Trying to Salvage Marriage With Undiagnosed BPD

[random376]

I'm new here to the forum and joined after reading a couple of Randi's books. My wife had been having really scary episodes for about a year and a half (I now realize she was splitting me black) and never seemed that curious what was overtaking her. After ~6-7 episodes, I put my foot down and told her if she didn't get on a path to figuring out what was going on, I was going to move to dissolve the marriage. Yeah, ultimatums don't work so well and so I found myself being accused of "attacking her in the middle of the night" as she stormed out the door with the dog while I was enjoying my morning coffee. She moved out and signed a one year lease on a new apartment that day and two weeks later, moved into it. And her entire support system, including her therapist, has been believing and reinforcing her distortion campaign. Interestingly (or maybe not so much) the distortion campaign that she's spreading about me is remarkably similar to what my experience is in dealing with her... .

Aside from the splitting, my wife and I had a truly beautiful existence together. She was supportive and loving and incredibly respectful of me and my space. I had room to grow as an individual--she'd forgive without holding grudges and always supported me working to attain my highest self. She is terribly scared of losing me and of facing herself and I want to modify my own behavior and thought process so I can not get in the way of her taking the initiative she needs to get different/better assistance to problem solve this so that we have the opportunity to work on our marriage. I have already learned so much about how I can change my communication that has made a tremendous difference in our ability to communicate (for several weeks straight she was splitting me black and we had very limited contact during that time).

I love her and, if she is willing to do the work, would love to provide her with the space and safety to do that in the comfort of our marriage. I just don't know how to get around her current support system and have her face the music that she needs to get her butt in gear. Everything that I hear from her is all about how I'm a broken person who is hurting people and I need to take a good look at myself bc I'm scary and I operate in extremes. Her therapist is working with her on understanding how to accept my scary behavior and draw boundaries. Umm? Anyone have experience in navigating around this? I haven't the slightest clue what to do.

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[RolandOfEld]

Hi random376 and welcome. Sorry to hear your marriage has come to such a difficult place.

You're right that ultimatums don't really work when the relationship hits a spot like this. We can usually at best control our side of things and work to improve what we can.

You say the episodes started about a year and half ago. How long have you been together (not just married)? Do you think there was any particular event in your lives that set it off?

~RolandOfEld

[Radcliff]

Hello random376, I'm sorry for the painful situation you are in, but am glad you have found us.  This is a great place to get support.  I'm glad you've taken the initiative to read a couple of Randi's books (which ones?) and have started to use the tools to make things better.

One powerful tool is validation, but be careful that you are only validating the valid.  Don't fall over yourself to make false apologies to appease her.  If she is upset with you over something you didn't do, you can use partial validation and validate her feelings, but not false facts.

Can you describe the episodes in more detail?  Why were they scary?

The therapist is a tough issue.  Let's circle back to that.  Don't let us forget.

WW

[random376]

You say the episodes started about a year and half ago. How long have you been together (not just married)? Do you think there was any particular event in your lives that set it off?

Hi Roland, thank you for your reply. We have been together two years and the splitting episodes didn't start until after we were married. All of triggers seem to be related to me telling her she's hurt my feelings in some way or that I won't help her at the moment, but can help her out when I get home, etc. There were two episodes while I was traveling by myself from business as well. It might also be important to know that she was very close to her mother until her mother declined to attend our wedding because she couldn't watch her daughter marry a woman. That has been very difficult for her.

I never knew what was going on when the episodes were happening and encouraged her to investigate--get her hormones checked, see a therapist, etc. She would go and then not really follow through or be interested in the results. There were two six month breaks where there were no episodes at all. I only realized she is exhibiting BPD traits when I started researching myself after she moved out.

A few days after she made up the attack and up and left, I went to a therapy session with her therapist. It was very open and collaborative and I was assisting by providing information to document the episodes. After the session, my wife asked me what she should do about the apartment that she'd just ran out and put a deposit on and I told her she should take it. But if I had to pinpoint when her complete story about me and how I've "treated her" has changed and when the distortion campaign began that she's only woven thicker and thicker, it happened when I told her she couldn't come back home. Again at the time, I had no idea what BPD was. I'm proud of how I've handled myself through this most of the time knowing what I knew at the time, but telling her she can't come back home in that moment is something I regret because I do think that if she had come back home that day, she would have settled and we would be tackling this together.

