So my replacement was replaced...

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

Found out today from a family member on her side who didn't believe my ex-wife's smear campaign.

I wanted to share this because during my recovery, for many days this was ALL I thought about, particularly in the beginning. I believed in my heart (contrary to what I knew about BPD) that he was a better man than me and she was a much happier person. I spent many nights trying to sleep, agonising about them together, wishing they would separate for whatever reason so I knew it wasn't me.

Now I don't know the circumstances of this replacement, only that it happened. New guys looks normal enough (I got sent a pic NOT that I wanted to see). This was it, this was the day i was hoping and praying for, it had finally happened! And you know what I felt? just a great sadness from the whole damn mess that is BPD, I even felt bad for my replacement, I hope he didn't get destroyed like I did.

Literally just been called into work as I write this so I'll skip to what I learned:

I wanted to share this because today It served as a strong reminder that true happiness comes from within (internally) not from external things like my little bit of news today. I also learned what I wished for (thought I wished for) was just coming from a place of anger.

I do feel a LITTLE better, but c'mon, if we suspect our partners are borderlines, we already know they are not going to be happy in whatever relationship they are in as long as they remain out of treatment... .

[Ahoy]

Found out today from a family member on her side who didn't believe my ex-wife's smear campaign.

I wanted to share this because during my recovery, for many days this was ALL I thought about, particularly in the beginning. I believed in my heart (contrary to what I knew about BPD) that he was a better man than me and she was a much happier person. I spent many nights trying to sleep, agonising about them together, wishing they would separate for whatever reason so I knew it wasn't me.

Now I don't know the circumstances of this replacement, only that it happened. New guys looks normal enough (I got sent a pic NOT that I wanted to see). This was it, this was the day i was hoping and praying for, it had finally happened! And you know what I felt? just a great sadness from the whole damn mess that is BPD, I even felt bad for my replacement, I hope he didn't get destroyed like I did.

Literally just been called into work as I write this so I'll skip to what I learned:

I wanted to share this because today It served as a strong reminder that true happiness comes from within (internally) not from external things like my little bit of news today. I also learned what I wished for (thought I wished for) was just coming from a place of anger.

I do feel a LITTLE better, but c'mon, if we suspect our partners are borderlines, we already know they are not going to be happy in whatever relationship they are in as long as they remain out of treatment... .

[woundedPhoenix]

Hey Ahoy.

Can relate to that, you want comfirmation and when you get it it's not what you thought it would mean or feel like.

My replacement only lasted for 3 weeks, maybe two months when you count in the online flirting.

And oh yes she is already trying to pull me back in. Says she missed me the whole time, it was not what she expected, and feels guilty about it all.

And those words would have meant the world to me some time ago.

But now i know they are just words. Words which can't be trusted, words she would say to anyone just to avoid being alone.

It actually makes me sad, cause i know it's a condition that keeps on destroying her life and the very people she pulls in close enough.

She fantasises up her own saviour from reality, and in the end she will try and destroy that very saviour when reality hits home again... .

[gotbushels]

Thanks for sharing Ahoy 

Interesting.

Another way we could look at it is recalling the 2-5-10(?) years or so of managing her through a course of treatment. I'm not even counting % success rate either. I've assumed of course that one wants some sort of a "normal" life.

[Fr4nz]

I wanted to share this because during my recovery, for many days this was ALL I thought about, particularly in the beginning.  

I can fully relate to your experience.

In the aftermath I was constantly thinking "why I'm so horrible in her eyes?" and "why she sees my replacement like a knight in shining armour? How's possible that he's so much better than me, considering that she constantly claimed, throughout the r/s, I was the love of her life, soulmate, bla, bla, bla?".

As time went by, I realized, by carefully analyzing the relationship and her behaviours/thoughts, that she has, extremely probably, BPD/HPD.

Then, confirmations came from 3 different psychologists.

