Boundaries instead of stonewalling?

[impromptus]

 

Hey there, thanks for having me here!
I'm in a relationship with a BPD. We're together about 2.5 years and there are currently quite a lot more downs than ups, unfortunately. She has lost her father around 3 years ago and her mother last year.
 
I struggle with keeping my own emotional balance at the moment, as it seems that when I 'patch' one vulnerability of mine, another one is found immediately. Pardon the geek talk but this analogy with software and operating systems is somewhat helpful to me.
It seems she is able to find my weak spots without fail and especially without conscious effort, which makes it ever so difficult to talk about that.

Actually, talking (about emotions or life choices or anything important, really) has proven to be extremely difficult.
Somehow everything I say she hears as a blame, without question and without checking. My efforts to correct that misinterpretation are fruitless, because they too are only experienced as my efforts to tell her how she does everything wrong.
My appeals to logic and reason are futile as well, asking her how likely she thinks it would be, or how statistically probable, that everything I say is meant to harm her in some way. If she is (relatively) low on stress she will agree and say she knows I mean well.
But come the next conflict, that's all out the window and I am treated as a prime enemy again.

So back to the topic title.
In these conflict situations regularly feel like a desperate actor in a poorly written soap opera, as the inevitable outcome is that we are farther apart and she can feel like she cannot rely on anyone but herself.
I want to be clear with her (and myself) in my boundaries, without losing myself in emotions and rages that aren't mine, and without treating her like a toddler. She doesn't particularly like to be confronted with her BPD symptoms (she has the diag and is in therapy), she will either deny them or say she does not do these things knowingly, depending on context. This leaves me with few options to discuss these issues.

I'd love to find a way to keep our relationship going (and make it healthier even), even if I can only have control over my part ( instead of playing someone else's ).

Man, long introductory post. Hope someone reads it and maybe has some tip for me. Thanks in advance 

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[AnuDay]

You are not in dire straits.  Please read the Lessons here in the Lessons section.  You MAY be able to fix this.  You are in the devaluation stage of the relationship.  How long you can last in this stage is anybodys guess.  She may dump you tomorrow.  From what I have learned your best hope is to get recycled.  To initiate the recycle phase something horrible has to happen as a result of rage or her actions to get you to renew the relationship and fall back into the idealization stage.  Some sort of trigger is needed.  And yes, at this point in the relationship you do need to treat her like a toddler.  Sheneeds that, enjoys that, and longs for that much needed attention.  You need a lot of time and energy to maintain these BPD relationshps.  Do some more reading on here and welcome to the club.

[Mutt]

Hi impromptus,

I want to be clear with her (and myself) in my boundaries, without losing myself in emotions and rages that aren't mine, and without treating her like a toddler. She doesn't particularly like to be confronted with her BPD symptoms (she has the diag and is in therapy), she will either deny them or say she does not do these things knowingly, depending on context. This leaves me with few options to discuss these issues.

Is like to join AnuDay and welcome you to bpdfamily, I'm sorry to hear that you're going through a difficult time in your r/s. I'm glad that you decided to join us there is hope.

I could be getting the context wrong from your statement about setting boundaries on her, I just wanted to let you know that there are only two things that we can control and those are our thoughts and feelings. It's great to hear that you want to take responsibility of the r/s and change the things that you can change. We don't set the boundary on somebody else we set the boundary on ourselves, if she does X, I respond with Y. That being said.

What are the issues that you're both struggling with?

[impromptus]

Thank you both for taking the time to reply.
I am certainly going to read more lessons here, thanks for that suggestion. And I'll  re-read parts of Stopwalkingoneggshells, too.

And Mutt, I am only setting my own boundaries, not hers. You're very right that we can only control ourselves.
To communicate my personal boundaries when she tramples over them is my objective. And also to distinguish between her and myself, as that is something she struggles with regularly. She does not always see where her emotions end, then start blaming me for things that really are hers and not mine.
It has gotten a lot easier for me to recognize that scenario but sometimes I too get confused and can be swept up by the raging emotional storm. Being blamed, especially when it rubs sore spots (of course, often it does ), and I find myself in an anger that does not really feel like it's my own, if that makes any sense.

The biggest issue we are facing in my opinion is that we seem to be unable to talk without her feelings getting hurt and stop talking.
She will feel like there is no room for her in the conversation when literally (yes, literally) all I have done is ask her to elaborate, go into a bit more depth.

I hope the lessons will help us turn it around and I'll look in to the 'recycle' theory as well, sounds interesting.

[AnuDay]

Maybe talking about her feelings makes her feel shameful. She probably doesnt have the vocabulary to explain her feelings. She probably doesnt understand her feelings.  You will see it often on this site, pwBPD do not have high levels of emotional maturity.

