Verbal Abuse Escalate To Violence?

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

This might not be on the right forum, however, a question.

H has been gone since Monday. Discovered he had a Tinder account. I "confronted" him by saying "Nice Tinder account." Mentioned age he put down, his university affiliation and said nice pic of your cat.

He responded: ". what did you expect? no one likes a thief." (he thinks I steal his money)

monday, i also discovered he'd been texting a woman pretty regularly. i contacted her via text and asked who she was and why she was texting him. i emailed H and asked who she was. I was inflammatory in either interaction, just asked who she was. didn't hear back from either.

then i checked phone logs. there were series of texts going between them, then nothing, and finally a phone call from H to her. Don't know what they said.

when he has left before, his P has told him to contact me via email that he's "safe." he did so monday night. i let him know he no longer had to do that and what I'd wanted was the respect i was due as his wife and that leaving without saying good-bye and without letting me know where he was did not indicate to me i mattered to him, so no reason to let me know he was "safe."

my coach when i told her suggested i could just write thanks when he tells me he's safe, and his P wrote me and said she was sure i'd worry if i didn't hear from him. i told her i'd worked that through. and right now i'm not worried about him at all.

tuesday, i saw H's T, who will no longer be his T, by the way. i told T i was worried H may be back on drugs, i.e.: crack. T told me that if H is taking too much marijuana, he could be behaving as I described.

so i thought about that, and i then sent out a follow up to an email i'd previously written that i thought it would helpful for all of us to meet to see if we could get the household more stable--r'ship between H and me.

immediately after, i received an email from H: " . meet me at (resort near our house). bought u ticket to tonight's concert. . running late."

i am slightly ashamed to admit that my first reaction was relief, "oh my god, he realizes how he's been hurting me and wants to spend time with me."

i wrote back, "really?"

H: "yea. . may be late. ."

then i texted 2 of my sisters, my coach, 2 of my friends, asking if i should go, as excited as a school girl to be invited to a dance. and then i stopped. (took maybe 5 minutes). truth was i didn't believe he'd bought me a ticket. i think he bought it for the woman he'd been texting. (no. i didn't tell him that.) and i realized i didn't trust him to keep me emotionally safe even alluded to it in text to coach. i realized i didn't need advice.

i emailed H: "honey, i would have loved to come, but i've already made plans. have fun." (that was true. i'd made plans to join an al-anon meeting)

i'd forgotten that i'd put an "i'm not available" auto responder on my email.

so off i went to al-anon, and realized i really belong there. a lot of choices i've made in my life, i realized, were attributable to all the alcoholics in my life.
 
came home in a great mood. really happy how i'd handled things. then i emailed H saying i'd hoped he'd had a good day, and opened an email he'd sent me in response to my turning his invitation down (not remembering about the 'i'm not available' auto responder.

He wrote: "Go hang yourself, C**T."

amazing that didn't even hurt. made me overjoyed that i'd trusted my gut that he'd not be emotionally safe.

two things: i forwarded the emails to his P and T, who may or may not be his T, and said this is why I question how psychologically fit H is to be gone and essentially to have disappeared.

second thing: i look at that four-word sentence, and i see it as verbal violence, not as bad as his threatening to strangle or shoot me or something, but it gave me pause.

how frequently does verbal violence escalate to physical violence? and this is a man who goes after my really old dog and the younger one, who is primarily my dog.

i am considering reporting the behavior to the local police department. i feel safe right now as he's out of the house, and i generally feel physically safe when i'm here as i keep my doors locked.

but i don't want to minimize his words or my reaction.

Opinions? Advice?
does verbal abuse such as this turn into physical abuse? a 

I opened the email

[toomanydogs]

This might not be on the right forum, however, a question.

H has been gone since Monday. Discovered he had a Tinder account. I "confronted" him by saying "Nice Tinder account." Mentioned age he put down, his university affiliation and said nice pic of your cat.

