Back where I started

[Larmoyant]

A week ago my ex made contact blaming me for things I hadn’t done. To get a reaction and it worked. We ended up discussing his damaged wrist and I told him to be careful and I hoped it got better soon. He disappeared after this. Six days later (2 days ago)he sent me this:

“That was good. If you had really loved me you’d have been concerned and helped with my wrist. Like I did with L (my dog) and your Mum. Feels good to know. I think I did anyway when you left me when unwell in January I hope S**, the Prof and all the others that have an unfair opinion of me leave you alone be yourself. Although you need to work on yourself and be less judgmental. I don’t feel any malice and wish you all the best”

This brought up a lot of thoughts and feelings. It seems that he’d been hoping that I would offer him help with his wrist which makes me feel sad. I had loved him very much. He caused chaos and pain when my dog died and when my mum was diagnosed. He had been unwell in January. He hadn’t looked after his elbow properly after surgery, had to go and have the wound cleaned, requiring more surgery. I left him shortly after this because I couldn’t take any more of the rages, push/pull and future faking. His use of “all the best” is a goodbye. He uses it again and again and again when he’s saying goodbye to me. This always triggers me.

It’s as if he’s still having a relationship with me where he gets to continue playing with my feelings. I'm allowing it I suppose because even though I feel as if I'm moving on, sometimes I slip back. I sent him this in response:

“I’m sorry about your wrist. It seems like you’re having some trouble and it must be difficult. I’m not sure how I could help you given what’s happened between us. It’s a difficult situation for both of us but I do hope it heals soon and well”.

He didn't respond so it was another goodbye.

I received some very sad news yesterday so I’m feeling really fragile and crying again. I was doing so well. My head is battling my heart again and I’m thinking that maybe I had a chance to be with him again, but at the same time maybe it’s time to block. I’m back where I started and feeling miserable.

I am tempted to respond to his text with things I mentioned above and then wish him "all the best".

[Lifewriter16]

Hi Larmoyant,

I know it may feel like you are back where you started, but it's not true. Healing from being in a BPD/non relationship is a spiral affair requiring visiting and re-visiting issues as we heal them at deeper and deeper levels.

Take very good care of you, practically and emotionally. Aim to find a place within yourself where you are supportive of yourself and on your own side.

I'm sending you lots of love as you deal with your sad news. Don't let your sad news make you vulnerable to going back when you are making so much progress.

Love Lifewriter x

[Infern0]

It's typical BPD "trap setting" behaviour. My ex has done this to me numerous times.

They come back contacting you and expect you to mind read, and just general other stuff that is unreasonable considering the nature of the relationship then get angry when not getting what you want.

A good example is my ex started a habit of flaking on me and making every excuse under the sun to not hang out. Then we fell out, then a few weeks later she starts contacting me and then gets mad at me because I didn't ask her to hang out.

I mean she could have asked me, and considering that she had flaked and avoided me so much before I was hardly going to put myself out there to be rejected again, was I? I actually told her this and she just instantly stopped replying.

Yes, I felt miserable afterwards and spent days trying to figure out if I was in the wrong or something but nah, my behaviour made sense in the circumstances, as I say she could have asked me, she has done so many times in the past, she's not shy.

It's just mind games, they are looking for an outlet for their negative stuff and sometimes they contact us just to set a trap where they can play the victim and accuse us of stuff and vent their negative crap on us, then they get to walk away feeling relived and we end up back at square one.

[Sadly]

Hello Lar 
Speaking as "The Queen of Back Where I Started" believe me, it may feel like you are but you are not. I recently posted about being so angry with myself after reading my posts when I first found this site and felt I was in the same place but a few days later I know I have made some progress albeit small.
Reading the text he sent you shows he hasn't made any progress, he won't, nothing for him has changed and it won't. Reading the positive post you wrote called " A  Shift" you have, read it again. 