[random376]

Hello random376, I'm sorry for the painful situation you are in, but am glad you have found us.  This is a great place to get support.  I'm glad you've taken the initiative to read a couple of Randi's books (which ones?) and have started to use the tools to make things better.

One powerful tool is validation, but be careful that you are only validating the valid.  Don't fall over yourself to make false apologies to appease her.  If she is upset with you over something you didn't do, you can use partial validation and validate her feelings, but not false facts.

Can you describe the episodes in more detail?  Why were they scary?

The therapist is a tough issue.  Let's circle back to that.  Don't let us forget.

WW

Hi WW, thank you for taking the time to respond. The episodes are interesting. They usually begin with a weird agitation that I notice with her. The tension is palpable and I don't know why. I'll inquire if anything is wrong and I'll get a really quick nasty reply that's an accusation of something I am doing at the moment that is bothering her. But everything she is saying is either not true at all or is a gross distortion of what's really happening. She just turns into someone who hates me, like there's a force inside of her and she has to project all of this hate vomit on me or else she'll explode. Things she's loved about me in the past now disgust her. Misunderstandings we've worked through in the past are brought up as if they were malicious and were never worked through at all. One night she destroyed our christmas tree, christmas stockings, books she gifted me, the letter I wrote her on our wedding day, our wedding photos that were on the table to be framed. One time an episode escalated into her driving recklessly with me in the car and me begging for my life. She finally let me out on the side of the road but then stalked me in her car while I tried to escape on foot. When I threatened to call the police, she left.

Afterward I always feel like I'm "buzzing" for a while. Maybe it's days, maybe it's weeks. She's never been remorseful or apologetic. She disputes my version of events and insists that I "was there too". She's always done just enough to look into what could be causing these episodes to satisfy me at the time but then I'm blindsided by another one. They happened monthly just after we were married (4 total). Then there was a six month break until another one. And then there was a six month break after that one until there were three in a row with the last one being her accusing me of attacking her and moving out right away.

It should be said that even though I never knew what was happening or why, my intention was always to diffuse and reassure her that everything was ok. I never understood if she actually believed the things she was telling me or why she was even so full of rage. I've read that splitting is dissociation so she is not actually connected to reality (even though she maintains a sense of reality) so maybe she does think that I am doing the things she says she is.

She went to my therapist with me yesterday (it was the first time I've seen my wife in over a month) and she started splitting me black as soon as the session started even though she was so sweet and excited to see me when she arrived. It's hard. I want my wife and I want to create a validating environment for her at home and love her through this. I don't think we have to give up on this if she takes the initiative to change how she's taking accountability for her 100% of her 50%.

[Radcliff]

random376,

Thank you for all of that detail, it helps us to understand your situation.  I'm sorry for all the pain you have experienced.  Living through those episodes is excruciating, and sometimes terrifying.

I don't get the sense that you were fanning the flames during her episodes.  When all of those accusations come flying at us, the natural instinct is to defend ourselves.  How have you responded?  Did your responses change as you gained experience with her episodes?

This is not something you will want to go through without support.  I encourage you to make this message board a regular part of your support system.  Read the posts of others and respond.  Build friendships here.

Have you heard of DBT therapy?  Do you think this is something that might be possible for your wife?  Does her current therapist have experience with personality disorders?

WW

[random376]

Thanks for your support, WW! I did not realize that this could be BPD (I'd never even heard of it before) until after my wife left the marriage. I had no idea what it was, really. I would say that I tried to fan the flames in the way that I understood would work with someone in a normal emotional state, but looking back now with what I am learning about how to communicate and respond to someone with BPD who is in distress, I definitely did not do that. However, I did use newly learned communication skills to validate her and begin productive conversations just last week and have found they work like magic.

Before she made up the attack and then bolted, she and I were a united front in trying to help her figure out what is going on. Of course, that came with an ultimatum which I'm almost positive is the reason why she felt she had to sabotage everything and run.

