Has Your Taste in Partners Changed?

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

Has your taste in partners changed since getting out of a relationship with someone with BPD?

Mine did, though there was an adjustment period.  As a younger person I found myself attracted to charismatic guys.  Unusualness was attractive to me as was boys/men with distinctive traits like tallness, sharp verbal wit, high intelligence, etc.  

Now it's kindness that attracts me.

How about you?

[Insom]

Has your taste in partners changed since getting out of a relationship with someone with BPD?

Mine did, though there was an adjustment period.  As a younger person I found myself attracted to charismatic guys.  Unusualness was attractive to me as was boys/men with distinctive traits like tallness, sharp verbal wit, high intelligence, etc.  

Now it's kindness that attracts me.

How about you?

[Maxpax2011]

Mine sure did, my ex was a business woman type, very stuck up and arrogant, heavy drinker and obnoxious. Kind of nerdy if you see her at her job. I am now dating a nurse, who is very shy, sweet, kind of goofy, and more of a homebody. But she loves my dog, and she loves kids. So ya I guess our taste could change.

[valet]

How are we defining the word partner in this situation?

I find that I'm still attracted to lots of different people, but I wouldn't jump into a relationship with someone just because I feel a natural sense of attraction. I think that the main differences are in my boundaries with myself in how I relate to others. I used to see character mismatches and ignore them. I don't do that anymore. I listen to my gut, and more or less trust myself.

So it's not so much that my tastes have changed, just that I am more patient in seeing how I can nurture them in healthy ways.

This is a good thread. I hope the discussion ramps up!

[Insom]

Hi, Maxpax2011!    

I am now dating a nurse, who is very shy, sweet, kind of goofy, and more of a homebody

That does sound like a change.  How are you feeling in your new relationship?

How are we defining the word partner in this situation?

Great question, Valet!  Initially I was thinking romantic partner but this could apply to friendship or any other chosen relationship.

FWIW, I am married and not seeking to date, but my husband has forever changed what I would find acceptable in a romantic partner, for the better.  However, I DO still rely on chemistry - sometimes with not-great results - when choosing female friends.

I used to see character mismatches and ignore them. I don't do that anymore

Did you go through a process/did this change happen gradually for you? Or did it feel more like an insight?

[Maxpax2011]

Hi, Maxpax2011!    

That does sound like a change.  How are you feeling in your new relationship?

Great question, Valet!  Initially I was thinking romantic partner but this could apply to friendship or any other chosen relationship.

FWIW, I am married and not seeking to date, but my husband has forever changed what I would find acceptable in a romantic partner, for the better.  However, I DO still rely on chemistry - sometimes with not-great results - when choosing female friends.

Did you go through a process/did this change happen gradually for you? Or did it feel more like an insight?

To be honest it is pretty scary at times, I have serious trust issues, very cautious. We have been dating for almost 3 months and the intimacy is very limited. Sometimes I am afraid to put myself out there, first time I bought her flowers was Valentine's day. We do have a connection, but she is more of a companion than anything, we don't seem to base the relationship on intimacy, more like quality time spent together. We are just taking it slow. This one is very kind, very supportive, I know she would never hurt me, but I just feel kind of numb sometimes. There are still days where I miss my ex, I loved her deeply, more than I realized after the break up, she reach a part of my heart that no one ever has. I don't know if I will ever feel that type of love again or if it was once in a lifetime. But as my therapist said, I can't hold myself back from being happy with someone, as long as they treat you good, and they respect you that is a big part of a relationship. So I am just going to go with it and see what happens.

[Bo123]

Mine didn't change other than finally finding out she was a highly functioning very low grade BPD.  She had all the qualities an, values and ethics I want in a wife.  I just didn't find out she was BPD in time, otherwise I would have married her.  Rare case.

[Shedd]

I actually find myself not interested in love at all anymore.

[gotbushels]

Hi Insom 

What a fun thread! Thank you for creating it.  I'm really enjoying myself reading peoples' responses to it.

I'm less attracted to the edgy/troublemaker type of person. To me, I learned aggressiveness ≠ capability ≠ assertiveness. I still find troublemaker people attractive... .but it stops there.

I've found I'm more interested in women who seem to have calmness, warmth, and comfort as part of their lives--and they have those without being excessively dependent on a single interpersonal relationship.

Logistically, I'm also interested in getting enough face-to-face time with a prospective partner. The pwBPD relationship I had started with text and LDR communication; so instead I then try to put myself in more face-to-face situations. These are situations where I can really pay attention to all my emotions while I'm with the prospective person. I try to listen to the flag-emotions more early on, because it's good to temper that against the excitement of the "new"--especially so to keep a sound judgement hat on. 

