives behaviors towards one another. Expect no less. You deserve a lovely angel; somebody better in your life that will treat you with respect and dignity you deserve.

I've often had the dream that my uBPDxgf emails me back and finally admits to ALL the things she did wrong to me, and how badly she treated me. And I dream of the embrace, our bodies melting within in each other, weak we become, dizzy actually, we can barely stand. Both of us overflowing with passion. I've played this scenario out in mind for so long. But, I'll tell ya... its a fantasy. Because her actions from this disorder have showed me otherwise, time and time again. And, ya know what? — that is real, not some fantasy. She is not capable of true accountability and understanding the way i see it -period. She never, EVER could! So, I'll never get the answers i need. I wanted to make her into something she is not. And, until I begin see her for what she is, (somebody with serious BPD traits) I'll continue to delude myself and keep taking sips. We both need to stop the cycle, believe me. No more sips. Put the bottle down.


But yes, I still do dream of her glowing with happiness to see me... and perhaps that dream has me now seeing her in more loving way. Perhaps I'm starting to pity her. I'm turning a corner. But, it is and will be a hard road. But, i know that I deserve better. I'm 45 years old man... I've been at this love thing way to long to be spending my life pining over some... child personality. As sad as it sounds. But, yeah I will always love her but, at some point you need to decide to have more self respect and be on your way. And, It starts with you. You sound like you have more time than me to figure this one out. Don't waste it brother. As trite as it sounds, life is too short... be good to yourself, and always surround yourself with good people and more importantly, good HONEST love. You're not alone, most EVERY song on the radio is about this very thing. Loss, failure, missed opportunities... loss of love. Its an old song that we humans are destined to experience. So, in that sense, you will never be alone. And, if dealt with correctly, with true and positive understanding, we evolve as better people in the end.  It will take time but, the rewards will be worth it.

cheers.

[john83]

The thing is, I have no guarantee how she will react. If she reacts badly, my anxieties kick in 10 times worse... .

Personally, I wouldn't take that chance, but the decision is yours. You say this new bf of hers is abusive towards her and you also have reason to believe she lost a lot of friends shortly after the break up. Do you know this for a fact, or is it secondhand 'grapevine' stuff from people who only know her superficially? It's my understanding that pwBPD have few if any real friends, perhaps one or two very close ones, to whom they can relate. My ex has countless 'friends' who think she's adorable, because they haven't had to live with her. She also has a string of failed relationships with men, all of whom are 'monsters' of some description or other... .cheats, liars, abusers, multiple suicide attempters... .this is her narrative, I don't know this for a fact. I do know, however, that she twisted the truth about a great many things that happened between us, so I have every reason to believe she wasn't exactly straight with me about her previous partners.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that even with a diagnosis, and appropriate intervention, the implications of sustaining a long-term relationship with a pwBPD would be fraught, to say the least. How much emotional bullying and mistreatment are you prepared to suffer just to be with this person? And before you answer, remember that her 'love' for you is CONDITIONAL and QUESTIONABLE at best... .and subject to change at short notice... .DESPITE WHAT SHE TELLS YOU... .not the ideal recipe for a stable, healthy relationship, especially if you yourself, have unresolved anxiety issues.

You have no guarantee how she will react... .but you do know how she has abused your love and kindness thus far... .is it really worth the cost?

[LostInMemories]

You say this new bf of hers is abusive towards her and you also have reason to believe she lost a lot of friends shortly after the break up. Do you know this for a fact, or is it secondhand 'grapevine' stuff from people who only know her superficially? It's my understanding that pwBPD have few if any real friends, perhaps one or two very close ones, to whom they can relate. My ex has countless 'friends' who think she's adorable, because they haven't had to live with her. She also has a string of failed relationships with men, all of whom are 'monsters' of some description or other... .cheats, liars, abusers, multiple suicide attempters... .this is her narrative, I don't know this for a fact. I do know, however, that she twisted the truth about a great many things that happened between us, so I have every reason to believe she wasn't exactly straight with me about her previous partners.

Unfortunately I do know this for a fact. Not only her friends (2 of her closest friends like you describe), but numerous people that I didn't even know told me about this guy. Apparently he's notorious in his town for being abusive and manipulative. At first I was skeptic aswell, because of her BPD and her incredible ability to twist stories like you describe.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that even with a diagnosis, and appropriate intervention, the implications of sustaining a long-term relationship with a pwBPD would be fraught, to say the least. How much emotional bullying and mistreatment are you prepared to suffer just to be with this person? And before you answer, remember that her 'love' for you is CONDITIONAL and QUESTIONABLE at best... .and subject to change at short notice... .DESPITE WHAT SHE TELLS YOU... .not the ideal recipe for a stable, healthy relationship, especially if you yourself, have unresolved anxiety issues.

You have no guarantee how she will react... .but you do know how she has abused your love and kindness thus far... .is it really worth the cost?

This is as much as an easy as it is a very hard question to answer. When I look back I'd say yes. I can deal with the sh*t she put me through. But her love being conditional and the risk of her being able to leave me AGAIN any moment makes the question a bit more complicated. If it only was 'BPD traits' I had to deal with, and not the constant fear of her leaving me again I would definitely say: Yes, it's worth it (for me).

Although I know if she'd came back I would take the chance, only time would tell if it had been worth the cost... .