Can anyone give me advice on how to continue with no/low contact

[Veryconfuseduk32]

It's a tough one. She started saying she feels really bad, I said not to, said to have a nice evening and that we'd have a chat at some point. She said "you too and that sounds good." I'm struggling a little with this because I don't know what to think or what to do.

Mod Note: this thread has been split from So confused... . to continue the discussion

[Veryconfuseduk32]

I'm stuck on how I deal with this. We had a bit of a joke and a laugh on messenger earlier which was nice. Then she made a rediculous reason to come to my desk ("someone had a customer through that you've been dealing with but she doesn't know who you are so I've come over for her" just - it seems like - to talk to me. I want us to get on but this just feels pretty awkward. If she wants to talk to me she can talk to me whenever she wants, but she seems to be prefer to make excuses to come rather than just coming over and saying hi. I don't get it.

[Veryconfuseduk32]

I need a bit of advice now really. Kinda struggling because I don't know where she's coming from. She tries every opportunity to come see me at work (finding any work related reason to come talk to me - most staff never come over to our department, she's been over at least once every day since she came back and was never over when I was off. She is also coming over on behalf of other staff now, which she shouldn't do.), said we should still go to the gym together but then had a go at me on Saturday about my relationship, added me to Facebook but didn't talk to me on Sunday and then said yesterday we needed to talk before we went to the gym together.

I just can't work her out. I know that that's an issue with any pd's - but none of it makes sense. I haven't spoken to her since having a bit of a joke with her yesterday on messenger and then her coming to my desk just before I left. But I worry that she may want more than just a friendship based on her actions. I really don't know how to deal with her.

[Harley Quinn]

OK Veryconfused,

I'm going to suggest an exercise here.  It's entirely up to you if you play along.  Firstly, I'd say go back to the beginning of your thread and read all of it as though someone else wrote it.  Then assess objectively what you think this person may be struggling with.  From there I'd say let's swap seats.  If this was someone you deeply cared about, such as a close friend or family member, that was saying what you are, what would you advise them?

Love and light x 

[Veryconfuseduk32]

It's tough to take a step back and analyse that. I'd probably say it's best to step away as it's too soon after everythig and there's a lot of feelings mixed up in there on both sides.

[Harley Quinn]

That sounds like good advice to me.  Can you give it to yourself and will you accept it?

Love and light x

[Veryconfuseduk32]

I'm trying but it's not easy. Seeing her every day makes it worse! I deleted her and blocked her from facebook and i no longer have her number to make not contacting her easier. She emailed me rather than coming round at work today - but again it was for stuff she didnt need to ask. I responded with professional answers and didnt respond to anything but the questions.

It's very hard though. She has been a huge part of my life for almost a year.

[Veryconfuseduk32]

And it's stuff like this which makes it hard. When I left today she was looking across as I was walking out and she made a point of looking at me as I was walking out with a kind of hurt-forced-smile which makes me feel really bad.

The more I look back the more I realise I did nothing wrong in the break up. I broke up with her  because of the crazy arguments and her threatening then attempting suicide when I tried to end it. She drew me back in again and when we did sleep together it was her who always initiated it. When we did get really close and seemed to be getting back together again she then invited another man to her house and and cancelled our plans to see him. I've since learned that she met him when we were still together!

I maybe overreacted to that and I probably should have completely walked away as soon as I found out. But I did nothing wrong and, realistically, she's already proven she isn't a very good friend. She tells me we can't be friends until we talk but she's yet to make any effort to make time to talk to me. And when she has, all she's wanted me to do is tell her how I was in the wrong and that I'm sorry. I don't even think she wants to just be friends, especially after she tried to ring me at 4 in tbe morning It hurts to do it, but I'm going to stick to no contact (as much as possible) this time.

[Veryconfuseduk32]

This is quite difficult already as she's tried phoning me tonight and text saying my name and a question mark. I want to speak to her but I think it's best to back away... .even though it hurts so much to do so.

[Veryconfuseduk32]

Can anyone give me advice on how to continue with no/low contact in this kind of situation. I don't want to be mean to her, but I really believe that any kind of contact will make things worse.

[once removed]

Can anyone give me advice on how to continue with no/low contact in this kind of situation.

the short version of low contact involves not getting emotionally caught up in her actions - much easier said than done. being polite and responsive when she reaches out, but not really engaging on your end.

right now the recent lack of responses (from you) look like mixed messages, from her perspective, much like her actions look like mixed messages to you.

if you are opting for no contact? i might send a nice message that indicates you would like to be friends, but right now you think that requires a period of space.

if you want low contact? she reached out. ask whats up.

[Veryconfuseduk32]

I did reply today saying I missed her call and that i hope shes ok. She said she was fine and asked how i was, i said great thanks and she said good. I left it there. Is that about right?

[once removed]

Is that about right?

sure. again, things are going to be awkward, and thats okay - forcing anything will only make it more awkward.

with low contact, and in this situation, i think its mainly about letting her lead the contact, without getting caught up in it. be responsive and polite if she reaches out. meanwhile, take some space for yourself to process, to grieve, to allow a natural transition into what i think should be viewed as a new friendship (if that is what you are going for).

