Well I am cut off again...

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

So she's been ugly all day. Had a pain clinic appt, she was wrong about it, said it was tomorrow, I said my calendar says its today. Then comes back and guess what, WHO WAS RIGHT? As you might gather, I didn't hear those words.

So I was already told not to come over tonight. So I offered to since her appt was today. NOPE.

So all day the messages have been ugly. All day I have been nice and not taking the bait. So tonight I finally said, I am going to have to take a break for me. I really want to say something to you, and it won't be heard, so I will just have to talk to you in the morning.

She was fussing about having to go to my parents house for thanksgiving, so I said, I release you from that obligation.

So now I am cut off again. Blocked on messenger. Blocked on hangouts. Probably turned off at cell company for texts because I dare drop off the face of the earth and not talk to her, or rather not be abused by her.

And uninviting her was an FU move. I didn't uninvite, I just said, if black friday shopping is so important, then I release from having to go with me.

All day I have been nothing but nice. Not even a snarky comment. And this is what she doesn't get. No matter what I do, the result is the same. So, why put forth a whole bunch of effort, when I get the same crap?

[Lockjaw]

So she's been ugly all day. Had a pain clinic appt, she was wrong about it, said it was tomorrow, I said my calendar says its today. Then comes back and guess what, WHO WAS RIGHT? As you might gather, I didn't hear those words.

So I was already told not to come over tonight. So I offered to since her appt was today. NOPE.

So all day the messages have been ugly. All day I have been nice and not taking the bait. So tonight I finally said, I am going to have to take a break for me. I really want to say something to you, and it won't be heard, so I will just have to talk to you in the morning.

She was fussing about having to go to my parents house for thanksgiving, so I said, I release you from that obligation.

So now I am cut off again. Blocked on messenger. Blocked on hangouts. Probably turned off at cell company for texts because I dare drop off the face of the earth and not talk to her, or rather not be abused by her.

And uninviting her was an FU move. I didn't uninvite, I just said, if black friday shopping is so important, then I release from having to go with me.

All day I have been nothing but nice. Not even a snarky comment. And this is what she doesn't get. No matter what I do, the result is the same. So, why put forth a whole bunch of effort, when I get the same crap?

[sad but wiser]

That's an excellent question.  Why do you?  Is this the kind of relationship you want?  Trust me, the drama can go on for years like this. 

[tryingtohelp]

Hi ,

Sounds like very BPD behaviour   !

Is she diagnosed BPD ?

When they are in that mind-set ,you can be as nice as you like , they generally won't give an inch , you are being put firmly in your place.  Give it a few days , it will pass,  till the next time.

[bobcat2014]

Happy Thanksgiving Lockjaw,

Holidays, birthdays, and get togethers ALWAYS trigger my wife into some type of meltdown.

We once had 20 different family members modify times, dates and travel plans to accommodate my uBPDw part time work schedule (that she sets). Not anymore. If she doesn't want to go see my family she doesn't have to. Of course that means she get excluded and proves herself correct, in that nobody likes her. Adult child... .and been this way for a very long time. It doesn't get better, only colder and more resentful for next go around. More ammo to unload for next year or next holiday. At least when they rage, you know whats on their mind, but getting cut off and silent, tends to worry me a bit more.

[bobcat2014]

Trust me, the drama can go on for years like this. 

Such a true statement... .

[Lockjaw]

No she is not diagnosed. She won't go see a counselor, because they, in her words are more F'd up than the people they counsel.

In discussing some of my issues with her with my therapist, she asked the question if she was BPD and asked me to look at it online. When I did, lights and bells went off.

I told her she was one night when she made me really mad. Which was a mistake. It's on my permanent record.

The way my therapist explains it, only family and their "Neo" are the target of the BPD behavior. Most others don't see it or get subjected to it. All they see is she is outspoken. She says she has lots of friends, but... .I don't see that. Women don't seem to like her, and most guys, well they just want to hit it, if you know what I mean.