Her current therapist is not certified in BPD, and as far as I can tell from her website and her therapeutic approach thus far from what my wife has shared, may not have experience treating PDs. I do absolutely think that DBT would be great/essential for my wife but I do not think I have any ability (unless you have suggestions?) to suggest that to her because she is so defensive of me talking about her own process and plan for seeking treatment. She does not think she's even having "episodes" (even though during our marriage we talked about them as such and she was acting like she was trying to figure out what they were). She is 100% of the mindset that her problems are all related to things I've done or said (most of those things I've "done or said" are made up by her or grossly distorted because she's assigning malicious intent that I didn't have). She is perfectly satisfied with her current course of treatment which is to read books about children who grew up in abusive households to try to understand "my behavior" that she's made up that I've done to her. Again 100% projection and deflection and fear of trying to figure out what's going on with her. I just do not think at this point in our relationship, I have an ability to impact her path with her treatment. I also do not have the support of anyone in her own circle of friends/family because they believe her distortion campaign as well.

I need her to take accountability and do her part to save our marriage as she has not been contributing to that at all. I think (and what I've been trying to do) the best plan of action is to reassure her of the fact that I want her and love her and very much want this marriage to work but that she needs to come to me with at least the first step of a plan of how she is going to work on her own role in this. That plan has to include steps to trying to understand what is underlying during these episodes. Since we have been speaking again over the last week, I have been consistently sharing with her things I'm learning about myself and how I am modifying my behavior to model for her my commitment to growth and to being a better partner to her. I have been apologizing and validating her experiences and feelings when I can and I really have found that to be very successful. I'm going to highlight that to her as well to reassure her that she's not the only one doing work on herself here.

I will have to work on the language so I can be sure I am effectively communicating this to her. What are your thoughts on that approach? How do I give her specific and firm limits/required actions so that she gets herself out of this hamster wheel she's on and contributes to trying to salvage this marriage?

[Radcliff]

We misunderstood each other about "fan the flames," I think.  I meant that you appeared to not be fanning the flames of conflict, which is good.  But I think you were thinking about fanning the flames of love   Now I realize I should be more specific!  Here, we talk about learning not to “justify, argue, defend, or explain” (JADE).  If you didn't know about BPD before the split, then as you observed, there is a lot of ground to be gained, and pain lessened, by using these tools.

I will have to work on the language so I can be sure I am effectively communicating this to her. What are your thoughts on that approach? How do I give her specific and firm limits/required actions so that she gets herself out of this hamster wheel she's on and contributes to trying to salvage this marriage?

I think your outline of what you want to communicate is generally good.  With two big cautions.  And these are classic, time-tested warnings:

1.  Make sure to keep the focus on your growth and controlling your own behaviors.  It is totally natural for us caretakers to feel driven to modify the behaviors of our pwBPD, but trying to directly get them to do the things we want them to do usually creates strife and causes us great pain.

2.  You are right that in order for this to work, she is going to need to make some changes.  You can be absolutely brilliant at doing what you need to do, and she may not come along.

Learning to not control the other person, and coming to terms with the fact that they may not close the gap can be terrifying.  I'm not trying to discourage you, but it's important to understand these things at the outset so we can create the best possible circumstances for success.  Think of it that way -- you want to do everything within your power to increase the chances of success.  Some of it will be out of your power.

You said that you've come to understand much more about BPD and how you can approach things better.  What have your information sources been?  What things would you change about your behavior?

WW

[random376]

Thank you for the thorough response, WW! You have been so so helpful! Haha yeah I misread what you wrote! I definitely see how my behavior (mostly me trying to convince her that what she's saying about me during these episodes isn't true) was wildly unhelpful and for sure escalated things.


I've read "I Hate You--Don't Leave Me", "Stop Walking on Eggshells" and "Loving Someone With Borderline Personality Disorder". I also ordered ""Get Me Out Of Here" and "The Essential Family Guide to Borderline Personality Disorder: New Tools and Techniques to Stop Walking on Eggshells". Any other suggestions? I'm a reader! I've found the subreddit BPDlovedones validating of my experience but once I shifted gears away from anger and realized I could have a real part in saving this, I stopped visiting there. I've read some academic papers on different studies and treatments, etc., perused some random discussion boards where people with BPD are describing their own experiences, etc. My wife and I visited a couples therapist who specializes in BPD several weeks ago and I've made an appointment to see him 1:1 this upcoming Monday. And now that I've found this forum... .I'm spending some time digging through different posts here! I am so relieved to find a community of people who want their relationships to work!