He responded: ". what did you expect? no one likes a thief." (he thinks I steal his money)

monday, i also discovered he'd been texting a woman pretty regularly. i contacted her via text and asked who she was and why she was texting him. i emailed H and asked who she was. I was inflammatory in either interaction, just asked who she was. didn't hear back from either.

then i checked phone logs. there were series of texts going between them, then nothing, and finally a phone call from H to her. Don't know what they said.

when he has left before, his P has told him to contact me via email that he's "safe." he did so monday night. i let him know he no longer had to do that and what I'd wanted was the respect i was due as his wife and that leaving without saying good-bye and without letting me know where he was did not indicate to me i mattered to him, so no reason to let me know he was "safe."

my coach when i told her suggested i could just write thanks when he tells me he's safe, and his P wrote me and said she was sure i'd worry if i didn't hear from him. i told her i'd worked that through. and right now i'm not worried about him at all.

tuesday, i saw H's T, who will no longer be his T, by the way. i told T i was worried H may be back on drugs, i.e.: crack. T told me that if H is taking too much marijuana, he could be behaving as I described.

so i thought about that, and i then sent out a follow up to an email i'd previously written that i thought it would helpful for all of us to meet to see if we could get the household more stable--r'ship between H and me.

immediately after, i received an email from H: " . meet me at (resort near our house). bought u ticket to tonight's concert. . running late."

i am slightly ashamed to admit that my first reaction was relief, "oh my god, he realizes how he's been hurting me and wants to spend time with me."

i wrote back, "really?"

H: "yea. . may be late. ."

then i texted 2 of my sisters, my coach, 2 of my friends, asking if i should go, as excited as a school girl to be invited to a dance. and then i stopped. (took maybe 5 minutes). truth was i didn't believe he'd bought me a ticket. i think he bought it for the woman he'd been texting. (no. i didn't tell him that.) and i realized i didn't trust him to keep me emotionally safe even alluded to it in text to coach. i realized i didn't need advice.

i emailed H: "honey, i would have loved to come, but i've already made plans. have fun." (that was true. i'd made plans to join an al-anon meeting)

i'd forgotten that i'd put an "i'm not available" auto responder on my email.

so off i went to al-anon, and realized i really belong there. a lot of choices i've made in my life, i realized, were attributable to all the alcoholics in my life.
 
came home in a great mood. really happy how i'd handled things. then i emailed H saying i'd hoped he'd had a good day, and opened an email he'd sent me in response to my turning his invitation down (not remembering about the 'i'm not available' auto responder.

He wrote: "Go hang yourself, C**T."

amazing that didn't even hurt. made me overjoyed that i'd trusted my gut that he'd not be emotionally safe.

two things: i forwarded the emails to his P and T, who may or may not be his T, and said this is why I question how psychologically fit H is to be gone and essentially to have disappeared.

second thing: i look at that four-word sentence, and i see it as verbal violence, not as bad as his threatening to strangle or shoot me or something, but it gave me pause.

how frequently does verbal violence escalate to physical violence? and this is a man who goes after my really old dog and the younger one, who is primarily my dog.

i am considering reporting the behavior to the local police department. i feel safe right now as he's out of the house, and i generally feel physically safe when i'm here as i keep my doors locked.

but i don't want to minimize his words or my reaction.

Opinions? Advice?
does verbal abuse such as this turn into physical abuse? a 

I opened the email

[Fian]

I would not assume that verbal abuse escalates to physical abuse; I certainly don't see anything that you could forward to the police.  I would also caution you against emotionally escalating the problems you are having with your husband.  You have enough to deal with, without tossing in a hypothetical future problem like physical abuse.

[flourdust]

Verbal abuse alone doesn't necessarily turn physical -- what about other behaviors? Is he physically abusive to the animals? Does he have any history of fighting or assaulting others? Damaging property?

Here is an EXCELLENT diagnostic tool, MOSAIC, to help evaluate the risk in your situation. Let the experts on domestic violence help you: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=301379

[formflier]

I agree with other posters... .it doesn't necessarily escalate... .especially if you remove the fuel.

I have a big picture observation that I hope you can reflect on.

I see lots of thought and detail that are put into responses to his actions and things about him.

I see far less thoughts and detail (although undeniably you are taking steps for you!    ) for things that are for you or for others (not your hubby).

I would feel much more comfortable with the trajectory of YOUR LIFE if there were far fewer things done for him or in response to him and the extra energy and thought put into things for you.

I certainly get into the mode of thinking... .If I do this one more thing... .then a big breakthrough will happen.  I tend to focus on hitting home runs, when I need to consistently have hits that get you to first base.  (hopefully you are baseball person and get that... .)

Here is the thing... .guys that consistently get hits have long careers.  Guys that occasionally hit homers but are otherwise erratic... .are interesting for a season or two.

I'm not suggesting you give up caretaking.  I am suggestion you let the team take the lead in defining your role... .play that role and accept the outcome. 

Right now... I'm seeing "him in control" with you responding to outrageous things he does.

I'll hush and see how this sits with you.

FF

[Cat Familiar]

Not to be Debbie Downer, but to answer the question in the title of your thread, it certainly can, without warning. Lalathegreat's story is an example of that.