She has a sweet side, but good lord she can be a royal B. And I should say this, I am not the kind of guy who says things like that. If I say someone is a royal B, you can believe they are. I just don't use language like that.

[Lockjaw]

Messenger back on. Apology for being ugly. I said I am sorry I lost time with you. To which she says, she wouldn't have had time to spend with me anyway. Well I guess that makes it ok then. 

I sent her an email this am. I listed out all the things I had done for her at her house that I could remember in the last year, it was rather long, and pointed out, how much did your ex do in his 10 years there? And that I hadn't said anything ugly or snarky.

So now she wants to argue about my "releasing her" from having to go with me to my family's house for thanksgiving. It was an uninvite. No, it was me saying, hey I heard you say black friday shopping is your hobby, and its important to you, much like opening day of deer season is to me. So go if you want. It was a gesture of me being nice. You may not like the terms I used, but it was very clear, and not ugly.

She just wants to nitpick and argue. I presume this is projecting since she was so ugly to me, and feels guilty?

[waverider]

She just wants to nitpick and argue. I presume this is projecting since she was so ugly to me, and feels guilty?

No, she just doesn't want to be seen to be the guilty party and that anything she did was ultimately justified and understandable. ie she may be able to admit overreacting, but it still has to be seen to be a reaction to some mistake of yours. Not completely unprovoked.

[Lockjaw]

So really its my fault, even though its really hers?

[bobcat2014]

So really its my fault, even though its really hers?

It will always be someone at fault... .just not her.

[Lockjaw]

Well it just gets better and better. I am at work, so she is mad I couldn't keep messaging her. And of course that is an all or nothing kind of thing. As in, ok I won't bother you anymore.

She was also mad because I stopped messaging her last night after I clearly said I needed to take a break for me, and I would talk to her the next day. This is what she hates about messaging/texting.

So do they need you at their beckon call too? I mean literally? It seems like that is an issue too.

[sad but wiser]

Exactly so.  It's kind of amazing how perfect they are!

[Lockjaw]

Tell me about it. I got more of the same after work. Snarky messages, then she called. I said I don't know, 7 or 8 times I needed to eat and wanted to get off the phone, and she just kept right on.

Her whole thing is "I said I was sorry", but then she just continues to act like a B. I finally said, you know, you told me many times how your ex would get drunk and cuss you out and call you all sorts of ugly names, and it didn't mean anything to you because he would just do it again. That's what you do to me. You apologize but the crap keeps coming.

The more I sit and think about it, the more it just pisses me off. I am doing nothing wrong, minding my own business in my own little world thinking everything is just fine, and she blows it up.

I should be going out to hunt this am. I set my clock, but I don't feel like it. Supposed to go to see my parents and get my kids thanksgiving, with her, I don't want to go. I will just have to hear more of her mess in the car, and the bad thing is I will be trapped.

I finally got mad last night and just cut her off. Said I didn't want to talk, that I was going to bed. She blew up my phones. Sent texts, messenger called me, left to come over and then turned around. I ended up sleeping in my son's room so I could have peace, and turned on my nest camera in case she lost her marbles and kicked in the door.

I know this is wrong, but I wish I could make her FEEL what I feel when she does her thing. I wish she could experience it. I told her last night I wished she could just tell me that I would always be wrong. I think I could deal with it if she did that. I think that would tell me she gets she is the problem.

All she does now is say she has to accept her punishment. I wish she could see its not punishment, its self preservation. It's me keeping myself from going completely dark, off the deep end, from wanting to strangle her, figuratively speaking.

I am so thankful for this board. If nothing else, just to be able to speak freely and be among people who understand what its like to be me.

[Meili]

Lockjaw,

You have written a lot about what she does, but can you switch your focus from what she is doing and tell us what you think that she is feeling?

From the sounds of it, if you can learn to stop taking it all so personally, because it isn't personal... .it isn't actually about you... .and learn to Listen with Empathy and Don't be Invalidating to her, some of this (if not most of it) might stop.

