BPD fiancé want open relationship

[Khusban]

Hi,
I have been reading this forum for guidance for sometime now and now have entered into a situation that I need to seek assistance in understanding.

My (ex)fiancé is BPD, we have had our fair share of problems as a result over the course of our four and a half year relationship. In our time together we have had to children, both boys, and we have been cops renting her now 16 year old son(from a teenage pregnancy).
A couple of months back things reached a tipping point for her I guess you could say and she decided it was over. Two months prior we had finally set our wedding date and begun planning it out. Over the course of the five month prior to the break up she had been developing a friendship with another guy. The week following her decision to end us she was already beginning a relationship with this man(who is himself in a relationship with a child on the way). We remained separated for a little over a month when she decided we were worth trying again.
For a month and a half now things have been great, she is telling me that she is seeing what we could have always been, we have been talking about a time frame for the baby we had been planning when everything came crashing down and we had again begun to prep for our coming wedding date.
Now the trouble, she can't shake the feeling for the guy she was with during our separation. They saw each other and now she believes the only way she can move forward is by seeing where that relationship might go. Resultingly she has told me she wants us to have an open relationship. It cause us some problems in me trying to understand and she went as far as to tell me she should have just let it happen and not told me.
I love this girl with all there is, and I want nothing more than to still marry her. But I just don't know how to handle this.

I'm hoping someone can please give some insight.
Thank you

[DaddyBear77]

Hello Khusban and welcome to the bpdfamily

I'm really sorry to hear about what you're going through. It sounds like you really care a lot about your pwBPD (person with BPD) and you're trying really hard to make things work.

Having an open relationship works for some couples - I know a couple for whom it seems to be a mutually acceptable thing. But I think the success of an open relationship depends a LOT on building trust within your primary relationship, and it takes a LOT of honest communication about boundaries, what each of you is comfortable with, etc, etc. These are all things that tend to be very difficult to establish in a relationship with a pwBPD. I'm not saying it can't work, but be very aware of how difficult it would be if you decide to pursue this path.

How do YOU feel about an open relationship? Is that something you would be willing to accept? Are you able to have really hard conversations with your pwBPD and openly discuss what is and isn't acceptable? Is she willing to respect those boundaries and communicate openly with you?

I will also share a little about my own story - my pwBPD also came to me with similar feelings - she couldn't get this "other guy" out of her head. She brought it up a couple times right before and right after we got married. Things between us got really difficult and instead of asking for an open relationship, she asked to end our relationship so that she could pursue another. I was devastated and hurt, but I also respect her more for having been honest about what she was really looking for, which was to start something new and novel and NOT involving more than just her and him. It turned out that after a couple of years, we got back together, and I'm not sure that would have happened if she hadn't been honest.

Tell us more about how YOU feel about all this. It's really hard for us to get to the bottom of how WE really feel, so I hope you can share some of that here and maybe even learn a little about yourself, too.

~DaddyBear77

[Notwendy]

I agree that is it important for you to decide if an open relationship is OK with you. If you agree just for her sake, yet know that it isn't something you can handle, then it could be difficult for you.

I don't want one. I know personally that this is not something I could agree to so I would not be able to honestly say "yes" if asked to be in one. I have also known people who agree with it in theory, but when they actually experience the emotions that go along with having a partner openly in a relationship with someone else, decide they don't like it.

In general, I have heard these kinds of relationships take more of what is needed for any relationship: more effective communication, the ability to manage ones own difficult emotions such as jealousy, more honesty about the other relationships. These are things that are difficult even for people who don't have a disorder, so I imagine they would be more difficult for someone with BPD.

Having read some posts about open relationships on these boards, they seem to be on the line of the person with BPD proposes the idea, not the partner. The partner agrees in theory but is actually bothered by it and isn't being true to his/her values. The pwBPD is OK with having the open relationship with two or more people. However, I have seen an incident where the partner takes on someone else, and the pwBPD has a very difficult time with it. One thought is that it seems to be OK for the person who wants it so long as they do it, but not if the other person does it.

Be true to yourself whatever you agree on. Know that what seems OK in theory may feel differently when being involved in it to both people.

