Vicarious sexual PTSD threatens our marriage

[aldjfalfj]

 Hi all,

my wife suffers from a severe vicarious sexual PTSD that might be the cause of her bipolar and borderline disorder. It took us a while to figure out what was going on but she is finally in DBT and is showing improvements already.

One thing that is still severely threatening our relationship is our missing sex life. We had a fantastic sex life at the beginning of our relationship but after the birth of our child several years ago it is almost completely absent. While the DBT helps us to re-build trust, the lack of intimacy is hurting and causing further resentment. She is at the point where she encourages me to get my sexual needs met by another person which is not easy for me and the potential impact on our relationship scares me.

I wondered, if anyone here has similar experiences and can share approaches that worked or didn't work.

Thanks!

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[zachira]

I hope you don't mind my replying to your post, as I am a woman and cannot share with you from a man's perspective. I can only share with you how differently men view sex from women, and I am sure most of this you already know. An emotionally healthy woman cannot really enjoy sex with a man unless she is emotionally connected to him. Working on your emotional connection with your wife may help you to reestablish a satisfactory sex life. Do look at San Diego's Sexual Medicine's Web Site at Alvarado Hospital as they are the national experts on how to repair sexual dysfunction in couples, and I am sure you could do a consult with them which could help. Please keep us posted on how you are doing and let us know what is helpful.

[pearlsw]

Hi aldjfalfj,

Can you tell us more what you mean by this term "vicarious sexual PTSD"? I am not familiar with this and I am wondering what you mean by it actually.

I think zachira raises an important point about sex for women. I know at times the sexual pressures my BPD traits partner has put on me have kinda made me wish he'd just go sleep with other women. It's not what I would want really, but I just felt exhausted at times by his complaining, nagging, and trouble-making around sex. It's not like I didn't offer him sex... .but even 5 times a day was not enough for him at times... .No amount was ever enough to fill his emotional needs - he was like an emotional black hole. I had never met a man who complained about sex! I didn't know those kind of men even existed!

Honestly, it's been pretty awful to be with someone who has done so much to ruin sex for me at times. I never even thought you could ruin sex - I was pretty naive I guess. I had to work pretty hard to not have it be totally ruined... .

Also, my partner had lied to me up front, and for many years. He said he had not been sexually abused, but it turns out he had been. I think he is the only partner I have ever had that was sexually abused. Well, as far as I know. And he has had no counseling around this issue and I am the only person he ever told. He has a lot of issues around sex and it has not been easy... .Anyway... .sorry to digress, you got me thinking... .

I think that many women can, BPD/bipolar or not, can develop issues related to sex after childbirth. Has she said anything about it? What does she say is going on with herself about this?

I don't know what you are saying to her, or how you are saying it, but perhaps you can find a way to turn this around or at least not make it worse? Perhaps a therapist could help? Or perhaps you can share more here about it and more eyes can take a look.

with compassion, pearl.

[Radcliff]

No guys have responded yet, so let me be the first.  While it may seem like pearlsw's situation doesn't have much relevance to yours, your wife's sensitivities might make it feel like your normal needs are threatening.  You may be thinking once every five days, and that may feel as oppressive to your wife as five times a day feels to pearlsw.

Let me say that I understand from personal experience how hard it can be to cope with a lack or near lack of sexual intimacy over an extended period of time.  We want to be respectful of our partner, and learn to stuff our need for intimacy and do without.  If we simply talk about sex we can trigger discomfort in our partner, or can be accused of being selfish.  There is an impact on our spirit over time that we may not acknowledge as we determine to just soldier on.

I found that my wife's interest in sex went down with the birth of each child.  A certain amount of this seems understandable even in a "non" relationship since kids add stress, wear us out, and take time.  But stress also worsens BPD symptoms.  Having a child can be hard on someone with BPD because small children by their very nature are invalidating (they are incapable of acknowledging our needs and are all about having their own needs met).

I echo pearlsw's request for you to teach us what "vicarious sexual PTSD" is.  Is this something you have raised wtih a counselor?