When you were trying to be supportive of her and "released her from her obligation" so that she could go shopping, you said that she switched it to "uninviting" her. This likely triggered her insecurities about not being good enough or unlovable.

When she kept you on the phone when you wanted to get off to eat, did you acknowledge that she was telling you that she was missing you, or did you just tell her that you didn't want to talk? Again, this could have been a trigger to her.

And, her feeling punished, did you validate what she was telling you, or were you invalidating by JADE'ing?

I know that it's hard and frustrating trying to learning new ways to communicate with a pwBPD, but to make the relationship work, that's what it's going to take. The non is also involved in the discussions. The non cannot control the pwBPD, so the only thing that the non can do is control his/her part in the conversation.

[waverider]

She is feeling a lot.

She has a completely dysfunctional way of communicating this using often unfeeling toxic wording which is projection of her inner emotions

As a result you hear her words rather than her feelings.

As a result of this mishearing you react in a way which indicates you did not hear her emotions.

This she interpretes as not caring and being self interested.

She ups the anti and attacks you in any way she can think of as punishment. "See how you like it" mindset.

Its classic miscommunication creating escalation.

The more frustrated and depressed you get the less likely you are to turn this around as your energies become sapped.

Creating space for yourself, not taking it personally (hard), not being distracted by the specifics of her choice of words or accusations. Asking questions rather trying to resolve. Do those things you like, even if you feel unmotivated to initiate them, as what you need is respite and a little refreshment in your life.

Spent too long in the pit and you forget what sunshine looks like and you loose the resolve to climb out. You become the entrenched victim and see persecution in everything, and everything seems pointless. Do not underestimate the risk of depression in nons dealing with a BPD relationship.

Just a posting tip, after every vent try to finish on a positive suggestion or humorous note. It works wonders, its like the "fluffy dog" story at the end of the daily news bulletin.

[sad but wiser]

Or, she wants what she wants, is used to getting her way and isn't really able to handle a grown up relationship because her emotional needs are so great there is no room for anyone else's needs.
  I do understand and pity my ex... .I just don't want to live my life in a war zone not getting my needs met and feeling emotionally drained.  And that's ok.  I tried for 19 years, but it just got worse.  That wasn't a marriage and I didn't sign up to adopt him.

[Lockjaw]

You know what? It frustrates me to no end that there is all this talk about how THEY feel? What about us?

How do I FEEL to have someone on my azz about everything that bothers them? How do I feel to have a number 1 criticizer, not a number 1 encourager? How do I feel that I can't even got more than about a week before another argument starts?

I am a nice man. I don't want to argue and fight about things. I don't want to be on someone's case about every little thing they do that bothers me. I let it go, life is to short. I mean if its going to piss me off a month from now, then I will bring it up, pretty much anything else, I let it go. What's the point? Especially with her.

I asked her for 2 things. To be my number 1 encourager, and to tone it down with the opinions. That's it.

With me, even if I am mad as a hornet, you can ask me if I am being rude, ugly, inconsiderate, a jack wagon, whatever, I will admit it. Her? NOPE! Forget it.

When she is wrong, which is often, and she finally manages an apology, what happens after? I still get to hear her justify, defend, and all the other mess she does over what she was wrong about and apologized for, for days after. But, if she apologizes and I say anything about what she did, OH NO, I APOLOGIZED, ITS OFF LIMITS!

If she doesn't like something I do, even if its something so stupid and dumb, 99.99 percent of the population would let it go, does she? NOPE! Oh no, she has to say.

I just came home in the middle of a date. Drove her back to her house, left my stuff in her car and came back to my house. She left and went to a movie or something alone.

I was inconsiderate about something I did, but she blew it out of proportion. I got the insults, the rude comments, and of course she won't let it go. So I just came home. I said we just got done with the whole thanksgiving thing, and you are on me about something again. Something that doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things.