Having lived with a former husband with BPD, his disrespect of me started with verbal abuse and over time, escalated to physical violence. In retrospect, I think it was because I tolerated the milder forms of abuse, he felt he was free to escalate it.

I think we are all capable of violence. Years ago, I had a conversation with my first husband when he actually had a moment of compassion and was listening to me. I told him about how all the times he had hit me, hurt me, knocked me to the ground and sat on me, knocked the wind out of me--just how devastating that was and how it destroyed my love and trust.

He offered to let me hit him back, just to make things even. It seemed like a crazy idea and I was extremely reluctant to do so, but he kept egging me on. I have taken martial arts, so I know how to throw a punch, but I'd never done so, other than in a controlled environment when I didn't intend to hurt someone.

So, after all that encouragement from him, I did hit him and I continued to hit him, over and over, as a rage came over me. He was truly shocked and after it was over, so was I, and I was so grateful I didn't break any ribs, but I did leave him sore and bruised. And it really did nothing to settle things. It was awful.

[chillamom]

Hi, toomanydogs,

In my case, extreme and essentially constant verbal and emotional abuse did NOT escalate to physical violence…but then again I did see him rip apart his parent's staircase, attack MANY inanimate objects, and leave a significant dent in my walls. 

My T said that in her experience verbal abuse almost inevitably escalates to physical, so I believe it may have just been a matter of time if I had stayed.  Also, we did not live together - for a time we did, but I made him leave in 2012 when it became utterly clear my children could not tolerate him around.  The relationship persisted for another 5 years, and only recently would I consider it permanently over because the stress of dealing with him quite literally landed me in the ICU with a cardiac situation.

I think everyone's case is obviously individual, and I don't take my T's word as gospel, but I would also consider the experiences of others, most namely LaLa, whom as we know is now recovering from an unforeseen and terrible attack by a person without a previous history.

I would also urge you to do the Mosaic assessment noted earlier - my situation warranted a score of 7, and that is without a history of physical violence.  Please be exceedingly careful, particularly in light of what you have shared before with us about your beloved animals.  I have a chinchilla with an amputated stubby little tail because of my ex "messing" with him years ago  Accidental?  I think not.

[toomanydogs]

Hey all,
   Thanks for all the responses. Regardless of the last post or any of my posts, I am most definitely moving forward.

  What I do on this forum is ask questions when I'm really down, and I also don't want to share anything on here that could possibly identify me to my H in the event that he started looking on this forum. He has me on edge.

  That said, since the last post: 1) I am moving my career forward: setting up the social media sites that I'll need; 2) I have hung out with friends since Monday; 3) I have hung with kids and grandkids; 4) I have talked with my wonderful sisters; 5) I have joined Al-Anon (long overdue).

  I haven't seen H since Sunday, don't know where he is, and I don't care.  I am successfully divorcing him emotionally, and I am getting my head around the possibility of losing my home.

  I don't post most of what I'm doing "right" because until I get cleanly through to the other side, I don't want to present myself as knowing much about getting through any of this.

  Nights are very hard for me. I have trouble sleeping. Last night when I woke up, I decided to do something productive, got out of bed, and was able to fall back asleep.

  I am leaning on friends temporarily, which is not to imply that I hang out with them and gripe and complain. I laugh with them.

  I am physically active and very very proud of my deltoids. I am a small woman, an old woman, and the fact that I have such pronounced muscle definition fills me with pride.

  With the help of my coach, my friends, and now Al-Anon, I have not "reacted" since mid-May but have responded. I want to jump up and down and scream every obscenity I can think of to some of what my H does, but I do not do that. Instead, I see my coach, my friends, and I talk with my sisters.

  As I post this, I have one dog to my right and two more on the floor keeping me company, and I have no H. I've got to admit, I like the lack of chaos.

  I can also say that I truly hope his P can help him and that when my H files for divorce, which I'm 95% certain he will do, she can keep him calm enough so that the dissolution can remain as amicable as possible.

  I am not afraid of my future, and I am working at getting my head around the possible loss of my home and farm animals.

  So that's it. Just wanted to check in and let everyone know that what I post here is generally going to be the kinds of rants I can't do with my H, his P, or my FIL. Sometimes I require more ranting than I'm able to get with all my support.

  Have a great night, everyone! And thank you all for taking the time to respond to me.

TMD

[flourdust]

  So that's it. Just wanted to check in and let everyone know that what I post here is generally going to be the kinds of rants I can't do with my H, his P, or my FIL. Sometimes I require more ranting than I'm able to get with all my support.

