New to BPD: We've been estranged 6 wks, thought we were on better path

[LongRunner]

Hi,
I do not have a clinical verification that my spouse has BPD. However, after speaking with counselors and reading Stop Walking On EggShells Second Edition. I can identify many of the characteristics of a BP. While there may have been mild indications of this behavior in the past, it has erupted in the past two months. I believe it may have something to do with an unleashing of buried trauma that appears to have occurred in May, 2018. Since then my spouse's behavior has become more BPD-like. I have been estranged for about six weeks with no access to my own house and have been the subject of many tirades about what a bad person I am. Truth is that I went through a period of several years where I was verbally abusive (yelling and criticizing mostly) but thought I had been on a much better path in recent years.
My spouse has indicated that she wants a divorce but has not taken any action. I love her and am committed to her so much that I want to avoid this if possible and reconcile. I don't know if that is possible. She seems to be in a downward spiral but with no indication of self harm. She has been alternately lashing out and me and other people who love her very much.
This is just my introduction. Obviously much more to the story.
I have tried to get on some of the BPDCentral sponsored support groups but it appears to my PC that they are all inaccessible or shut down.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[pearlsw]

Hi LongRunner,



Sorry to hear you have been struggling so much, but glad you found us! I found this site by doing a search for support groups because I was sure there must be one for people who have partners with mental health issues. I got lucky!

I strongly encourage you to stick around, read, study, ask questions, share experiences and offer support to others. We're all peers here. We really don't want people to feel alone and without options.

You mention you've also had some anger issues. Have you found a way to work on that a bit? I feel like I've said this a few times today, but I tell ya, meditation practice is free and easy and is a great way to slow down one's reaction times and as a bonus gain compassion for others, be really able to see them and their suffering. It can be a very helpful tool for your own peace of mind. I can't recommend it highly enough to you and all who might be reading here. Basically, it's free anger management.

Aside from that, can you tell us more about what led up to you leaving the house?

wishing you the best, pearl.

[LongRunner]

Pearl,
I am so new to this that I am hoping this is the right way to respond. I am working on self care with Tai Chi, Yoga and running/biking/hiking. It is helpful as is joining groups with similar interests.
My wife seemed to undergo a rather violent shaking episode in early May while we were attending a marriage seminar. The same thing occurred the following day. After that, there were many days where she seemed intent on bringing up many things from the distant past and having great difficulty (I would say rather severely physically locked up) talking about them. The stories had recurring themes about me and members of my birth family. She began acting very uncomfortable around me, become much less willing to embrace and then would ask for me to stay out of the room she was in. This grew into staying out of the house initially for a couple days at a time but now appears more permanent. During this time I went on a short trip to visit my mother in another state. She is very old and slipping mentally. This visit to my mother and some members of my birth family greatly agitated my wife (abandonement?).

[pearlsw]

Pearl,
I am so new to this that I am hoping this is the right way to respond. I am working on self care with Tai Chi, Yoga and running/biking/hiking. It is helpful as is joining groups with similar interests.
My wife seemed to undergo a rather violent shaking episode in early May while we were attending a marriage seminar. During this time I went on a short trip to visit my mother in another state. She is very old and slipping mentally. This visit to my mother and some members of my birth family greatly agitated my wife (abandonment?).

Hi LongRunner,

Wow! It sounds like you have a lot of great things going on! I used to do Tai Chi and am dying to do it again, but haven't found a way!  

She was shaking? Do you think she has PTSD as well? Was she emotionally reacting to the marriage seminar? I think I've read that they don't necessarily encourage marriage counseling for people with this disorder. I can imagine because of the emotional reactions they might have. I know that is one reason I do not want to do marriage counseling with my SO. I am afraid it would get him too upset and just lead to more dysregulation episodes that I would be stuck managing/surviving on my own.

Do you have any idea what, in her mind, is upsetting about your family? Has she ever articulated this, her reasons, however distorted it might be? Has she ever interfered with your relationship with your family?

take care, pearl.
 

[LongRunner]

By the way, I am reviewing books on anger management. I believe I have improved over the past few years and, before my wife recently went off (not sure how better to describe), that is what she was saying. I believe I am paying the price for behavior that occurred mostly more than 10 years ago. I know that it doesn't help as my wife is experiencing these things in the present day.
I appreciate your responses. I see where others have read my post but have not heard anything back yet.
I don't know if  I should but  I do hang on to a small hope for reconciliation for us and recovery for my wife. Is that a healthy thing to do.?