And then, one piece of final closure came from one of her past boyfriends: I contacted him (first, by making sure he was completely out of her life), asking if he observed the plethora of dysfunctional behaviours I observed during the r/s... .he confirmed everything.

Finally, the final piece of closure came after 13+ months of NC, when I met her by accident in a bar.
In this occasion, she told me that the r/s with my replacement was just over; even more, after 2 further months I noticed that he wasn't an FB friend of her anymore (I think he got enough of her), thus repeating the "detachment" patterns she had with me and past bfs.

In the end, BPD/HPDs repeat the very same, rigid dysfunctional behaviours/thoughts across different relationships, so the end result never changes.

[Hopefulgirl]

My replacement was replaced (5 months later)by the girl he dated before me. The replacement was so anguished and confused I felt so bad for her, even though she was nasty to me. Then that girl decided she just wanted to be friends so he went back to the still hopelessly in love Replacement. Now the former girlfriend, now "best friend" can't let him go and she's become his weekend bed mate. And he seems to want to have nothing to do with me.

The only person who wins is the "friend", because she's admitted (to me) she's never been in love with in the first place.

He gets his "supply", gets his p***s and his pocketbook taken care of without commitments to either. 

[Jonathan Ricciardi]

Being replaced is something that is used way too much.  Any relationship you enter into and doesn't result in marriage for life, is going to have a replacement. No one dates one person or marries and divorces and never dates again.  In every failed relationship, you will be replaced. Absence doesn't make the heart grow fonder.

[Wize]

Being replaced is something that is used way too much.

In a normal breakup between two non-disordered people, there is the realization that incompatibility exists. The differences in life goals and personalities usually drive the two apart.  In a BPD breakup, it's much more impersonal.  We are called replacements because, like an object that no longer functions properly for its user, we are cast into the trash bin for a fresh new object that can provide the necessary service to the user.  Rinse and repeat.  An object is replaced.  

[Jonathan Ricciardi]

In a normal break up between two non-disordered people? There maybe a realization that incompatibility exists, agreed.  However, when there is a break up 99% of the time one person is hurt. Very few, next to zero, end in mutual break up. Even in that situation, one party is usually lying about their pain.  The one party who was dumped and hurt may take years to realize that there's compatibility issues. They won't agree the day of dumping. So is the person who dumped someone, suppose to wait months, years, or even decades, just to make sure the dumped is aware of the incompatibility issues? No the dumper moves on, many times never to speak with the ex ever again. It happens it's called moving on. It stinks that people are mean, I know this. But being replaced is a fact of life on every relationship you have, unless you find the one.

[Wize]

Moving on is what normal people do.  Continuing the idealization-devaluation cycle is what pwBPD.  Don't forget, pwBPD are defined by their history of tumultuous relationships.  These pwBPD do not attach in a healthy way and therefore do not detach in a healthy way.  Their detachment comes via a white to black shift... .good to bad... .working to broken.  When a non gets shifted from white to black by a pwBPD this is often accompanied by a discard and replacement.

In a normal breakup, even if it was one-sided and one person felt most of the pain, both people can look back after some time and recognize normal incompatibilities. We are here at bpdfamily because the attachment, relationship and detachment lead to a very abnormal, abusive and traumatic experience.

NC for years, I appreciate you wanting to make sense of your own relationship with your pwBPD by drawing parallels with normal relationships.  There are a few parallels, but it's not the similarities that cause us to reach out for help and answers after we are shockingly discarded and replaced by our pwBPD.  Most of us were replaced before the breakup. Check out the poll.

[Jonathan Ricciardi]

Moving on is exactly what normal people do, are you saying that you are BPD? If you're not BPD, then move on. I was dumped by a very sick person, mentally, 4 years ago. Now I could have chased her and tried to get her back, I did for about a week. But then I realized, I was painted black. Nothing I did was funny, cute,and I was no longer a hot. Ripped abs and all. I have granted her wish of NC, that is what she wanted, she hasn't contacted me,and I haven't contacted her.  Only I can let her come and go in my life, I have that control. You choose to let someone come and go, I wouldn't.

