Going back to the house tonight...

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

I left last Thursday morning early. The night before that I was being threatened. Was told I needed the hell beat out of me several times. She told me that if people that she knows knew of the crap I pull with her that they would want to beat the hell out of me also.

I left for safety reasons. Did she hit me? no. Do I think she could snap and throw down on me? possible. She has hit me in the past but no punches just hard slaps to the side of the head, twice.

Our circumstances financially are forcing us to have to live under the same roof while we go through this "divorce". She has filed a divorce complaint but I have not been served yet. She doesn't know that I know that the papers are at the courthouse. My attorney found out for me, well the attorney I hope to hire (I have to come up with the money).

I am going to stay on this board for now since we are not split up and no papers have been served. It was filed on January 31 they are good for 90 days. I know she has sent the check for the remainder of the retainer. She must have called them and told them to hold the second check because she does not have the money yet.

Some of you know my story. This sure has been a rough journey. It has been so nice over the past week not having to be so careful as not to say the wrong thing or be looked as a troublemaker.

Will be back later, work is calling

BF

[byfaith]

I left last Thursday morning early. The night before that I was being threatened. Was told I needed the hell beat out of me several times. She told me that if people that she knows knew of the crap I pull with her that they would want to beat the hell out of me also.

I left for safety reasons. Did she hit me? no. Do I think she could snap and throw down on me? possible. She has hit me in the past but no punches just hard slaps to the side of the head, twice.

Our circumstances financially are forcing us to have to live under the same roof while we go through this "divorce". She has filed a divorce complaint but I have not been served yet. She doesn't know that I know that the papers are at the courthouse. My attorney found out for me, well the attorney I hope to hire (I have to come up with the money).

I am going to stay on this board for now since we are not split up and no papers have been served. It was filed on January 31 they are good for 90 days. I know she has sent the check for the remainder of the retainer. She must have called them and told them to hold the second check because she does not have the money yet.

Some of you know my story. This sure has been a rough journey. It has been so nice over the past week not having to be so careful as not to say the wrong thing or be looked as a troublemaker.

Will be back later, work is calling

BF

[KateCat]

byfaith, I have followed your story. (Ever since you mentioned that you were the sixth husband of this troubled woman. Your story has been a worrisome one from the beginning.)

You left the home for safety reasons. And I wonder if you should stay away now for the same reasons.

If your wife is both desperate and experienced at threatening men--and particularly if she sees you as a kind of "last chance" husband--then I wonder if you might need to put your safety even above finances for the moment.

Some men on this forum have found it takes only a moment and only an accusation from a mentally unbalanced wife for their own arrest. There are some stories over on the "Separating and Divorcing" forum.

ADDED: Just want to add that she may not "snap" in particular, but she may be in a strategizing mode, looking for the best financial package to emerge from this divorce. There are some cards she doesn't hold, as this is not a particularly long marriage and there are no children in common. But she might be able to try something else, like filing for exclusive possession of the marital residence, at least temporarily, if she alleges violence on your part. I sense danger.

[PFCI]

I left last Thursday morning early. The night before that I was being threatened. Was told I needed the hell beat out of me several times. She told me that if people that she knows knew of the crap I pull with her that they would want to beat the hell out of me also.

I left for safety reasons. Did she hit me? no. Do I think she could snap and throw down on me? possible. She has hit me in the past but no punches just hard slaps to the side of the head, twice.

Our circumstances financially are forcing us to have to live under the same roof while we go through this "divorce". She has filed a divorce complaint but I have not been served yet. She doesn't know that I know that the papers are at the courthouse. My attorney found out for me, well the attorney I hope to hire (I have to come up with the money).

I am going to stay on this board for now since we are not split up and no papers have been served. It was filed on January 31 they are good for 90 days. I know she has sent the check for the remainder of the retainer. She must have called them and told them to hold the second check because she does not have the money yet.