What I am learning is that because those with BPD have an un- or underdeveloped sense of self, they rely heavily on external cues so the emotion I do or don't bring to a situation effects her emotional state greatly. I'm learning that she takes a lot longer to calm herself when she's worked up so the simple act of taking a breather or slowing my responses to her can be very helpful. I've learned that while I am not responsible nor am I expected to act on her behalf, there are [very effective] things I can do while she's having a splitting episode to calm her, stop escalating her, and prevent crises myself. It has been such a relief to understand there are things to do here! It was so scary feeling like it was all outside of my control and that I was at her mercy. I'm learning why she can't hear me talk about how much she's hurt me and why I've been so frustrated with her lack of consideration, compassion and action in the past. I've also learned that I need to validate her first when any hard conversations need to be had and that I can validating toward her emotions even if how she is expressing it is hurtful to me.

I'm learning not to get as frustrated and to listen for how she is feeling and for any truth in her accusations that I can acknowledge and reflect on in my own growth. I'm also realizing how I can, because of things that I've mentioned above, sabotage her ability to take the initiatives to makes progress towards being accountable for herself. I'm learning that she really does love me and is terrified of me leaving and is terrified of the work needed on her part to save our marriage. I am learning it's really helpful and reassuring for me to text her in the morning and then again before I go to bed right now, even though we aren't having constructive conversations about our marriage just yet. She really does respond well to that and seems to need that from me. 

I'm also learning that splitting black is a form of dissociation and I don't have to take the things she says to me when she's splitting me personally because it isn't personal.

Can you help me understand more about what is happening with splitting? Is she truly in a dissociative state? I'd read and watched videos about splitting being fight or flight response to the brain thinking it's about to be re-exposed to a past trauma. This video made a light go off in my head: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYUjo7zvz4A&feature=youtu.be

So that means that while she maintains a sense of reality, she isn't actually connected to reality? She is "behaving logically" if she was actually under imminent attack but she's getting the wrong input on reality because she's triggered? Her brain is in auto-pilot, "yikes I'm under attack and I need to protect myself" mode? Do I understand it correctly in stating she's treating me as if I'm threatening her because she TRULY BELIEVES that I am threatening her?

One thing in particular I am trying to understand is how come the distorted/false things she accuses me of when she's splitting does she continue to assert that I did even after the splitting episode is over? Is this because she has no self-awareness since she's not in treatment and doesn't understand her brain is working in this way? Will she ever be able to sort these things out and stop insisting that I take accountability for "threatening" things she says I'm doing to her during these splitting episodes?

[Radcliff]

OK, straight to the head of the class for you, you've done your homework!  You have read the first three BPD books I read.  The next one I'd add to your reading list is "The High Conflict Couple," by Alan Fruzetti.  It is about building more constructive communication.  Fruzetti is a BPD expert, but the book doesn't mention BPD, so it's OK for the two of you to read together.  Speaking of which, you probably have read not to discuss even the name "BPD" with your wife.  This usually does not go well at all.  There are exceptions where someone accepts a diagnosis, but assume for now that you should not talk about it, unless you get some guidance otherwise.  Also, despite how enthusiastic you may be about the support you receive on this site, do not ever, ever reveal its existence.  She may feel quite threatened, and you may come under intense pressure about it.

Regarding splitting, yes, you are right, they do believe it.  I finally realized this about my wife -- it was the only way to explain how intense and authentic her emotions were around things I knew not to be true, and I thought she should know.  The only explanation was that somehow she believed it.  When I've been sitting on the couch six feet from her, leaning back and talking in a soft voice with mild hand gestures, I've been accused of being threatening and abusive.  She has actually assaulted me from behind as I was running away, and then said that I was threatening her.  You ask a great question -- why do they still believe it once the black phase is over?  I believe it's because they see themselves as one person with one, continuous experience.  They don't perceive themselves as fractured, Jekyl and Hyde.  So if they have one continuous experience, then "facts" can't change.  Once they establish a "fact" in the black phase, it sticks.  To recognize it is false would require them to recognize that their thinking is distorted, which is almost an oxymoron.   

That's great that you've found a couples therapist who has expertise in BPD.  How did the first session go when you met with her together?

WW