I have never tried so hard to make someone happy and failed so miserably in my life. I love her to death, but I hate her guts at the same time. I just want to feel good, I want someone to love me for me. Not watch for every little thing I do wrong so they can point it out.

If you don't want someone to leave you, you have this giant fear of abandonment, then why do you ride their case when you know its going to piss them off and make them leave?

I blew 50 bucks on dinner. I didn't go hunting this afternoon. I came back to go on a date with her. Because I have to ask her out still, even after a year and a half. She can't ask me, I have to ask her.

But to ask your question, for the most part, I don't justify what I do wrong. I do get angry because quite frankly I am sick of being run down for everything. I don't defend what I do, and I have quit explaining.

Here is what happened wednesday night. I told her I WANTED HER TO GO with me to see my family for thanksgiving, but, I didn't want to rehash our argument all the way over. From the minute I walked in her house, she was on me about everything. I just kept quiet. All the way over to the hotel, same. We went to eat, same. Come back to room, same. Finally I said, if you don't stop, I am going to go out and sit in my truck and sleep there. So she kept on. I was worn out. I had gone hunting that morning, gotten up at 330 AM. Its getting close to midnight, and she wanted to online shop at walmart for some TV's.

So she keeps on, so I got up out of bed, put on my shirt, shoes, and jacket and was heading out the door, when she stopped me. Hugs me, I just stand there. Don't say a word. Then she starts telling me she needs my help to order these tvs. I said, you have your phone and laptop, you order them. Oh no, we both had to. I said I am not ordering anything, I am not rewarding this behavior. So she didn't get to order her TV;s. That's on my permanent record, EVEN THOUGH, we stopped at a walmart on the way back and they had them in stock.

Even on the way over to my parents the next morning, she was still complaining. She said, I will just stay in motel. I said, then I will get the kids and we will all just go back.

My joy in life, my hobby is deer hunting. I can't go every weekend, I have custody of my kids. On my kid free weekends, I come back to go on date nights she blows up. I came back this morning, to take a nap, so I wouldn't be tired, so we could go eat where she wanted to go and watch a game on tv.

I don't even like to go hunt anymore. I just want to crawl into a hole and hide. I feel so worthless, and useless. I have lost nearly 20 more months of my life on a person who doesn't love me for who I am. She couldn't even admit tonight's issue wasn't a big thing. It was very minor. In fact, it wouldn't have even bothered me. I am not trying to dismiss it to make myself appear to be not at fault.

But it was just one thing after another. I am not a team player. I am a team of one. I am over reacting. Did I take my medicine today. I take 5 mg of lexapro for anxiety. I should take 10 to date her. If she doesn't like something, she is going to say something. She was just trying to have a conversation. This pisses her off.

I am sorry, I couldn't help it, when she said that, I was like, there's a shock.     I just couldn't help it.

I hate feeling like a total failure. I hate it. 

[Lockjaw]

Oh and I was to quiet at my family's house. It was at my sisters house, her hubs is dying, he has stage 4 colon cancer. I haven't seen him since he was diagnosed a year ago. So I was watching him, and quite frankly, I didn't know what to expect, I had been bashed by her for 3 days, so... .I just kind of didn't say a whole lot, which isn't unusual when I am around them. I just kind of listen.

He's been good to me, and good to my kids. But I wasn't all on top of her in front of my family. So... .again, just one of the many things I do wrong.

I even heard about that yesterday again, after I explained to her, you know, that is my BIL, he is dying, my niece and nephew who I love to death and love my kids to death have to watch this. He feels like crap, and I had no idea what to expect when I walked in there. I said I made myself stay toned down. Not that its hard, I am introverted. I finally said, can you just let some of this go? Please?

Oh and we got this deal at dinner, buy a gift card and then we would get some promotional discounts to use. So I bought it, she hands it to me and tells me to use it to take some hoochie out. That is not my style. I don't do things like that.

But just one of those comments I get.

[Lockjaw]

I hate my life. I really do.