I threw my guy out of my house a week ago today and in response to his " What did I do" text I sent him an email on the Monday to which he replied " the email is full of lies" trust me, it really isn't. It's full of personal stuff but I am going to show you it so you will see why how you and I cannot go back to these ill people however much we love them. I have suffered all week, public meltdowns, no sleep, sheer misery. Email coming up now and then I will tell you what happened
next

Dear Gxxxxx
Maybe this time you are being honest because you are trying so hard to prove it. I didn't  notice you rushing round trying to clear your name about cheating on me, you telling me about "a blow job", the love bite (sorry, strange insect bite on your thigh) ! The awful birthday I spent alone in a hotel room followed by an Easter rushing around caring and cooking for your dad, been shouted at and humiliated by you cos of the stress, he was giving you, a man who had the nerve to slag me off recently. That same Easter, coming home and you lying to me you were ill then taking speed and shutting me out for days. I remember sitting on your step when you wouldn't answer the door thinking something bad had happened to you then hearing the sound of porn movies coming from your sitting room and still I never gave up. There have been many lies, large and small and yet still I have loved you. You are right, I am stupid. I made myself into a doormat and let you wipe your feet all over me, I truly accept the blame for that. Ironic isn't it, a mistake on my part is the straw that broke the camels back. It matters not, I am sick of seeing and hearing that woman's name, we did this, we did that, ( his ex) ugh. 2 f*cking years of it. Whatever, when I tried to prove I was telling the truth to you about stuff I was accused of cut and pasting emails, of going on and never shutting up. You have shouted at me so many times, just like your dad does to your mum. you see it, you know it and you hate it but when the rage is on you you still do it. I've loved you and forgiven you through all this. I will miss so much of our lives together, it hurts so badly but it can't continue. You will never be sorry for any of those things, you will find a way in your head of blaming me, it's how you deal with it. I clearly remember sitting in the firelight telling you how strange it would be when we didn't know each other anymore and you saying we will always be friends. You really didn't understand. Tbf I didn't know just how much I would come to love you and had no idea of the amount of pain you would inflict on me but I always maintained we could never just be friends. And now it has come to that point, heartbreaking for me, I have no idea how it will affect you. To me loving is about give and take, accepting people for who they are, warts and all. Your dad did a right number on you Gxxxxxx, helped make you what you are and yet you love him, that is good. You will soon find someone else, it appears you don't like to be alone. I really don't want to see or hear about it though. You complain I have changed, yes, perhaps I am guilty of loving too much. You have virtually crushed the spirit out of me Gxxxxx, but a little bit remains, I can build on that.  I don't know why I am writing this, you will only see it one way, your way, maybe I am writing it for me. Like I said, hope you find what you are looking for, I don't think it exists but I do hope so for your sake. Bye now, stay safe.

None of it was lies Lar and there was so much more. Yesterday he sent me a text saying he was going stock car racing that night and " you can come if you want?
I replied " no thanks but I hope you enjoy it. Nothing since but he will. Do you see, everything in that email and he acts as if nothing has happened! Every time I waver right now I read that email and it gives me strength. Write one, even if you don't send it. Keep reading it when you waver. Sorry if this has gone on a bit.
Love to you
Sadly xx

[Dutched]

Larmoyant

Reading many of your posts, you have made a great progress.
So be proud despite feeling miserable now!

Please don’t forget that your wise mind (rational mind) responded to an emotional mind.
He accused you for being cold, a lack of empathy, not loving him enough, etc.
He felt abandoned when he needed you (his mind, feelings = facts…)
The lonely and hurt child that craved for love, shouted for help.

So because of hurting him, you need help… you need to work on yourself.
Get it?

Now your way of responding.
I understand your sincere response, nothing wrong with that.
Saying sorry however, is for him a confirmation of his feelings/thoughts about you.
He needed to hear that from the one that caused so him so much pain.
 The door is open…

Then you explain from your mindset that it is difficult for ‘both’… parties
Please wait. To whom it was addressed? 
You confirm that you need to work on yourself, as he said…
Why?
You are blaming him too for “what’s happened between us’…
(you are not, but that is how he perceives it, as you caused his pain)

I would have responded like:
I sincerely hope your wrist will heal, medics are really good these days. Wish you the best’

He is clearly not on his baseline, so don’t attempt to respond like you did, it is futile.
 