[pearlsw]

By the way, I am reviewing books on anger management. I believe I have improved over the past few years and, before my wife recently went off (not sure how better to describe), that is what she was saying. I believe I am paying the price for behavior that occurred mostly more than 10 years ago. I know that it doesn't help as my wife is experiencing these things in the present day.
I appreciate your responses. I see where others have read my post but have not heard anything back yet.
I don't know if  I should but  I do hang on to a small hope for reconciliation for us and recovery for my wife. Is that a healthy thing to do.?

Hi LongRunner,

Hard to say. Do you think she would give you any kind of chance? Still feels love towards you?

People sometimes read, but don't post because they feel they don't know what to say or aren't experts, but they are all welcome to lend their thoughts and support anytime and I hope they will! All are welcome!  I think by supporting others we learn a lot about compassion and validation, so it is also good practice!

Great that you are working on anger management! Any tips you can share with this? I had a rough relationship when I was much younger and it really set off my anger. I turned to regular contemplative practice and it helped a lot!

What happened 10 years ago that she isn't letting go of may I ask?

sincerely, pearl.

[LongRunner]

Hi LongRunner,

Hard to say. Do you think she would give you any kind of chance? Still feels love towards you?

People sometimes read, but don't post because they feel they don't know what to say or aren't experts, but they are all welcome to lend their thoughts and support anytime and I hope they will! All are welcome!  I think by supporting others we learn a lot about compassion and validation, so it is also good practice!

Great that you are working on anger management! Any tips you can share with this? I had a rough relationship when I was much younger and it really set off my anger. I turned to regular contemplative practice and it helped a lot!

What happened 10 years ago that she isn't letting go of may I ask?

sincerely, pearl.

Hi Pearl,
This is such a long story (42 years of marriage). In the 1990's we moved away from my wife's parents so I could begin a career in another state. They were very close to their daughter. To help with that separation, we made many trips to visit her parents (and mine who were nearby). During my career (1990's and 2000's) I focused too much on work and brought my stress home with me. As I mentioned, I verbally abused my wife with shouting outbursts. One or two times she locked herself in the bathroom to get away from me. I was too ignorant at the time to understand that a simple apology to make up did not suffice to settle my wife's fears of it happening again. Though it didn't happen much, she said she lived in fear of it repeating. She said she was walking on eggshells. After the reading I have been doing, makes me wonder if I didn't have a minor case of BPD at the time (maybe just anger issues). I believe by the late 2000's I had gotten better but still had relapses of anger. I think this was felt as trauma by my wife (she has had many other traumatic experiences in her life). I think she suppressed all the sadness and guilt from being far from her parents and suffered silently through my outbursts. If trauma can contribute to BPD in later years, then these experiences may be contributors. Her guilt about her parents has apparently become my fault.
I slowly became a calmer person but I still have episodes where I get mad for very minor things. No more yelling. Therapy is indicating a possible relationship problem with my father. I am reading books and self-help manuals and hoping the meditative things I am doing will help. Practicing mindfulness as well.
My fear is that I am coming to all these self improvements way too late in life and way too late to save our marriage.
I am also concerned that no one will be able to convince my wife she could benefit from therapy beyond a regular counselor.
We still don't have a diagnosis.

[pearlsw]

Hi Pearl,
This is such a long story (42 years of marriage).
I am also concerned that no one will be able to convince my wife she could benefit from therapy beyond a regular counselor.
We still don't have a diagnosis.

Hi LongRunner,

I have a lot of respect for you doing so much work on your anger! That is very brave and impressive to hear about! Thanks for sharing more about your story!

I had a boyfriend once who had drug problems for awhile and it was not easy to communicate with him. It made me very angry at the time and I didn't want to be that angry so I began a pretty serious contemplative practice at a Zen center. It was great and has benefits that linger until this day.

It is such a great way to slow down and look at your thoughts and have more self-control.

Did your father express anger towards you? Was it modeled by him? Or did you repress some anger due to issues related to him? Or... .?

Have you ever sat and talked with your wife about your anger issues and how you feel about them? Would she benefit by hearing, perhaps, about your growth on this or would this just upset her? Is it better for her to just see the changes?

I would not guess BPD about you, from what you have stated, you've seen the list of symptoms, right? Maybe just anger issues, I agree with your suspicion. (Without further info.)

A lot of us have partners who are not diagnosed. Mine isn't and may have multiple mental health issues if I had to guess. We just deal with the symptoms. Sometimes that is all you can do, and that is just fine. I'm still a bit unclear; what symptoms is she exhibiting? PTSD and not BPD perhaps? Or you highly suspect BPD because... .?

take care, pearl.

[LongRunner]

Hi LongRunner,

I have a lot of respect for you doing so much work on your anger!

take care, pearl.