[Oncebitten]

Lockjaw

I feel for you... .really do.  Mine is fond of the blocking/cutting off silent treatment.  Gets mad about god knows what... .takes it out on me... .makes me out to be the bad guy... .then when I ask why... .tells me how awful I am and blocks me.  I am amused now when she tells me how childish I am.  Every flaw she claims I have are simply projections of her own short commings. 

[sad but wiser]

Dear Lockjaw,
   They don't have it to give.  That is all.  It is frustrating because they seem to at first, but that goes away quickly... .a mirage.  These poor people don't have a solid core and are unlikely to develop one.  This started when they were very, very young.  They need a mommy very badly.  They spend most if their time frightened and lost and it comes out as evil hostility.  If you want a true marriage or partnership, you cannot get it with a person with BPD any more than you could get water from a dry well. 
  People who stay in relationships with BPD sufferers must be willing to accept this.  Like you would if she were your child.  It is what it is.  And it is incredibly sad for both people.

[Lockjaw]

She knows she does it to me. She will buy me something to make up for it. But its just stuff. I want someone who gives me the emotional I want too.

This is my life. This is what I attract and what I am attracted to. I bust my butt to give, and give and give, and do the things they want and need to be happy, and slowly it goes away. I end up empty and unfulfilled. They always do things for me, it is how it should be, two people doing things for each other. Then it ends up just me.

I heard last week how I am slacking. How I am not getting stuff done at her house. She says she knows my potential, and she is going to push me.

I told her last night, I just want 2 weeks of not getting fussed at. Just two. She just doesn't understand why I can't "communicate" like an adult. Why do I "run". Maybe its because she is never wrong. Maybe its because no matter what I say, its wrong, its not good enough, and because I get to get my chops busted for days after. But she says that is what I do. No that is me not letting her spin everything into her being right and me being wrong.

There are so many things we are the same about, and yet it is really these two things that just drive me insane. I hate feeling like a failure, and that is how I feel. And I hate that every little thing I do ends up being an argument, because she HAS TO say something.

I am not perfect. I am flawed, just like her, and I hardly ever say anything to her. I try to keep the peace.

I need to just cut her loose. I really do. I am probably so messed up now, no woman will want me. First one that says something about me doing something they don't like I will probably go nuclear. They will probably look at me and go, DUDE WTH?

[Oncebitten]

lockjaw

I feel for you.  I found myself in the same situation, I do and do.  And yes she has good days and tells me ho great I am... .but in the end its never enough.  there is always some criticism to follow... .the bar raised once again. I am simply being set up to fail over and over

[waverider]

This is my life. This is what I attract and what I am attracted to. I bust my butt to give, and give and give, and do the things they want and need to be happy, and slowly it goes away. I end up empty and unfulfilled. They always do things for me, it is how it should be, two people doing things for each other. Then it ends up just me.

This is the "Black Hole", principle you can put everything in until you have nothing left to give and it will make no net difference. They do not like being a black hole, but they are trapped in it, for a while they can role play the shining star as that is what they want to be, but they dont have the inner self and faculties to maintain that role, but they try hard and hence can even be over the top "too shiny', but ultimately implode back in to the black hole mode as teh effort becomes too much

They can't help being a black hole, but with awareness you can learn not to pour everything you have into it.

Always ask yourself the question "Why do some people always seem to try too hard?", because they want to desperately be something they aren't.

Throwing "baubles" at people in a disguised attempt to impress is a common BPD trait.

[bobcat2014]

Dear Lockjaw,
   They don't have it to give.  That is all.  It is frustrating because they seem to at first, but that goes away quickly... .a mirage.  These poor people don't have a solid core and are unlikely to develop one.  This started when they were very, very young.  They need a mommy very badly.  They spend most if their time frightened and lost and it comes out as evil hostility.  If you want a true marriage or partnership, you cannot get it with a person with BPD any more than you could get water from a dry well. 
  People who stay in relationships with BPD sufferers must be willing to accept this.  Like you would if she were your child.  It is what it is.  And it is incredibly sad for both people.