[Veryconfuseduk32]

The problem is that I don't know if a friendship will work or if its even what she really wants. I suppose time will tell.

[Veryconfuseduk32]

I really found it hard today. She came over and pretty much acted like we were still together according to one of my colleagues. Leaning right over me, laughing at every little thing I said and taking ages to actually leave. She waited for me to finish my call to talk to me - about a work thing - even though my colleague who does the same job was sat across doing nothing!

I just chatted as normal and was friendly enough to her. But then later on in the day I walked out of an office that she can see from her desk, I was in the middle of a conversation and as I looked across I noticed her pretty much staring at me  with a sad kind of forced smile. I looked back a few seconds later ( I was talking to someone in the office so I had to stand outside/half in the office) and she was still looking. Five minutes later I was asked to get something from the printer (in her side of the office) by a manager and she did the same thing. I feel awful when she does that because I feel like it's because she's trying to get me to talk to her. But I don't really want to do that - especially as the last time I did reach out to her she told me it was "inappropriate when you have a girlfriend".

It really is so difficult to do this. I feel like I'm being really mean to her.

[Harley Quinn]

Hi VC,

You're a kind and considerate person and are putting her feelings before your own.  How do you feel about that statement?  Is this something you think you are comfortable with?

It really is so difficult to do this. I feel like I'm being really mean to her.

The reason I ask the above is that as a self confessed codependent myself the guilt was the hardest thing to deal with in the aftermath of the relationship with my ex.  It took me a long time to realise how little effort I gave to my own well being and peace of mind.  That state of constantly being concerned about him and giving little thought to myself made me feel as if I was constantly on red alert whilst failing to notice how unsettled and uneasy that made me within myself.  Does any of this sound familiar?  Breaking free of that pattern took a concerted effort and was worth it as I gained clarity and perspective I'd not had previously.  I know your struggle.   

The likelihood is that she too is putting her feelings before yours so I sense an imbalance here, which I'm afraid is fairly typical of any BPD r/s, as the pwBPD is at the emotional maturity level of a small child.  When you look at it like this, it's like handling a toddler in the body of an adult.  If we consider how we must parent a toddler at times, it's a reality that at some point they must learn that everything cannot be on their terms, and their need for instant gratification cannot realistically be met.  This is something that both parent and child can struggle to accept.  As the mum of a 3 year old I speak from experience.  There will be tears and push back at times and that is unavoidable.  As much as we'd like to, we cannot protect them too much from having these emotions of feeling upset, disappointed, angry or frustrated.  Otherwise, how will they ever learn to be OK with those emotions and learn to deal with them in healthy ways? 

What I'm not doing is saying that teaching this person how to deal with their emotions in healthy ways is your responsibility.  However allowing yourself to deal with your own emotions in a healthy way is.  You cannot be her saviour.  Only she can do her own moving on from the relationship.  Setting clear boundaries now both for her and yourself is the only way to ensure that you prevent long term upset for both of you.  It is worth the short term discomfort at your perception of 'being mean to her' to give yourself long term benefit of knowing that you did what was right for you and remained consistent in your message that friendship is as far as you're willing to take things.

I hope this helps a little.

Love and light x

[Veryconfuseduk32]

Thank you for that post, it is really helpful.I do care about her, which is why it bothers me so much. I would still be upset if I thought she wasn't bothered at all - but at least then I would feel less mean about the whole thing. It's even worse since everyone at work around me can see it happening. They are all supportive of me, but it isn't nice.

Everyone I've spoke to says I need to put myself first. My mum even said I don't owe her anything and it isn't my job to make sure she is ok. While I think that is going a little too far and I wouldnt be comfortable thinking that way. I suppose I do need to be a little more selfish in making sure I am ok before thinking about anyone else.

[Veryconfuseduk32]

This week has been easier but still difficult. She's still coming over to ask questions she doesn't really need to ask but not as often. I have put it to my manager to see if there's a way of stopping that. I haven't had a text or phone call from her other than her telling me she doesn't know it she's going to the gym classes this week so i said i'm looking at diffeent classes anyway.

Not sure how to interperate her actions but I've decided no contact is better than low contact as I don't think a friendship is going to work.

[once removed]

I don't think a friendship is going to work.

what gives you that impression? this seems like the natural flow of events - first everything is really awkward and both parties may overcompensate or undercompensate - second is still awkward but things begin to cool down; the bleeding stopped- the third is where both parties begin to let their guard down a bit with each other, joke around, see flashes of what they liked about the other. the fourth is rare, and it is when a new and separate friendship forms where both parties are, give or take, invested.

this sounds somewhere between stage one and stage two. do i have that about right?

I haven't had a text or phone call from her other than her telling me she doesn't know it she's going to the gym classes this week so i said i'm looking at diffeent classes anyway.

why was this your response? are you trying to coordinate gym classes? the opposite?

what actions are you looking for from her?