Some of you know my story. This sure has been a rough journey. It has been so nice over the past week not having to be so careful as not to say the wrong thing or be looked as a troublemaker.

Will be back later, work is calling

BF

My wife used to often hit me.  Eventually, I went to the police after she tried to kick me down the stairs, and filed a DV report.  I did this for 2 reasons. 

1.  To try and stop the violence.  It worked.  My wife was mortified by the police visit.  Hasn't touched me since.

2. In case we ever divorce.  I have photos of injuries, dated posts to social media showing my injuries, and a police report of DV.  If she claims anything (she might, she tried to to stop me leaving once), I have documented proof.  You should do the same. 

If she is violent, you need to be careful.  If you can't make her stop, leave if you can. 

Take care of yourself.

[Grey Kitty]

Was told I needed the hell beat out of me several times.

  Leaving when she is only threatening violence instead of waiting for her to hit you is an excellent decision!

Good luck... .and please find some way to pay your lawyer. I'd seriously suggest you post on the legal board here, to better understand your legal options, even while you continue posting about your relationship on this board.

[formflier]

Any chance that you have a recording of her threatening you?

Can you talk to the lawyer about protective orders and that kind of thing, based on her threats?

Do you have the recorder app on your phone?

If not... get it there asap.  Anytime you are in the house... .have it going.

If you do have a recording of her threatening you... .then we have to evaluate with the local DV guys how that is viewed in the local court systems.

Listen... you are a caring guy.  It's time to protect yourself 

Is your wife on deed to the house?  ON mortgage?

   

FF

[byfaith]

This evening it will be a week that I have been back to the house. So Thursday, Friday, Saturday were quiet. We just kept to ourselves. Sunday before I left

for church she said "Can I ask you a question?" My insides took a deep breath. If I would have taken a visible deep breath it would have set her off. I said yes but I am getting ready to walk out the door.

Do you want a divorce or not? I said well that is not something that can be discussed right at the moment. I will talk to you when I get home. She pushed for an answer and I said "I'm not sure" she was good with that

Got home and then we discussed it. I told her yes that I "wanted" a divorce. I put it this way, its not something I want but it's our only option. NOTE: she has divorce papers filed at the courthouse, they just have not been served to me yet.

then she went into a rant about how I wanted to save my previous marriage and I would have done anything to save it even though (my ex's name) was humping all over ( the guy my ex ran off with). She did this dramatic thing acting like me saying Oh it was the darkest day of my life. BUT I was was willing to just discard her like a piece of garbage. She said I knew it, I was just a rebound.
 
I said well if you want to bring the ex's into it we can and I named off her 5 previous. then she says oh so I guess you are going to go tell everyone how many times I have been married, I said no.

The dramatics died down, she cried.  Then she was "resigned" she told me she told me last week she hasn't wanted to be married to me for a long time now, she doesn't like me but she doesn't want to divorce me.

anyway Sunday calmed down I went for a hike. she asked me to pick up some hamburger at the store on the way home. on the way home I was getting texts

HER: When I said I did not want to be married to you anymore I was referring to the angry byfaith not the kind byfaith
We both stood before God and promised for better or worse. Then we listened to that song about the Holy Spirit. Was that just for show? Just something that sounded good at the time?
We were pronounced man and wife in the name of the father, the son and the Holy Spirit. How can we break that promise to God?
I guess I'm still needing some answers

I didn't answer the texts.

Ok sorry but I have to go, was on my break at work. I will continue this. There has been no physical threats BTW since I have been back.
   

[formflier]

How can we break that promise to God?   

"I will discuss this with you in MC.  I won't discuss the status of our marriage outside MC"... .or something like that.

While I understand why you did what you answered her... .and engaged in some drama (and I likely would have done so as well... )... .IF your goal was to help preserve your marriage... .giving her an answer after you told her you would do it later... .didn't help the dynamic.