Have a pleasant week.

[Chynna]

No. His illusion was the type of person I am attracted to.

[Jeffree]

I have no idea as of yet. However, I do know that in all my time where I live I have not connected with anyone relationship wise.

First ex wife I met in NYC when we both lived there, second I knew from NYC and reunited with her some 20 years later on FB when she was on the West Coast.

I worry that this is not a good place for my dating interests whatever they may be.

Was on match for 6 months and managed 2 dates with women who weren't interested back.

J

[araneina]

I haven't had a new relationship since my ex but I can definitely say that there are now things I look out for in potential partners that I never looked out for before.

The last two men I was in a relationship with both hated their jobs.  My ex LOATHED his job and it bled into our relationship.  Now I listen very closely when someone talks about their work.  Of course work isn't all sunshine and rainbows, but I look for indications that they're relatively happy with their job and they are looking forward to growing in that position.

When I reflected back on the first few dates with my ex I realized he had already begun his negative talk, victimizing himself, and bashing ex girlfriends.  I am hyper vigilant for that kind of talk with men I date.  It's not an immediate dealbreaker, but if it continues then I will most certainly cut myself off from that person.

Also - the constant communication.  My ex texted me non stop when we first started dating.  I LOVED it.  Now I have no interest in that.  I like to set a date, and just talk to that person face-to-face.  If a relationship eventually ensues then I will like phone calls, but I will make sure to limit the communication so I can still maintain my own life.  There were nights when my ex would call me and I'd look at my phone and say "Well, there goes my evening."  I won't do that again.

I had a wonderful date with a man on Sunday.  Never once did he say anything disparaging about friends, family, coworkers, ex girlfriends.  He spoke positively about his job, about where he lived.  We talked about a range of topics and it was just... .nice.  I sent him a followup text a few hours later and he quickly asked me out on another date.  There are no "good morning beautiful!" texts from him, just casual conversation setting up the next date and that's it.  And that's all I need right now.

In the end... .I just want someone who is happy with themselves.  They don't need to be rich, or hot, or whatever.  Just someone who is happy with themselves and capable of love.  It might take me a while to find that person but at least I have tools now to help me find him.

[Chynna]

P.S. ... .but I am educated now.

[Lucky Jim]

Like you, Insom, kindness is at the top of my list.  The interesting thing is, since leaving my BPDxW, I've dated three women who are all kind, generous and caring, so I can confirm that good people are out there.  I don't waste my time anymore with those who raise red flags  regardless how attractive they may seem on the outside.  I recently went through a b/u with a Non-BPD after a 2-year r/s with many happy times.  Any r/s, of course, raises emotional issues, but nothing like the turmoil of a BPD r/s, based on my recent dating experiences.

LuckyJim

[Chynna]

Just be careful... .My person w/issues illusioned all of those good things too. Kindness, generosity, gentleness, etc. Everyone loved him. I was very envied, little did they know. Ah but you all are educated now so... .

[Lucky Jim]

Sure, my pwBPD seemed ideal at the outset.  Yet now I go much more slowly in new relationships.  Plus, I like to think that I'm ready to jump ship sooner if I get warning signals.

My BPDxW had back issues and a drinking problem.  Several years ago, I went out on a date with an old friend from college.  Turned out she had developed back issues and a drinking problem!     It was a No-Go for me.

LuckyJim

[Insom]

Great responses, everyone!  Keep 'em coming.

I'm stepping away from my computer for the rest of the day but look forward to responding more when I have more time.

[Insom]

Maxpax2011:

Great idea, I think, to take it slow.

She reach a part of my heart that no one ever has. I don't know if I will ever feel that type of love again or if it was once in a lifetime.

Yes!  I can relate very much to how emotionally intense a relationship with someone with BPD can feel.  I remember feeling a strong bond with my BPD-ex.  I felt seen by him, like he understood something special about my character that I wanted seen and that no one else saw.  How about you?  What part of you do you feel your ex reached?

Bo123:

She had all the qualities an, values and ethics I want in a wife.

Would you like to say more?  The word "ethics" is an interesting one.  What are the qualities and ethics you are looking for?

Shedd:

I actually find myself not interested in love at all anymore.

Oh, Shedd!  You sound discouraged.     Hugs.  How about friendships?


gotbushels:

Logistically, I'm also interested in getting enough face-to-face time with a prospective partner. The pwBPD relationship I had started with text and LDR communication; so instead I then try to put myself in more face-to-face situations. These are situations where I can really pay attention to all my emotions while I'm with the prospective person. I try to listen to the flag-emotions more early on, because it's good to temper that against the excitement of the "new"--especially so to keep a sound judgement hat on.