This should be required reading for all Non's. Precise explanation of BPD relationship expectations.

[Lockjaw]

I told her yesterday evening I just wanted to arrange a time for us to each get our things and go our separate ways. She didn't understand why I was saying that. I asked her point blank, are you happy right now? I said because I am not. I haven't been for quite some time, and I have said it in not so many words. She had trouble answering, she ended up saying, that I made her happy most of the time.

I told her that is what is so frustrating to me. There are so many things good about us, but there are these two issues, and I hate them. I said, I hate fighting. I hate it. If it was over something worth it, then that is one thing, but its always about something dumb. And I said I feel like I am always wrong. If there are things I do every week you don't like, then how can you be happy with me? I said do I say you do something I don't like once a week? Maybe I live in a fantasy world, but that is not two people who work well together if one is always doing something the other doesn't like.

She said just because I say that doesn't mean I am criticizing you. I said what is it then? Does it help? Does it make us better as a couple, or does it cause a fight? I told her I wanted the love like in Corinthians in the bible. I said I want to give it, and I want to receive it. Nothing.

So then she tells me that I am throwing away a quality person. That I won't find someone who loves me more. I said, how can you say that when I do all this stuff you don't like? She said I have been slacking for a while. I asked her if she had? She said she had. I said, I have too. You know why? Because I never win. I fail. I said i have never tried so hard to make something work, and fail. I hate it. I obsess about it. I said I have tried everything I know to make these go away. She says everything but the one thing I told you to do. Well her one thing isn't practical. I can't be in front of you holding your hand and tell you lovingly you hurt my feelings every time we have a disagreement. I am a single dad, I have 2 kids. I can't pretend we are all good until we can see each other.

She says all I see is the bad. I said the bad hits me in the face. I told her the other night at the motel, when she got angry while I was laying down in the bed that I was on edge because I felt like she was going to smack me. (Carryover from my dad as a child). She said why didn't you tell me? I said, what would it have done. She said, I could have held you and told you it was ok. I said, you were angry with me. Over nothing. Why would I think me telling you that would make a difference?

I asked her, why can't you just say you see my point? I said why don't I get a heartfelt apology? It's just like you recite something, it doesn't come across as genuine.

She says I am a team of one. I said a team doesn't mean that you get to tell me what i need to do all the time. She said no one listens to her anyway. I said, you know why, right? People need to be receptive to receiving advice you want to give. If they aren't, they won't hear it. I asked her what did I do when she asked me what I felt like she needed to do different with her son? I said I gave you my opinion, you disagreed with some of it, what did I do? Did I get mad? Did I say you weren't a team player? Or did I say, ok, and leave it alone? Why is it so important that I accept your opinion and act on it? No good answer for that.

She wanted me to come to her house, and I said no, so she asked if she could come to mine. I said what for? To cuddle? I said, what is the point? She said had I known last night would be the last night I was going to be with you, I would have wanted to spend it with you. So I said ok, but, I don't want to argue, and I am not having sex, since you keep throwing that in my face.

I didn't sleep well. She stayed plastered next to me. She is hurting, and it hurts me. She is so beautiful in my eyes. When she is tender and sweet, I am in heaven. When she gets in one of her moods, I am in hell. She said something about me making up my mind and that I would go find someone else. I said, the sad thing is I haven't heard you say anything, like you wanted me, and you wanted us to work, and you would make some changes.

I love her with all of my heart, but I hate fighting over dumb stuff all the time more. I said I need to feel like I win. If we could get into a rhythm of not fighting all the time, I could handle it, but as it stands, I never get to really get over the latest one before another one happens.

And I said to her, the sadest part of all of this is I cringe everytime you say something, because I never know if its going to start something and I have stopped saying much, because of the same reason.

The hardest thing for me though is she is the first person I have ever dated that I like to touch me. I would always get tired of the person, no matter how much I liked or loved them, and want space. I hate being away from her, but I hate fighting even more. It is the only thing that keeps me away. I told her I will come back from hunting to be with you. I have never done that for anyone. It's my one and only hobby now.