The big picture here... is to leave the guilt, responsibility... .whatever of ending the marriage... .on her.  My guess is that her goal was to transfer some guilt to you (by her measuring system)... .and she accomplished that

All of this assumes that YOU DON'T WANT THE MARRIAGE to end.  Which is what I'm seeing. 

   

Hang in there... .

FF

[byfaith]

I went back to the house because it was ridiculous for me to be floating around somewhere when it's my house, that's what I told her the day before I came back. At this point FF if I saw any change that I thought could help keep the marriage together I would want to make it work.

I know this may sound selfish but I get nothing from this relationship. I have come to a place where I don't want to try any longer. We had been going to MC for a year. No improvement. We go and talk to the pastor and his wife no improvement. 

I still love and care for her but I don't want to do this the rest of my life. 

I will post more later. I am in a bad spot here. She is in a bad spot.

hangin' in.

[formflier]

 
Hang in there bud... .     

What does trying look like for you?  What would you "see" that would indicate she is trying. 

I think I know... .but want to make sure.

My encouragement to you... .is not to make it worse.  Perhaps another way of saying it... .regardless of how she acts... .keep your dignity and be true to yourself.

I also get it we are not perfect and will fall short.  Be kind to yourself... .

FF

[byfaith]

note to anyone that might read this post... .when referring to the son, that is my wife's son who lives with us 32 year old suffers with paranoid schizophrenia. His fixed delusion is that I have accused him of being a child molester.

I know this may sound selfish but I get nothing from this relationship. I have come to a place where I don't want to try any longer. We had been going to MC for a year. No improvement. We go and talk to the pastor and his wife no improvement. 

What does trying look like for you?

Trying on my part has been being patient and going to MC for over a year, she went also and going to pastor to get help. I have tried to make compromises in every aspect of our marriage.
They do not work out. example: the sex issue. To make the long story short I do not get what I need let alone what I want. From a christian standpoint it has put me into a deep spiritual battle let alone the physical aspect.
Trying to "understand" her relationship with her son. We literally have no privacy from him. She makes no attempt to achieve any.
I try, try to live my life without having her affect my happiness. While I was gone for a week I was "happy" in the fact I did not have to contend with her and him.
I have tried to use the communication set forth here on these boards. At times I succeed at times I don't succeed.
I try to envision a productive life going forward with her and I do not see it.

What would you "see" that would indicate she is trying. 

 
An attempt and a seen desire to spend quality time with me. Not just in the bedroom but as a husband and wife, separate from the son. (we spend plenty of time with him together)
She lets me know that I am a disappointment as christian leader. She is just projecting her self image onto me. She doesn't read her Bible, she does not attend church she does not have normal fellowship with other believers but yet judges other christians when they fall short of what she thinks a christian should be. I don't throw any of this up to her.
My wife has not touched or kissed me in a way that has showed me that she truly loves me in over 4 years. Just a touch that would make me feel like she truly cared.

these could be a start in "seeing". They are not happening

I used to care about what she thought of me. As it stands now I just try to be kind. I have not tried to put my arms around her or kiss her for almost a month. I don't tell her I love her anymore. That makes me sad. She doesn't tell me either.

We are just existing under the same roof, until I decide how to exit this marriage. Its' not a matter of do I want to or not but it's how do I do it? It's not that I "want" to but I believe it's the only option to lead a healthy life
 

[Notwendy]

Forgive me if I step over a line with religion ( as there are many ways to interpret religious ideals) but sex in marriage is sanctified. It is a blessing, a way to bond two people in an emotional and physical way. It isn't just sex. If it were just that, marriage would not be necessary. It is intimacy in the physical, emotional, and spiritual way. If it was just biology, you can take care of that yourself. But 4 years of being denied the entire scope of sex within the context of marriage isn't something I think (IMHO) God wants.

There are ways to embrace celibacy. One is to be single, become a monk, priest, or nun. But nowhere have I seen that celibacy in marriage is sanctified by religion. But sex in the context of religion is.  