Please step out of his rollercoaster and you will be less triggered

[Rayban]

Hi Larmoyant,

My impression is that he is using guilt to control you.  I've heard many times from my ex. It was always I should have been there when she was having one her many health mishaps.

I agree with dutchess. Don't waste your time and energy by sending him a lengthy email or text. You'll be playing directly into his hands, and worse you'll be stuck in a loop with a person you can't reason with.

Respond short and sweet if you want to. In the mean time don't give him that satisfaction of getting to you. Take this as another reason to stay away. Use your energy to do something nice for yourself.

 

[heartandwhole]

Larmoyant,

You may be back in a similar situation, but you are not the same person. You have grieved, you have learned, you have grown, you have dreamed. This is a different Larmoyant who is once again faced with a choice: him or you.

If you choose you, I promise you will better be able to love others going forward. It's a win-win.  

A poem for you, Larmoyant, with  

The time will come
when, with elation
you will greet yourself arriving
at your own door, in your own mirror
and each will smile at the other's welcome,

and say, sit here. Eat.
You will love again the stranger who was your self.
Give wine. Give bread. Give back your heart
to itself, to the stranger who has loved you

all your life, whom you ignored
for another, who knows you by heart.
Take down the love letters from the bookshelf,

the photographs, the desperate notes,
peel your own image from the mirror.
Sit. Feast on your life.    ~Derek Walcott

heartandwhole

[JQ]

Hi Larm,

I followed you over here from the other post. Right then ... .so you've stumbled on your journey as you & I have discussed many times.  You're sitting on the ground in a confused & hurt frame of mind. Well, look behind you, over your right shoulder ... .            Thats us! The group! As promised we're here to pick you up & dust you off & straighten you up so you can continue your journey.

H&H has a solid point here. YOU Lar are NOT the same person! You have grieved, YOU have learned, YOU have grown & YOU have dreamed!  You have done off that & more. Remember Lar, being "here" with the group, on this site, in this life is ALL ABOUT YOU!  Getting to a better place!

Rayban points out that your exBPD is using guilt to manipulate you into the situation you're currently in. As Rayban points out do NOT send him any more text or emails. This only feeds their need in the sick mind of someone who has the Very Serious Cluster B Mental Illness of BPD.  By NOT sending him anymore text YOU have taken back control of YOUR life! This is part of the journey ... .this leg of the journey is a little bumpy ... .time for some new shocks.

As you have said, your BPD has done this over and over and over and over and over and over ... .see where I"m going with this?  They're in a endless loop cycle ... .this behavior, these feelings of sadness, hurt you feel will play in endless cycle until YOU decide to as Dutched says, "Step off the roller Coaster".

Everyone in the group has a common theme if you really read what they're telling you ... .NOT to reach out to him, NOT to react to his text, NOT to email him.  Everyone in the group is telling you to return to No Contact!  But you already know this, you know that NC is required for you to move forward. NC is required to REALLY take care of yourself. NC is required to get to a better frame of mind. NC is required for you to continue taking care of YOU, YOUR needs, wants. NC is required for YOU to regain YOUR life!  We're just here trying to remind you of it by pointing the road signs out to you.

So the question to you Lar are you ready to fill the gas take up for the next stage of your journey?  Are you REALLY  ready to take care of YOU?  If the answer is yes, then you know that NC is what you need to do. You've read about it so many times, you know in your heart, mind, soul that this is the next stage of your journey that you need to do, but none of us can make that choice for you.

So block his number on your phone then delete it. Delete his emails & then put it in the spam folder. Take his letters, cards, pictures & burn them in a Viking funeral to say good bye ... .not forgotten but good bye. It's now time for you to move on with your life Lar.  Like H&H said, YOU choose YOU!

Don't worry you're NOT alone on your journey ... .you have us the group right here for you. We're always be here without judgment with a lot of   and or just to talk too.

Get back on your path because I see nothing but clear sunny sky's ahead for you!

J

[Moselle]

.
, they are looking for an outlet for their negative stuff and sometimes they contact us just to set a trap where they can play the victim and accuse us of stuff and vent their negative crap on us, then they get to walk away feeling relived and we end up back at square one.

pwBPD actually need three things

1. As inferno says they need someone to project their negative and intense emotions onto. Someone to carry this burden -a scapegoat.