It sounds like you're being more careful about who you want to be in a relationship with.  How is that going for you?  How does it feel to be more deliberate?

Ha, Chynna!  (You crack me up.) 

Just be careful... .My person w/issues illusioned all of those good things too. Kindness, generosity, gentleness, etc. Everyone loved him. I was very envied, little did they know.

Yes, I can relate to having a relationship change.  What was that like for you?  Going from feeling envied to something else?


Jeffree:

First ex wife I met in NYC when we both lived there, second I knew from NYC and reunited with her some 20 years later on FB when she was on the West Coast.I worry that this is not a good place for my dating interests whatever they may be.

So interesting!  I agree wholeheartedly that a place can have a character just like a person or a family.  How would you describe the place you're in now?  What connects you to it?  What do you feel is lacking?

Lucky Jim:

The interesting thing is, since leaving my BPDxW, I've dated three women who are all kind, generous and caring, so I can confirm that good people are out there.

Yes!  I can relate.  What do the newer relationships feel like?  Do you still miss your BPDxW or do you feel you've grown past whatever initially drew you in?

[once removed]

great thread Insom!

i suppose my answer would be "yes and no" 

similar to gotbushels i have a type, and it turns out that type doesnt necessarily translate into an ideal partner. when i feel that initial draw, i press pause and wait. and then, gradually, i tend to be drawn away. and like Valet says, attraction is harmless, it doesnt necessarily need to go further than that. though ive read some pretty knowledgeable members here suggest that sometimes its a matter of finding the "best version" of that type, and somewhat inevitable.

ive always been attracted to confident, smart, funny, kind, and loyal women. i just didnt pursue them, or in some cases i over pursued them, for whatever reason, we didnt click.

something about bowens family systems theory ("we tend to mate with our emotional equals" really stuck with me. i find the more i "up my game" so to speak, the more im drawn in a different direction, the more its drawn to me, the more capable and deserving i feel of having the happy and healthy relationship i want to have.

[MeandThee29]

I actually find myself not interested in love at all anymore.

Me too. I can't imagine. I do have a lot of friends though including some couples who have stuck with me through all of this. My young adults live at home too.

A friend of mine remarried several years ago after an abusive relationship for 30 years with a husband who constantly cheated on her, and I was amazed at the risk she took. They're doing great though.

[Jeffree]

How would you describe the place you're in now?  What connects you to it?  What do you feel is lacking?

I'd describe it as an OK place. I find it hard to believe that with all the professionals who live here and the decent amount of brainpower here that I can't find someone to connect with. There does seem to be a greater population of country bumpkins up here than I let myself believe is here, and I most definitely do not connect with these types. I do not own a gun, a 4x4, a big utility truck, camouflage, chew, or any Budweiser products. Not that there's anything wrong with that. That's just not my thing at all.

What connects me to the area is that it is where I had a great job for 11 years, and since losing it I haven't been able to find work anywhere else other than here.

The cost of living is fair, real estate taxes a drop in the bucket compared to any other place in the state I'd consider living, and it has accommodations for many different interests.

Maybe it's me. LOL!

J

[Lucky Jim]

What do the newer relationships feel like?  Do you still miss your BPDxW or do you feel you've grown past whatever initially drew you in?

Hey Insom, No, I don't miss my BPDxW at all, so I guess I have grown past my attraction to someone w/BPD.  My Ex and I are LC because we have kids and occasionally she still tries to draw me in with drama or inflammatory comments, but I'm not interested in playing that game anymore; it's too exhausting!

Concerning my newer relationships, I would say that it's been great to find out that not all women consider me the horrible person that my Ex made me out to be.  I would also say that I've learned that, without all the drama and turmoil, a relationship can be a fun, positive experience for both parties.

LuckyJim

[Insom]

Lucky Jim:

I would say that it's been great to find out that not all women consider me the horrible person that my Ex made me out to be.  I would also say that I've learned that, without all the drama and turmoil, a relationship can be a fun, positive experience for both parties.

   Yes!  This is heartening to hear.  I know some of us (me included) felt addicted to our relationships, like nothing else would do.  FWIW, over time, I've had to redefine love for myself.  As a younger person I equated it with intense feeling.  Now, years post-relationship with BPD-ex, it's something different.  I like that you mentioned positivity.  Love feels positive.

Jeffree: 

What connects me to the area is that it is where I had a great job for 11 years, and since losing it I haven't been able to find work anywhere else other than here.