[Fr4nz]

I agree with Wize... .relationships with BPDs are characterized by extreme behaviours, traumatic events and tough  events from a psychological point of view. In this context, it doesn't have much sense to talk about how to "move on", as if we were in a normal setting.

It is like telling to a traumatized, Iraqi veteran to move on with his life, as if nothing happened when he served in Iraq.

Obviously WE HAVE to move on -- and in the most possible healthy way... .BUT, the ways through which we can reach this goal shall be deeply different.

[Wize]

Moving on is exactly what normal people do, are you saying that you are BPD? If you're not BPD, then move on.

NC for years, while your obvious lack of empathy doesn't exactly motivate me to respond to you, I will.

Moving on is exactly the process that I'm currently in.  However, unlike my wife with BPD, I can't simply paint her black and emotionally detach.  I don't have that defense mechanism nor would I ever want it.  So my process of detachment/moving on takes time as I discover what exactly took place.  

Emotionally and rationally processing events in our lives allows us to move on, get better and have healthier relationships.  Learning from my mistakes and experiences makes me a better person.

Most of us here have experienced significant trauma due to these relationships and as such need to be handled a bit more gently than simply telling us "move on."  At 4 years removed from your relationship I would certainly hope you have moved on, yet here you are.  Why are you here?  Are you here simply to tell the rest of us how great you're doing and how poor we're doing?  If so, find the exit and leave.  

[Jonathan Ricciardi]

Why am I here? To let you know that only you can control who comes and goes in your life. If she goes, let her go. I bet you did everything right, there is no doubt in my mind you did. I know I did, I wanted to marry this woman, so I treated her way better than I got in return. I also know that if you're truly painted black, then she has nothing to do with you, other wise you're not painted black.  No contact means no contact, no texts, no phone calls, IMs, or FB. When you hit the four year mark, you may realize that she has the right to end a relationship anyway she wants. It sucks, but she can.  But, you can control the damage.

[Wize]

Why am I here? To let you know that only you can control who comes and goes in your life. If she goes, let her go. I bet you did everything right, there is no doubt in my mind you did. I know I did, I wanted to marry this woman, so I treated her way better than I got in return. I also know that if you're truly painted black, then she has nothing to do with you, other wise you're not painted black.  No contact means no contact, no texts, no phone calls, IMs, or FB. When you hit the four year mark, you may realize that she has the right to end a relationship anyway she wants. It sucks, but she can.  But, you can control the damage.

Try to understand... .some of us have children caught in the middle, lawyers, paperwork, court appearances. NC isn't an option for me.  You were in your romantic relationship for 5 months with your pwBPD. And here you are 4 years later giving us advice.  Wow, thanks so much for stopping by. 

[Fr4nz]

Why am I here? To let you know that only you can control who comes and goes in your life. If she goes, let her go. I bet you did everything right, there is no doubt in my mind you did. I know I did, I wanted to marry this woman, so I treated her way better than I got in return. I also know that if you're truly painted black, then she has nothing to do with you, other wise you're not painted black.  No contact means no contact, no texts, no phone calls, IMs, or FB. When you hit the four year mark, you may realize that she has the right to end a relationship anyway she wants. It sucks, but she can.  But, you can control the damage.

I think it's pretty clear we're not questioning that everyone has the right to leave a relationship; also, no one here is doubting about the fact that we can control who comes in and goes from our life, as well as how NC should be implemented and which purposes it serves. These are all things we learnt the hard way.

As I told you in one of the posts above, the problems we have to tackle are different and very precise.

PS: Anyway, I'm sure your intent is to help and give perspective after 4 years
As such, it becomes a matter about how you communicate your thoughts.

