I don't know how to end it

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

It's simple. But not. My relationship is done and just when I think we both agree and are both willing to move on it's like we never had to conversation. I'm not in it anymore and we both know it. There's a lot of history here but the hurt came from her. I'm so tired and just want to be happy. I don't know how to stop all this craziness. I know I can't just avoid hurting her but I fear what the reaction from her will be. I'm not physically afraid of her, although there have been times. I've always tried to be understanding and helpful but her mental health only seems to be getting worse. I don't feel like she's actually trying to get better even though she goes to therapy weekly. We've tried couple counseling numerous times with no help. The sessions become all about her. I've told her everything I can think of... .I'm tired, I'm done, we're not happy, this isn't fair to either one of us etc. she says it's my decision but when I tel her she says I need the help or she's going to live in a shelter or how she understands why people kill themselves and on and on. Basically guilting me. But then denies it when I point it out. It's like she's become so manipulative she doesn't even realize it. If I don't give her attention it's the guilt trip. If I pay attention it's not the right attention and then the guilt comes back. My friends have said to just kick her out. But I just don't know how to be mean. She's had a lot of that in her life and I don't want to be added to the list. So basically I'm stuck. Stuck and getting hopeless. Not in a hurting myself way. More in a just stuck and miserable way.

[Ke11y]

It's simple. But not. My relationship is done and just when I think we both agree and are both willing to move on it's like we never had to conversation. I'm not in it anymore and we both know it. There's a lot of history here but the hurt came from her. I'm so tired and just want to be happy. I don't know how to stop all this craziness. I know I can't just avoid hurting her but I fear what the reaction from her will be. I'm not physically afraid of her, although there have been times. I've always tried to be understanding and helpful but her mental health only seems to be getting worse. I don't feel like she's actually trying to get better even though she goes to therapy weekly. We've tried couple counseling numerous times with no help. The sessions become all about her. I've told her everything I can think of... .I'm tired, I'm done, we're not happy, this isn't fair to either one of us etc. she says it's my decision but when I tel her she says I need the help or she's going to live in a shelter or how she understands why people kill themselves and on and on. Basically guilting me. But then denies it when I point it out. It's like she's become so manipulative she doesn't even realize it. If I don't give her attention it's the guilt trip. If I pay attention it's not the right attention and then the guilt comes back. My friends have said to just kick her out. But I just don't know how to be mean. She's had a lot of that in her life and I don't want to be added to the list. So basically I'm stuck. Stuck and getting hopeless. Not in a hurting myself way. More in a just stuck and miserable way.

[fromheeltoheal]

Hi Kelly-

And welcome!  I'm sorry you're in the middle of that, it is very painful and confusing, although it's not unique around here, we've all been there and we understand.

But I just don't know how to be mean. She's had a lot of that in her life and I don't want to be added to the list. So basically I'm stuck. Stuck and getting hopeless. Not in a hurting myself way. More in a just stuck and miserable way.

So you're putting her needs ahead of your own, very common.  You mention you're not in it anymore, and do you think ending it now would be less mean than letting it drag on?  Was it a pattern in the relationship for you to put her needs ahead of your own?  Selfishness can be your friend right now, and selfishness gets a bad rap, but really, if we don't take care of ourselves first we have nothing to give, and being in a relationship with a borderline tends to be depleting, do you agree?

[Ke11y]

There was a pattern there for several years where I put her in front of myself. Now when I make it a point to take care of my needs I get all the little fits about it. The guilt trips and the threats. I don't want to drag it on. I've told her numerous times and in so many ways that it's over. I've told her I'm not in love with her. There was even one night we had a calm adult conversation. I went to bed thinking the next day we were going to find her a new place to live and both agreed it was over. She got up the next day and basically pretended the conversation never happened. When we go to therapy, or even when we talk at home it's like we're having two different conversations with two different out comes. She acts one way in therapy and around people then a completely different when it's just her and I. I never know form day to day or even from walking from one room to the next who she's going to be the next day or later that day.

[fromheeltoheal]

When we go to therapy, or even when we talk at home it's like we're having two different conversations with two different out comes. She acts one way in therapy and around people then a completely different when it's just her and I. I never know form day to day or even from walking from one room to the next who she's going to be the next day or later that day.

Yes, both of those are common.  Borderlines don't have a fully formed self of their own and they have a mandatory need to attach to someone to feel whole, so they get very good at being who they need to be in whatever situation to attach, which also comes in handy when trying to be accepted.  Also, affective instability due to a marked reactivity of mood is an official trait of the disorder, which in a nutshell means rapid and extreme mood swings, which you're experiencing.

So sounds like the goal is to have her move out; are you at the point of making a real decision, like it will happen, and then coming up with a plan?

[Ke11y]

Yes. I am at that point of making a plan. I care for her. I will always have love for her. I've told her I don't want this to drag on so far that we don't even like each other anymore and I'm afraid more and more that it will end up like that. I feel like I've kind of become her end all be all. If that makes sense. Which makes me feel more like a care giver and a parent. Neither one of us can give each other what we need out of this relationship. I feel that I've been patient and understanding over the years and that I've given all I can. I'm just tired now. All in all I am ready. This is reaching an unhealthy level for both of us.

[Ke11y]

The point is... .we've been at that point and about the time I think I have her out she figures out a way back in or a way to not leave in the first place.

[fromheeltoheal]

The point is... .we've been at that point and about the time I think I have her out she figures out a way back in or a way to not leave in the first place.

