Feeling paralyzed

[loveandsadness]

I apologize for what will be a long rambling first post but I wanted to give background to my current state.
I believe my 44 year old daughter has BPD. She is an incredibly intelligent and capable woman with 3 children. She is currently, for all intents and purposes, separated from her husband. She has had another short marriage and a relationship that was very near marriage that ended badly. She’s currently working, raising her children, homeschooling 1 of them and maintaining a house by herself.
As a child she was extremely jealous of her younger brother. He was not an easy child and she was a near perfect child. She has never gotten over her jealousy of her brother and has never had a close relationship with him. She feels we’ve always favored him and neglect her. He’s now married with 2 children and she hates his wife. For the most part the only relationship they have is to please me and my husband and when we’re all together my daughter makes it very unpleasant for me.
My relationship with my daughter has been very complicated. She sometimes wants me with her for the most intimate times, (including being with her in the delivery room for all 3 births) but will then become angry with me and push me away if I give an opinion she perceives as critical of her. She has stopped communicating with me on a few occasions and frequently doesn’t answer my texts.
My husband and I live in a different state from both of our children but when my daughter gave birth to her first child, seven and a half years ago, we bought an apartment close to her and go there for a week a month. The relationship between my daughter and her father isn’t great and he feels very uncomfortable when we go there but he continues to do so. My son lives further away but we travel to see him a few times a year and both children visit us a few times a year. For years he has asked us to sell our home and buy something near him. His wife is very close to us and feels the same way. As an aside, my daughter hates her and feels she is deliberately cruel to her.
The relationship my daughter has with her husband has been unusual and not healthy for several years. He has slept in the attic while the children ages 7, 5 and 3 sleep in bed with her. She controls most aspects of their lives including just about every decision about the children. She never wants to be with him without the children. Several months ago our son in law decided to apply for a job across the country without telling our daughter. He ended up accepting the position, has been there for 5 months and now visits for one long weekend a month. The children hate him, won’t speak with him on the phone and say things about him that sound like they heard from her.
My husband and I are both in our 70’s and while we are in good health now we’ve decided to sell our house and buy a home near our son. We will keep our place near our daughter and intend to split time with them. We’ve decided our primary residence will be the one near our son as the state he lives in is tax free, has better health care and we feel he and his wife are in a better position to help us should the need arise. We will however be able to spend more time than we currently do with our daughter. We told her about our decision about a month ago but didn’t tell her we’d be spending more time near her
brother.
A few days ago while she was visiting us we told her about our plans. We explained why and told her we would be seeing her more even though it was not our primary residence. We told her our dream would be to live near both of our children and we would help her move if she was willing to do so. We explained we’d be able to help her more and it would be better for her children to be near family. By the way, they have no relationship with their father’s family. We offered to help support her (we give both of our children money to help them get by). As expected it didn’t go well. She yelled, cried, said we were abandoning her, hate her and generally were always awful parents to her. I tried to appeal to her. I accepted blame for any pain I’d caused her but it was all in vain. She proceeded to tell the children we were abandoning them. We pleaded with her not to withhold her children from us, as much for their sake as ours. She implied she wouldn’t do that to them but left in a very bad state and will not respond to our attempts to reach out and has blocked us from her social media sites. We are to visit them in less than two weeks. We promised to bring some toys our grandchildren wanted from the house. I am beginning to think she won’t let them see us and is currently poisoning them against us. We will still go but I am afraid, though my friends say she’ll get over it as she’s done in the past, that this may be the final break.
I am devastated and don’t know how to handle the situation. I do occasionally see a therapist and will make an appointment with her but I’m hoping someone who has experienced something similar might be able to give me some insight that can potentially make things better for us.
Thank you!

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Pook075]

Hello and welcome to the family.  I completely understand feeling paralyzed in your position and it's certainly very stressful.

Has your daughter received any mental health treatment in the past?  Or visited with a therapist?

I'm asking because mental health is a personal journey- only you can choose to do things for your own mental health.  The same goes for your daughter; we can speculate all we want, but if she's not willing to get help then there's literally nothing you can do to "help her".

However, you can learn to communicate in healthier ways to hopefully cut down on some of the explosions in your life.

The problem with you moving closer to your son is about control and manipulation.  If you see them more, then they'll have more say in your lives, which is hard for your daughter to deal with.  But let's step back for a minute here- what's best for your mental health?  It's living close to your son and his wife.  So regardless of how your daughter feels, it's the correct move.  Let her deal with the rest of it.

It's entirely possible that she'll try to keep the grandkids from you.  But you will deal with that once you get there.  If that's what she chooses, then we'll find what the next steps should be.  Until then though, your focus has to be on you because that's what you control.  Let everything else go because it's not within your control.

[Notwendy]

Clearly- it is better for you and your H to move closer to your son. It's not about which child you love more- you love them both. It's a rational decision based on the resources in the area and your son's stable family. I think this is a choice that many families make when they have adult children who live in different places. They may travel to see their children but they have to live in one place which they choose on a variety of factors- cost of living, climate, etc.

You aren't moving near your son for him to take care of you or because of that need. You are setting things up for him to be able to help you and your H get care or help in case that need were to happen.

As to children- they have different skill sets. Ideally they'd all be willing to help in their own way.  But if a family member has BPD- the dynamics are different.

Having been involved with my elderly parents- and mother with BPD- I would again, agree that moving near your son is the better move. If he's reliable, I'd also not have your D named as power of attorney or have access to your finances.