How is your wife with non-sexual physical affection?  Does she hug you?  Can you trade back rubs?  I'm not suggesting this as a substitute for sex, but it would be helpful to know if you have this available as a way to connect or not.

WW

[isilme]

Sex is very personal.  BPD affects intimate relationships the most, the greatest potential for vulnerability and hurt can be present, or perceived to be resent.

Women without BPD can have hormonal changes following childbirth (or simply as a result of aging or possible internal undetected issues, like fibroids) that affect more than feelings - their actual bodies hurt, things that felt good once now cause pain.  Weird case in point.  I have always been on the ticklish side, but could usually repress the need to wiggle or squirm away from touch when it tickled, but as I've entered my 40s, my left side, from my thigh to my hip, is almost unbearable to have touched, no matter how.  I have never felt this way before, and now it galls H because he interprets it as him "doing something wrong" when really, my nerves just seem to have re-wired.  My lady MD accidentally brushed against my thigh during my annual exam last week, and I jerked away and had to explain to her.

So - the human body is weird, and what worked just fine at 20, 30, might decide it's a jerk, it's retiring thank you very much at 40, 50, and beyond. 

I too, need to ask about vicarious sexual PTSD.  Based on the word combo, it almost sounds like PTSD by some sort of proxy, like ingesting someone else's trauma to a point you develop PTSD?  Has she or someone she's known been assaulted or abused?  I have a form of PTSD, and know it can manifest from many sources, not just combat or all-out assault.  But it would help to understand the term better as you are using it.

Back to feelings.  yes, all the ladies are correct.  Contrary to popular tropes that exist in the world today, it's been shown over and over that women (and even men) benefit more from sex with an emotional connection.  If BPD and postpartum and possibly nursing issues are present, or she just recently stopped nursing, her hormones have not reset as much as they can to baseline, so there could be some "static" in the signal for emotional connection.  So there's one thing.  Also, how does she perceive herself physically?  Does she feel attractive, or not so much?  I am certainly NOT in the "mood" when I feel like a hot mess, bloated, or am having weird bodily function issues, or just plain sick or fat. 

Also, to be frank and honest, and not to share TMI, but when I am tired, bone tired, my body shuts down, and it takes a lot of time for it to warm up and actually FEEL anything.  Like H can be doing things that worked great a few days before, and I can't even feel it if I am too far gone and need sleep.  This can be a big cause of his starting fights DURING sexual encounters, if he waits till I am almost asleep and it's super late (2am on a work night), then I have to physically wake up and get the engine going.  He wants what he wants and gets invalidated if I can't give it right then and there - and then he feels ashamed about it all and it's makes him super mad because it's MY fault he feels bad. 

So, how are things otherwise, are you close, holding hands, cuddling watching TV? 

[WileyCoyote]

The sexual part seems to be just a specific type of exposure here, but vicarious trauma is the result of being a counselor or something similar where highly empathetic people take on the trauma of the victim and develop the same symptoms of PTSD.

Vicarious Trauma

This is very different from witnessing traumatic events (i.e. seeing your sibling sexually abused over and over but not being DIRECTLY abused yourself)  As a witness in this example you too are a victim.

[pearlsw]

The sexual part seems to be just a specific type of exposure here, but vicarious trauma is the result of being a counselor or something similar where highly empathetic people take on the trauma of the victim and develop the same symptoms of PTSD.

Vicarious Trauma

This is very different from witnessing traumatic events (i.e. seeing your sibling sexually abused over and over but not being DIRECTLY abused yourself)  As a witness in this example you too are a victim.

Hey WileyCoyote!

Thanks for showing up with that link. I feel like I've heard of that, but the sexual part made it more confusing for me. Huh. I'm rereading now... .but still hoping for more details.

So aldjfalfj,

I am so sorry that your sex life is missing and the two of you are having such painful issues. Is she able to talk with you about sex? Or is even discussing this totally shut down?

Do you think she is sincere about wanting you to get your sexual needs met elsewhere? How do you feel about this?

warmly, pearl.