Then it may be time for a real decision.  Decision comes from the same root as incision; incision means to cut into while decision means to cut off, meaning a real decision is one that cuts off any other possibility.  It sounds like the main obstacles may be your own internal conflict, and you can look at that a couple of ways.  If your relationship with her just isn't happening, then staying with her prevents her from getting into one that may make her happy.  Of course if she exhibits significant traits or the disorder we know what "happy" entails, but still, it may give her a shot at it.  And the other way is like alcoholics, who have to hit bottom before they see the light and seek help; no guarantee that would happen with a borderline, but nothing else seems to be working yes?

So is it time for a real decision?

[elfyguy]

The point is... .we've been at that point and about the time I think I have her out she figures out a way back in or a way to not leave in the first place.

Heya Ke11y. I didn't have the courage or willpower to end it with my ex. I tried a few times but it was too painful to follow through. In the end, 5 years and a bit later, I mustered the courage to say to her that "I may never marry." She instantly started looking for a new partner. Then, with her web-weaving and deceit she chose when it was best convenient for her, not for me. The healthiest thing to do is what your instincts are telling you. However, like someone with an addiction, it's not so easy. I wish the best of luck to you!

[spacemadness]

Hi Ke11y,

I just wanted to let you know that you're not alone. Most of what you said could have been written by me. I just left my uBPD husband several weeks ago. I have tried for years to detach; I left twice last year but went back. One of the reasons I stayed was fear that he would kill himself, but he is actually doing quite well.

Only you can make the decision. I just wanted to let you know that you are not alone. Come back here any time you need support. This site has been invaluable to me.

[VitaminC]

Hi Ke11ly,

Your situation resonated for me too.

I don't want to drag it on. I've told her numerous times and in so many ways that it's over. I've told her I'm not in love with her. There was even one night we had a calm adult conversation. I went to bed thinking the next day we were going to find her a new place to live and both agreed it was over. She got up the next day and basically pretended the conversation never happened.

As has already been pointed out, this is quite common. I also kept having these conversations with my ex. And somehow whatever conclusion we reached, and there were a few calm 'adult' conversations in there, it never seemed to stick.

I was guilt tripped into going back, but even more often it was the seeming maturity of those conversations that made me think - "wow, maybe it is possible". And then I would start the thing all over again.

I kept thinking I had truly decided, but my decision kept changing because I kept thinking I had previously missed out some important facts. 

Yes. I am at that point of making a plan.

... .Neither one of us can give each other what we need out of this relationship. I feel that I've been patient and understanding over the years and that I've given all I can. I'm just tired now. All in all I am ready. This is reaching an unhealthy level for both of us.

I realised about 3 or 4 months in that that was one of the most likely outcomes. I predicted it. It was only when I started looking at what was actually preventing me from making a plan and executing it, that I got together the wherewithal to depart the relationship.

If you know this, and if you know that your caretaking tendency is keeping you stuck, then take a close look at what's in there. Co-dependency is the term that comes to mind.

I think that you will have to be the one to make the decision and that will involve dealing with the emotional consequences of that for yourself. She can figure out ways to not leave or to come back, but you can also figure out a way to not permit that to happen. I don't think that's easy, but it is doable.

What would a plan entail at this stage? What practical things and what emotional things? Can you break it down a little and tell us?

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Ke11y, Many of us have been in your shoes.  It's hard to make the break, my friend.  Nevertheless, waiting for a pwBPD to give you permission to break-up is a thankless vigil, because it is unlikely to happen due to their fear of abandonment.  The reality is, you don't need her approval to move forward on your own.  It sounds like you recognize that the time to move on has come.  Sometimes you have to be "cruel to be kind."  You're not doing anyone any favors by staying too long in a r/s that has run its course, in my view.  The longer you wait, the harder it will be to disengage.

LuckyJim

[Ke11y]

I guess where I have a hard time is when I put my foot down, express where I'm coming from in a clear way, think that we're on the same page and then it gets turned around likenit didn't happen. It's like climbing a mountain and getting as high as you can then camping for the night and wake up at the bottom again. She's been diagnosed with BPD but absolutely refuses to accept it. So when I attempt to talk to her about her mood swings and the fact that she has various teenage and some times childlike behavior and that those are factors in why she can't hear me it turns into how horrible of a person I am and how I've let her down just like everyone else. Then we go into the substance abuse and suicidal tendencies until I stop talking. Then boom... .square one again.

[bunny4523]

Hi Kelly,

Here is the thing... .no matter how nicely you are in ending it, how reasonable and accomodating you are to her feelings and needs... .it is not likely that will be how she will see it.  So my advice to you, after being in that situation myself, is just do it.  When you really ready, come up with a plan and stick to it.  Be prepared for an intense uproar and just remember that it will not last forever.  Peace will follow.

I remember my situation like it was yesterday even though it was over a year ago.   He kicked me out and then changed the locks on me so I couldn't leave.  I had to call the police to have them tell him he needs to let me in to get my stuff.  Finally when the last box was in my car... .this peace came over me.  My new place was in shambles because he made me move out 5 days earlier than planned.  I had no appliances or furniture, I had sold everything to move in with him. I couldn't even find my son's asthma medication or school supplies and school started the following week.  Even with all that going on, I can't even express how peaceful and free I felt getting away from him once and for all.  And I would still have to deal with him everyday at work... .but I was so relieved to be out of that relationship.

Bunny

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Ke11y, Like many things in life, there's no "good time" to break-up with a pwBPD.  As bunny notes, you just do it and let the chips fall.  Only you know in your heart when things are over.  I'll share a quick story:  one time my T asked me if I thought that I had tried everything to save my marriage to my BPDxW?  I said Yes.  She said, "I think so, too."  That was an eye-opener for me because my T rarely expressed her personal opinion.  Maybe you should ask yourself the same question?

LuckyJim