She thinks that is insulting. I should want to come back to be with her, not doing her a favor. I said its not a favor, its me willingly doing it because I want to be with you. There is significance to it, but she doesn't see it. So I just said I am sorry, what I meant to say I wasn't able to convey properly.

I wish she would go see someone with me. But she won't. And I will probably be so screwed up from this that any new person will get hammered the first time they tell me they don't like something I do. YAY!

This is my life. This is where I always end. Always. It's disheartening.

[sad but wiser]

Bobcat:  Thank you.

Dear Lockjaw,
   This is really tearing you up.  Don't pay a full emotional price for words from someone who is broken.  Easy to say, very very hard to do.
    My experience is this:  you can get past the damage, you can heal.  You just cannot do it sitting on a fence.  Your inner self needs a real decision desperately.  With her, or moving on?  Stay or go?  If you stay, don't beat yourself up about it.  That is your decision to make.  Just don't make it without your eyes fully open.  You will never again be her shining knight.  That was the start-up relationship.  I don't care if you wait 30 years, it doesn't come back.  Sometimes there will be a day or two, and you start to hope.  But when you look at it later, you see she was romancing on the fumes of some other love. (Like at her sister's wedding, or her cousin's new baby where everyone else is all happy and sweet, she picks it up and projects it.)
     If you go, you need No Contact.  It is like an addict coming off drugs, but on the other side is peace, and self-esteem.  You can heal if you give yourself time.  You will grieve and you will see where you have been and wonder what you could possibly have been thinking.  Don't beat youself up on this path, either.  You are in good company.  All of us entered a relationship and tried to do what people normally do with reasonable expectations and high vulnerability.  And we got confused and manipulated as they renegotiated every agreement and blamed all difficulties on us.
  You get to choose.  It is your life and your choice.  No one else, not even she, gets to dictate your choices or set all the terms of your relationship with her.
   

[Lockjaw]

Do they ever get it? Like if she has traits of BPD? I want us to do some kind of class if I stay. Sometimes I think she sees. She told me this morning on the phone that she is beginning to understand why I just don't like all the conflict. I told her that what happened to me as a kid with my dad, I can't remember a lot of it. I know what he did, I know why I got in trouble, but so much of the whole thing is missing.

Just to refresh, my dad knocked the heck out of me when I was in 5th grade. He wanted me to help my sis do her homework, but I was doing mine, and kept telling him that. It wasn't good enough, so I got sent to my room. I feel certain I was roughed up on the way. I was in my room in bed, crying, and he came back down in a rage, and just layed me out. I know I screamed, but that is all I remember, until I got off the bus the next day to come home from school. I know at some point I looked in a mirror and I had a hand print on my face. My mom tried to get me to talk about it, and I wouldn't. I just cried. He never apologized.

So I wanted her to see that because so much if this is missing, I feel like there are things she says or does that my subconcious recognizes and it triggers these feelings. It is why I don't like to fight, or have someone talk to me very bluntly and directly. I just cringe. I have even had a boss talk to me directly and felt the fear of being struck.

She says she understands that now. Before she would just dismiss it, but I think she needed to see I was a child when this happened. I didn't have logic skills, or even reasoning skills at my age when it happened. She says I need to let it go. I said, I am not angry about it, my dad is forgiven, but I can't deal with what I can't recall. You know?

This is why I told her I just let stuff go. I will die on a hill over something big, but something small, something little, no. And I told her I need to feel heard. I need to know you heard what I said. Its respect. If I get that, then I am able to deal with things better.

I don't know what will happen. I just don't. She said yesterday she wanted me to do online dating for 2 months. I said why? She says so I will see what is out there, and realize she is better. She says quality women don't use dating sites. I know when I have been on them, you sure get a lot of people hitting you up that don't even read to see what you like. And of course, they are never what they say.

