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How to communicate after a contentious divorce... Following a contentious divorce and custody battle, there are often high emotion and tensions between the parents. Research shows that constant and chronic conflict between the parents negatively impacts the children. The children sense their parents anxiety in their voice, their body language and their parents behavior. Here are some suggestions from Dean Stacer on how to avoid conflict.
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Author Topic: Children help BPD Mother Take Us Down  (Read 702 times)
jenbren2006
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« on: February 13, 2018, 04:27:26 PM »

Everytime my husband tries discipling his children on his time.  The BPD ex called Child Protective Services on him.  The investigations are always unfounded.  This last time all he did was yell at his children-there was no laying on of hands at all.  How is she even allowed to file a report for something like this.
I view this as both the children and the ex BPD wife abusing and trying to control my husband. 
Is there anyone else out there who cannot be a family because of the children helping the ex wife.  We feel really alone.
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Ulysses
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
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« Reply #1 on: February 14, 2018, 12:00:25 AM »

Yes, it's a balance when you're divorced.  Each party has to give some things up, and it can feel especially painful when the ex spouse has BPD traits or has been diagnosed.

How old are your husband's children?  Are there other ways he can discipline/teach them rather than yelling or getting physical?

Sometimes parents who are divorced have to weigh what is important to them/their values vs. their relationship with their child.  I was told this by S's T, and it was a hard pill to swallow.  It was important to me that S finish homework, get tutoring at school that was offered to him, etc.  But my relationship was more important.  I hated giving up raising him in a way that I felt was right.  He flunked a class in middle school and it was hard to watch.  I didn't like it but he's doing really well academically now and we have a good relationship (at least, I think so).
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Panda39
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner’s ex
Relationship status: SO and I have been together 9 years and have just moved in together this summer.
Posts: 3462



« Reply #2 on: February 14, 2018, 07:28:45 AM »

Hi jenbren2006,

My SO experienced this during his Separation & Divorce.  His daughters were enmeshed with their uBPDmom and their mom was also actively alienating the girls from their father.

His daughters about 11 & 14 at the time were actively spying for their mother.  They went through their father's belongings, read his phone text messages and took his laptop with intent to hack into it (it took the police to get it returned).

He also had an incident similar to yours.  He was on the phone with his stbxw and got frustrated with her, hung up the phone and threw it into the couch.  This was escalated up to he threw the phone and it shattered into a million pieces, to he threw the phone at the kids, to he wouldn't let them use the phone to call their mother, finally to he wouldn't let them leave his house.  All of this came from their mother who wasn't there to see anything, but was also not disputed by his daughters. (It was years later that they learned that their actions could have taken their father out of their life)

He was accused of abuse and had to appear in court.  He took his intact cordless phone and went to court, the oh so concerned ex didn't bother to show up, she was "ill" (in reality out getting a mani/pedi with their younger daughter  )  He told his story, was believed, the charges were dropped, but he had to attend counseling for anger management.

He resented being sent to counseling, yes he was angry and frankly he had reason to be.  However, therapy turned out to be excellent for him, the therapist pretty quickly recognized that he didn't have "anger issues".  She was however, a really good support for him during what he and his kids now call "the dark times".  He was able to talk to her about the kids and their relationship and give him tips and ideas that were really helpful.  So his ex and her attempt to make him out as "bad dad" actually ended up giving him someone who was helpful and supportive.

I think the key is to remember that his children are children and they have to negotiate living with their mother.  It is hard for the adults on this website to deal with the BPD people in their lives imagine how hard it is for children.  Their mother is an authority figure... .listen to adults, do what your told, your survival depends on your parents, and yes they also love their mother and want to please her.  They are squeezed between their mom and dad.

Your husband can't make his ex or anyone else do something they don't want to do.  The only people we can truly change is ourselves. So that being said, can your husband change his discipline style? Yes. None of us are perfect we can all lose our temper and everyone approaches discipline in their own way (probably the way they were raised) but maybe he could try another approach that will help with his relationship with his kids and will not give his ex any ammunition to create more drama.

Has your husband considered therapy for himself?  Like I said above my SO though forced into it found it very helpful, he was able to vent about the ex in a safe place, which helped him be in a better place with his kids and he was able to get tools that helped when dealing with his kids and the parental alienation.  A good therapist could help your husband both with his discipline style and his issues with his kids.

Sometimes parents who are divorced have to weigh what is important to them/their values vs. their relationship with their child.  I was told this by S's T, and it was a hard pill to swallow.  It was important to me that S finish homework, get tutoring at school that was offered to him, etc.  But my relationship was more important.  I hated giving up raising him in a way that I felt was right.  He flunked a class in middle school and it was hard to watch.  I didn't like it but he's doing really well academically now and we have a good relationship (at least, I think so).