Sometimes sex isn't possible, but two people can still be intimate, affectionate and close.

Although your wife's refusal to have sex or intimacy or affection with you in four years may have caused a spiritual conflict for you, I also do not believe this is kind to you, loving, or Christian. You too were made in the image of God and I think you have the right to honor yourself. There is nothing sinful in wanting intimacy with another human being in the context of your faith.

[byfaith]

Thanks NW,

My wife claims that she is "ok" with having sex but she just won't have sex with someone that she cannot get along with. She has made this claim in front of the MC and the pastor and his wife.

Only having sex 10 or 12 times in the past 4 years counts as celibate to me. The times we were together I did not feel an emotional or spiritual connection with her.

The following is not making any excuse for her:

The compromise I mentioned concerning sex was back at the beginning of Nov 2016. She came to me and told me that she felt sorry for me that I was being "denied" (I don't believe it now) I did back then.
She told me how much it stressed her if we were in the bedroom with the door closed and her son was up walking around the house. I'm talking 11:00pm-12:00am time frame. It would be nothing for him to knock on the door "needing" her for something.
 
So her "solution" was to wait until he goes to bed that way she won't be stressed. I was "ok" with it. Sometimes he would not go to bed until 2 or 3 in the morning. I even told her to wake me up if needed. We have been in separate bedrooms since last August.  Needless to say this compromise did not work out for numerous reasons. He would be up too late, then she would be too tired. She would end up falling asleep and he would still be up. He would end up going to bed a couple of times around 11 but then she would be mad at me for something. The list goes on.

The last 2 times we were together she insisted on covering parts of her body up. There has been no freedom in the marriage bed. I'm told that I complain and that I should take what I can get.

She uses my faith against me when it comes to this even though she claims to share the same faith. In Ephesians 5 it says that husbands should love their wives as Christ loved the church and gave himself for the church. That is supposed to hold true for me  BUT over in 1 Corinthians 7 it talks about the sexual relationship being sanctified by marriage that the husband and wife, their bodies belong to one another ( for anyone reading this post, please read the scripture as not to take this out of context)

I know my wife has a problem with sex even though she claims she does not. Then blames me for her not wanting to because I am not a nice person. I cannot fix her problem.

I am in limbo right now. I have divested myself emotionally from this marriage. I am now just trying to understand a way out with the least amount of conflict as possible.

Note: at present she is being nice to me, we are keeping everything on a superficial level. I am not showing any level of disappointment in the way things are because I have separated myself from her emotionally. I know things cannot remain this way. For right now there is no fighting. I need that for the moment.

 

[Grey Kitty]

When it comes to sex, my take is that (obviously), you have no right to force or coerce your wife if she doesn't want to--In other words, she has every right to choose celibacy for herself.

That said, she doesn't have the right to choose celibacy for you, and your faith doesn't allow you any "creative" ways to get around this and stay in your marriage.

And if this was all she did to you, it might not be enough to push you out of your marriage... .but it isn't all she does to you!


It seems to me that this "limbo" of her having filed for divorce, but not moving forward, not having you served is a really uncomfortable place for you, and is keeping you from living your life the way you should be living it--first as a single guy, then finding a new, healthier relationship when you are ready.

Can you talk to your lawyer about filing for divorce yourself and having her served, to move forward?

[formflier]

Can you have your lawyer go to courthouse and "accept" service and move forward?

No idea... but good to ask.

Have you ever read "love must be tough" by Dobson.  Title may be off a bit... .google and you can find it.

Very good Christian perspective of "standing up for yourself"... .and how to communicate that.

Basic thing:  If your wife is not able to have any boundaries with her son (and therefore boundaries between the marriage and the son)... .you are not going to experience the marriage you want.

Do I pretty much have it?

This would be with sex, time together... etc etc.