[Khusban]

Thank you for the responses.

Personally, I am not ok with an open relationship. But in a sense I understand where she is in her thinking. I understand that we separated and she developed feelings for someone else in that time, and that just letting go is hard for her.

I really do love her. Like nothing else, and do not want to lose what we have. It's hard for me comprehend how we got back together and it was like we were right back on track for what we had planned, wedding in five months time and to start trying for a mother baby soon as well. She wanted it, and pushing forward towards it and then on the same day she is making purchases for our wedding, he contacts her and the entire table has turned. Now she says she needs time and to see what those feeling really are. I guess I just don't understand how she can switch like that so easily. Or tell me that it would have been better had she not told me and done it, and let it work its course.
 
I don't want to lose her, and though it may sound foolish I do believe this will pass and her and I will mend our relationship but I'm afraid of at what cost, to both her and I, and our children. I feel she is living the honeymoon right now with this guy and though she has told me she knows he is going to hurt her, and is aware that he is cheating on his pregant fiance at he moment, it doesn't seem to bother her that much.

I feel what hurts me most and makes understanding what to do the hardest is I always want to believe her. I might just be that fool in love that wants to believe she is always telling me the truth. I can't wrap my head around the jumping back into planning your wedding and extending our family, to instantly putting it on the shelf and wanting an open relationship so she can figure it out.

On the other side of it, I know I would never be with someone else during all this. And not just because I know the damage it would cause her if things work out as I hope and we mend this in the end and get married, but because I honestly just don't want anyone but her in my life. I know between the BPD and her constant fears of not being good enough or needing to compare herself to others, me having a relation with someone else would destroy us. She wouldn't be able to handle it.

Anyways, that's a little more insight into how I am feeling I guess. Maybe the word is hopefull, or maybe foolish. I don't know

[HopefulDad]

Be wary of trying to paint this as a BPD issue; This is a trap that is very easy for us nons to do.  There are plenty of people in this world who want open relationships and do not suffer PDs.

She told you she wants an open relationship.  Take that at face value.  Decide if this is a dealbreaker for you.  Be very clear to yourself what you want.  Don't try to talk yourself into an open relationship in order to keep her when deep down you know this will be very painful.  Also, should she change her mind now, will you spend the rest of your time with her waiting for the other shoe to drop and she wants to go back to an open relationship?

Good luck.

[Khusban]

Thank you Hopefuldad,

I had considered this. But from the beginning of the relationship she told me what her history is like. She would cut and run from relationship at the first sign of conflict, never taking the time to solve or mend a relation. Or she would cheat to kick herself in the butt to end it or them to end it. His was an old pattern of hers. Prior to our relationship, 4 and a half years, she had never been with anyone more than a year.
Why I say I understand a little where this idea is coming from is because when we separated, she was dead certain it would never be again. She claimed she was ready for everything that was to come, separating the kids, selling our home, taking all the losses, everything. We were in this process as she was cultivating this new relationship. But at home I was persistent in trying to remind her of what we were and had together. What made us that couple that was planning wo marry lass than a year from then. She then chose one day that yes we would try again, and I guess things quickly flooded back to her and we were right back in the relationship highway. Then this guy popped back in and her need to know and not have 'unfinished business' surfaced.
I feel I need to stay positive and believe that she will continue to see what we hold together. But a life long open relationship is not in the cards for me. It is not the image I want for my boys and I know at a point I won't be able to be the father they need if I am consumed by these other things.

[HopefulDad]

"I had considered this.  But... ."

You can psychoanalyze your fiancee until the cows come home.  Maybe you're right, maybe you're wrong and more likely the truth is somewhere in the middle.  In the meantime, you're looking at an open relationship.  Sometimes you just have to put aside the rationalizations and look at what's in front of you.

[Notwendy]

One thing you can do is put off the wedding ( you don't need to be unengaged, just don't have date, or you can stop the engagement) and most important: put off having the baby, until this thing plays out.

You can agree or not agree to her idea of an open relationship, but if she wants to see where the relationship goes with this other man, then this is her choice.