Hey!  It sounds like work-wise you're doing great and have landed in a supportive place but that you also feel a bit like a fish out of water?  I can relate.  The place where my husband and I live has been great for his career, less so for mine.  Since memories of my BPD-ex came up for me in a strong way about a year ago I've wondered if there's a connection to frustration I feel in my work life and creativity.

MeandThee29:

I was amazed at the risk she took.

This concept of risk is interesting!  What did your friend risking by leaving an abusive situation?

once removed: 

something about bowens family systems theory ("we tend to mate with our emotional equals" really stuck with me. i find the more i "up my game" so to speak, the more im drawn in a different direction, the more its drawn to me, the more capable and deserving i feel of having the happy and healthy relationship i want to have.

Thanks for this!  (I am googling "bowens" as I type . . .)

araneina:

Also - the constant communication.  My ex texted me non stop when we first started dating.  I LOVED it.  Now I have no interest in that.

Wow, that's a big shift from LOVING the intensity to having no interest.  Congratulations!  It sounds like things are going great!  Can you tell us more how you achieved that shift?  Was it an immediate reaction to your BPD relationship?  Or something you learned over time?

[gotbushels]

once removed--I just wanted to support what you shared here.

when i feel that initial draw, i press pause and wait. and then, gradually, i tend to be drawn away.

Something I happened upon recently in a Linehan publication reminded me of what you said.

"If intense emotion is obvious, suspect emotion mind. Give it time; if certainty remains, especially when you are feeling calm and secure, suspect wise mind."

I think maybe this is the way of our mind or heart or both telling us that something isn't going to work with that person. I personally experienced this with two potential partners, without actually recognising that Linehan discussed this idea. I was "drawn away" as you put it--and in hindsight--I'm very happy I did. Honestly, I describe it clinically now, but I was extremely upset because I found some things about each of them very attractive. I heaped on the self care to out-funk myself.  *guilty--hands up* 



I like how you and Valet put this--thank you.

and like Valet says, attraction is harmless, it doesnt necessarily need to go further than that.

... .i find the more i "up my game" so to speak, the more im drawn in a different direction ... .

Yes! I felt this too. Surprisingly, I found it was easier to speak to prospective dates--but the rate and quantity of relationships I wanted to advance was lower. It was disheartening for me, so something that helped me was when I felt unsettled about being single on another weekend, I reminded myself that of course I'm going to find fewer qualified fish in the sea than before, because I'd like more yellow in the fins, more blue near the top, etc. I guess the more you narrow your region of desire, then of course it's going to be more rewarding, but of course it's going to be more challenging.

... .being more careful about who you want to be in a relationship with.  ... .How does it feel to be more deliberate?

Insom, tremendously liberating! Thank you for asking. When things don't go my way in relationships, I find it much easier to figure out how to get up and keep going (again).

I feel comforted by the overlap of a lot of skills from work into my relational life. It feels like I'm using new limbs. Like when you sleep on your arm, then panic because you don't feel it at all, but then get that gradual sense of relief that you don't have to chop your arm off as the sensation returns to it. That feeling of tremendous relief, but in spoons rather than shovels.

I feel disconcerted--but concerted? "OK, these are my strengths and weaknesses, how does this interrelate to hers, and what implications will that mean for both of us in this situation"-- that feels weird.  Disconcerted because it's against my self-seeking "feeling" of the moment, but concerted because it's honouring my long-term "want" of growing the relationship. I think it's working out well so far. 

I'd like to share this. I guess, relating to pwBPD relationships, the glue to going forward was realising that a lot of what the *non* brings to each instance of dysregulation are qualities of openness, empathy, and in want of a healthy relationship. The realisation that these qualities are represented by the *non*--that observation is what gives permission to chase those things you want in life, outside and beyond the relationship with the pwBPD. That can then lead the non to confidence that what traits you're bringing to market is valuable. Then--if you bring good things to the market--then you can also feel like you're matching more well with reciprocal tastes that you truly want.

[Harley Quinn]

Great topic Insom! I really haven't found myself attracted to anyone in person since my BPD r/s although I suspect many of the qualities he displayed (minus the bright red banners) would still attract me. What I do know is that if I were to meet someone now I'd be much more reserved about following that initial attraction and take a lot of time to sense check it.

I'm hopeful that I will have done a lot more work on myself before I find myself faced with a decision about attempting a new r/s as that's my main focus right now. It will be interesting to see if my taste changes as a result of that work. Thanks for posting about this!