  You set the boundaries to protect yourself.  2.5 years in, you may still be able to save yourself.  The disaster comes when YOU lose your sense of self trying to maintain an unhealthy relationship.  Set your boundaries and remember them. 

[impromptus]

Maybe talking about her feelings makes her feel shameful. She probably doesnt have the vocabulary to explain her feelings. She probably doesnt understand her feelings.  You will see it often on this site, pwBPD do not have high levels of emotional maturity.

  You set the boundaries to protect yourself.  2.5 years in, you may still be able to save yourself.  The disaster comes when YOU lose your sense of self trying to maintain an unhealthy relationship.  Set your boundaries and remember them.  

This is definitely true (and pretty difficult). She does lack the vocabulary and does not realize this. So while she makes little sense and takes emotional (and logical) shortcuts,  is convinced she is being clear, consistent and concise.

Then when I hurt from not being able to wrap my head around what she's trying to say, she'll tell me I really need therapy to deal with my issues because of reasons. I just feel like that is a tactic to 'offload' issues onto me so she can somehow 'share responsibility' for the emotional instability... .

Good advice on the boundaries,  I am taking time to find and protect them, trying to unmesh some, reinstating them. Not easy, not easy at all!

[impromptus]

Oh man... .

I have given up... .

Not possible to talk.to her at all. Now that I have taken steps back to not engage, not accept her blame and stop frustrating over her allegations,  she responds by 'choosing herself and no longer being pushed into the corner'. Telling me how grown up she is while at the same time telling me that I have to stop.talking to her because she gets stressed out, then a few minutes later saying she only said she did not want to talk anymore and that had no influence on me.
Just a complete alternate reality to mine.

She says she is so happy that she can stay calm but I only see the underlying current of destruction,  raging to obliterate everything that is good, or nice, or even just barely acceptable. It all has to go.

I think this is just to protect the ( flawed, AFAIK) logic that because she hears me say she isn't good enough *I must think that*.

I keep going back to my chronic fatigue syndrome: as long as I accept that I have limited amounts of energy, I can accept help from those around me. But if I act as though I am Superman, that all changes and people will be less than understanding about my shortcomings.
but she seems to believe that because she wants it, she can will her behavior how she wants to, by herself.  And when I tell her I see something quite different unfolding, I get the blame. My analysis does not correspond with hers, so I must be wrong and broken.

Awful. Just awful.
I don't want to end it just before she starts this 10 month treatment. I think this whole tantrum is one big resistance against the possibility that I could see she needs help. Shes always so furious when there's even a hint of her not being completely selfsufficient. She'd rather break me so hard that I have to choose the exit. And at the same time she's mad at me for suggesting that it's the BPD talking, asking her to trust me for just an instant, not treating me as the enemy that should be annihilated.

UGHH.

[AnuDay]

You are in trouble.  She has detached and has disassociated.  Nothing you say will make a difference.  All you can do is take steps to protect your personal boundaries and your emotional health.  Yes, sounds like she is in full destruction mode.  Do you have a crisis hotline?

[impromptus]

You are in trouble.  She has detached and has disassociated.  Nothing you say will make a difference.  All you can do is take steps to protect your personal boundaries and your emotional health.  Yes, sounds like she is in full destruction mode.  Do you have a crisis hotline?

It certainly looks like destruction mode to me, too.

I have no crisis hotline, do you mean like friends or family to call on? Or a professional hotline?
We do have couple's therapy tomorrow, so I am hoping she can keep from playing nice there :D.

[AnuDay]

It certainly looks like destruction mode to me, too.

I have no crisis hotline, do you mean like friends or family to call on? Or a professional hotline?
We do have couple's therapy tomorrow, so I am hoping she can keep from playing nice there :D.

You need a public mental health crisis line.  Mine plays nice before counseling and on days where she needs me to do something... .recognize the manipulation

[impromptus]

You need a public mental health crisis line.  Mine plays nice before counseling and on days where she needs me to do something... .recognize the manipulation

Oh yes, that's very relateable. Things aren't as bad on Sundays and Mondays, usually, and when we're in therapy there's no real drama. But at this moment, she's too stressed out to keep her composure towards me. With our therapist she was more or less composed.
Hell, she called her psychiatrist to order new meds and told him things are alright. When I later told her I find that a bit puzzling, she said that 'given the circumstances she is alright'. Sure, given the circumstances jumping off a cliff may still be considered 'a moderate reaction to the amount of stress' but I would hardly call it 'alright' :'.
Then our therapist, who at the beginning said he has extensive BPD experience, reacted to my "I see a BPD in crisis / extreme stress / flight & destruct mode", reacted by saying he isn't big on 'diagnoses', instead looks at the person. Well sure, look at the person all you want instead of looking for abbreviations or traits. But if BPD explains the behaviour, then we might as well call it BPD and see if it helps us cope, understand and love the human showing that behaviour.