2. Someone to be intimate with when they "pull". And appease the feelings of abandonment.

3. Someone who will stay involved when they "push", to appease the fear of engulfment.

Larmoyant you have come so far by deciding that this dysfunctional dance is not for you, so this is by no means a return to the start.

It is however a momentary relapse into the old pattern of supplying what he needs in terms of 1,2 and 3.

But that's all it is. You are still aware  and you have reached out to those who can help. These are both very healthy responses. So perhaps you can love yourself - everybody makes mistakes

[Rayban]

.
, they are looking for an outlet for their negative stuff and sometimes they contact us just to set a trap where they can play the victim and accuse us of stuff and vent their negative crap on us, then they get to walk away feeling relived and we end up back at square one.

pwBPD actually need three things

1. As inferno says they need someone to project their negative and intense emotions onto. Someone to carry this burden -a scapegoat.

2. Someone to be intimate with when they "pull". And appease the feelings of abandonment.

3. Someone who will stay involved when they "push", to appease the fear of engulfment.

Larmoyant you have come so far by deciding that this dysfunctional dance is not for you, so this is by no means a return to the start.

It is however a momentary relapse into the old pattern of supplying what he needs in terms of 1,2 and 3.

But that's all it is. You are still aware  and you have reached out to those who can help. These are both very healthy responses. So perhaps you can love yourself - everybody makes mistakes

Interesting could the same person play all 3 roles, or do they seek elsewhere when their partner can't  fill one of the roles?

[C.Stein]

pwBPD actually need three things

1. As inferno says they need someone to project their negative and intense emotions onto. Someone to carry this burden -a scapegoat.

2. Someone to be intimate with when they "pull". And appease the feelings of abandonment.

3. Someone who will stay involved when they "push", to appease the fear of engulfment.

I'll add a fourth one to this list.

4. Someone who will validate they are a good person.

[Moselle]

They look for "the one" who is all nurturing and all good. They idealise in their own mind.

A healthy person will exit when the push-pull dance starts.

A caretaker often feels like it is their mission to help and stays

[patientandclear]

pwBPD actually need three things

1. As inferno says they need someone to project their negative and intense emotions onto. Someone to carry this burden -a scapegoat.

2. Someone to be intimate with when they "pull". And appease the feelings of abandonment.

3. Someone who will stay involved when they "push", to appease the fear of engulfment.

I'd suggest one revision.  I once wrote a post about how my exwBPD "needs" qualities in a partner like those Moselle lists above.  A wise member here corrected me and said that he wants those qualities.  But what he needs is someone who will hold boundaries that are sometimes at odds with those dynamics and not provide these services just because they are wanted and create the least conflict and the least risk of losing the relationship.

[C.Stein]

Good time to drag this thread out of  the past?

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=289091.0;all

[JerryRG]

PwBPD are the one's forever trapped inside their self imposed prisons, the very survival skills they employ keep them stuck.

We nons don't have to stay where we were or stay where we are.

I've thought this many times, my exgf hasn't changed one bit (maybe worse) she's using the same failed play book over and over.

This is my belief and I've heard it said more times from people outside these rooms as well, my trap was my belief she wanted to change, I kept trying and she wouldn't budge. When she's miserable enough and finally realizes she's lost everything to gain nothing, she may seek help.

I'm not waiting around in that pit anymore, life is way to important and fun to live in constant stress and chaos.

Hang in there Larmoyant

[Lifewriter16]

I find myself wondering if our trap isn't only that we believe our pwBPD want to change but that we expect them to change for us, that we do not accept them as they are and we have so little understanding of the process of change that we do not realise what a difficult process that is. It's as if we are saying: 'If s/he loved me, they would change for me so I could stay with them happily', when if we truly loved them, we would accept them as they are.

[Larmoyant]

Thank you all for your responses. I’m not in a good place right now. My mum is ill and I'm not coping too well. Outside maybe, but inside I’m struggling. One thing after another and I really have come tumbling down.