Dude... .very reasonable request.  Just this morning my wife and I spent 3 hours or so away from the house... .breakfast, shopping... talking... no hurry.  It is spring break... .she was in good mood... .great time to catch up and talk.

Anyway... .time like that "on your terms" is critical for the marriage to continue.

The Dobson book will help you communicate that.  That book also encourages people to take steps along with the communication.

And it may not work... .  She may choose her son. 

That is not a Biblical choice, not a Christian choice... .  In fact, I'm not aware of any worldview that would support that choice.

Still... it's her choice to make.

 

FF

[byfaith]

my lawyer... .at the moment I have no way to fund an attorney. I have consulted with one. I am in a serious bind financially. Some of it my fault, some I can blame others and some of it is life happens.  I will email him that question about going to courthouse and accepting service. When I find a path to getting the money for an attorney I will probably be the one filing.

I found the book. I downloaded a sample on ibooks. I will probably buy it. To be honest I have read so many books on marriage, personal inventory, these boards, MC and personal counceling etc over the past 4.5 years I am burned out after seeing "no progress" in the marriage.  I see myself more clearly now, that is progress to me as far as me goes.

Basic thing:  If your wife is not able to have any boundaries with her son (and therefore boundaries between the marriage and the son)... .you are not going to experience the marriage you want.

Do I pretty much have it?

This would be with sex, time together... etc etc.

Dude... .very reasonable request.

Correct, and even if we got past that she has other issues that run deep. It has to do with men and being intimate.

I have communicated the need for our time together throughout our marriage in every way possible... .she has made her choice. I try not to even look at it as her "chosing" her son over me. I just see it as her not chosing to do what is needed to keep our marriage together (as far as an emotional, spiritual and physical bond) goes. Our marriage exists on a piece of paper at the courthouse.

At the beginning of March I tried to discuss with her the possibility of setting up the upstairs and downstairs as separate residences in order for us to have a level of privacy. The conversation didn't last 5 minutes before she made it sound like I wanted to lock him in his room downstairs, so I just exited the conversation.

anyway you get the idea   

[formflier]

Quick cliff notes:  The point of that Dobson book is to help a Christian do "tough love".  Which... .lot's of Christians struggle with, because it is seen as "mean"... .or "selfish"... .or "prideful".  And sometimes it can be.

He helps focus a message... .and then focuses on respect... .for yourself and for the other person's choices... .to include consequences of those choices.

Mainly the book is about cheaters (broad overview)... .but the basic message is about what to do when the marriage covenant is set aside... .willfully... .by one party... and the other party wants to "make it work".

"Giving in"... .is the wrong answer... .because the person setting aside the marriage covenant, then sees the person giving in and looses respect... .which reinforces there is no reason to honor the marriage covenant, because I don't respect my partner... .which leads to more giving in... and more loss of respect... .the cycle continues.

My hope in you reading this book is that you can see yourself some... .and learn to send a clear message... .and take action to support it.  

FF

[Grey Kitty]

my lawyer... .at the moment I have no way to fund an attorney. I have consulted with one. I am in a serious bind financially. Some of it my fault, some I can blame others and some of it is life happens.  I will email him that question about going to courthouse and accepting service.

Are you and your wife collectively flat broke, with all credit maxed out?

Is she the only one with income, and does it go into an account you don't have access to?

Do you personally have any friends or family that could give/loan you money to get out of this? It seems like a really bad place to be trapped!

Is there no way you can come up with a few thousand dollars for legal fees?

Can you be more specific on the bind you are in; perhaps we can help you see a way out.

When I find a path to getting the money for an attorney I will probably be the one filing.

I do see a point there--As the saying goes, don't bring a knife to a gunfight. So waiting to take legal actions until you have competent legal representation sounds reasonable.

OTOH, long-term delays being stuck living with your wife as things are is really harming you, far more than you are aware. The FOG just settles in, and the life and energy kinda squeezes out of you. Only after you've been out of it for a while will you realize how bad it really is!