This actually makes sense- BPD or not. A couple has a plan to get married. Then one of them realizes they have feelings for someone else. Better to know this now than after being married and making a baby.

Seems you have some choices here:

Not be a couple ( call off engagement)  while she sorts things out and figures out what she wants with this guy and/or you.

Continue to see her while she also sees him. (open relationship). Decide to get married anyway or not.

Decide the relationship is off altogether ( I don't think you want to do this, but it is an option).

For me, the larger consideration here is the baby planning. The two of you and your existing children are already involved in this relationship that is uncertain at the moment. Bringing a baby into the world before this is settled ( if it can be settled )won't make things easier or better for either of you. In addition, if you do make a baby would you know who the father is?  

[Khusban]

Thanks notwendy,

I'm worried to make any drastic changes to her life like cancelling the weeding date. We are both aware it may not happen, but I don't want to our right say it. I feel the same regarding having more children. I want them, I know she does as well, so our right stating it isn't going to happen is something I can't do. I know how either of these situations will cause her to react. Either she will believe I am no longer wanting things that I have so vividly expressed to her, or she will feel like I am abandoning her.  And in turn, as her past dictates, that will be the end with no turning back. Once hurt always hurt. The smallest scars still hurt her like a piano has fallen in her at times.

I am aware of the options, I just don't know how to handle myself while figuring out what I can handle, if that makes sense. I don't want to make a drastic dessision and regret it for the rest of my life, even though I know she already has on her end of this.

And to lessen your concern, no I would not go forth with making a baby if things weren't certain. If we aren't on stable  ground there will not be a wedding or baby. We can wait on the both of those. I just worry if she jumps back to being fully in on us and she is back as quickly into wanting these things right back as they were being planned, how will she react when I tell her I need time to recover myself from this first.

[Notwendy]

I understand your concerns about upsetting her. I hope though in the long run, that you do pay attention to your own feelings and values. Some people may choose an open relationship, for others it is a deal breaker. You seem ambivalent at the moment.

There aren't really any rules about open relationships ( other than religious ones for people who adhere to them). However, one good "rule" about anything is to pay attention to your feelings. You are thinking about her, but you can also think about you and how you feel as this plays out.

[Khusban]

That's how I am currently feeling , like I need to asses as it plays out. Like I stated earlier I believe in the end we will find our relationship again. But as time passes I will need to see how I am on a personal level and remember I have three chirldren who need me to be there in my best capacity. I love their mom but understand that at a point I will have to decided if this is lessening my ability as a parent.
I know this weigh on her heavily and believe she will realize that this is in fact not what she wants with time. But I don't know to what extent the damage it will do will reach. I know what she is decided is better than the alternative, in being cheated on, even though she thinks it would have been better off to keep it from me. But in the end I fear if she does chose me and our family to just be our single unit, I feel she will want this to be as if nothing has happened and have everything return back to how we were prior to her deciding this. I don't think she realizes that as much as I love her and want us to remain together until the end, this will scar me for the rest of my life, even if nothing happens on her end, the mental damage it has already done will stay with me forever.
The worst in this is I fear she is being manipulated by this other guy. He has experience with a BPD fiancé at home, who he has no problem with cheating on while she raises his two other children and is pregnant with another one. She has told me she has been warned by others of what he will do to her, and cheating is his thing. She doesn't understand that she what she is a part of now, will no doubt be her own future. It pains me to know I will be picking these pieces one day to help her, regardless of how damaged it makes me in the process just because I love her so.