[Jonathan Ricciardi]

They have what is called limited contact as well. That is why you hired a lawyer. He now speaks for you. The only thing you need to talk about with your ex is where and when to pick up or drop off kids. Everything else is just excuses. 
You're break ups are no more different or precise than others, you choose to make it that way. You're not the first.

[Turkish]

Let's try to keep this discussion on topic and remember: collegium, not debate.

2.1 Collegium, Not Debate: bpdfamily.com is set up as a collegium. We follow a Collegial Discussion format which is characterized as having "authority" vested equally among colleagues/peers. As such, members present their ideas in "collegial harmony" and the credibility of their positions are based solely on the quality of the points they advance in writing. Diversity is to be embraced - there is often much to be learned from others views and perspectives. Collegial Discussion is the exchange of ideas, not a debate or an argument to be won. Our common interests and goals are what brings us together - let it not be what comes between us. Please be mindful that one of the important roles we all have is to help “center” others, not pile on or inflame emotional unrest. Member should not "hijack" the threads of others by changing the subject. All posts should be targeted to the subject matter introduced by the host of the thread. Our individual thoughts and ideas are important to each of us. Members shall be patient and understanding of other members that are in different stages of the learning or healing process or have different opinions than their own.

Please note that collegial discussion is different than debate. Debate is an argument or a discussion generally ending with a vote or agreement on the best decision. In debate, unity is the objective. Members are discouraged from debating and arguing against others' positions, or questioning the wisdom of others, or restating of their position repeatedly.
https://bpdfamily.com/content/terms-service#collegium

[hurting300]

They have what is called limited contact as well. That is why you hired a lawyer. He now speaks for you. The only thing you need to talk about with your ex is where and when to pick up or drop off kids. Everything else is just excuses. 
You're break ups are no more different or precise than others, you choose to make it that way. You're not the first.

Its ok. You're hurting still aren't you?

[shatra]

Wize wrote---
We are called replacements because, like an object that no longer functions properly for its user, we are cast into the trash bin for a fresh new object that can provide the necessary service to the user.  Rinse and repeat.  An object is replaced... .most of us were replaced prior to the breakup (reoll)

-----Yes, and also I believe the word replacements refers to the idea that the next person may be a "stand in" or "partial substitute" for the previous partner----as if the BPD can "pretend"  they didn't lose the partner, so they replace the person quickly as a defense
-----Re: replaced prior to the breakup that is a BPD trend---why do you think they do that?

Re: the discussion on the "right to end a relationship any way they want" I don't feel that way... .I feel that after being committed to a person for awhile we can end the relationship, but there is a considerate way to do it, which pwBPD don't really do... .I wouldn't say I have the "right to"  storm out of my job, screaming at my boss, or telling off my neighbor when they say hello to me, etc.  Just because an action is legal doesn't really give people a pass to do whatever they want. I also feel like pwBPD may use that as an excuse----"I have the right to (dump all over you)  so therefore it's not so bad that I do it and you shouldn't react badly to my bad behavior because it's legal... .not for me

[Jonathan Ricciardi]

You can feel any way you want, however that doesn't change the fact that people can break up anyway they chose. You need to accept it, she doesn't. You can walk out of a job anytime you want. You don't have to say hello to your neighbor. You're trying to make situations that appease you, she has a right to break up with you anyway she wants. If she didn't have a mental illness, and did the exact same thing, what would you say?

[Fr4nz]

You can feel any way you want, however that doesn't change the fact that people can break up anyway they chose. You need to accept it, she doesn't. You can walk out of a job anytime you want. You don't have to say hello to your neighbor. You're trying to make situations that appease you, she has a right to break up with you anyway she wants. If she didn't have a mental illness, and did the exact same thing, what would you say?

Well, following your logical reasoning, in theory a person is also free to spit on the ground whenever she sees black people, jewish people, etc. There's nothing illegal in such act.

Nonetheless, it's horrible, disgusting, and unethical.

I used this simile to make you understand that there exists a plethora of behaviours that are perfectly legal yet completely wrong, including those that lots of BPD sufferers exhibits when they terminate a r/s with a partner.