Well, I have no hotline of any sort that I know of.
I have, however, taken the very clear position of not accepting drama. First in therapy, where I told her I will no longer accept this relationship because I choose against losing myself in it. I also made it as clear as I could that I love her and wish to be with her, just in a relationship that is striving for mutual respect, defineable boundaries, other rather grownup things. Man I feel old writing this... .At this moment we just can't talk about emotions, because as soon as something isn't as smooth she feels like there is no room for her.
I understand that, as my logic would say "if feelings are reality, then questions about what is behind those feelings, what drives them, potentially tear up the fabric of that reality."

Anyway, I have been clear: not this kind of relationship anymore.
I asked her if she'd join me to the very nearby shops, she said no. Then she said she experiences extreme disapproval and she does not want me to judge her in that way and more in the same vein of reasoning, tying her feelings directly to my behaviour.
I find that unacceptable in the sense that I do not accept responsibility for her feelings and I do not accept that she behaves like that. I told her first that I was only mildly disappointed and that I am not responsible for her feelings. Didn't help her much.
Then I told her to "get used to it". This of course ignited her (I can't say this was a surprise), but it was quite obvious that she got the message that she will not dump this on me. She then proceded to tell me she needs to find her own place because she does not fit into the relationship, there is no room for her emotionally, etcetera. I stood my ground, told her that if she needs to leave, well, she needs to leave but not tell me that it's because I expressed mild disappointment, told her I love her and want to be with her, worked to not end the conversation on a negative note but without engaging (yes, I am very proud of myself to have succeeded here). Then I went outside into sunny weather, did some grocery shopping, bought her a can of soda she loves.
Later in the evening she realigned slightly, opening up for conversation. It seems she does not want to leave (this much was obvious), is very stressed because of the looming treatment (obvious as well). Didn't go so far as that she admitted her behaviour wasn't quite exemplary though but given the circumstances I would not expect that.

So I would not say it's great but I feel good about my part. I haven't read up on "detaching with love" but so far I'd expect this to be my best effort at it :P.

[impromptus]

Right, that's that.

I felt like she put drama in front of me just to see if I would care enough to respect her wish. A test. When I asked her about details, it quickly unraveled and she started blurting out that she did not want to talk. I asked her if she could focus on the positive, that I want to improve the house at the moment (I know for a fact that she also wants this particular change, as we had already talked about it). Shortly after she just packed her bag and left, as I did not shut up like a good [whatever] should when his girlfriend demands that.
I sent her a message saying there will soon be a time that I will not let you back into my life after she's left again.
My patience with that sort of behaviour is wearing very thin, I do not find it acceptable.

I started (and finished) making dinner.

After a while she came back and went straight past me to another room. When I went after her, she only kept repeating over and over and over "this is my boundary, I want to be alone, this is my boundary and I want to be left alone". Without end. I told her she could either act maturely or the relationship is really over. I will not have it anymore. I am not mad in any way, I am a little sad but since this is no surprise anymore, I can't take anything personal anymore. This is my boundary and I will leave her alone alright... .

So I left the room, ate my dinner.

An hour later I went to her again, told her this would be the last time I approach her. She only kept repeating the previous mantra. I told her again, this really is the last time, either act like an adult partner, see that I am here, that she is not the only one in this relationship, not the only one facing this conflict. Or, not act like an adult and face the consequences. The way the relationship is at this moment, there is no room for this kind of crap. Again I am sad but realistic and not angry, as far as I can feel anyway. She kept wanting to stress how that would be my choice. I told her it's really her decision to withdraw at this time, she disagreed.
And sure, I understand that maybe she is "unable" to act any different. But that does not mean I can keep being the buffer, the punching bag. There's an end.
Well, maybe after she's done therapy she realizes what she's done and lost. Or maybe not.

Strangest thing (and a bit amusing, I find) is that hardly anything changes.
- Sex? Virtually non-existent anyway for the last, well, ehm, damn. About a year and a half? Out of two and a half, not a very good score, eh? I may be using a wheelchair when I'm outside the house (mostly) but damn, on the open market I could hardly do worse, man. What a farce!
- Emotional intimacy? Non-existent.
- Feeling of togetherness? Nope.
-  

Anyway, thanks for some advice. It really helped me quickly assess the situation, define lack of "ego strength" and "personal boundaries" as my main exploitabilities and fix those holes (well, as best I could within the week :P).