Without a doubt my worry about my mother is related in some way and also my own fear of abandonment has been triggered by his “all the best”.  Being told “goodbye” over and over, as many of you know, is so damaging. I sort of got used to it, at least I thought I had, but not really. It still hurts and I again wonder if he really means it this time. Maybe, given his pattern he'll contact me again, but then what does he want? I can’t seem to shift the thought that maybe he wanted me back, but was too scared of rejection to make that happen. Then again, maybe he was just touching down to see if his ‘attachment’ was in place? It’s all still so confusing.

Also, in responding to him I was trying to be compassionate and understanding. I was trying out SET which I read on here, but clearly failed. I’m now trying to work out what I was expecting him to do. I thought he’d respond, but he didn’t.

I'm a little tired right now so maybe that's why I'm feeling so down. I really am quite alone and just feel like I need him to help me through this. I won't contact him in any way, but I can't help wanting him to call me right now. I must sound incredibly pathetic, but it's just what I feel right now.

[Sadly]

Hello lovely
Don't worry about sounding or feeling pathetic, I have written those same words here many a time and just like me, when you feel a bit stronger you will know you are not pathetic at all, it's a normal reaction to what you are going through. I am so sorry about your mum, I hope she feels better soon.
You do know don't you that if he did call it would be about him, he wouldn't really be able to help you, he can't. It's weird but the person I want to comfort and soothe me now through this awful sad time is the person who caused it, now then, how daft does that sound  . I too wonder sometimes if when he contacted me he wants me back, but I think he just wants his comfort blanket back, not me as me. Stay strong sweetheart as others have told me it will pass. Try and visualise if he came back, trying to cope with your mums illness and deal with his tantrum me me me moments. Xxx

LW
I know in my case I had already accepted him for who he was, hated his BPD and would have flown to the moon and back to help him with his illness. However, a. He wouldn't admit he had a problem and b. He thinks I am mentally ill and need help.
I have given up because there is precious little left of me to fight for myself never mind him.
 Love from Sadly xx

[Lifewriter16]

Hi Sadly,

I think that what you describe as 'giving up' is the beginnings of radical acceptance. We finally realise that we can't be what they want OR need us to be and they can't be either what we want OR need them to be. Eventually, we realise that there is no way forward except through walking away with our broken hearts to heal in our own way.

Love to you all,
Lifewriter
x

[Larmoyant]

LW, Sadly, I would like to be at the stage of radical acceptance. I want to let go yet here I am concocting in my head myriad reasons to contact him! Wth has happened to me going backwards like this. I just want to be held and supported like I'm doing for my beloved mother and those around me. I am a caretaker of that I am sure, but I'd like someone to hold me too. Sometimes life is just too hard, but I'm not going to act on my feelings. Not going to reach out to someone who hurts me over and over. I'm hoping this is as low as it gets. I hope so. And, Lifewriter I'm so sorry you're feeling sad today. Know that I'm thinking of you and today will pass and you're going to be ok. You too Sadly and all here. These people crush us, but we can get back up can't we?   

[Lifewriter16]

Thanks Larmoyant. We will all get there together.
LW x

[Sadly]

Yes Lar, we can get back up. I too am wavering badly right this minute. You know when children build a sandcastle and then watch as the sea starts rushing towards it, gradually eating away at its walls, tumbling it down. That's what I feel right now, the fragile walls I have built around me gradually eroding. It's scary and horrible. I am trying to do what I did as a child, rush down and rebuild my walls before I get washed away. How brave that sounds   I wish it was as easy done as said. But that's all we can do Lar, you would not be able to be as strong for your mum and family if you allowed a sea of destruction to wash you away. I feel your loneliness, I am so lost and alone too. Would love arms around me. Try, close your eyes and I will close mine. Hold yourself tightly and let us imagine we are holding and hugging each other. I hope it works, I am going to try now.    
Love from Sadly xxxx

[C.Stein]

I'd like someone to hold me too.

Learning to hold ourselves can be very difficult, especially when in emotional upheaval, but it is something I feel we all need to learn how to do.  To that end, what are you doing for yourself, to support and hold yourself?

[Moselle]

Sadly. What a great topic.