Hi Pearl,
Thank you for the support. I will try to address all your questions.
My father was somewhat angry, always working and worn out (many kids to feed!), very controlling of my mother (she was never allowed to drive). I grew up in a house with many brothers and we fought a lot (seemed normal back then). I have always forgiven my dad, thinking that I earned the spankings and rare knocks. He never randomly showed violence.

I have apologized to my wife many times over the years and she accepted my apologies. I have been learning better ways to apologize lately but there is no acceptance at this time. Overall, I thought our marriage was on a positive upswing until the past 3 months. I do believe she suppressed a lot and it all came down on her at once. (I  know I am blaming myself but I was imperfect).

Going through the list of criteria:
1. Frantic efforts to avoid being abandoned: Told me in June that she was trying so hard to keep me in town but instead I went to see my 90 year old mother who was in distress. I did not get "the message" about leaving. I thought I got encouragement to go. I was told that this single event may have caused her decision to divorce.

2. Instability in relationships: She has had huge relationship problems with friends and my side of the family that have gotten increasingly worth. This one is a definite match. Now I am the focus of relationship instability.

3. Problem with an unstable sense of self, self-image or identity: Definitely. I am accused of being responsible for losing her sense of self. She has had low self-esteem and depression for a long time partly due to physical injuries and ailments. Has been on antidepressants and benzos for 24 years.

4. Impulsivity: She spends a lot of time online shopping (really a total waste of time) but does not spend too much. She is often in a cycle of buying/returning. After spending 3 years on opiates for an injury, we got her completely free of them. However we were not warned about subsequent affinities to other drugs/alcohol. She spent a year drinking which I  didn't realize but eventually became sober (for several years now).

5. No indications of self harm or suicidal thoughts. She has let her physical health go downhill. She is working on mental health with yoga and dance. Believes it is sufficient for her current problems.

6. Mood swings: She has been in a constant bad mood for two months. Occasional upswings around children. Very irritable.

7. Chronic emptiness:  Has also been making this claim for months.

8. Sometimes goes off about people who love her and are trying to help. In our failed marriage counseling attempts, she was in a constant highly emotional state.

9. Transient, stress related paranoid thoughts or severe dissociation: She believes her family members are conspiring to control her life. We are all just very concerned and want to help.

This list came from The Mindfulness Solution For Intense Emotions. I think it is from American Psychiatric Association 2013.

Please let me know your thoughts. Thank you.

[Radcliff]

I'm sorry to hear of the situation you're in, but am glad that you've found us.  I can understand your feelings about having uncovered and started improving many relationship issues very late in the game, but with a background of having a controlling father, you started at a big disadvantage.  When our issues are combined with a spouse with a mental illness, it gets tremendously complicated.

Did the two of you raise children together?  How old are they?

Can you tell us exactly what the topic of discussion was when she first started shaking?  You've done some reading about BPD, so probably have read about the various traumatic risk factors.  What past traumas has your wife experienced?

WW

[Learning2Thrive]

Hi LongRunner,

Welcome to the family. I’m glad you found us but sorry for the circumstances that brought you here.

I understand you’ve been out of the house for about 6 weeks, she has indicated she wants a divorce but hasn’t done anything about it and you would like to reconcile with your wife. I’m sorry if I missed it, but I’m curious how often are you now in contact with your wife? How do you communicate? By phone, text, email?

Have you noticed any other changes in her behavior? New friends?

I don’t want to give you false hope because I know nothing about your wife, but I think it’s quite possible you have a chance in working it out—depending on many circumstances and what each of you is willing to accept and/or work on. 

I moved out of my home and lived in my own apartment for a year. At that time, I was sure I wanted a divorce, but never did anything about it. I have been back at my home for 5 years now. Things are not perfect, but we are both working very hard on acceptance (of ourselves and each other) and self improvement. I can envision a lifelong future for us if we stay on this path.

Hang in there. Keep posting and let’s see if we can help you come up with some healthy strategies.

  L2T

[LongRunner]

I'm sorry to hear of the situation you're in, but am glad that you've found us.  I can understand your feelings about having uncovered and started improving many relationship issues very late in the game, but with a background of having a controlling father, you started at a big disadvantage.  When our issues are combined with a spouse with a mental illness, it gets tremendously complicated.

Did the two of you raise children together?  How old are they?

Can you tell us exactly what the topic of discussion was when she first started shaking?  You've done some reading about BPD, so probably have read about the various traumatic risk factors.  What past traumas has your wife experienced?

WW

Two grown children. In their 30's. I don't remember the marital topic when she started shaking. I don't know if there was a connection with the marriage seminar or just a coincidence. She was in several car accidents before we met. One was severe with a concussion and possible brain damage.

[Radcliff]

LongRunner, it''s been a while; how are you doing?

WW