[Khusban]

Update on my situation

I found out today, that yes the open relationship has started. My BPDgf (I guess I call her that now), has begun seeing the other guy as well as maintaining a relationship with me.
Now that it is more than an idea, I have taken some advise from here and made my current feelings very clear. I love her and am willing to try this if she feels it is truly something she must get past, but I told her if it begins to affect my personal health or mr my ability to parent our three boys properly I will need to reassess everything.
But today held some interesting situations that confuse me. When this all came to head, we were in the process of refinancing our mortgage (something we must do regardless of future outcomes) and about to embark on some large scale renovations to our house. She is still pushing hard to do the renovations(kitchen) and fill all of the refinancing documents asap, though we are not in a rush. She is trapped up in all of this like nothing is going on outside of it. Now of course I have told her we have to wait to begin moving forward on any large scale renos or things like that. So much so that I told her that some extra money had for this would now have to go into a account that requires us both to sign off on things. I told her I don't want her to think I am baking down on our plans, which I'm not exactly, and that we can continue the planning process and assessing everything and she seems fine with that for now, but at the same time seems upset by it.
This confuses me because she is wanting to do things with me that are long term investment things, life building things. Yet she still wants to have this other person in a relationship with her.
This afternoon I tried to express to her what she was involving herself in, being with someone who is cheating on their pregnant fiancé and that has a history of this, and didn't seem to faze her. I think she believes she's the one where it will be different. She expressed to me that she doesn't know what to do in anything now and is just searching for the highs she needs to feel good and that she gets him because he is the same. I asked her what happens when the high that is cheating on his fiancé with you becomes cheating on you. She doesn't see what she is involved in.
She had a break down this evening telling me she knows she needs help. I want to help her, she thinks it is hopeless and that because all of the times she has tried to get help have failed the next one willl let her down as well. The first thing I told her after us talking about getting her help was that she needs to stop what is going on if she knows Something is wrong before she damages us and her family more. Again she seems unfazed.

Sorry that this was all over the place. I'm sorta messed up trying to recount the whole situation after how to makes me feel.
Thanks for the support

[HopefulDad]

Good luck while you sort this out.  Think long and hard about any resentment you may have towards her if this is one-sided (only her having relations with others) or even if she decides to re-commit to you... .perhaps you'll never look at her the same again.  Be honest with yourself and don't try to talk yourself into things you know deep down won't work for you.

Maybe this is a weakness of character of mine, but I wouldn't want any friends or family to think of me as a cuckold.  Whether it's fair or not, you will be looked at by some, if not most, in this manner, especially if she keeps sleeping with other(s).  You really need to be okay with this or else it will eat you up.

[Turkish]

She expressed to me that she doesn't know what to do in anything now and is just searching for the highs she needs to feel good

This is the heart of BPD. At least she's honest. Insight and self-awareness, however,  aren't healing.  BPD is an attachment based disorder, and pwBPD have difficulty regulating their emotions. She's right: searching for soothing behavior is what she's doing (similar to the past cutting). She searches for soothing to regain that lost early childhood attachment (likely) that originally caused her core pain. One professional refers to pwBPD as "abused children all grown up."

This is even more difficult given the kids,  and also that she's not overtly abusive (is she?). So, as others have said,  and you also,  what is acceptable to you? What are your boundaries,  based upon your personal values,  not hers?

This discussion might help you relating boundaries to your core values: 1.08 | Boundaries - examples

My ex conducted a r/s outside of our home.  Different from your situation,  she didn't desire any further romantic r/s with me,  but seemed ok with living with me for some indefinite amount of time,  while "phoning it in" as a mother to then D1 and S3.

For me it was like this:

Value:   A romantic relationship (and definitely a marriage) should be monogamous,  especially if children are involved. It would hurt me,  and twist the kids.
Boundary: I will not be part of a faux relationship or marriage as this is unacceptable to me.
Action:   Ask tell her to move out and pursue her needs as an independent entity, free to make her own choices (freeing me, and also her).

And I did.

[Grey Kitty]

I've been in an open relationship. I've also found that it can work for me, and know a few things about how to make it work. That doesn't mean that it can work well for you, and it doesn't mean it can work well with you and your BPDgf either.

Unfortunately for you, the nature of BPD is that close intimate relationships are something that she can't do well--she does things that damage or blow up relationships... .if you did decide that you could accept the open relationship, she is likely to continue all the same bad behavior she's done with you anyways... .and also likely to give her other lover a similar (but not identical) treatment.

She's likely to paint one of you white and paint the other one black... .then swap roles, rather than painting you both black at the same time, for example.

BTW, just to be clear--is she living with you in the same house, which the two of you jointly own today?