[once removed]

(I am googling "bowens" as I type . . .)

just to share with all, bowen defines emotional maturity similarly to our level of "differentiation". the good news is that our level of emotional maturity/differentiation is not fixed in place. it can grow, and it stands to reason that the dynamics we are drawn to can change, and in simple terms, we can better connect with more emotionally mature individuals.

more here (9, 13 and 15 were big ones for me): https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=279626.0

Yes! I felt this too. Surprisingly, I found it was easier to speak to prospective dates--but the rate and quantity of relationships I wanted to advance was lower. It was disheartening for me, so something that helped me was when I felt unsettled about being single on another weekend, I reminded myself that of course I'm going to find fewer qualified fish in the sea than before, because I'd like more yellow in the fins, more blue near the top, etc. I guess the more you narrow your region of desire, then of course it's going to be more rewarding, but of course it's going to be more challenging.

i like that attitude. its sort of "good things come to those who wait". its also true i think, that the older we get, the smaller the pool of healthy, or qualified mates there are, which is not at all to say they arent out there, just that we need to have our eyes open.

but i also think if we dont play the field to some extent, we narrow our exposure. healthy dating is all about having the right tools. setting up safe parameters around potential relationships.

"upping our game" is attractive to everyone, at least initially, the bad fish and the good fish. we wont suddenly repel the bad fish and lure all the good ones. and initial attraction and/or the first steps of a relationship with a "bad fish" arent inherently bad either. the danger is when we dont recognize when its not working, and not going to work, especially if we continue to do more of what isnt working.

i do think upping our game goes a long way toward that. our taste in dynamics is what changes most. if i met my ex today, it would fizzle out quickly because we wouldnt have that unhealthy, yet dysfunctionally compatible, "click".

[tiki]

My introspection has centered more about people in my life.

I think as an adolescent I liked really intense people. I was really into like people that acted and spoke like they were in a novel. I was into people who were full of themselves. As if I bought it too.

The first person I feel in love with in high school was an almost hilariously exaggerated version of this. He was so dramatic, and also incredibly smart and would make what I thought were really amazing observations about life and reality. 

I went on to date him years later and it was pretty bad. He wasn’t very respectful to me and demonstrated an outsized regard for himself.

It wasn’t at all like how I thought it would be. It seems like I bought into traits that actually weren’t there.

I guess I was into people who were really into their own bs.

Which to me seems very adolescent like. People with an adolescent like way of seeing their world dramatically. That’s what I used to be into. And it was always not what I thought it was once I got involved.

So yeah I’m weary and aware of that inclination now. Also I think it’s something I should have grown out of.

[Insom]

tiki: 

I’m weary and aware of that inclination now. Also I think it’s something I should have grown out of.

Yes, I can relate with this, feeling like I should definitely be over something before I'm actually over it.  Would it be fair to say you understand one thing in your head but your feelings are in a different place?

once removed:

bowen defines emotional maturity similarly to our level of "differentiation". the good news is that our level of emotional maturity/differentiation is not fixed in place. it can grow, and it stands to reason that the dynamics we are drawn to can change, and in simple terms, we can better connect with more emotionally mature individuals.

I love this idea about growth.  Thank you for sharing. 

HQ:

I'm hopeful that I will have done a lot more work on myself before I find myself faced with a decision about attempting a new r/s as that's my main focus right now. It will be interesting to see if my taste changes as a result of that work.

Interesting, indeed!  Would you care to share a bit about the work you're doing?  (No pressure.  On my own journey & interested in how others are handling self-learning.)

[Jeffree]

The other day I chatted up an artsy-fartsy type gal at the checkout at a local grocer. This was my first attempt at dusting off my schtick. What inspired me was that she had a kind demeanor and a smile. It's a start.

J

[Lucky Jim]

The other day I chatted up an artsy-fartsy type gal at the checkout at a local grocer. This was my first attempt at dusting off my schtick. What inspired me was that she had a kind demeanor and a smile. It's a start.

Jeffree: As long as you're being authentic to what you find attractive (e.g., kind demeanor and a smile), then I'm all for you dusting off your schtick.  It's about figuring out what you really like, I think.

Insom: No, I don't seek out intensity anymore.  Now I prefer a kind, steady sort of love.  To quote myself in a former post, "I'd rather have good sex with a kind person that great sex with a persecutor"!

LJ

[Jeffree]

Concerning my newer relationships, I would say that it's been great to find out that not all women consider me the horrible person that my Ex made me out to be.  I would also say that I've learned that, without all the drama and turmoil, a relationship can be a fun, positive experience for both parties.


Now this would truly be a breath of fresh air for me, like discovering there truly is life on Mars.

J