[Veryconfuseduk32]

what gives you that impression? this seems like the natural flow of events - first everything is really awkward and both parties may overcompensate or undercompensate - second is still awkward but things begin to cool down; the bleeding stopped- the third is where both parties begin to let their guard down a bit with each other, joke around, see flashes of what they liked about the other. the fourth is rare, and it is when a new and separate friendship forms where both parties are, give or take, invested.

this sounds somewhere between stage one and stage two. do i have that about right?

why was this your response? are you trying to coordinate gym classes? the opposite?

what actions are you looking for from her?

The problem is that her friendships are all very one sided and completely about her and on her terms. Her best friend works at our place and when he wouldn't do what she wanted during the time I was with her she threatened to kill herself. While I don't want to be as close friends with her as that, it seems the way most of her friendships are. I then look at her actions while we were together and can't imagine that she'd act much better as a friend. She was on her best behaviour during the love bombing at the beginning and after I first broke up with her - outside of that she was very needing, controlling and possessive. She seems that way in her friendships too.

I then look at the age/maturity gap between us and don't think we really have much in common. She decided to copy pretty much all my interests when we were together - tv programs, gym classes, my kids, my part tims uni course, etc. But apart from when she was doing that - we have nothing in common. I look back and the time I enjoyed with her before the relationship was pretty much all flirting. When we were together it was pretty much just the interests of mine she copied, flirting and sex!

With the gym text, I asked if she wasn't going to the classes because if she wasn't then I would. I'm not sure whether she said don't know so that she could see me if I did go, because she was playing games and not letting me go to make it difficult for me (she told me it was best for us not to go together till we talked about everything) or if she genuinely didn't know. I just told her I'd go to different classes.

It's sad because I did care about her. But the relationship wasn't going to work and I don't think the friendship will either.

[Sheila3636]

I can so relate to what you say about the sex being the only thing that holds it together. 

It's like trying to fix a plumbing leak with bubble gum. Or that's how my r/s is.

I think working with someone like that would be really hard! It would be hard after breaking up with someone who's NOT BP, then you add this element and all of the drama with yours. I know it's much easier to say than to do, but if you want LC you need firmer boundaries, like when she comes over to say hi, say you're on deadline. Work makes a natural excuse to not talk. Be professional and even a little short with her. Ask her if she needs something work-related, if not excuse yourself. When you leave or are in her area avoid eye contact. I think you're coming across to her like you're bewitched by her still and probably seem open to rekindling the romance.

I'm not pointing a finger, I struggle with NC myself. But my thing is easier because I don't run into my ex/bp or whatever he is.

Good luck to you.

[once removed]

okay. things like "nothing in common" and "her friendships tend to be one sided" are highly valid reasons to rule out a friendship. heck, there are lesser reasons that are perfectly valid.

it sounds like you have been doing some grieving. do you find that this line of thinking is beginning to overrule the previous desire to talk to her as often as before?

im not sure that total no contact is possible, and it would probably only add to the awkwardness. id shoot for extremely limited contact: polite response if required when she engages you, like if she says "hi, good morning Veryconfuseduk32", smile and wave, keep going. involve the manager if shes crossing boundaries at work, like youve been doing. if she sends some nonsense text, a response probably isnt necessary. i wouldnt bother with trying to get your schedules straight when it comes to the gym, or at all. just do your thing.

further detachment being the goal. if her actions are curious or awkward (it sounds like they generally are), let them be curious and awkward and try not to read into them beyond that.

[Veryconfuseduk32]

No Contact is certainly difficult, but I don't know. Maybe it's possible.

I have messaged her to say that I am wanting to go back to some classes from next week so if it's going to be an issue for her to let me know when we can talk. She said that next week is fine because she can't go anyway due to shifts but that she wants to talk next week so it isn't awkward. She has been trying to keep the conversation going but I don't want to get too caught up in a conversation with her.  I've told her I'm a bit too busy to talk next week but if she lets me know when I'll try and make the time.

I don't know what she expects from this conversation. There's really not much to say. All I expect is that hopefully we can just agree to get on ok at the gym and at work. The last time I spoke to her properly she told me that she wants to still "hang out" outside of that. Which is, realistically, not possible - it would be a lot to expect of my girlfriend to understand me spending time with someone I had a relationship with before we got back together.

As for the sex thing, it definitely wasn't something I consciously thought about when we were together. But, looking back, we spent a lot more time alone having sex than doing much else! But she did put a lot of effort into taking interest in things I really liked so that I would spend more time with her. She's unlikely to carry that on now she knows a friendship is all that's on the table.

I do worry that, now that she knows I'm with someone else, she will want try and push for more than a friendship. I know that she wouldn't chase me if I didn't try to talk to her - which is why I think no contact is better. But I do think she would try to see if something could happen if we did spend time together. Even as I'm typing this, she's messaged me again trying to keep the conversation going even though I've tried to finish it.