TMD, I am glad you are feeling better and taking some steps to help yourself.

There are a lot of people who post here following a similar pattern -- they come here to vent when things are bad, then back off when things are better. That's understandable, but it's also a symptom of denial. Ignoring the problems when they are not at crisis levels takes away your opportunity to address them when you are most able to think clearly and have an effect.

Please take that MOSAIC assessment. It can be extremely helpful in providing guidance.

[toomanydogs]

TMD, I am glad you are feeling better and taking some steps to help yourself.

There are a lot of people who post here following a similar pattern -- they come here to vent when things are bad, then back off when things are better. That's understandable, but it's also a symptom of denial. Ignoring the problems when they are not at crisis levels takes away your opportunity to address them when you are most able to think clearly and have an effect.

Please take that MOSAIC assessment. It can be extremely helpful in providing guidance.

I took the MOSAIC. I got a 7.

[flourdust]

I took the MOSAIC. I got a 7.

That's the same score I got. What do you think?

[toomanydogs]

That's the same score I got. What do you think?

I'm not sure, flourdust.
I spoke with a domestic violence shelter today to see if they could help assess the risk. They were concerned about his treatment of the dogs and the ":)ie you hideous c**t" email he sent me this morning, but told me that most police won't take a report unless there's physical harm.

I know he's being abusive because I'm being advised not to react to him as it'll only make him angrier. I didn't react to the email, didn't react to all sorts of other stuff (he's not here by the way. he's been gone since Sunday. don't know where)

The shelter thought I should report him missing. I don't know what to do.

I'm exhausted. The stress is making my hair fall out by the handful.

[formflier]

What things, specifically, do you do in order to manage stress?

How long has it been since you made a change in the way you manage stress?

FF

[toomanydogs]

What things, specifically, do you do in order to manage stress?

How long has it been since you made a change in the way you manage stress?

FF

I manage stress by hanging with friends, talking with my sisters, playing with the dogs, laughing, meditating, and writing. Not necessarily in that order.

It's been a while since I've done anything different.

[formflier]

I didn't necessarily see anything "physical" on there.  Since there are physical symptoms (hair loss)... .I would think it wise to take a hard look at the way you care for your body.

Perhaps less time on other things and more time on walks and light exercise... .build up slowly.  Be deliberate about evaluating you diet and nutrition.

Perhaps there are supplements for hair. 

In all this stress, maybe you have changed your nutritional intake... .without realizing it.

Said another way... .your body is showing you displeasure with "something" (hair loss)... . 

I would not assume it is the relationship stress "only" that your body is "yelling at you" over. 

We know that is stressful... .and will remain for a while.  So... .check all the rest out... .

FF

[5xFive]

Formflier,
Would you be willing to elaborate on this?:

I am suggestion you let the team take the lead in defining your role... .play that role and accept the outcome. 

I recently read a post that you also posted on, but I can't remember whose response resonated with me. But it was about not being able to fix or resolve everything, and it being ok to cave and allow pwBPD to win, that they NEED to win or it will get worse. I think letting the team take the lead would be my goal to get to the place where I don't argue? I don't usually justify, I sometimes defend, I often explain, and I almost always argue. But your use of the word "team" rings something inside of me. Here I am trying to explain my question, . Anyway, would you be willing to elaborate a little for me?

[toomanydogs]

I didn't necessarily see anything "physical" on there.  Since there are physical symptoms (hair loss)... .I would think it wise to take a hard look at the way you care for your body.

Perhaps less time on other things and more time on walks and light exercise... .build up slowly.  Be deliberate about evaluating you diet and nutrition.

Perhaps there are supplements for hair. 

In all this stress, maybe you have changed your nutritional intake... .without realizing it.

Said another way... .your body is showing you displeasure with "something" (hair loss)... . 

I would not assume it is the relationship stress "only" that your body is "yelling at you" over. 

We know that is stressful... .and will remain for a while.  So... .check all the rest out... .

FF

Yikes, how could I have left out the farm animals--the mucking, the feeding and such, twice a day. (I have impressive deltoids as a result of hauling hay and feed. ) I also do Pilates once a week. This morning when I was stressing, I started stripping beds, dumping cat littler, and doing laundry. Moving helps a great deal.

I'm a late late convert to getting off my butt; however, the exercise is one of the best ways for me to combat stress. I'm amazed I forgot to include it.
Must be because for so many years I wasn't getting off my butt.

Thanks!

TMD