And yes, even NONs can show such behaviours; howevers, NONs are able to regret them and learn from their mistakes.

[gotbushels]

I'm just gently highlighting that it's not everyday you get an entire subsection of the board's guidelines pasted onto a thread by a moderator. Furthermore this is despite the recent exercise to prevent clogging.

It's not really fair to OP. OP's news may be useful to nons looking to heal. One scenario resulting from guideline issues is locking of the thread. That deprives some nons from seeing it. Those nons could use a perk-up just like us when we were NC+# of days. Not every non's experience is identical to our own.

Please gently recall that one of our strengths as people playing the "non" role is that we're generally assumed to be more able to grasp shadings in-between black and white. 

[Hopefulgirl]

Thank you Shantra and Wize for writing what you did.

I've been trying to describe to friends what I'm going through and your descriptions are spot on. I've just never been able to find the words.

[StayStrongNow]

Personally, I am losing interest in the replacement my kids are telling me about. The more I learn about this disorder and crossover disorders that may exist with my stbxBPDw such as DPD and HDD, I am viewing her again as a ticking time bomb to blow again like before and do further damage to my children.

The replacement is just the equipment and will be replaced again, it's inevitable with my ex for sure.

[hashtag_loyal]

Who is a "replacement" anyway? We're all just replacements, really. Just toys used by sick people to distract from the pain. To be picked up or discarded at will.

Don't mind the props, look at the magician. And the "magic" that is at hand gets more tiring and predictable the more you see and understand it... .

[shatra]

NCforyears wrote
You can feel any way you want, however that doesn't change the fact that people can break up anyway they chose. You need to accept it, she doesn't. You can walk out of a job anytime you want. You don't have to say hello to your neighbor. You're trying to make situations that appease you, she has a right to break up with you anyway she wants. If she didn't have a mental illness, and did the exact same thing, what would you say?

----Again, people can break up, but the way they do it is not okay or acceptable just because it's legal.  No, I would not just walk out on a job or ignore the neighbor's greeting just because I have "the right".  Just because someone can get away with something because it "is their right" does not make it okay.  And the negative way the BPD typically handles relationships and breakkups is going to get a reaction from people.  If they didn't have a mental illness and did the exact same thing, I would say they are being inconsiderate and hurtful, I would not say "they have the right to break up that way". 
  I find that people use that expression "they have the right to do a or b"  when they have done something really disgusting and harmful, but technically legal, as if that justifies bad behavior.

[Ahoy]

Didn't think this would evoke such a passionate debate.

The message I intended to get across is that in my instance (as probably a lot of us here) I thought I had found my 'soulmate' in-fact I believed it even for a period AFTER I left my wife.

Of course anyone can leave anyone whenever and in whatever way they want, it's part of what makes Western society so damn great, however they betrayal I felt finding out my ex was seeing someone new, which had significant overlap with my marriage AND had a secret relationship on the side during my marriage was a terrible, terrible betrayal.

My message was to not take it so personally, to not hold onto the feelings of inadequacy that might be generated from seeing your ex apparently happy with a new partner because, more than likely, they are not happy, the relationship will not last and the disorder will simply claim another victim.

I also wanted to demonstrate how when I finally got what I thought I wanted (her current relationship ending) I did not feel any better whatsoever, in fact I felt momentarily worse. Happiness truly comes from within us, not from what happens externally, I wanted to highlight this too.

It's important we focus on US, not them (as hard as that is to do) your healing time will greatly be reduced.


A lot of bitterness in this thread to so I wanted to add one more thing. As many bad day's as I still have, I think I'm starting to realise this relationship breakdown has uncovered the secret to true happiness. I don't think I can describe how in a post, it's a feeling deep inside of me, not from my brain, it feels warm, it feels good. heck I sound like some sort of raving lunatic here but perhaps its finally acceptance?