I can also relate to what Ulysses says above. I have a son with ADD and I tried to push and control when it came to his school work... .usually involved a lot of frustration and yelling.  I too came to the conclusion that I wanted a positive relationship with my son and decided to let the professionals (teachers) deal with his education.  I would be there and support my son when he asked for help or support but my relationship with him was more important to me.  He hated High School and really struggled there, graduated with a 1.65 GPA.  My expectation was that he was going to post-secondary school.  He enrolled in our local community college.  He is just wrapping up an internship and has one final class to take before graduating.  He currently has a 3.00 GPA.

If your husband is interested he could also join our group, my SO and I are both members here and we have found it really helpful, for ideas, support, and for us to be a united front that spoke the same language.

Take Care,
Panda39

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"Have you ever looked fear in the face and just said, I just don't care" -Pink
ForeverDad
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Relationship status: separated 2005 then divorced
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You can't reason with the Voice of Unreason...


« Reply #3 on: February 14, 2018, 08:20:03 AM »

Does yelling at the children qualify as an incident of child abuse?  The ex will surely claim so, well, unless the ex does it.   Check to find out what your agency, court, county or state view as verbal child abuse.  In any case, cast any raised voice as merely raised for the children take note, hear clearly the instructions or corrections and that it was in no way threatening.  Then again, might also be a valid strategy not to get into details, you don't want to risk things becoming worse than they are by getting explanations twisted by either ex or the agencies.  Open mouth, sink ship.

So many of the complaints ("he always... ." or "she always... ." are too vague to be anything other than 'hearsay' or of too minimal impact to be seen as 'actionable'.

I called my CPS agency twice before we separated, both times because my ex was ranting and raging in front of our son.  I mentioned how he wilted during such times.  I recall one time he "hid" in plain sight underneath the dining table, another time crouched down beside the sofa, another time prone flat on the floor, as though if he didn't see her, then she didn't see him.  So the lady asked, Was she screaming at him?  I replied, No, at me but he was right there.  She instructed, We can't do anything but do call back if she screams at him.

My point to you? ... .See the fine distinction many agencies make?  They realize the children can't be protected from every little bump or stress in life, that's just the way it is, so usually they limit themselves just to the times when the poor behaviors are directed at the children (and rise to the level of being 'actionable'.  Don't let the professionals overlook that fact.
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jenbren2006
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« Reply #4 on: February 16, 2018, 02:30:17 PM »

Everytime my husband tries discipling his children on his time.  The BPD ex called Child Protective Services on him.  The investigations are always unfounded.  This last time all he did was yell at his children-there was no laying on of hands at all. 
By the way he has never laid his hands on his children.  It started with us nicely explaining to them what they and their mother was doing was wrong to taking things away.  It took months for him to get to the level of yelling at them.
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soundofmusicgirl
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner’s ex
Posts: 179


« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2018, 09:17:28 AM »

jenbren2006 I sometimes want to yell at my stepsons Smiling (click to insert in post) Especially if they treat my husband like dirt (which they have learned from their mom).

Somewhere (i believe on another thread on here) someone mentioned that with alienated kids you lose your role as a parent to them. Therefore disciplining them is hard because it just confirms to them that you are this horrible monster that they constantly hear you are from the alienating parent. They do not see you in a parent role anymore.

I have no good answer to how to deal with this.
All I know, is that I understand your situation so well. Right now my stepsons barely talk to my husband when he calls them. When they do say something, it is snotty, rude and completely inappropriate. When I hear those calls and I am close to the phone I say something. But it is not helpful because all the kids do is hang up.
There simply is no winning with alienated children.
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Panda39
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Relationship status: SO and I have been together 9 years and have just moved in together this summer.
Posts: 3462



« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2018, 10:17:20 AM »

I thought I had another post here, but maybe it didn't take... .anyway... .how old are the kids?  Are they receiving any kind of therapy? What does custody look like?  How much time does your husband have with his kids?  How many times has CPS been called to the house?  Are the kids having problems at school?

Just trying to get more of a feel for what is going on.  Also, below are some resources and discussions that you might find helpful... .

Divorce Poison New and Updated Edition: How to Protect Your Family from Bad-mouthing and Brainwashing Paperback
by Dr. Richard A Warshak

Check out Dr. Craig Childress on-line: www.dr-childress-index.droppages.com/

Parental Alienation... .
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=104479.0

Shared Parenting... .
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=67574.0

Co-Parenting doing what is best for the kids... .
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=182254.0

Hopefully you will find some ideas to try that will be helpful in your situation.

Panda39
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"Have you ever looked fear in the face and just said, I just don't care" -Pink
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