This is not because you don't love your daughter. It's because she acts on emotions. The role of power of attorney requires that the person acts in the person's best interest, not on feelings. It requires an emotionally stable person. It sounds like your son could take on this role. If it's not your son, or you don't want to choose one child- choose someone who is.

PwBPD tend to perceive things from victim perspective. Having a family member who needs assistance is a change in the dynamic. You are supposed to be the one doing things for your D. Also, if a parent needs help- it's a stressful situation and the pwBPD might dysregulate.

Your D will likely react to your move. I hope she doesn't keep the grandkids from you. It's also possible that her reaction doesn't last long. I hope not. But don't compromise you and your H's well being because of her feelings. You made a rational choice that is the best one for the two of you.

[Notwendy]

PwBPD tend to perceive things from victim perspective. Having a family member who needs assistance is a change in the dynamic. (To your D)You are supposed to be the one doing things for your D. Also, if a parent needs help- it's a stressful situation and the pwBPD might dysregulate.

To clarify- you aren't obligated to do things for your D- it's that if she perceives it this way, then if you need her assistance, it goes against her perception. Where I saw this happen is when my father, who was the main emotional support (and support in other ways too) for my BPD mother was the one needing assistance, her BPD behavior escalated. She was not able to help.

Having recently had the experience of my own parents needing assistance- it becomes more of a collaboration than parent- child. There needs to be mutual trust. Putting your well being in the hands of a pwBPD may compromise that. You are wise to look out for your well being.

[loveandsadness]

Thanks so much for your insights. They’ve certainly helped me feel less guilt. For years I’ve been in fear of her reactions as I worry about what she might potentially do, though now that she’s a mother I don’t think she would do anything to jeopardize her ability to raise and be with them.

My daughter is in therapy herself and for a few months, at my request and on my dime, we went to therapy together but it became clear that it was going nowhere and she expressed that it was taking time away from her ability to be with her children so we stopped. As for her therapy, I think she’s likely just looking for validation and is smart enough to disguise herself when she speaks with her therapist. Since writing my post I have reached out to her via text and email trying to acknowledge her feelings and my role in her unhappiness but haven’t received any response as yet. Additionally, my grandchildren, who previously called almost nightly for bedtime stories have not called at all.

I know staying the course of moving near our son is the best decision for us. Unfortunately,  my daughter wasn’t even willing to hear that the time split between staying near her and staying near him would be about 40/60 when now we’re only there near her 25% of the time, though I don’t think that would have be good enough anyhow. My grandchildren have no close, solid relationship to anyone other than my daughter at this point and I’m afraid that losing us so soon after their father left will be extremely damaging to them. I know if she continues in this direction that we can petition the court for visitation rights but if they’ve been poisoned against us I don’t know if that would be in their best interest.

I hope she comes around. I’m finding it unbelievably difficult to bear the loss.

I’m so glad I found this forum. The support you’ve given me truly helps and makes me feel less alone.

[Notwendy]

I hope she does too. If she's recently lost her husband, this is a stressful time for her.

I think a part of her reaction is the "shame" about something not being OK being brought to light- by your decision to move near your son and not her. But this reaction also confirms why you made the decision.

One of the unspoken "rules" in our family was to maintain the appearance that all was "normal" at home. We were not ever to mention there was anything "wrong" with BPD mother. BPD mother was able to "mask" her issues in public for the most part.

When my father needed assistance, the "normal" expected situation was that he was being cared for by his wife. But instead, at home, BPD mother was dysregulated.  Again, I think it is wise that you don't put yourself in a situation where this might happen.

Reading about the Karpman triangle can help you to understand the dynamics. BPD mother ( and I think pwBPD in general) perceived herself in victim perspective. Even if the motivation for a decision was not directly intended to hurt her, she could perceive it as her being attacked, and then retailiate in anger.

To your D, and truthfully- you chose the son as a more secure situation for you.  This is the reality of the situation. However, to your D, the other side of this is that she knows and you know, there are issues. She may feel shame at this. But compromising your own well being isn't a wise solution.

We had a lesser than this situation but it illustrated the feelings. My BPD mother disliked my father's family but we kids were close to them. She and my father's family were cordial to each other for the sake of my father. After he passed, I assumed they'd have little to do with each other. Some time later, they planned a family get together, and invited us kids but not BPD mother. We  knew she'd get upset to learn we were attending. We didn't want to hurt her feelings but we wanted to see them.

Understandably- she'd be upset that we made plans to visit them instead of coming to visit her. Also, by her not being included- brought to light the relationship.

She was very angry when we told her. But to not go to see them, in order to avoid her feeling this way would mean we'd miss out on seeing them.

How she expressed her feelings was not direct. (sometimes what is said as the reason isn't the actual reason). She said she was angry that she wasn't invited. This didn't make sense. I said "but you don't like them and you wouldn't have gone anyway" and she replied "but they should have invited me as your father's wife".

She then, said she wasn't going to speak to us. She also said she wasn't going to send my kids anymore presents for their birthdays. I told her that was OK- it wasn't about the presents for them anyway- we don't expect them. Several weeks later she called, acting normal, as if nothing had happened. I hope your D comes around too.

To make the comparison- your D did feel hurt at not being chosen. (but this was a choice in your best interest, just as we chose to visit my father's family- because we wanted to see them). It also brought to light there were issues- behavioral issues with your D, and in my situation- the strained relationship between my mother and my father's family. Neither decision was intended to be hurtful but to the pwBPD it felt that way, and they responded that way. Hopefully with your D, she will come around in time.