I am 6'3'' and weigh about 180. I call myself average. If you are 5'4'' and weigh 180, you aren't average. You know what I mean? Or you say non smoker only, and you get those who are "trying to quit".

So I said no, I don't want to do online dating. I don't want to waste money on that. She said, I will give you money for it. No thanks... .

I wonder if she got some therapy would it help her? If she would go.

[sad but wiser]

My dear Lockjaw,
  What happened to you was horrible child abuse and there is absolutely no excuse for a grown man doing that to a kid.  I suspect it wasn't the only time.  My friend, please get counselling over this issue.  And perhaps your girlfriend will wait for a few months while you start working through this.  I can't imagine what that did to you.  He should have been someone you could count on to defend you, but you had to avoid him.   Yes, this sets us up for being linked to a person with BPD or other similar traits later.  I ask you to seek counselling only on this personal abuse issue for now... .it seems to be the root.  You may want to run from it, but have courage, it will be worth the pain because you will gain perspective. Please keep us posted.

[Lockjaw]

I am seeing a counselor about it. I told him, and got really upset when I did. My GF knows about it too. She has softened up on it, she said for a long time I just need to get over it. Like I was still mad at my dad. I am not mad at him. I am past all that. He is forgiven too.

But what I am not past is the effects of it. I believe she finally saw that. I had awful issues growing up. I never got in trouble in school, except for grades. I was put in AP classes in High School, but no one told me. So in some of them I struggled, in others I did well. When I was about 16 I started drinking, and let me tell you, I took to that like a fish to water. By the time I was 21, I had 2 dui's, and was drinking over 12 beers a day, everyday. I was in pain, and this whole thing with my dad seemed to be the root.

I put myself in rehab, and walked out 28 days later realizing I had a problem. I hated AA, I never went to a single meeting once I got out. I did 2 years of aftercare at a local hospital, meeting 1 time a week. After that I quit. Funny thing though. I didn't stop with going to bars and stuff, so I was at a bar one night, with my best friend, and was just struggling. I looked at him and said, hey, either buy me a pitcher of beer so I can stay here, or take me home, because I can't stay here and not drink. He took me home.

That night I realized I was a beaten man. I prayed to God that night to take away my desire to drink, and did He. I could feel it leave my body. It was and is a miracle. That was over 28 years ago, and I still have no desire to drink. I never relapsed.

She knows about all of this.

For a long time, I was good. Then I was reading a book that made alot of this come back up. I have always struggled with my parents, I don't meet their expectations. They don't get me.

I did boyscouts as a younger kid. Got Eagle. I went camping every chance i got. It got me out of the house. When I was old enough to be gone from the house, I was.

I love my dad, but sometimes I wonder what I would be like if this hadn't happened to me. I don't know what happened to me later on after this. I know if he got really in my face and I had no where to go, I would bring it up and throw it in his face. I'd challenge him to do it again. That seemed to make him back off. But I had other instances where he was just a bully. That was his way.

I am such an introvert in person too. I can talk forever here, like this, in person I am quiet and reserved. If I get comfortable, then you will see my dry witty side.

One interesting thing I was discussing some of this with my sis, who was also a victim. She said one time I pulled a shotgun on my dad. I said, no, that isn't true. I just went and got it, because he was mad at me. I didn't even have ammo. I asked her why she thought I got it. She said she didn't know. I said it was because I didn't feel safe. I used to hide from him. I told her that is why I always have a gun on me now. I won't set foot in the woods without one. Usually always a pistol.

Funny how you remember some of this stuff when you talk about it. I just now realized that. Probably why I hide from her sometimes. I am getting worse I think sometimes. I have a wifi camera up in my house too. Mainly for when I am not there. But if she is mad at me and not there, at night, I will turn it on.

Isn't that sad?

Sometimes I feel like I am so damaged. When I was drinking, I just wanted to be good at something. You know? I was too. I could drink like a fish, and I was an awesome quarters player. Some thing to be good at.

GF may get me after all. Who knows? I don't.