We can re-frame and rebuild a new life with our new freedom

[Sadly]

Sorry Lar, I seem to have hijacked your post, didn't mean to, was just trying to help.   x

Thanks Moselle
I have been reminded of something my dad said to me when I was growing up.

The reinvention of our daily life means marching off the edge of our maps.

I have always lived like that, I guess it's why I have been to so many places, experienced so many diverse things. I think I may have forgotten it the last two sad years. Time to live up to it again I guess.   x

[Larmoyant]

Learning to hold ourselves can be very difficult, especially when in emotional upheaval, but it is something I feel we all need to learn how to do.  To that end, what are you doing for yourself, to support and hold yourself?

C.Stein, I’m finding this very difficult to answer. I really don’t know. I moved to my new place (3 months ago) and didn’t tell him the new address and that helped me, gave me a sense of safety and much needed peace. I’ve also managed to resist the overwhelming urge to reach out to him that has plagued me the last few days. This tells me that I’m stronger then I realise. Just one day at a time it’s the only way right now.

Sadly, you have helped a lot and that was a much needed hug, thank you   

[C.Stein]

C.Stein, I’m finding this very difficult to answer. I really don’t know. I moved to my new place (3 months ago) and didn’t tell him the new address and that helped me, gave me a sense of safety and much needed peace. I’ve also managed to resist the overwhelming urge to reach out to him that has plagued me the last few days. This tells me that I’m stronger then I realise. Just one day at a time it’s the only way right now.

This is great L.  Lets explore ways you can reach out to yourself when you feel the urge to reach out to him.  What are you hoping to get when you feel the urge to reach out to him?

[Larmoyant]

This is great L.  Lets explore ways you can reach out to yourself when you feel the urge to reach out to him.  What are you hoping to get when you feel the urge to reach out to him?

C.Stein, the first thing that springs to mind is that I'm hoping that he will take away all the hurt and painful feelings. I remember going back to him before and feeling a sense of relief, but it was only ever fleeting before the rages and push/pull came back. I'm still struggling with this urge to contact him, to have him come back and make everything right, but decided to help myself again today by reading some past entries in my journal. Here's one:

Had an argument today and wanted to go home, but sorted that out on my way back, and he decided to fix my retic. All seemed to be ok until we left and he started on about my relationship with L (brother-in-law). I went quiet hoping he’d stop. We got some ice-cream from McD but he wouldn’t let me have mine because he’d paid for it. I asked him to stop and take me home. He screamed at me that I had ignored him at my house, didn’t help him, failed to give him water for 2 hours, ignored him talking to A and L. Demanded to know what they said about him. Then told me nobody likes me. I’m a fake person. I started crying in confusion. He dropped me off, virtually threw me out of the car, and I struggled with my bags, but he came running after me pleading with me not to go home,, to go back with him. Omg, I did. He seemed better only he attacked me when we arrived. He said I was a giggly idiot when greeting F (his dog), he pays for everything and I’m ungrateful, I’m a fake again, I don’t deserve anyone good…………….I can’t write anymore today. I’m a crushed soul.

I wrote this on 2 February 2015.
I’m not going back for more.

[Sadly]

So so well done Lar   that's what I do, I read that email I copied you, it hurts so very much but it strengthens my resolve. So proud of you. Xx

[JQ]

L,

The group is proud of you and I hope that you are proud of you. You've come along way on your journey. You're story has show so much strength, triumph, stumbles on your path ... .fortitude to continue your journey.

I know you like others (including myself) have struggles about your exBPD wanting to reach out ... .hoping that there will be a positive result to this contact but you know deep down inside that it will end sadly in pain & hurt to you reopening old wounds & scars along with new ones. Know that you are not alone in your thoughts & feelings and the group is here for you. BPD is a horrific mental illness because it not only affects the person it has within it's grasp for a their lifetime but it also affects those closest to the BPD in what in some cases is a life time of the push / pull, I love you I hate you back and forth that we know all to well.

It has taken an extreme about of strength, courage, self reliance, and self care to get to this point for you. You are stronger than you believe you are and you have such a wonderful happy life in front of you free of BPD to explore and enjoy!

Take a deep breath Larmoyant, you're dong ok. It continues to getter better with each step forward on your journey! 

J